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since the other thread got a little carried away next years starting 5

H

hawkjazz

Rookie
Aug 24, 2013
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8
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this is my opinion only
FR Kreiner @ center won't need to score a lot will be needed to patrol the paint
FR PF Cook reminds me of Reggie Evans
JR SF Uhl
SR SG Jok
SO PG Williams


would not mind seeing Pemsyl and possibly Bohanon RS, as I believe Moss and Fleming can be very serviceable as a backup PG.

Ellingson will backup Jok as will Moss
Baer and Hutton will backup Uhl
Wagner will backup Cook
Jones will backup Kreiner


my opinion is based on watching this years team, Jok has been known to bring the ball up the court as has Uthoff.

as most have noted the group coming in and off RS year is more athletic than the previous years. a little further and I will explain my madness.
 
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hawkjazz said:
why do people insist that Uhl @ 6'9 195 lbs is a 5? and yet Kreiner @ 6'10 240 lbs needs to bulk up.

Uhl is a 3 and is developing quite nicely, I can see the others.
Click to expand...
Uhl is closer to 210 I think and really a 4/5, but I think a point well made. Both Kreiner and Cook are coming in physically ready to play the 5. My guess is Cook starts. I cannot imagine Baer not starting next year based upon what we've seen so far.
 
Mitch122 said:
PG - Williams
SG - Jok
SF - Uhl
PF - Jones
C - Cook
Click to expand...
Uhl has been playing the 5 this year, not sure if that will change next year when many of the bodies are gone from the current lineup.
PG - Williams, Bohannon?
SG - Jok, ellingson, Moss, Fleming
SF - Baer, Moss, Hutton
PF - Jones, Wagner, Hutton
C - Uhl, Cook

I don't think Pemsl, or Kreiner contribute much at all.
 
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hawkjazz said:
why do people insist that Uhl @ 6'9 195 lbs is a 5? and yet Kreiner @ 6'10 240 lbs needs to bulk up.

Uhl is a 3 and is developing quite nicely, I can see the others.
Click to expand...

Uhl comes in for Woody now. He will draw out his defender and open up the offense. On defense he will have to cover like a glove and play ball denial. That and some zone. It'll be interesting. But working this year.

1- Williams
2- Jok
3- Baer
4- Cook
5- Uhl
 
Williams
Jok
Baer / Uhl
Cook / Uhl
Uhl / Kriener

My starting 5

Uhl can play the 3, 4, or 5 so that is a nice option to have. Jok can play the 2 or 3 so you could add Ellingson in at the 2 to spell and shift Jok to the 3 without missing a beat.
 
hawkjazz said:
why do people insist that Uhl @ 6'9 195 lbs is a 5? and yet Kreiner @ 6'10 240 lbs needs to bulk up.

Uhl is a 3 and is developing quite nicely, I can see the others.
Click to expand...
Agree that Uhl can play 3 and is developing nicely. But if he can guard Hammons/Haas, Costello/Davis as he did the the last 3 games, then he can also play the 5 spot and is certainly not just 200lbs. Uhl's movement w/wo the ball, his ball-handing, height, shooting range make him a very flexible player capable of legitimately playing 3-5.

Uhl and Jok are the only 2 guys I'm absolutely certain will start next year. But because Jok can also play more than one position (2-3), it leaves a lot of flexibility for player development in the next several months, with multiple lineups possible around them.

As has been stated before, next year's lineup is something of a crapshoot. But there's going to be a nice combination skills to choose from.
 
Williams
Jok
Baer
Jones
Uhl


Long and Athletic lineup. Wayyyyyyyy too much love for Cook right now, I'm sorry.
 
PG - Williams, Bohannon
SG - Jok, Ellingson
SF - Baer, Jok (when Fran goes small)
F - Uhl, Jones
F - Wagner, Cook

Not a ton of offense in this lineup; Uhl will need to be a scorer next year.
 
