IMO the entire team looked tired at the end of the ISU game Having those 4 guys log 30+ minutes twice a week is (again IMO) a recipe for disaster; especially when you look at the last 7 or 8 games of the season.
Who starts now?
- Thread starter Zildjian6868
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IMO the entire team looked tired at the end of the ISU game Having those 4 guys log 30+ minutes twice a week is (again IMO) a recipe for disaster; especially when you look at the last 7 or 8 games of the season.
If he can slow down a bit and be patient he will do just that. He has some skills and ability he just doesn't have the same feel of things like Garza does.
He looks like he can hardly move or take any contact. It's got to be the back rather than the knee, because he didn't look this bad to start the season.
That stretch again isu was hard to watch.
Maybe he gets some treatment and it improves latter in the year.
Hes the worst offensive player yes, but on a team full of good offensive players.
Hes good on perimiter defense, but poor at rebounding and has shown some potentially good handles.
He was a pg before this year so hes been out of of position too on both ends.
You cant cut down to 6 man rotation IMO, BE is going to have to play more and I would be shocked if he doesn't improve now with increased pt.
Yes we seem to have trouble salting the game away in our stall mode. Looks to me like we could use JoeT out there for quickness. We seem to be emphasizing free throw shooting as opposed to quickness.
If you’ve watched Fran’s rotations the last couple games you can see where he’s going with the lineup. There is a point of diminishing returns on any starter when you start going over 30-32 minutes/game for an extended period of time in the BIG. Foul trouble and a starter having an off night will be a factor as well.
Who said anything about a 6 man rotation?
Touissant
Fredrick
Wieskamp
Connor
Garza
Kriener
Pemsl
Evelyn
I just dont think increasing Evelyn's minutes is the right idea. He was a PG with 165 career assists and 160 career turnovers for his career with 2 of those 3 years being played in the Valley. Not sure why you think he can help at this level with an increase in playing time.
His win shares per 40 minutes is at -.009. An average player is .100. His ORtg is 67.5. The next lowest on the team of guys that get regular minutes is Pemsl with an ORtg of 92.4.
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This years stats:
Pts Rb FG% 3PT FT%
6.3 4.4 56 33 71
That seems pretty good to me.
On the other subject of minutes for everyone, Millers 'Six Pack' scored over 100 pts a game in 1970 with 6 players getting most of the minutes. The stats online don't show minutes, so I can't give exact numbers. I am guessing they each averaged 31-35. Of course they had 2 guys that played at least 15 years in NBA (lol).
What is the alternative? I'm not trying to be cute or argumentative, but really the only options would be:
Play bigger - use Kriener and Pemsl a lot more. I don't think the team is helped by this.
Play Evelyn and Toussaint a lot more minutes. Both of them will have to play more as it is to fill the void by Bohannon.
Playing 30+ minutes a game is a heavy workload, but it is done. Michigan went 15-5 in league last year, and had 3 guys play over 31 minutes a game, another average 29.6 minutes a game and a 5th (Teske) go for 28 minutes a game.
Michigan State had 3 guys play 30+ minutes a game and would have had a 4th in Langford had not been hurt. And their core guys got more rest due to more blowouts.
Purdue (a very deep team) had Edwards and Cline both at over 34 minutes a game, then 2 more over 25 minutes a game.
Wisconsin had 3 guys at 32+ minutes per game last year. Maryland had 3 at 30 minutes a game last year, and 2 more at 26 or more.
The workload is going to be a bit extreme, but I am not sure what other choices Fran has. I suppose if Patrick McCaffery becomes an option it would ease the workload, but I'm not sure he's even practicing right now. Expecting him to play meaningful minutes at a high level after sitting out this long would be unfair to him. 2 games a week is manageable if the practice load is lighter.
Meh, good info just hasn't looked good while in more often then not I hope he figures it out and finishes strong always liked him and he is needed regardless if he starts or not.
Evenlyn can be a lot better than he is. He’s not great by any means but he’s shown me more the past couple of weeks. He just doesn’t look good for short stints.
