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The Elephant in the Room?

Whinny

Whinny

All-Conference
Aug 6, 2007
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SW Michigan
I haven't seen this discussed here yet, and it's been bothering me. It's been obvious that we've gone conservative in our play calling in the third quarter of our last two games. Lots of plodding carries up the middle. Looking a lot like recent year Hawkeye teams. All I know is that a different offense seems to show up after halftime. And I'm not liking it. My questions: Is Kirk reverting back to his old conservative ways? Is it just an attempt to control the clock to keep the ball away from the opponent? Is it due to the injuries to CJ and our RB's that limit our offensive options as the game goes on?

What think you all?
 
It's kirks philosophy. It's also am NFL philosophy of shortening the game, especially when holding a lead. Running the football is NOT a bad option for us. Whst I don't like is that we seem more dynamic in our run schemes in the first half. We see wadley pressing the edge and we see some perimeter runs that have worked very very well for us. In the 3rd quarter, it's a lot of middle zone runs and while those plays are necessary to set up play action, we run more effectively when we're creative in the schemes.
To that end, we can clearly see Brian Ferentz's fingerprint in the running game and we're running some more diverse plays than in past years. Just wish we'd stay the course with it in 3rd quarters. We ran for 234 against Indiana. Iowa football simply doesn't lose with that kind of effectiveness on the ground. I think we cone close to the 200 mark again Saturday.
 
We have 246 pass attempts and 391 rush attempts so far this year. That's 61% rush which is about perfect. Most good teams, especially those that play a similar style to Iowa (like Alabama), are above 60% every year.
 
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Night and day difference in the play calling in the second half of Maryland and Indiana games. Against Maryland we were up 21-0. Maryland does not have a quick strike offense. They were not likely to put up 21 points on us in one half. The proper strategy was to play conservative and run the ball. Indiana game was much more competitive and Indiana does have the capability to put up points in a hurry. We threw the ball a great deal more in the second half against Indiana than we did against Maryland. Our goal was to control the ball and the clock using the running game and a short passing game.

Executed the strategy quite well in both games.
 
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Best way to wear a team down and keep their spread offense off the field is to run it down their throat. I was at the Illinois game and it was something see how they couldn't stop Iowa even though they knew Iowa was going to run the ball. Iowa ran it 11 times in a row took 5-6 minutes off the clock plus pretty much put the game away with a field goal.
 
I think in the third quarter you have a quarterback who, after playing a half of football, gets a little sore and stiff. I think he gets a little more conservative(unless you have to regain the lead) to avoid further injury.
 
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I'm likely remembering wrong, but didn't Iowa throw deep immediately to start their first possession of the 3rd quarter? They kept taking shots when they could. Just didn't happen.
 
The big difference is that Iowa was in complete control of the Maryland and Indiana games, despite the close second-half scores. Even considering that Indiana was an on-side kick recovery away from possibly having a miracle game-tying drive (TD + 2-Pt conv), neither game did I have any doubt Iowa would put the opponent away. Before this year, we'd go into ultra-conservative mode even when the game was still in doubt and had the feel for an opponent's comeback. This year's great defense has a lot to do with it, also.
 
[QUOTE="grosie#2, post: 1196042, member: 10652"]Best way to wear a team down and keep their spread offense off the field is to run it down their throat. I was at the Illinois game and it was something see how they couldn't stop Iowa even though they knew Iowa was going to run the ball. Iowa ran it 11 times in a row took 5-6 minutes off the clock plus pretty much put the game away with a field goal.[/QUOTE]

It is what the bullies of the big ten do......wear them down.
 
Whew! When I saw the thread title here I thought Iowa did something stupid and went out and hired Mark Mangino as the new OC.
 
Whinny said:
I haven't seen this discussed here yet, and it's been bothering me. It's been obvious that we've gone conservative in our play calling in the third quarter of our last two games. Lots of plodding carries up the middle. Looking a lot like recent year Hawkeye teams. All I know is that a different offense seems to show up after halftime. And I'm not liking it. My questions: Is Kirk reverting back to his old conservative ways? Is it just an attempt to control the clock to keep the ball away from the opponent? Is it due to the injuries to CJ and our RB's that limit our offensive options as the game goes on?

What think you all?
Click to expand...
I've heard others say this, and there is some merit to it. I really hope that we aren't doing the "play to not lose" crap we have seen in the past. What got us here was being aggressive and attacking, that is what we should end it with.
 