I am cautioning against Jones because of his knees, besides as a bench scorer he could be a good option to have. but to each their own
yerpHAWK said:
Williams
Jok
Baer
Jones
Uhl


Long and Athletic lineup. Wayyyyyyyy too much love for Cook right now, I'm sorry.
Click to expand...
so you are saying that 6'9 240 LB Cook who is rated 53rd by ESPN, that people can't give him a lot of love?

posters have pissed and moaned about all the so called misses by Fran and noq that he score a Big hit we can't get EXCITED. PLEASE EXPLAIN?
 
Most of these lineups scare me a lot! Having to start Williams at PG with Bohannon as backup will be a disaster especially in conference games. Fran is completely avoiding getting Williams any playing time that he desparately needs. Look at how much better Gesell has been the last two years at controlling the offense and you want basically two freshman doing that next year, not a good option. Thinking that the RS, Cook or Pmesl will be the answer is hoping for a prayer. Ellingson will get lost on the bench if the RS are anything. 2016-17 will have a lot of growing pains

I also got to see the McCaffrey boys in person on Friday night. Not what I expected at all. Connor does a good job of running the offense and controlling the team, but not sure he is B1G point. Only offense in the first half was a banked in 3 pointer at the buzzer. While he has decent form on the shot, he shoots it too low to be effective in college. He is way behind Matt Gatens at same point in his career. Patrick didn't play a lot and didn't score. Granted, he is only a freshman and went through significant health issues last year, so hopefully he fills out and gets a lot stronger over next 3 years. Kind of looks a little like Baer in body type except 20 pounds lighter. Felt bad for Patrick during the game too as Daddy couldn't sit still in the stands so was standing down on one end of the court and during a dead ball was yelling to Patrick about what he needed to be doing. Tough for any dad to avoid helping his own son, but having your coach as D1 coach probably sucks. Probably why it was fortunate that Gable had all daughters
 
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hawkjazz said:
I am cautioning against Jones because of his knees, besides as a bench scorer he could be a good option to have. but to each their own

so you are saying that 6'9 240 LB Cook who is rated 53rd by ESPN, that people can't give him a lot of love?

posters have pissed and moaned about all the so called misses by Fran and noq that he score a Big hit we can't get EXCITED. PLEASE EXPLAIN?
Click to expand...


Well sir, since Fran has done such a good job recruiting, I don't see the need for Cook to step in and start right away between the combination of Uhl/Baer/Jones/Wagner inside, but yes, start 2 Freshmen when not necessary.
 
hawkjazz said:
this is my opinion only
FR Kreiner @ center won't need to score a lot will be needed to patrol the paint
FR PF Cook reminds me of Reggie Evans
JR SF Uhl
SR SG Jok
SO PG Williams


would not mind seeing Pemsyl and possibly Bohanon RS, as I believe Moss and Fleming can be very serviceable as a backup PG.

Ellingson will backup Jok as will Moss
Baer and Hutton will backup Uhl
Wagner will backup Cook
Jones will backup Kreiner


my opinion is based on watching this years team, Jok has been known to bring the ball up the court as has Uthoff.

as most have noted the group coming in and off RS year is more athletic than the previous years. a little further and I will explain my madness.
Click to expand...
That starting line up would have some god awful spacing...
 
hawkjazz said:
this is my opinion only
FR Kreiner @ center won't need to score a lot will be needed to patrol the paint
FR PF Cook reminds me of Reggie Evans
JR SF Uhl
SR SG Jok
SO PG Williams


would not mind seeing Pemsyl and possibly Bohanon RS, as I believe Moss and Fleming can be very serviceable as a backup PG.

Ellingson will backup Jok as will Moss
Baer and Hutton will backup Uhl
Wagner will backup Cook
Jones will backup Kreiner


my opinion is based on watching this years team, Jok has been known to bring the ball up the court as has Uthoff.

as most have noted the group coming in and off RS year is more athletic than the previous years. a little further and I will explain my madness.
Click to expand...
Yikes, what is the justification on that starting lineup? I would be surprised if we have 2 Freshman starting at the start of the season. I think Fran has done a good job of recruiting where Frosh do not have to come in and be key players and will be more role players. IMO that is how it should be unless they are uber talented. Cook is solid, but if you watch his film he stills has plenty of room to grow, especially at the offensive side. I could see maybe one of the two (Kreiner or Cook) but both starting, not so much. I could be wrong, but if I am we could be in trouble
 
While anything is possible that line up seems somewhat unrealistic. Like Dom U starting at 3? I just cannot see how he'd move from 4/5 to 3, where we've already got a kid that will be 3 year starter.