Kriener was voted most improved player last year. This year his numbers are up in every category once again while playing the same minutes. Advanced analytics show Kriener to be one of the top couple defenders. As far as offensive efficiency Kriener is rated number two behind Garza. Kriener leads the team in FG% and has proven to be a three point threat. In the last 9 games Kriener has only had 5 turnovers and his foul numbers are once again improved from last year. Kriener has shown steady improvement over his career while only being given sporadic minutes. As we enter the Big Ten more and more teams will employ two big men. Over his career, Kriener has consistently performed better in Big Ten games vs pre season games where teams routinely employed 4 guard starting lineups. Matchups will dictate minutes going forward. Kriener is a proven Big Ten player who has been through the league three times. There will be games he plays 15 minutes and there will be games he plays 25 minutes and gets 15 points and some boards. We don’t need him to do more then he’s capable of. We just need him to be solid as he’s proven to be over his last couple of years. If he averages 20 minutes/game. His past stats say he should average 8.5 to 9 points and 6 boards if he’s given 20 minutes/game. Pretty good numbers while being efficient and a good defender. Those are good numbers, whether he starts or not. Just another piece of the puzzle on a team with some very good pieces.
Ralph's 6 pack team was my favorite team in history, but they played very little defense.
I’ve seen him play well. I saw several of his games last year and he was respectable in a certain role. He looked very comfortable vs SDSU where he got extended minutes.
I think people were vastly overrating him coming into the year but now the pendulum has swung too far the other way.
They weren't tired, they didn't know how to run a slow it down half-court offense.
If I were coaching this is what I would do. I really like how Connor has been playing at the 4, but he'll need to play more point guard now. Kriener and Till will need to play more and hopefully the light turns on for Evelyn now that this huge opportunity has fallen into his lap.
In my opinion, like many others, you can't start Kriener. While Garza has dramatically cut down on his fouls, there may be a time when he will have to sit and Ryan is his best replacement.
I'm thinking you have to throw Mr. T into the fire and hope he can handle the extra minutes and limit his TO's. He certainly isn't afraid of the challenge and brings a lot to the table. I really wish that Bakari and Pemsl would settle down and provide some productive minutes. They'll be needed.
I'm thinking you have to throw Mr. T into the fire and hope he can handle the extra minutes and limit his TO's. He certainly isn't afraid of the challenge and brings a lot to the table. I really wish that Bakari and Pemsl would settle down and provide some productive minutes. They'll be needed.
I get what you're saying, but I don't think we've seen a large enough sample size to make any conclusions for Evelyn. His defense has been solid, especially in Las Vegas. He's probably putting a lot of pressure on himself as the new guy on the team with only 1 year to prove himself. He's obviously played quite a bit at the mid major level with some success. I'm not prepared to write him off and we obviously are going to need him.
Kriener has been very good. He might be the best back up center Iowa has had since I've been watching, and it just so happens that he plays behind the best center Iowa has had since I've been watching.
We need him coming off the bench, and starting him would be a tremendous mistake.
We need him coming off the bench, and starting him would be a tremendous mistake.
Toussaint and Evelyn will have to play more minutes,... it's going to be what it's going to be...
Great post. There are times when Kreiner can struggle and look out of sorts but I think more often then not, he is a plus. Also, as you said he has a ton of Big Ten experience and that should help. While Kreiner, Pemsl, and Evelyn are by no means great, I do like that the guys who will be coming off the bench are all seasoned vets who have been through the conference wars before.
The offense has been running thru CMac quite a bit so far as a point forward. It wasn't his offense that was the issue most of the time but his difficulty stopping pg penetration of the defensive end. I would leave things the way were are and start Joe T. Start the game with a quicker team. You can always bring Kriener in after 2-3 minutes if needed.
I think with JBo out, CJ need the ball in his hands a bit more. Would like to see CJ get 5-6 more shot a game.
Run with Joe T and when he gets a little sideways Fran has to pull him out, let him get right and put him right back in at the next dead ball.
I don't think we will get much consistency out of Kreiner, Pemsl, Evelyn, Till but if 1 or 2 of them could have good night every other game or string a couple of games together that would be a great help.
I think CJ has to fill in most of the JBo void with Joe T lending a hand
Generally agree about short lineups. Disagree on PMac. The lad was a huge, if inevitable, recruit and appears to be a very talented player. The absence of Nunge has only served to help the team.
