Students sue Florida school, saying they were forced to undergo vaginal probes

[cigaretteman]

Two unnamed students who were enrolled in Valencia College’s Medical Diagnostic Sonography program in 2013 are suing the Florida school, claiming they were forced to undergo invasive and sometimes painful transvaginal ultrasounds nearly every week.

The school says it is “accepted practice” to use students as models in sonography training programs. Participating in the ultrasounds is voluntary, the school said.

But the two female students who filed a lawsuit in federal court last week say their academic standing and career prospects were threatened if they didn’t agree to participate. The practice was “widespread” and “so permanent” that it more or less constituted a “custom” at the school, according to the lawsuit.

A transvaginal ultrasound is a procedure that involves inserting a probe into a woman’s vagina to check for pregnancy, fertility or other reproductive problems. The probe is covered with a condom, then lubricated and inserted into the vagina. According to the lawsuit, the probe can be uncomfortable or painful and isn’t recommended for female patients who have not had sexual intercourse.

During orientation for the program, the lawsuit said, a second-year student explained the faculty believed that “students should undergo invasive transvaginal ultrasound procedures in order to become better sonography technicians.” The second-year student was nicknamed the “TransVag Queen,” according to the lawsuit.

In the fall of 2013, the two students who would later file suit expressed concerns about the practice to Barbara Ball, chair of Valencia State’s medical diagnostics sonography program, according to the lawsuit.

“One of the many concerns being the program had a male student who would also probe the female Plaintiffs on a regular basis,” the suit claims.

According to the suit, Ball told the students that they could “find another school if they did not wish to be probed.”

The suit claims that administrators threatened to lower the plaintiffs’ grades and interfere with their future employment prospects by “blacklisting” them at Central Florida hospitals if they didn’t submit to the probes.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...inal-probes/?tid=hybrid_experimentrandom_3_na

 

[thewop]

Maybe someone who's been through a medical program can speak to this? As a casual reader, I'd say if they're being trained to give them, getting one would be reasonable, but I see no reason they'd need to have it done more than once.

 

[The_Joker13]

Lol

 

[torbee]

FTA: According to the lawsuit, the probe can be uncomfortable or painful and isn’t recommended for female patients who have not had sexual intercourse.

I wonder how many college students that actually applies to.

 

[hawkifann]

Maybe someone who's been through a medical program can speak to this? As a casual reader, I'd say if they're being trained to give them, getting one would be reasonable, but I see no reason they'd need to have it done more than once.

My wife went through med school, but not a sonography training program, so I can't speak to that. I do recall that myself and several other spouses were guinea pigs for practicing IV sticks and there were a lot of basic level procedures they would practice on each other. I don't recall how they handled such things as breast and testicular cancer checks, but they probably did them.

I would think this case would come down to whether the women could prove that there was anything other than a professional approach taken in that training at that school. It makes sense that you'd train sonographers, in part, by having them practice with the equipment. At some point, you do so in a clinical setting, but I would imagine it's less than ideal if the first time they've ever used it is on a real patient. On the flip side, someone doing a bad job with it probably is going to cause pain -- and a bunch of noobs in training are probably going to be doing a bad job a certain percentage of the time.....but if this is standard practice and the program took a professional approach, it's probably going to be difficult to prove harm, though the school may just settle and make it go away.

 

[claykenny]

My wife went through med school, but not a sonography training program, so I can't speak to that. I do recall that myself and several other spouses were guinea pigs for practicing IV sticks and there were a lot of basic level procedures they would practice on each other. I don't recall how they handled such things as breast and testicular cancer checks, but they probably did them.

I would think this case would come down to whether the women could prove that there was anything other than a professional approach taken in that training at that school. It makes sense that you'd train sonographers, in part, by having them practice with the equipment. At some point, you do so in a clinical setting, but I would imagine it's less than ideal if the first time they've ever used it is on a real patient. On the flip side, someone doing a bad job with it probably is going to cause pain -- and a bunch of noobs in training are probably going to be doing a bad job a certain percentage of the time.....but if this is standard practice and the program took a professional approach, it's probably going to be difficult to prove harm, though the school may just settle and make it go away.

