Careful….. “Everyone,” isn’t very exclusive. Sounds more like commonism….
RBY coming back
- Thread starter Ja1339
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I’m not sure it shows that, at all. This drought of individual champions corresponds to our drought of team championships. Well-rounded teams win duals. Individual champs win team championships.
Yup…in our sport with NIL, they will never be more marketable as they are right now in college unless they end up being a Jordan Burroughs type in the college afterlife.
Even in football or basketball, the bust vs success ratio is pretty high. Five stars are going to get p-a-I-d just to show up up on campus regardless if there is any real next level talent. Hell, the Pro orgs have drafted busts and they evaluate talent for a living.
Huh? You’re not sure that Iowa has counted on well-rounded teams or more champs lead to more titles?
Not necessarily. I’d like to see businesses kicked off corporate welfare systemYou a commonist Dub?
Me too, but I was playing with Commonist vs Communist. I know what the latter is, but the first? New to me.
You with all your fancy spelling. Must not be from around here. The commonists almost ruint this world beck in the day. And there no “U,” in common. And I sure as hell wouldn’t be caught dead on a commune. ?E tu?
I'm not sure that having well-rounded teams leads to team titles. I think individual champs lead to team titles.
I guess I misunderstood your post that I responded to!
This is all Internet forum hypothetical talk amongst Iowa fans. I think the better question is, who is carter starocci beating at the top since he is the self proclaimed best in the world? He not beating Burroughs and he sure as hell isn’t beating dake…and that’s just this country. See, Spencer has said he believes he’s the best and I think he is. Healthy, Spencer beats uguev. Starocci isn’t making it out of this country any time soon if ever. Worry about your own.
At this point if healthy, I could see him walk through 125 and 133 as there is no other generational talent at either.
Really not sure about 141.
But I’ll bet he could win the first five starting spots on the team.
Who would Spencer have trouble with in this group?
Willits
Matthews
Woods
Bergeland
Composto
He'd "walk" through 141 before 133. I think "walk" is a bit of an exaggeration for RBY and Fix.
Never visited a commune, so I don't know. I HAVE visited Canada. Is that close enough?
I doubt they will have NIL in Canada, but you never know.
Btw, I’ve visited a few communes in my day. Canada doesn’t count. (Been there too.)Never visited a commune, so I don't know. I HAVE visited Canada. Is that close enough?
I doubt they will have NIL in Canada, but you never know.
I’m more, hermit in cave type.
Ya think?
But…. He IS a generational talent, imo. Dan Gable could take on most of his teams from top to bottom. So there’s that.
I keep hearing generational talent but Gable Steveson was just as good if not better. Yianni is every bit as good and for those of you that think he could bump up and beat Bravo-Young while weighing in the 120s is laughable.
Starocci beat Nolf at the WTT. I know that’s not the same as beating Dake, but I’m not sure from your post if you knew this.
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Dake ragdolled Nolf at OTT, so you’re right it’s not the same.
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I hate the term generational talent. That would mean what the best person every 10-15 years? As stated above there is a new generational talent every year if not a few of them.
GSteve is a generational talent. Yianni, is great but does not put up the points that Spencer does. Out of 15 matches at NCAAs, he has bonused in two of them (his first year). IIRC, Spencer has in 11/15. People expect Yianni to win. People expect Spencer to dominate.
When the whole country is asking what's wrong with Yianni because he didn't end a match against anyone below like 5th in the country in the first or second period then we can start putting him in the convo.
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I truly don't know if Spencer could bump up and beat RBY or Fix. It's a big ask to give up that much weight for a normal 125, and Spencer is a relatively tiny 125. How he's so much stronger than the field is truly incredible.
I wonder if he has slightly different muscle insertions that allow him to get more leverage/force out of his arms and legs than average, similar to monkeys. That would also explain being able to function without ACL's.
That being said, after winning his sophomore year at NCAA's when anybody in the know knew there was basically no chance, I've learned to never bet against Spencer Lee.
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Btw, Don….
If your definition of generational talent was correct, there would be four timers coming along every couple of years. Right?
these pst boys still really butthurt spencer chose iowa.
Wrestling is different because of the ten weights imo. I look at a guy like GSteve the past two years and wonder who would beat him in college. Kyle Snyder maybe? I don’t think so…not with that much weight disparity. GS is beating legit, really good guys, like a cat who is playing with his food.
Spencer has 5 (?) losses so that’s a knock on him. But I would ask, who has been better at his weight in the past 25 years? I think we would have to go all the way back to Abas.
Spencer gutted out a couple of those title runs injured but still pretty dominant. And luckily, we’ve seen what he can do when healthy.