Much more likely to be Uhl, Cook, Jok and who knows at guard. Baer might start if Jok moves to guard. Obviously Moss and Hutton are going to get time, if they both stay and I think they will. Wagner backs up Cook and Kreiner backs up Dom.

There will be a huge fight for guard minutes since both starting spots are up for the taking. Were I betting I'd bet on Williams and Fleming.
 
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1st on Uhl, when Jok got hurt it was Uhl who took his place and he ended posting a dbl dbl of 14 points and 10 rebounds as the 3, everytime he comes in it is at the 3 not the 4 not the 5 BUT THE THREE PURE AND SIMPLE.
now unless you can tell specifically that you know more than Fran who has stated on a couple of times Uhl will be a THREE {3}. Jok as a FR played the SG while Marble played the 3, again as a SO Jok when he finally started after Clemmons got hurt, AGAIN PLAYED THE SG while Uthoff played the 3 and White played the 4. this year Clemmons is the 2 while Jok plays the 3 while Uthoff is the 4 and Woodbury plays the 5.

why is it. there are many BT teams starting FR but let somebody mention Fran starting a top 60 player and he/she gets ripped to shreds for it.

as for Bohanon, Pemsyl and Kriener I get it they are from IA and CAN'T BE ANY GOOD. with Bohanon and Kriener double damned because they are WHITE, the same thing that is wrong with Connor and Patrick plain and simple they are WHITE.

but you let those same kids sign with a out of state school or UNI and Fran gets crucified for not signing them.

WHITE PLAYERS are flat out not wanted at IA. only BLACKS from URBAN cities are allowed as they are only ones that can play BB.

maybe its time some of you bigots were banned. in 2012 these 3 FR started and they won 25 games and reached the NIT Championship, PG Gesell {WHITE}, Woodbury {WHITE} Clemmons {BLACK} and now they are on the verge of doing something no other 4 year starters have ever done win 4 20 regular win seasons in a row.

by doing that they will be setting the ALL TIME 4 YEAR RECORD FOR WINS. but you people do nothing but trash, bad mouth, any thing but compliment them.

while you do nothing but try to put square pegs into round holes even if it means using a 20 lb sledge hammer to do so.
 
Mohawkeye said:
Uhl is closer to 210 I think and really a 4/5, but I think a point well made. Both Kreiner and Cook are coming in physically ready to play the 5. My guess is Cook starts. I cannot imagine Baer not starting next year based upon what we've seen so far.
Click to expand...
and what has Baer done that has impressed you.

Uhl is the clear 6th man this year. also he replaces Jok when he comes in. as I forgot to ask. just who on this team right now is even qualified to start at the 4 or 5 position. to me it is 6'9 240 lbs 53rd best player by ESPN @ PF, and 6'10 NR 240 lb Kriener,

to me I see nobody, White was 6'9 230 and he did not start @ the PF till he was a SR as he played the 3 till then. Olaseni was 6'10 225 and never started but was named the BT's 6th Man as a SR.

on Uhl the roster lists him @ 6'8 185 lbs not exactly a banger @ center now is he. I will take 6'10 240 lb Kriener every time to bang in the 5 spot.

all I expect out of him as a FR is to score 5-7 ppg, 3-4 rpg and 1 bpg. anything over that and it will be gravey.

Woody's stats as a FR, 16.5 MPG, 4.9 PPG 4.8 RPG and that year IA won 25 games ang went to the NIT championship starting 3 Freshmen Gesell, Clemmons, Woodbury, 1 SO White and 1 JR Marble, in the 2016-17 season IA looks to have 1 SR starter in Jok, 1 JR starter in Uhl, possibly 1 SO in Williams the rest who knows will it be RSFR or TRUE FR that get to start.

