“Sign Stealer:” Connor Stalions docu-series on Netflix on Aug 27. Harbaugh presented Stalions w/ a game ball after Beating Iowa 27-14 on Oct 1, 2022
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Having been a member of Michigan athletics and a grad...I think I have the privilege of saying we
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Sounds like something a person with no sense of right and wrong would say.
Don't you have some jocks to wash instead of your triggered replies on here?
I didn't have to wash any socks as a d1 athlete....did you have have to wash them as the team mascot of your Pee-wee team?
Do you really think that coaches don't try to steal signs? Are you that dumb? Like really...did you get kicked in the head by a mule and then get run over by a train as a child?
As Joel Klatt said...."the more you think this is a big deal the less you know about football "....
You obviously know nothing about the game
Stallions was our sign stealer ...everyone has one+...if you watched the doc you'd know he did it for the Naval Academy as a student coach...yes...Navy football was stealing signs
He became really good at it...the question is if he broke NCAA rules to become that good
The question is not if Michigan was the only one doing it...if this is a question of right or wrong...I guess 99% of programs are wrong
Maybe I did get kicked in the head a few times, but I am smart enough to know that just because everyone else does something, it does not make it right. According to your justification, all one would have to do is be in a room with certain people and anything is justifiable, according to whatever the people in that room are doing. So you justify your and others actions by what their surroundings are and what others are doing? What a weak person you must be.
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Wasn't Logan Jones flagged for that after driving and blocking a Mich defender into the turf or whatever?
And as mentioned there are certainly diff "levels" of deciphering and or stealing signs. Yes, most/all teams do this..but maybe it's "in game" or casual observation vs. a calculated effort with a paid staff member, buying tickets to other games, attending games in a disguise, etc. That's where the line should be drawn IMO.
So think of this a different way...
Coaches study film...they look for tendencies.... anything to gain an advantage ...this has been done from like the 1950s if not before
If you were a coach who could decipher what another teams tendencies were you were a genius coach....I mean if Coach Jim Jones in 1955 figured out that each time they lined Billy Joe left of the QB they'd run it off tackle....then that is just great coaching
Now let's go forward 60+ years or so...no longer simple schemes.... especially with no huddle and hurry up....you get your signals from the sidelines with half your O looking over to get them...no longer a guy running into the huddle to whisper the call to the QB
Why wouldn't you call it good coaching to try to figure out what they are doing? Whether that is in real time or film.... that's part of coaching
Stallions wasn't doing it for his personal collection. They were being given to someone, if not, it serves no purpose. I think you're in denial much like PSU fans were with Paterno's knowledge of Sandusky.
You are correct there is a difference between being observant and cheating.
Stealing signs at a game is the game.
Paying a stooge for the road trips to other stadiums and recording on a phone is cheating by the NCAA.
Michigan has a long culture of cheating and theft.
Fab Five got "loans " they were to pay back. Sure. Uh huh. Lol.
Hockey team lied to the NCAA to play in tournament.
Former baseball coach was a thief. Stole money from the sale of game programs.
Football. Lol where to begin.
Ol Harbag tossed Connor overboard in the middle of the ocean as soon as this all started to break.
End result is that Harbaugh/Michigan got caught. Regardless of what anyone else does or doesn't do, his program got caught. Most fans would probably put an asterisk on his time there and will also probably question his previous stops a little more as well.
Moral of the story is don't get caught or the narrative will always stick. Pretty well evidenced that Michigan was never going to get over the OSU hump unless they did something a little "extra." To me, Michigan was always quite far away from being in elite territory until about 2-3 years ago. The recruits were essentially the same and so was the coach. Iowa was beating them more often than not so I always wondered what changed outside of our offense being shit. Michigan still should never score that much against us. Timeline fits pretty well imo. Michigan went from being a team that struggled mightily against top competition to never losing to them.
Explain away Ellobo but it's pretty clear to me and I assume, most of us here.
FYI, we all already knew schools scout other teams, including us. Not news to us bud.
Moral of the story is don't get caught or the narrative will always stick. Pretty well evidenced that Michigan was never going to get over the OSU hump unless they did something a little "extra." To me, Michigan was always quite far away from being in elite territory until about 2-3 years ago. The recruits were essentially the same and so was the coach. Iowa was beating them more often than not so I always wondered what changed outside of our offense being shit. Michigan still should never score that much against us. Timeline fits pretty well imo. Michigan went from being a team that struggled mightily against top competition to never losing to them.
Explain away Ellobo but it's pretty clear to me and I assume, most of us here.
FYI, we all already knew schools scout other teams, including us. Not news to us bud.
Bo let his kid get raped by the team doc and covered it up. Sickos. Statues of that sick bastard on campus.
Now tell me Bo's son really did not get molested by the team doc and Bo had no idea the whole time.