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citizenHawk said:
I'm likely remembering wrong, but didn't Iowa throw deep immediately to start their first possession of the 3rd quarter? They kept taking shots when they could. Just didn't happen.
Click to expand...
True, there were a couple of deep throws by CJ that just missed the mark. I think both went to Tevaun.
 
I saw it more with Maryland than Indiana. Protecting CJ more than anything and tried to do that with Daniels pounding away...and it didn't work well. Defenses know what Iowa's going to run with Daniels more than it does with the other 3.

Iowa badly needs to get CJ healthy somehow...limited mobility turns him into a stronger armed version of Rudock. A steady dose of play action and waggles and Iowa's offense rolls very well. Then you can use Daniels more efficiently because it's 7 in the box and not 8 or 9.
 
bagdropper said:
I saw it more with Maryland than Indiana. Protecting CJ more than anything and tried to do that with Daniels pounding away...and it didn't work well. Defenses know what Iowa's going to run with Daniels more than it does with the other 3.

Iowa badly needs to get CJ healthy somehow...limited mobility turns him into a stronger armed version of Rudock. A steady dose of play action and waggles and Iowa's offense rolls very well. Then you can use Daniels more efficiently because it's 7 in the box and not 8 or 9.
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Agreed, I would have liked to see Mitchell get more carries in. I think he's Daniels with a bit more speed. I hoping that IF the RB's are all truly ready to rock and healthy that they take full advantage of that these next few games.
 
If you paid attention in the Maryland game, they play calling wasn't much different in the 3rd quarter they were just getting stuffed and Beathard wasn't completing his passes. In the 4th quarter they definitely just played vanilla but not in the 3rd.

In the Indiana game they weren't conservative in the second half. They only had the ball twice in the 3rd quarter. The first drive ended on Indiana's 26 when Iowa went for it on 4th and medium instead of kicking a field goal. The two drives that scored touchdowns were mostly a result of passing plays.
 
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ELEPHANT? REALLY? Is this some stinking redneck bastard from Alabama trolling us because you have one loss? Nice try you LOSER!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
 
Sigh .....:rolleyes:.

When a play doesn't work well, it is "conservative".

When a play works well, it is "aggressive".

Like when we scored on the 2nd play of the game against Indy, we were aggressive! I expected we would score on the 2nd play on every series. But, sure enough - KF pulled back on the reigns and we became "conservative", and it actually took several plays to score. Geesh!

Other teams have coaches that coach and players that play - perhaps they adjust well and it takes a couple of series to get something else working? Nope. It's because KF is afraid of success and wants to reign the offense in. Then Brian says, "Dammit Dad! We should run plays that work!" Then things are fine again.

3e3945b.jpg
 
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Whinny said:
I haven't seen this discussed here yet, and it's been bothering me. It's been obvious that we've gone conservative in our play calling in the third quarter of our last two games. Lots of plodding carries up the middle. Looking a lot like recent year Hawkeye teams. All I know is that a different offense seems to show up after halftime. And I'm not liking it. My questions: Is Kirk reverting back to his old conservative ways? Is it just an attempt to control the clock to keep the ball away from the opponent? Is it due to the injuries to CJ and our RB's that limit our offensive options as the game goes on?

What think you all?
Click to expand...
9 total posts since 2007.....should have kept it at 8
 
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bagdropper said:
I saw it more with Maryland than Indiana. Protecting CJ more than anything and tried to do that with Daniels pounding away...and it didn't work well. Defenses know what Iowa's going to run with Daniels more than it does with the other 3.

Iowa badly needs to get CJ healthy somehow...limited mobility turns him into a stronger armed version of Rudock. A steady dose of play action and waggles and Iowa's offense rolls very well. Then you can use Daniels more efficiently because it's 7 in the box and not 8 or 9.
Click to expand...

I think that against Maryland, we saw Iowa execute just the very nuts and bolts of our run-game. I think that the purpose of it was three-fold ... one was to get guys on the OL transitioned to playing together, another was to protect CJ, and, lastly, it was used to set up opponents downstream (particularly Indiana).

Against Indiana, we still ran our base runs ... but we also sprinkled in other wrinkles ... and to positive effect. We used the same counter-action run we had success with against Northwestern ... and saw success against Indiana as well. We saw that beauty of a draw-play that was our 2nd play of the game.

But, part of our success in that game was our ability to eat the clock. The other team cannot score if they don't have the ball. Indiana knew that they could exploit our D by using tempo ... but they also limited their use of it because they also knew that they'd be screwing their own D in the process. We kept their D on the field a long time and we ended up going 4 for 4 for TDs in the red-zone. That spells success to me.
 