Jones had Knee surgery so there is no definitive knowledge on his ability, 6'6 Baer is behind Uhl and to me has not really done much and IN MY OPINION if Jones does not have Knee surgery Baer does not get the minutes he is getting. as Jones would be the main backup at the 4/3 positions, Wagner is very Athletic but is handicapped by his ability to score,

Ellingson is a bench spark plug that reminds me of Jeff Moe, Fleming pickup way to many bad habits while @ Oak Hill and is relearning how to play team BB.. Moss and Hutton are both RS'ing so they are a unknown @ this time.

now please tell me who physically is in a better position to start?
 
Dom will be playing 4 or 5 majority of the time, not much depth with our bigs. Wagner, Uhl, Kreiner, Cook, a
hawkjazz said:
1st on Uhl, when Jok got hurt it was Uhl who took his place and he ended posting a dbl dbl of 14 points and 10 rebounds as the 3, everytime he comes in it is at the 3 not the 4 not the 5 BUT THE THREE PURE AND SIMPLE.
now unless you can tell specifically that you know more than Fran who has stated on a couple of times Uhl will be a THREE {3}. Jok as a FR played the SG while Marble played the 3, again as a SO Jok when he finally started after Clemmons got hurt, AGAIN PLAYED THE SG while Uthoff played the 3 and White played the 4. this year Clemmons is the 2 while Jok plays the 3 while Uthoff is the 4 and Woodbury plays the 5.

why is it. there are many BT teams starting FR but let somebody mention Fran starting a top 60 player and he/she gets ripped to shreds for it.

as for Bohanon, Pemsyl and Kriener I get it they are from IA and CAN'T BE ANY GOOD. with Bohanon and Kriener double damned because they are WHITE, the same thing that is wrong with Connor and Patrick plain and simple they are WHITE.

but you let those same kids sign with a out of state school or UNI and Fran gets crucified for not signing them.

WHITE PLAYERS are flat out not wanted at IA. only BLACKS from URBAN cities are allowed as they are only ones that can play BB.

maybe its time some of you bigots were banned. in 2012 these 3 FR started and they won 25 games and reached the NIT Championship, PG Gesell {WHITE}, Woodbury {WHITE} Clemmons {BLACK} and now they are on the verge of doing something no other 4 year starters have ever done win 4 20 regular win seasons in a row.

by doing that they will be setting the ALL TIME 4 YEAR RECORD FOR WINS. but you people do nothing but trash, bad mouth, any thing but compliment them.

while you do nothing but try to put square pegs into round holes even if it means using a 20 lb sledge hammer to do so.
Click to expand...
First of all I am a bit concerned, because you appear to be a psycho off his meds. Secondly, who said anything about white and black players? Third, nobody is ripping anybody about starting a Freshman. I for one said it is unlikely we start 2 Freshman because we have plenty of returning talent, one possibly but two unlikely. Yes in 2012 we started 2 Freshman but that was not out of luxury but more so we were coming off of a 10 win season. We now have established program but it is not like we are constantly pulling in a bunch of 1 and done Frosh that can come in and play right away.
 
milehighhawkeye24 said:
Dom will be playing 4 or 5 majority of the time, not much depth with our bigs. Wagner, Uhl, Kreiner, Cook, a

First of all I am a bit concerned, because you appear to be a psycho off his meds. Secondly, who said anything about white and black players? Third, nobody is ripping anybody about starting a Freshman. I for one said it is unlikely we start 2 Freshman because we have plenty of returning talent, one possibly but two unlikely. Yes in 2012 we started 2 Freshman but that was not out of luxury but more so we were coming off of a 10 win season. We now have established program but it is not like we are constantly pulling in a bunch of 1 and done Frosh that can come in and play right away.
Click to expand...

who do we have to start at the 4-5 spots,
Jok 2-3 spots
Uhl 3-4 spots and that's it

there will be 3 spots up for grabs the 1, 4 and 5, and the only ones that look physically ready to play are SO William @ PG
FR 6'9 240 lbs Cook @PF
FR 6'10 240 lbs Kriener,

6'7 230 lb SO Wagner @ the 5 don't think so
6'8 6'8 RSJR/RSSR Jones @ the 5 we don't even know how he will be after his 2nd knee surgery.
6'8 240 FR Pemsyl @ the 5 unlikely but possible some want him to RS as do I because of his knee surgery, 1st because it would give him another year to rehabilitate and 2nd spread the classes out.
 