This is so easy to explain and everything I'm about to say has been backed up by certain members of the national media who actually focus on cfb and aren't just talking heads that dable in many sports:
1) Michigan gutted it's S&C staff in 2018...fired everyone because we were soft and had too many players going through the motions. Harbaugh hired this guy Ben Herbert who you might of heard of as he was Bert's S&C guy at Whisky and followed him to Arkansas. He all of a sudden became available in 2018 and Harbaugh jumped on it. You guys know exactly the importance of having the top S&C guy (see Doyle) and know these are the coaches that spend the most time with the players during the entire year setting the culture. We backed Herbert up by investing millions into our weight room.
But you guys also know this does not change things overnight and needs other things to align with it ..
So
2A) Once the results of Ben Herbert started to kick in Harbaugh dumped Don Brown (the DC). Brown was a statistically very good DC and innovative in his own way. However, his style couldn't get Michigan over the hump as it was soft up the middle. He brought in Mike McDonald who in three years went from being a one year wonder at Umich, to becoming the DC for The Ravens to getting the HC job with The Seattle Seahawks....do you honestly think that fast a rise happens because of sign stealing or maybe he was that good (you realize NFL teams vett before hiring HCs)? But...but...he was only there for one year...enter Jesse Minter who came from the same coaching tree (The Ravens) and was actually neck and neck with Mac, when Harbaugh was picking which of his brother's assistants to take, before Minter took another DC job prior to Jim deciding.
I have to chuckle a bit because I literally had to explain to this board that losing Coach Mac wasn't going to cause the fall off you guys thought...I mean you guys were predicting 8-4...one guy even claimed that Michigan would drop back to it's NORMAL 7-5...I had to explain to him that Harbaugh had more 10 win seasons than less than ten (while at Michigan) but that guy was as hard headed as you seem to be...you guys gave Mac a ton of credit for 2021...this is before we even brought in Stallions on staff btw...and he deserved it which is why he was quickly called back to the NFL...but we brought in his clone who also had a year of film from his clone to find new wrinkles to make our D even better...he had bigger, stronger and faster players to do it with thanks to coach Herb...
Transformation done on that side of the ball
2B) Michigan also changed the way it played O. I list this as 2 because it happened at the same time. I list this as B because at first it wasn't because we replaced our OC but rather diminished his role as Harbaugh took more control over the design of our O. Gattis' "speed in space" was flushed...it was a hybrid spread power concept that was more spread ...it didn't work for Michigan and was gone... Harbaugh also started giving a young assistant named Sherrone Moore some play calling responsibility which made sense because he was running Michigan's best unit (the OL...thanks in large part to coach Herb)...less than a year later Harbaugh got rid of Gattis' and gave that Moore guy the OC job....ever heard of him?
2C) Overall, in a short period Harbaugh changed his entire staff, in the process got quite a bit younger and brought in a lot of new thinking. Did he feel pressured to do so? Yes, what he was doing wasn't getting us to the next level despite having more 10 win seasons than not. But to his credit...he built this new staff around his own philosophy and then let them do their thing.
3) The players took notice. The players took control. They were tired of what was happening also. They leaders took on the Herbert mentality of pushing others to get better or get the F out.... I'm sure many of you have seen the post game (on field) interview from Cade @PSU 2021 where he said "no offense to teams of the past but they would have lost this game...this team is different"...that's why I will always appreciate Cade...he was not only apart of the change...he helped lead it...note: Stallions is still not on staff at this point
SO TO SUM UP
Michigan basically changed everything leading up to that 2021 season... EVERYTHING...well besides the HC...but everything else...but you don't get that...that doesn't make you an idiot...you just don't know...hope this helps you understand better
SO WHERE ARE THEY NOW?
Ben Herbert is now the highest paid S&C coach in all of FB and in the NFL
The guy he replaced finally landed at Bowling Green
Mike McDonald is the HC of the Seahawks
Minter is the DC for the chargers
Don Brown went for one year to the U of Arizona before going to Umass
Sherrone Moore is the HC at Michigan
Former OC Josh Gattis has now been fired from two jobs and is a figure head OC at Maryland under the real OC (HC) Locksley
So do you still think the only thing that changed is Stallions?
It doesn't matter, it's already history.
If you haven't noticed, people move on from basically everything a week later.
I thought the doc was great.
Hilarious when Stalions said he couldn't recall attending that game haha.
And then the other dude is like Hey I gotta be done by noon?
Hilarious when Stalions said he couldn't recall attending that game haha.
And then the other dude is like Hey I gotta be done by noon?
Didn't read?... that's fine...it was really long
Don't Care? ..well no one is asking you to so that is fine also
Not impressed by my lecture?...well son...having an impression on the quality of my "lecture" requires you reading it and enough caring to do so...so which is it ..did you not read and care or are you some insolent little boy who makes judgements without knowing and care?
