Exactly. I don’t know why they are overplaying their hand. People are simply not gonna believe those statements came out of Doyle’s and Brian’s mouths with other black coaches and black players around. That is where they lose credibility from the allegations that may have some merit. I can’t say it didn’t happen since I wasn’t there but no person (juror) is gonna believe those things were said in front of other black coaches and players and it never came out until years later.
8 former Hawkeyes sue the university and ask for Ferentz firing
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Exactly. I don’t know why they are overplaying their hand. People are simply not gonna believe those statements came out of Doyle’s and Brian’s mouths with other black coaches and black players around. That is where they lose credibility from the allegations that may have some merit. I can’t say it didn’t happen since I wasn’t there but no person (juror) is gonna believe those things were said in front of other black coaches and players and it never came out until years later.
You know your lawsuit against Iowa football isn't great when even DJK isn't a fan of it or least how this tweet reads to me.
Publicity stunt for purpose of trying to show that the other 8 players aren't just in it for themselves. Anyone with any sense of clarity could see right through that.
Plaintiffs' counsel cannot arbitrarily set a figure that would apply to other former athletes who aren't part of the case. They would not be bound by that number nor would they be "entitled" to recover any of that amount unless the University set aside the monies and created a procedure by which a former athlete could apply for monies if they "hit" certain criteria. Even if that was set up, it would not act to preclude a former athlete from seeking redress in a court of law instead of trying to seek recovery under some sort of "set aside" program.
Plaintiffs' lead counsel is a moth. He loves publicity and camera lights. It will be fascinating to watch as this situation transpires. Personally, I think that he believes that Ferentz's comments about having "a blind spot, comments about not following through after setting up the task force/player committee about black athlete transfer rates and black athlete graduation rates and certain contents of the Husch Blackwell report constitute "smoking gun admissions" about disparate treatment.
Personally, I think that the issues are far more nuanced and no real "smoking gun" exists. I anticipate that counsel from Husch Blackwell have fully advised the University who said what during the interviews of the 40-60 former players (can't remember exact number referenced in the report).
In any event, I sure hope that the U of Iowa has counsel lined up and has started prepping their defense and punch back hard after the first volley is launched in court.
If somehow you can swing that, I am in! Already had covid so I don't worry about that, but I still follow the rules and wear the mask, etc. Just as I did before I got it and I still got it.
Someone may have already posted this, but this is their response to Iowa's no thanks reply.
Attny: Iowa saying no to demands only emboldens ex-players
ERIC OLSON
Mon, October 19, 2020, 8:37 PM CDT
The attorney representing eight Black former Iowa football players who allege racial discrimination during their time with the Hawkeyes said Monday night the university's rejection of their demands, which included a payment of $20 million, is not the end of the matter.
Civil rights attorney Damario Solomon-Simmons of Tulsa, Oklahoma, had stated the players' demands in a 21-page letter to university officials dated Oct. 5. In addition to $20 million, the players called for the firings of head football coach Kirk Ferentz, offensive line coach Brian Ferentz and athletic director Gary Barta.
The university general counsel's office issued its response Sunday, saying it would not give in to the demands and that work had already begun to create a more welcoming environment for Black athletes. The general counsel's response was issued to the media along with a copy of Solomon-Simmons' original letter.
“In response, it appears Iowa released our confidential letter to the media with the sole intention of trying to shame and intimidate our courageous clients,” Solomon-Simmons said in a statement. “It did not work. In fact, Iowa’s move has not only strengthened the resolve of our clients to continue to stand up for their rights and the rights of their teammates.”
The former players who have said they were mistreated are Akrum Wadley, Aaron Mends, Jonathan Parker, Marcel Joly, Maurice Fleming, Reggie Spearman, Kevonte Martin-Manley and Andre Harris.
Solomon-Simmons did not respond to an Associated Press request to interview the former players. Other attempts to reach the players were unsuccessful.
Solomon-Simmons’ original letter said if the players' demands were not met by Monday, the former players would file a lawsuit seeking damages.
The university in June hired an outside law firm to review the culture of the football program after dozens of former players, most of them Black, spoke out on social media to allege racial disparities and mistreatment. Their activism came as protests against racial injustice swept the nation following the death of George Floyd and after attempts to raise concerns inside the program resulted in only minor changes.
The athletic department cut ties with longtime strength and conditioning coach Chris Doyle, who received $1.1 million in a severance agreement. Several players had accused Doyle of using racial slurs when addressing them, an allegation he denied. Brian Ferentz, the son of Kirk Ferentz, also was alleged to have been abusive to players.
The review, which included interviews with 111 current and former players and employees, found the cultural problems were systemic.
The players' demand letter called for the university make a payment of $10 million “for the loss of earning capacity, loss of professional opportunities, defamation, pain and suffering, mental conditions, mental anguish, PTSD, humiliation, and overall emotional distress that our clients have incurred.”