Nobody tell Fran that Uhl can't play the 5 or he will stop using him there this year. Rewatch the Purdue game and see just how valuable it was to have Uhl at the 5 stretching the floor.
 
shoot_the_three said:
Nobody tell Fran that Uhl can't play the 5 or he will stop using him there this year. Rewatch the Purdue game and see just how valuable it was to have Uhl at the 5 stretching the floor.
Click to expand...

I thought part of the reason Fran was able to sign Uhl was that he projected Uhl as a 3.
Not sure Uhl is excited to be playing 5. I guess we will play small ball next year and have length at guard spots, but be undesized in post. Wagner and Kriener at post seems likely.
 
I would think that Uhl will primarily play the 4 but he will probably get minutes at the 5 too. Uhl helps Iowa more on the offense end at the 5 than he hurts Iowa at the defense end as a 5. I think we are starting to see the type of players that Fran prefers upfront, long and athletic. Outside of Woodbury (who is playing great this year) I can't remember a big that Fran recruited that couldn't knock down a 15 footer. Wagner I guess is an exception but he is only 6'7". IMHO I think Fran would prefer to have two PG/ball handlers and a long athletic front line that can shoot it. I think Iowa will become more of a pressing team next year and try to speed other teams up.

The thing that excites me about this years team, as I have stated before, is that this Iowa team shoots the ball as good as any Iowa team that I can remember. 86-87 team had multiple shooters but this team has/had (Jones) at least 6 guys that I feel good about taking an open three.
 
In today's game it is very common to not have a "traditional" 5 on the floor. In Fran's system the 1-5 is and can be interchangeable. Uhl plays an awful lot of "5" but it is more of a stretch 5. I do not think Uhl was excited to play the 5 this year until he actually started playing it. It forces the other teams 5 to play him more on the perimeter and more often than not forces teams to play zone or have a mismatch. On the flip side Iowa tends to press more in their 1-2-2 and fall back into a match up 2-3 or a 1-2-2 half court zone. There are not many teams that have a 6'10"+ 5 anymore any way. My best guess is this line-up
1- Williams
2- Jok
3- Baer
4- Wagner or Cook or Uhl
5- Uhl or Kreiner

Subs
1) Moss? or JB
2) Ellingson/Flemmin/Moss
3) Hutton/Moss
4) Pemsl (Pry RS) /Jones or Cook/Wagner (which ever one doesn't start
5) Kreiner

IMO I just think we try and avoid starting two Frosh, although it could be possible. I think one starts for sure out of necesity, but starting two should be last resort.
 
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hawkjazz said:
who do we have to start at the 4-5 spots,
Jok 2-3 spots
Uhl 3-4 spots and that's it

there will be 3 spots up for grabs the 1, 4 and 5, and the only ones that look physically ready to play are SO William @ PG
FR 6'9 240 lbs Cook @PF
FR 6'10 240 lbs Kriener,

6'7 230 lb SO Wagner @ the 5 don't think so
6'8 6'8 RSJR/RSSR Jones @ the 5 we don't even know how he will be after his 2nd knee surgery.
6'8 240 FR Pemsyl @ the 5 unlikely but possible some want him to RS as do I because of his knee surgery, 1st because it would give him another year to rehabilitate and 2nd spread the classes out.
Click to expand...
If you do not think Baer will be in the line up next year IDK what to tell you. It appears Baer, Jok, Uhl are pretty clear cut candidates for starters. So to me there is only the point and a post up for grabs b/c Jok will be 2, Baer is a 3, and Uhl will be 4 or 5 depending on Cook or Kriener. If cook starts Uhl to the 5, if Kriener starts Uhl to the 4. Also appear Wagner is physically ready this year and will only be better next year so would not surpise me if Uhl and Wagner are the posts next year either. Once again I think we try to aviod to starting Frosh...that is just my opinion so lets try to not have tantrum b/c I do not agree with you.
 
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I think Uhl will be primarily used at the 4 or 5, with Baer, Moss, Hutton, and Jok getting minutes at the 3. Baer will get starters minutes, but it is possible that rotations could work better with him coming of the bench.