Everyone needs to remember that these are the same guys who would say Kolat was a generational talent based on his dominance in high school and body of work…despite only winning 2 titles in college. Spencer has 3 and on his way to 4. Also, I’d genuinely be curious to see how many titles the greats would’ve won with Spencer’s injuries. I’m not making excuses because he won them anyway but I know most if not all of them would’ve tried and failed.
Yeah. And where’s Johnstown’s weird ass? I got about 20 notifications of him on posts from a year or so ago. Strange dude with lots of time on his hands to backtrack like that. But somehow he’s short on time when I ask him to have a chat at young guns. Go figure.
I'm from Pittsburgh and I followed Kolat and Spencer's careers pretty closely throughout high school. The cult around Kolat started very early and, as everyone knows, it continues to this day. For some reason, despite winning those world junior and cadet titles, Spencer never got anything close to the local attention that Kolat received when he was high school.
Whenever there is discussion about PA's high school GOAT, it's almost always Kolat who gets mentioned. Yes- what he did was remarkable and Spencer was a three-timer who lost his last match. But we all know the circumstances of that match and the fact is that Spencer was winning right up to the last second when he was taken down.
Kolat was an undefeated four-timer but he too lost his last high school match. Technically he didn't lose, it was a draw. But I was there rooting for Kolat at the 1992 Dapper Dan when he wrestled Bono and, in reality, he lost. Bono put a mean ride on Kolat for the entire 3rd period. Basically, he bullied Kolat. He titled him, he cross-faced him and it was only because of some hometown refereeing that Kolat got out of the period without giving up any back points. It was the last match of the evening and the mood of the crowd leaving the arena was very unhappy. At the time, I thought that maybe Kolat had underestimated Bono because he was from Florida and, in that era, it was the wrestlers from Iowa and Oklahoma who carried the big reputations into the Dapper Dan. But years later, when I saw the match on YouTube, it was clear that Kolat had started super-aggressively like he always did and Bono just took over as the match went on. In that way, it very much reminds me of the famous match that Kolat would later have with Ironside. If you want to check it out for yourself, just Google: Kolat Bono 1992 Dapper Dan. You won't have any trouble finding it.
If Spencer returns anything like what he was, I have to believe that his best work - collegiate and international - is still ahead of him.
I think that you nailed it. Kolat was the first of his kind. No one was feeling the same way about Teasdale either, although he is clearly a different animal. If Spencer won that match against Desanto, he'd be held in the same PA high school esteem as Kolat. As far as collegiate? He's already surpassed Kolat in about every fan's eyes. But his losses will knock him down a couple pegs in the GOAT talk.
I'd love to see him in the conversation in 6-7 years as an all time International great. As a PSU fan, I'm rooting for him to get a 4th title. I'd love to see a string of 4 timers happen over the next few years...
I think it may have been just the different eras.
Today, the U.S. has a ton of high schoolers having great national and international success. 30 years ago… not so much.
It was Kolat taking 3rd at Midlands when he was in 10th grade that really got everyone’s attention. The Midlands was THE tournament back then. Think how crazy the message boards would be if a 10th grader placed 3rd at the Scuffle this year. And then remember that the Midlands back then was a superior tournament to the Scuffle today.
Today, the U.S. has a ton of high schoolers having great national and international success. 30 years ago… not so much.
It was Kolat taking 3rd at Midlands when he was in 10th grade that really got everyone’s attention. The Midlands was THE tournament back then. Think how crazy the message boards would be if a 10th grader placed 3rd at the Scuffle this year. And then remember that the Midlands back then was a superior tournament to the Scuffle today.
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The next year, in 1990, and as a high school junior, Kolat placed 4th at 126 at the Midlands. He lost 2-1 to (1988 Olympian) Ken Chertow in the quarterfinals. Chertow would go on to win the tournament, beating (that season’s NCAA champion) Terry Brands 7-4 in the final.
In the consolation final that year, Kolat lost in OT to Adam Disabato, who would place 6th at NCAAs that year. In the consolation semifinal, Kolat beat Shawn Charles, who would place 5th at NCAAs that year.
No one in high school was competing with Olympians and NCAA All-Americans like that.
See the old Midlands brackets for yourself:
nusports.com
In the consolation final that year, Kolat lost in OT to Adam Disabato, who would place 6th at NCAAs that year. In the consolation semifinal, Kolat beat Shawn Charles, who would place 5th at NCAAs that year.
No one in high school was competing with Olympians and NCAA All-Americans like that.
See the old Midlands brackets for yourself:
Past Midlands Results/Brackets - Northwestern Athletics
Year Team Champion 2022 Midlands Brackets Northwestern 2021 Midlands (Canceled - COVID-19) 2020 Midlands (Canceled - COVID-19) ...
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If we went by the literal meaning of generational talent then that individual would be sadulaev.
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