Since Jordan moved into starting lineup for 6 games after Nunge injury he's averaged about 29 minutes a game.
So I look at it that we need to find 29 minutes somewhere. Garza, Wieskamp, CMac and Fredrick already average a good amount of minutes (CMac 27.7 , Fredrick 26.2 and Luka and Joe both over 30). So I really don't think we need to see much more from them (maybe 2 to 4 more from C.J and Connor)
Now Joe T and Ryan K both around 15 min a game, so if they both can increase about 10 each to 25 min per game then Cordell 11 and Bakari 12 can fill in where needed at about 3 to 4 more minutes.
Really going to need to stay injury free and avoid foul trouble (thanks captain obvious)
I'd go with starters:
Garza 30 min (no change)
CMac 30 min (2 more min)
Wieskamp 30 min (no change)
Fredrick 30 min (4 more min)
Joe T 25 min (10 more min)
Bench:
Kriener 25 min (10 more min)
Evelyn 15 min (3 more min)
Pemsl 15 min (4 more min)
So I look at it that we need to find 29 minutes somewhere. Garza, Wieskamp, CMac and Fredrick already average a good amount of minutes (CMac 27.7 , Fredrick 26.2 and Luka and Joe both over 30). So I really don't think we need to see much more from them (maybe 2 to 4 more from C.J and Connor)
Now Joe T and Ryan K both around 15 min a game, so if they both can increase about 10 each to 25 min per game then Cordell 11 and Bakari 12 can fill in where needed at about 3 to 4 more minutes.
Really going to need to stay injury free and avoid foul trouble (thanks captain obvious)
I'd go with starters:
Garza 30 min (no change)
CMac 30 min (2 more min)
Wieskamp 30 min (no change)
Fredrick 30 min (4 more min)
Joe T 25 min (10 more min)
Bench:
Kriener 25 min (10 more min)
Evelyn 15 min (3 more min)
Pemsl 15 min (4 more min)
This sounds about right but I think there is a good chance Till will be counted in fir a few minutes each half.
Kriener is most valuable as Garza's back-up. That is true for foul issues, but also Luka's need for occasional in-game rest to keep him from being worn down in March.
Pemsl and Till are currently not BIG caliber bigs. Pemsl's injuries are to blame, and Till is a normal walk-on, rather than a Baer walk-on. The truth is, the team needs another quality big, even if JBo could play.
Give Joe T. most of JBo's minutes, and Bakari the rest. Hope Luka can make it through the season injury-free without being overly worn down, and let Ryan do his thing mostly as a back-up, or with Luka during the second half of games if both have avoided foul trouble.
And, seriously, if one of the football team's 6'6+ bulky guys are willing to set screens, defend with physicality, and rebound, work a deal with Kirk and have one on the bench, if needed, starting January 1.
Pemsl and Till are currently not BIG caliber bigs. Pemsl's injuries are to blame, and Till is a normal walk-on, rather than a Baer walk-on. The truth is, the team needs another quality big, even if JBo could play.
Give Joe T. most of JBo's minutes, and Bakari the rest. Hope Luka can make it through the season injury-free without being overly worn down, and let Ryan do his thing mostly as a back-up, or with Luka during the second half of games if both have avoided foul trouble.
And, seriously, if one of the football team's 6'6+ bulky guys are willing to set screens, defend with physicality, and rebound, work a deal with Kirk and have one on the bench, if needed, starting January 1.
last 6 games he's started since Nunge went down he averaged 29 min per game.
That depends on Pemsl's back and if he can become effective or not? He's at least rebounding when he's getting minutes and we really need that if we are going to keep playing small.
I'm assuming the key word in that statement is "high."
I think another aspect of Jordan's game that we will definitely miss is his ability to make all of his FT's at the end of games. We do have other good free throw shooters, but Jordan was absolute money.
I still think Fran will have Till out there 3-4 minutes a game just to give guys a breather and I am fine with that. Nothing should be expected much from him other than giving energy and playing defense and battling for rebounds. Just being able to spell for a couple minutes without being a negative will be huge.
Yep, we're pretty spoiled now in that regard,... remember Gesell on the line?,... ughhhh