Herkmeister said:
ELEPHANT? REALLY? Is this some stinking redneck bastard from Alabama trolling us because you have one loss? Nice try you LOSER!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
Click to expand...

"Stinking redneck bastard? Loser?" Hardly. Actually, I'm a 76 year old grandma and a graduate of U of Iowa 1961. I've been a Hawkeye fan since before many of you were even conceived. My post reflects my actual concern over what I've noticed in the last few games. Thanks to most of you who responded with helpful insight. To you few bullies who are throwing insults at me, lighten up. You never know who's on the other keyboard. Besides, I have Grey Power and I know how to use it. *granny smoochies*

GO HAWKS!!
 
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It's is a mystery. How could "New Kirk" do almost exactly the same things "old Kirk" used to do....

I'm going to research and get back to you. I fear these 2 people may actually be the same guy.
 
Whinny said:
"Stinking redneck bastard? Loser?" Hardly. Actually, I'm a 76 year old grandma and a graduate of U of Iowa 1961. I've been a Hawkeye fan since before many of you were even conceived. My post reflects my actual concern over what I've noticed in the last few games. Thanks to most of you who responded with helpful insight. To you few bullies who are throwing insults at me, lighten up. You never know who's on the other keyboard. Besides, I have Grey Power and I know how to use it. *granny smoochies*

GO HAWKS!!
Click to expand...
Now that was awesome.
 
Whinny said:
"Stinking redneck bastard? Loser?" Hardly. Actually, I'm a 76 year old grandma and a graduate of U of Iowa 1961. I've been a Hawkeye fan since before many of you were even conceived. My post reflects my actual concern over what I've noticed in the last few games. Thanks to most of you who responded with helpful insight. To you few bullies who are throwing insults at me, lighten up. You never know who's on the other keyboard. Besides, I have Grey Power and I know how to use it. *granny smoochies*

GO HAWKS!!
Click to expand...


I highly doubt a 76 year old Grandma would be on a Football board....but I have seen some crazy sh*t in my life.........
 
ghostOfHomer777 said:
I think that against Maryland, we saw Iowa execute just the very nuts and bolts of our run-game. I think that the purpose of it was three-fold ... one was to get guys on the OL transitioned to playing together, another was to protect CJ, and, lastly, it was used to set up opponents downstream (particularly Indiana).

Against Indiana, we still ran our base runs ... but we also sprinkled in other wrinkles ... and to positive effect. We used the same counter-action run we had success with against Northwestern ... and saw success against Indiana as well. We saw that beauty of a draw-play that was our 2nd play of the game.

But, part of our success in that game was our ability to eat the clock. The other team cannot score if they don't have the ball. Indiana knew that they could exploit our D by using tempo ... but they also limited their use of it because they also knew that they'd be screwing their own D in the process. We kept their D on the field a long time and we ended up going 4 for 4 for TDs in the red-zone. That spells success to me.
Click to expand...

Game plan seems to vary a little from game to game, situation to situation. Which is good! I expect the Hawks to pressure Leidner tomorrow and force them into being one dimensional. On offense, I can see plenty of play action early to build up a lead, then pound Minnesota into submission in the 4th quarter with the run game.
 
83Hawk said:
Game plan seems to vary a little from game to game, situation to situation. Which is good! I expect the Hawks to pressure Leidner tomorrow and force them into being one dimensional. On offense, I can see plenty of play action early to build up a lead, then pound Minnesota into submission in the 4th quarter with the run game.
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I would like to start that pounding in the 2nd quarter please. Give Wiegers the entire 4th quarter would make me happy
 
I think in the second half of the Maryland game, Iowa's strategy was to "keep the offense off the field to give them some rest". It is the natural extension of the "keep the defense off the field" approach, when applied to the goal of preserving the offensive players.

;)
 
Whinny said:
"Stinking redneck bastard? Loser?" Hardly. Actually, I'm a 76 year old grandma and a graduate of U of Iowa 1961. I've been a Hawkeye fan since before many of you were even conceived. My post reflects my actual concern over what I've noticed in the last few games. Thanks to most of you who responded with helpful insight. To you few bullies who are throwing insults at me, lighten up. You never know who's on the other keyboard. Besides, I have Grey Power and I know how to use it. *granny smoochies*

GO HAWKS!!
Click to expand...
I knew you were serious Whinny. Plus I knew you were not a Bama redneck. I was just taking advantage of the word "elephant" to throw a barb at Alabama fans. My attempt at humor was obviously not clear. Never would I want to be considered a bully. Sorry for any misunderstanding. Glad we got that Minnesota win my friend.
 
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