Most medical schools use people from the community (who are compensated, of course) for practice breast and testicular exams (as well as basic cardiopulmonary, neurological, musculoskeletal, etc. exams). We didn't do "simulated" pelvic exams and were expected to get that experience on real patients during the obstetrics/gynecology rotation. We did practice some physical exam skills and other technical skills on each other, but they typically limited to things like heart/lung auscultation, eye/ear exams, starting IVs, etc.

 

[at4iowa]

The University of Iowa medical school paid men and women to have medical students do prostate and pelvic exams on them. Medical students did draw blood from each other and did some other physical exam stuff, but they sure as heck didn't do any intimate exams on each other.

 

[torbee]

Most medical schools use people from the community (who are compensated, of course) for practice breast and testicular exams (as well as basic cardiopulmonary, neurological, musculoskeletal, etc. exams). We didn't do "simulated" pelvic exams and were expected to get that experience on real patients during the obstetrics/gynecology rotation. We did practice some physical exam skills and other technical skills on each other, but they typically limited to things like heart/lung auscultation, eye/ear exams, starting IVs, etc.

Wait a minute - are you telling me I could VOLUNTEER to have someone fondle my testicles and actually get PAID for it?

 

[at4iowa]

Wait a minute - are you telling me I could VOLUNTEER to have someone fondle my testicles and actually get PAID for it?

You are correct, Torbs. The men and women who showed up for these exams were an interesting group, especially the men.

 

[claykenny]

Wait a minute - are you telling me I could VOLUNTEER to have someone fondle my testicles and actually get PAID for it?

Yep.

I recall one guy at my school who had been doing it for years (prostate and testicular exam volunteer). He was even in the instructional video we had to watch. Something tells me that he was in it more for the exam than the cash...

I also had a simulated patient with a penile prosthetic that he didn't disclose prior to the exam. I found the bulb, had no clue what it was, and then proceeded to inflate it... I was pretty creeped out until he explained the prosthetic and demonstrated it. He said very few students even find the bulb. I went into urology.

 

[at4iowa]

I should add that the volunteers were well versed in the exam and essentially taught while they were being examined. There would be 2-3 people in the room at a time and we would take turns doing the exam. One of my classmates was doing a pelvic exam on this woman and she said, "can you take your thumb off of my clitoris, please?" I damn near fell over laughing when I heard the story.

 

[JWolf74]

At my school, we did not hire men for testicular or prostate exams. We did hire females to learn how to do pelvic exams before we headed out on rotations. Mine was actually on my first Anniversary, so I got to do that rather than go to dinner and do fun bedroom things.

Everything else we used fellows students and mannequins to practice on.

 

[JWolf74]

Yep.

I recall one guy at my school who had been doing it for years (prostate and testicular exam volunteer). He was even in the instructional video we had to watch. Something tells me that he was in it more for the exam than the cash...

I also had a simulated patient with a penile prosthetic that he didn't disclose prior to the exam. I found the bulb, had no clue what it was, and then proceeded to inflate it... I was pretty creeped out until he explained the prosthetic and demonstrated it. He said very few students even find the bulb. I went into urology.

The most fascinating surgery I assisted on during my surgery rotation was a penile prosthetic implantation at the VA. Watching them core out the corpus cavernosum was...disturbing.

 

[claykenny]

The most fascinating surgery I assisted on during my surgery rotation was a penile prosthetic implantation at the VA. Watching them core out the corpus cavernosum was...disturbing.

What's really disturbing is getting an intraoperative consult for a hernia repair because they "accidentally amputated the penis"...

 

[JWolf74]

What's really disturbing is getting an intraoperative consult for a hernia repair because they "accidentally amputated the penis"...

Just nip the tip...

 

[Bulldogs1974]

I've gotten a good laugh out of this thread.

 

[TJ8869]

When I was in junior high and high school they grabbed my balls and told me to cough. Somebody owes me some cash.

 

[BABiscuit]

This thread made me lol and gave me a boner. Good stuff.