In addition, they sought $10 million to set up a fund established for athletes, not including the eight former football payers, to compensate them “for the discrimination and ongoing severe and pervasive acts that constitute intentional discrimination where Defendants intended to treat African-American differently.”
The players also wanted mandatory annual anti-racist training for all athletic department staff, the creation of a permanent Senior Black Male Administrator position and tuition waivers for Black athletes who attended Iowa during Kirk Ferentz’s 22 years and did not graduate.
“Our monetary demand for our clients and the over 100 other impacted African-American athletes may be shortsightedly characterized as a money-grab by some,” Solomon-Simmons said in his statement. “But our demand is just because the need for vindication and accountability is just. The need for meaningful change, and not mere administrative shuffles of Black employees for the sake of public relations, is just.”
Solomon-Simmons said the issue of racial discrimination won't be erased with “diversity councils, grandiose statements of support, helmet decals, ‘unity’ walks, prepaid expensive reports, kumbaya implicit bias seminars, and tokenizing of a few Black faculty, athletes, and staff.”
___
Attny: Iowa saying no to demands only emboldens ex-players
ERIC OLSON
Mon, October 19, 2020, 8:37 PM CDT
The attorney representing eight Black former Iowa football players who allege racial discrimination during their time with the Hawkeyes said Monday night the university's rejection of their demands, which included a payment of $20 million, is not the end of the matter.
Civil rights attorney Damario Solomon-Simmons of Tulsa, Oklahoma, had stated the players' demands in a 21-page letter to university officials dated Oct. 5. In addition to $20 million, the players called for the firings of head football coach Kirk Ferentz, offensive line coach Brian Ferentz and athletic director Gary Barta.
The university general counsel's office issued its response Sunday, saying it would not give in to the demands and that work had already begun to create a more welcoming environment for Black athletes. The general counsel's response was issued to the media along with a copy of Solomon-Simmons' original letter.
“In response, it appears Iowa released our confidential letter to the media with the sole intention of trying to shame and intimidate our courageous clients,” Solomon-Simmons said in a statement. “It did not work. In fact, Iowa’s move has not only strengthened the resolve of our clients to continue to stand up for their rights and the rights of their teammates.”
The former players who have said they were mistreated are Akrum Wadley, Aaron Mends, Jonathan Parker, Marcel Joly, Maurice Fleming, Reggie Spearman, Kevonte Martin-Manley and Andre Harris.
Solomon-Simmons did not respond to an Associated Press request to interview the former players. Other attempts to reach the players were unsuccessful.
Solomon-Simmons’ original letter said if the players' demands were not met by Monday, the former players would file a lawsuit seeking damages.
The university in June hired an outside law firm to review the culture of the football program after dozens of former players, most of them Black, spoke out on social media to allege racial disparities and mistreatment. Their activism came as protests against racial injustice swept the nation following the death of George Floyd and after attempts to raise concerns inside the program resulted in only minor changes.
The athletic department cut ties with longtime strength and conditioning coach Chris Doyle, who received $1.1 million in a severance agreement. Several players had accused Doyle of using racial slurs when addressing them, an allegation he denied. Brian Ferentz, the son of Kirk Ferentz, also was alleged to have been abusive to players.
The review, which included interviews with 111 current and former players and employees, found the cultural problems were systemic.
The players' demand letter called for the university make a payment of $10 million “for the loss of earning capacity, loss of professional opportunities, defamation, pain and suffering, mental conditions, mental anguish, PTSD, humiliation, and overall emotional distress that our clients have incurred.”
In addition, they sought $10 million to set up a fund established for athletes, not including the eight former football payers, to compensate them “for the discrimination and ongoing severe and pervasive acts that constitute intentional discrimination where Defendants intended to treat African-American differently.”
The players also wanted mandatory annual anti-racist training for all athletic department staff, the creation of a permanent Senior Black Male Administrator position and tuition waivers for Black athletes who attended Iowa during Kirk Ferentz’s 22 years and did not graduate.
“Our monetary demand for our clients and the over 100 other impacted African-American athletes may be shortsightedly characterized as a money-grab by some,” Solomon-Simmons said in his statement. “But our demand is just because the need for vindication and accountability is just. The need for meaningful change, and not mere administrative shuffles of Black employees for the sake of public relations, is just.”
Solomon-Simmons said the issue of racial discrimination won't be erased with “diversity councils, grandiose statements of support, helmet decals, ‘unity’ walks, prepaid expensive reports, kumbaya implicit bias seminars, and tokenizing of a few Black faculty, athletes, and staff.”
___
Wadley and Martin Manley were starters, so not sure how their earning capacity was diminished. Manley was destined for the MAC before Iowa stepped in.