Too early to know how competitions will shake out and how the rotation will work, but I will guess

PG Williams, with Bohannon back up, and Fleming as emergency back up
SG Jok, with Ellingson/Moss/Fleming back up
SF Baer, with Hutton/Moss as back up, and Jok swinging to 3 at times
PF Wagner, with Cook as primary backup, and Uhl or Baer or Hutton swinging there at times
Center Uhl, with Kriener as backup, and possibly Pemsl or Cook
 
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I agree mostly but believe Jok is the starter at 3, cos I believe Moss will be the 2 most of the time with Williams also playing the 2 some if his outside shooting is consistent and Fleming and then there is BE... this is making my head hurt, but it will be fun watching it play out.
 
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lovedwatchingLester said:
I agree mostly but believe Jok is the starter at 3, cos I believe Moss will be the 2 most of the time with Williams also playing the 2 some if his outside shooting is consistent and Fleming and then there is BE... this is making my head hurt, but it will be fun watching it play out.
Click to expand...
If Jok plays the 3 where do you see Baer fitting in? From his play thus far I think he appears as though he is in line to start next year. Jok's primary position is the 2 which he plays often when Uthoff moves to the 3 and uhl is at the 4 with woody at the 5.....
 
shoot_the_three said:
Nobody tell Fran that Uhl can't play the 5 or he will stop using him there this year. Rewatch the Purdue game and see just how valuable it was to have Uhl at the 5 stretching the floor.
Click to expand...

then you watched a different game as he played against Swanigan not Hammonds or Hass, Fran recruited him to play the 3 maybe 4 at times. Uhl was faster than Swanigan, a better ball handler and a better outside shooter.

you are one of those that keep trying to use a 20 lb sledge hammer in pounding a square peg into a round hole.

Fran HAS never used Uhl @ the 5 nor claimed that Uhl was a 5. Maryland recruited him to be a 3, Temple recruited him to be a 3 as did Minnesota, NW and PSU. that's 5 other coaches that recruited him to be a 3 and not a 5.
 
hawkjazz said:
then you watched a different game as he played against Swanigan not Hammonds or Hass, Fran recruited him to play the 3 maybe 4 at times. Uhl was faster than Swanigan, a better ball handler and a better outside shooter.

you are one of those that keep trying to use a 20 lb sledge hammer in pounding a square peg into a round hole.

Fran HAS never used Uhl @ the 5 nor claimed that Uhl was a 5. Maryland recruited him to be a 3, Temple recruited him to be a 3 as did Minnesota, NW and PSU. that's 5 other coaches that recruited him to be a 3 and not a 5.
Click to expand...
Dude here is a direct quote from hawkcentral "Eight minutes into Saturday's game with a slim deficit? Iowa ran out Gesell, Clemmons, Ellingson, Baer and Uhl. Moments later: Clemmons, Ellingson, Jok, Wagner and Woodbury." This was from the Drake game, in bold who do you think played the 5.....he also played the 5 in Purdue game....wtf are you talking about?!?!?!?!
 
shoot_the_three said:
lol milehigh that can't be right he was recruited as a 3 just ask hawkjazz.
Click to expand...

go ask Fran long before you ask me, also Fran now has the option of going with a 3 guard 2 forward line up or a 3 forward 2 guard line up to match what the other team puts out there, something that Fran didn't have the past 5 years,

funny how people who really know nothing about BB make things up to suit their fancy
 
hawkjazz said:
this is my opinion only
FR Kreiner @ center won't need to score a lot will be needed to patrol the paint
FR PF Cook reminds me of Reggie Evans
JR SF Uhl
SR SG Jok
SO PG Williams


would not mind seeing Pemsyl and possibly Bohanon RS, as I believe Moss and Fleming can be very serviceable as a backup PG.

Ellingson will backup Jok as will Moss
Baer and Hutton will backup Uhl
Wagner will backup Cook
Jones will backup Kreiner


my opinion is based on watching this years team, Jok has been known to bring the ball up the court as has Uthoff.

as most have noted the group coming in and off RS year is more athletic than the previous years. a little further and I will explain my madness.
Click to expand...
How many times have you seen Kreiner play? Must be a different player than I have seen.
 
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