The Curious Case of Isaiah Moss

[owenhawk]

You bring up some valid criticisms of his game. The no-shows in big games and general inconsistency are well documented. Rebounding is also a problem area. His “basketball IQ” can be called into question at times.

I’ll still trust the stats which indicate that overall, Moss is not “weak” with the ball. And I recall games where even when his shot wasn’t falling, he played good defense and got minutes because of it. As far as passing goes, he does occasionally have the weak/lazy pass. However that is an issue which extends to more than a couple players on this team. I’ve also seen IM make some really impressive thread-the-needle passes along with some nice drives and dump offs to Cook for jams.

Regardless, if you put more stock in the eye test and I put more stock in the stats, I can agree to disagree. Appreciate the thought-out, grown-up response as opposed to childish name calling

Definitely fair points. I probably lean on the side of being really hard on him and maybe expecting too much.

It just bothers me that going into a big game (against a really good team or needing a big win) it seems like he can’t be counted on to give much. And I’m not talking about just scoring. For as much heat as Fran and the team get for not having a dynamic PG, I personally believe having a more consistent and reliable SG is just as much of an issue if they want to be a really good team.

 

[24 so far]

The other thing is, he's a really good free throw shooter, but I don't think he was on the court when we were trying to ice it against Indiana, and I think that's been the case in some other close games as well. Garza was fouled out, so he wasn't an option.

So Fran must not have a lot of confidence he can get open to retrieve it, or hang on to it once he does. Isn't he 85% from the line or so? If that is true, you would think that player would be wanted on the court at the end of close games. Just doesn't seem like he's one of the "closers" very often, but I could be mistaken.

 

[5446myno]

Moss looks asleep and mentally checked out in his goose egg games as you call it.

Just my 2 cents

And half the time in plenty of others

 

[5446myno]

I’ve used statistics to support all of my points and opinion

This is part of the problem. Stats don't always tell the whole story. When Moss is engaged and shooting the ball he's a good offensive player, even if he doesn't have the handles to take it to the rim with any confidence. In those stretches hell pick up some assists at times, yes.

The rest of the time he's not worth much, though he doesn't usually commit a ton of turnovers in those stretches like previous years, so there's that.

But mostly I called you dense because when someone pointed out that 2 assists doesn't make your case, you responded by suggesting that meant everyone averaging less than 2 assists must not be a good offensive player either, which was an extremely dense way to look at it.

 

[unoHawkeye]

This is part of the problem. Stats don't always tell the whole story. When Moss is engaged and shooting the ball he's a good offensive player, even if he doesn't have the handles to take it to the rim with any confidence. In those stretches hell pick up some assists at times, yes.

The rest of the time he's not worth much, though he doesn't usually commit a ton of turnovers in those stretches like previous years, so there's that.

But mostly I called you dense because when someone pointed out that 2 assists doesn't make your case, you responded by suggesting that meant everyone averaging less than 2 assists must not be a good offensive player either, which was an extremely dense way to look at it.

The bolded portion was literally my entire point in this thread. That he isn’t as weak with the ball as some make him out to be. Glad you agree

As far as me being dense, you missed my point. I only listed assist numbers across the board to show a trend of low assists across the team, when another poster suggested that they should be higher given Iowa’s high scoring motion offense. Of course players contribute to an offense in other ways

 

[unoHawkeye]

Definitely fair points. I probably lean on the side of being really hard on him and maybe expecting too much.

It just bothers me that going into a big game (against a really good team or needing a big win) it seems like he can’t be counted on to give much. And I’m not talking about just scoring. For as much heat as Fran and the team get for not having a dynamic PG, I personally believe having a more consistent and reliable SG is just as much of an issue if they want to be a really good team.

It’s frustrating to me too. At least you know he’ll show up for the games that Iowa should win though if nobody else does. And the threat of him shooting means that defenses still have to play him tight which opens up the lane for Garza/Cook to work

 

[BirdistheWord]

OK, so i found his game by game statistics, and admittedly was surprised that he was a bit more "consistently mediocre" than i remembered.

His only real "goose egg" games as i coined, were the last two. 3 out of last 4 games he has 2 points TOTAL.

And, he has not JUST feasted on poor competition. He has done well against the likes of MSU (at least first game), Purdue and ISU.

3, 3, 8, 8,15, 4, 2 (wisky), 13 (MSU), 20 (ISU), 4, 9, 15, 7, 13 (Pur), 12, 12, 9, 12, 21, 2 (MSU), 23, 0, 0

https://hawkeyesports.com/cumestats.aspx?path=mbball

 

[unoHawkeye]

OK, so i found his game by game statistics, and admittedly was surprised that he was a bit more "consistently mediocre" than i remembered.

His only real "goose egg" games as i coined, were the last two. 3 out of last 4 games he has 2 points.

And, he has not JUST feasted on poor competition.

3, 3, 8, 8,15, 4, 2 (wisky), 13 (MSU), 20 (ISU), 4, 9, 15, 7, 13 (Pur), 12, 12, 9, 12, 21, 2 (MSU), 23, 0, 0

https://hawkeyesports.com/cumestats.aspx?path=mbball

Thanks for sharing. That’s more consistent than I thought as well. He’s had a couple really nice games, but I don’t think we’ve seen his best yet this year... maybe he should just start pretending he’s playing Minnesota every game

 

[5446myno]

The bolded portion was literally my entire point in this thread. That he isn’t as weak with the ball as some make him out to be. Glad you agree

As far as me being dense, you missed my point. I only listed assist numbers across the board to show a trend of low assists across the team, when another poster suggested that they should be higher given Iowa’s high scoring motion offense. Of course players contribute to an offense in other ways

(Facepalm)

 

[unoHawkeye]

(Facepalm)

I keep facepalming too when I respond to your posts but forget that you are incapable of holding a rational grown-up discussion

 

[HawkRugged17]

Moss is on the board already vs Northwestern.

 

[owenhawk]

OK, so i found his game by game statistics, and admittedly was surprised that he was a bit more "consistently mediocre" than i remembered.

His only real "goose egg" games as i coined, were the last two. 3 out of last 4 games he has 2 points TOTAL.

And, he has not JUST feasted on poor competition. He has done well against the likes of MSU (at least first game), Purdue and ISU.

3, 3, 8, 8,15, 4, 2 (wisky), 13 (MSU), 20 (ISU), 4, 9, 15, 7, 13 (Pur), 12, 12, 9, 12, 21, 2 (MSU), 23, 0, 0

https://hawkeyesports.com/cumestats.aspx?path=mbball

Interesting. That’s a little better then I expected. I totally forgot he had a good game against ISU. I will give him props for hitting a few big shots late in the comeback tonight. That little coast to coast 8 ft jumper he hit near the end was nice (and unexpected by me because I told my kid when was bringing it down “Come on Moss don’t mess this up”.).

The scoring numbers do kind of back what I was saying. Besides the ISU game, he had had his big scoring games in blowouts by other team when his points didn’t really mean anything (MSU and Purdue) or against inferior opponents. I giguted he’s have a good scoring game tonight going into the game.

And it’s not really the scoring I have as much of an issue with, it’s what I feel is his his lacking in other phases that is only magnified when he’s not scoring.

I don’t know maybe I’m being overly hard on him. I just feel his spot could use an upgrade with a better all-around and consistent player.