Add in Braithwaite worked side by side with Doyle for almost 20 years as a black assistant and never heard him utter the word. I think these 8 x players are confusing people being a holes to them and Doyle is the scape goat due to his riding the players like a drill instructor when they didn’t get their reps in, make weight, or look like a fool instead of a representative of the Iowa Football Program.
We are talking football and being a D1 athlete on scholarship. It’s not do as you please. You are expected to meet the requirements set out for you by the team and if you don’t meet these demands then you won’t be a welcome member of said team. It is hard being a D1 athlete on a team. And being a teammate means you don’t let your teammates down by not accomplishing individual and team goals.
We are talking football and being a D1 athlete on scholarship. It’s not do as you please. You are expected to meet the requirements set out for you by the team and if you don’t meet these demands then you won’t be a welcome member of said team. It is hard being a D1 athlete on a team. And being a teammate means you don’t let your teammates down by not accomplishing individual and team goals.
This sounds like someone that is starting to understand being a college fb coach is a pretty good gig and if you want longevity in the profession you have to act and speak like a grown up.
Man somebody should post that on CF. The biggest KF hater ever thinks this is a money grab bunch of BS.
A
anon_8rcdnbko1jbe0
Guest
"Solomon-Simmons said the issue of racial discrimination won't be erased with “diversity councils, grandiose statements of support, helmet decals, ‘unity’ walks, prepaid expensive reports, kumbaya implicit bias seminars, and tokenizing of a few Black faculty, athletes, and staff.”
But it WILL be erased with $20 Million dollars. Damn right it will!!
But it WILL be erased with $20 Million dollars. Damn right it will!!
A million right now would make me feel more comforted.
Will the coaches that left get called in? White and Kennedy and Greg Davis and Campbell? Davis basically axed Campbell and brought in his guy in Kennedy.
The lead attorney is an out of states Civil Rights specialist. Interesting your comments about Parrish (I don't know him at all personally) but both he and the other local attorney listed on the case are University of Iowa grads.
Indeed.
Saban should realistically be our next coach if winning national championships is what were after anyway.........
In a related trivia question...Where was the "lawyer" in this GIF born?
For those of you still playing... <crickets>... Phil Morris, the actor who played Jackie Chiles on "Seinfeld" was born in Iowa City. His Father Greg (of Mission Impossible fame) was a student at the U of I. Shortly after Phil was born, the family moved to L.A. so Greg could pursue his acting career.
He is a rage machine. Just ask Lane Kiffin.
He doesn't look anything like the other son of Greg Morris. What is James up to these days? He was amazing at Solon.............
He doesn't look anything like the other son of Greg Morris. What is James up to these days? He was amazing at Solon.............
he played for Michigan..
This. If DJK isn’t on board with this lawsuit, then this says something.
What you’ll notice is that the vast majority of the players who are or have spoken out the past several months are guys who are either in college or were in college within the past 7 or 8 years. While I’m sure the claims made by the players stepping forward are founded, it almost makes you wonder if, as the guys who played for KF in the 2000’s and early 2010’s have matured, they have realized that there may be something to the culture that KF has instilled in Iowa’s program... maybe even DJK to a degree, which is really saying something.
You’ll also notice that everybody involved in this suit against Iowa was there in that 2013-2014 time frame. It would be one thing if it were players across several classes getting involved, but the fact these players were all in school with one another just makes this seem like a bunch of buddies trying to stick it to Iowa
So . . . did some digging today.
Andre Harris transferred in 2016.
Reggie Spearman transferred in 2015.
KMM last played in 2014.
Maurice Fleming transferred in 2016.
Marcel Joly transferred before the 2018 season.
Jonathan Parker last played in 2016.
Akrum Wadley last played in 2017.
Aaron Mends transferred in December 2018.
Plaintiff's counsel's letter referenced liability under both Title VI and under Section 1981.
I haven't been able to thoroughly analyze the applicable statutes of limitation ("SOL"). It appears to be somewhat convoluted and there is some discussion about when the statute was enacted and whether the court will borrow from a state SOL.
I'd defer to those who practice in this area regularly. If the SOL is two years for a particular claim, it would appear that the only potentially viable claim would be held by Aaron Mends. If the SOL is four years for a particular claim, it would appear that any claim by Andre Harris, Reggie Spearman, KMM and/or Maurice Fleming would be barred. There are some theories which could, in theory, toll the statute of limitations (thereby extending them) but IMO they wouldn't seem to have applicablilty to these claims.
Andre Harris transferred in 2016.
Reggie Spearman transferred in 2015.
KMM last played in 2014.
Maurice Fleming transferred in 2016.
Marcel Joly transferred before the 2018 season.
Jonathan Parker last played in 2016.
Akrum Wadley last played in 2017.
Aaron Mends transferred in December 2018.
Plaintiff's counsel's letter referenced liability under both Title VI and under Section 1981.
I haven't been able to thoroughly analyze the applicable statutes of limitation ("SOL"). It appears to be somewhat convoluted and there is some discussion about when the statute was enacted and whether the court will borrow from a state SOL.
I'd defer to those who practice in this area regularly. If the SOL is two years for a particular claim, it would appear that the only potentially viable claim would be held by Aaron Mends. If the SOL is four years for a particular claim, it would appear that any claim by Andre Harris, Reggie Spearman, KMM and/or Maurice Fleming would be barred. There are some theories which could, in theory, toll the statute of limitations (thereby extending them) but IMO they wouldn't seem to have applicablilty to these claims.
Hell yea... I won't be wearing a mask, not sure what the enforcement will be. Anyway yea, players still get their usual ticket allotment. And I should be able to get even more than usual bc a lot of players won't have as many fam/friends come like before. Esp the out of state guys.... idk if there's like a private message feature on here, but let me know how u wanna communicate. At this point, I'm 99% sure I should be able to get tickets to every game home and away.
AuroraHawk thanks for digging. So, five of the players transferred. I chose at random, Aaron Mends. Maybe it's already been posted but his tweet from December 2018 talks about "most importantly, earned a college degree with the support of my coaches", incredible opportunity, memories, blah, blah, blah. Nothing about abuse or discrimination. https://www.blackheartgoldpants.com...-iowa-football-iowa-football-scholarship-bhgp
This is what I have been thinking as well. There are going to be SOL problems which is why I think they are trying to tie the 1983 cause of action to breach of contract claims to try and get a longer SOL.
I wonder if there is some outside influence from a former member of the coaching staff.
I'm not an attorney but I thought in a suit there had to be actual damage. What damage did they incur? Are they trying to say Iowa kept them out of the league? That would be almost impossible to prove, very few players make it to the NFL and most on the list barely played in college. Or can we now sue if our feeling were hurt or we got yelled at?
Damages has been a question in my mind as well. A lot of folks are saying that depositions and discovery will be embarrassing for Iowa. All that takes time and probably an incredible amount of money from the plaintiffs. Even if they take this on a contingency basis that assumes they win an amount that makes it beneficial. I agree that Iowa will need a law group representing them that has deep experience around these type of questions. I wonder how long it will take for an actual suit to be filed?
To anyone I posted a lengthy response to a question by Screw on the thread “Lawyer” and would welcome your thoughts and comments.
Wouldnt they be in even more trouble if they file the actual lawsuit with false claims?
One of the things I've wondered is what if the principle players namely Barta, Kirk, and Brian are all gone in the next 2 years. I could totally see that happening. I think Kirk wants to steady the ship before he leaves. Can he do that in the next 2 seasons? I suspect the new President will want to bring in their own AD, particularly given all of the problems Barta has had. Ferentz may not want to build a relationship with a new AD and new AD may want to hire his own coaching staff.
I'd guess that they'll try to argue they didn't know they were being harmed until this summer when others spoke up.
I don’t think that holds water here. You are referring to what is known as the “discovery rule.” Usually applicable in malpractice cases. So for example you go in for surgery and the doctor screws up. The statute of limitations is 2 years from the date of the negligence. However, the discovery rule says that the statute of limitations does not start running until the injured party knows or should have known a mistake was made. So in my example maybe a year after the surgery that was done negligently, the injured party starts having complications because of the negligent surgery, then that is when the statute of limitations would start running. Here for example, if Doyle used the “n” word 3 years ago I don’t think they could say the player needed until this summer to realize that was discrimination. I hope that makes sense.
I guess another example that is more in my wheelhouse that happens a lot because I defend a lot of lawyers for legal malpractice is this. The statute of limitations for bringing a legal malpractice case is 5 years.. So let’s say a lawyer does an estate plan negligently in 2000. The normal time to bring a claim would be 2005. But say the person dies in 2010 and due to the negligent estate plan by the lawyer there are severe tax consequences that could have been avoided but for the lawyer’s negligence. But that negligence is not “discovered” until the IRS gives notice of the additional tax liability. The 5 year statute would not start running until that time (2010) not way back in 2000. The “discovery rule” would “toll” the running of the statute of limitation as the client did not and could not reasonably have know the lawyer screwed up the estate plan at the get go in 2000. So once again if Brian F called someone a “dumb ass black kid” In say 2013 or whenever, I don’t think they could argue that that they didn’t’ know or “discover” that was discriminatory until the summer of 2020.
This. Guys like Jaleel Johnson, Faith Ekakitie, Dez King, Mike Daniels, Geno Stone, Amani Hooker, etc all have said they think change will come and are trying to help change come from it.
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