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Blame Governors for Coronavirus Deaths in Nursing Homes

hawkboy76

HB All-American
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May 24, 2006
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Thought I'd do a Ciggy impression and post some important news:



https://nypost.com/2020/05/16/blame-governors-for-coronavirus-deaths-in-nursing-homes-goodwin/

An article in Nowhere Magazine several years ago explored the ways ancient cultures dispatched the elderly, a practice known as senicide. Author Justin Nobel recounted several gruesome rites that made the Inuit habit of putting Granny on an Arctic ice floe seem humane.

At one point, Nobel mentioned that his own grandparents had moved “to a fancy nursing home in the suburbs of New York City.”

That made me shudder.

If they are honest, historians judging the American experience during the coronavirus pandemic will excoriate our barbaric failure to protect the elderly. We think of ourselves as civilized, but mindless policies and bureaucratic indifference turned many nursing homes and rehabilitation centers into killing fields.

At least 28,000 residents and workers in long-term care facilities already have died from the virus, according to a New York Times analysis done more than a week ago. That represented one out of every three COVID-19 deaths recorded in the United States at the time and was likely an undercount because of reporting lags and varying state methods.

This massacre of a helpless population shames America and Washington must find out why it happened and who is responsible. Elderly people in these institutions could not protect themselves, and because most states banned visitors early in the outbreak, the institutions, their regulators and elected officials were fully obligated to shield them against infection.

They failed miserably.

The Times found 14 states where more than half of total deaths occurred in facilities for the elderly. It was 55 percent in Connecticut, 57 percent in Colorado, North Carolina and Kentucky, 58 percent in Virginia, 59 percent in Massachusetts, 61 percent in Delaware, 66 percent in Pennsylvania, 73 percent in Rhode Island and 80 percent in West Virginia and Minnesota.

The states with the most nursing-home deaths, New York and New Jersey, didn’t make the list because of so many other deaths, yet more than 10,000 people died in their facilities. The 5,500 nursing-home deaths in New York are more than the total deaths in all other states except New Jersey.

SEE ALSO
Soaring nursing home coronavirus deaths don't match official NY state tallies
Many if not most could have been avoided. The earlier outbreaks in Asia and Europe demonstrated that the elderly were easy prey for the virus, doubly so when they have underlying health conditions. Everybody knew that.

Florida got the message and implemented a model response. Despite its vast enclaves of long-term care homes, it reported under 750 deaths in them, or slightly more than one for each of its 615 facilities.

The striking contrast between Florida on one hand and New York and New Jersey on the other can be traced largely to policy decisions by their governors. Gov. Andrew Cuomo of New York and Gov. Phil Murphy of New Jersey issued almost identical orders in late March requiring nursing homes to accept COVID-19 patients being discharged from hospitals. The orders barred the homes from even asking if the patients had the virus, lest they be discriminated against.

Those politically correct orders quickly became death sentences as infections spread like wildfire.

Florida, thankfully, followed a different path. Gov. Ron DeSantis said his state moved early to protect the elderly because statistics from South Korea showed “that not all age groups were equally at risk” and that most deaths happened to “folks 65 and up.”

As a result, he allowed his nursing homes to reject hospital referrals who were still infected. More recently, Florida started sending infected residents in the opposite direction, from nursing homes to hospitals.

“Our goal is to keep the virus out of our facilities,” one Florida nursing-home CEO told the Sun-Sentinel. “Hospitals are more concerned about their beds.”

Because Cuomo and Murphy had the same information as DeSantis, their ruinous actions remain inexplicable. They can’t say they weren’t warned.

On March 8, Dr. Thomas Frieden, former head of the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, wrote on CNN that “nursing homes and other long-term care facilities are ground zero.” On March 18, the CDC, in a study of the nation’s first large outbreak, in a nursing home in Kirkland, Wash., told health officials, “Substantial morbidity and mortality might be averted if all long-term care facilities take steps now to prevent exposure of their residents to COVID-19.”

Yet seven days later, Cuomo issued his infamous March 25 order that said, “No resident shall be denied readmission or admission to NH solely based on a confirmed or suspected diagnosis of COVID-19.”

Six days after that, on March 31, Murphy used similar language in his order. Although it allowed carve-outs that enabled some facilities to dodge the bullet, the mandate had disastrous impacts overall, with more than 5,000 deaths recorded in New Jersey’s long-term homes.

One of the worst is the state-run Veterans Home in Paramus, which has recorded at least 72 deaths. A man who lost his 91-year-old Army-veteran father there was quoted as saying the home should be demolished and replaced with a memorial park. “It’s like a mass shooting,” he said.

SEE ALSO
This nursing home disaster is on you, Gov. Cuomo: Goodwin
Despite the surging death count, Cuomo defended his directive for more than six weeks. He reversed himself only last Sunday, ruling that patients must test negative before hospitals can send them to nursing homes. Yet he insisted that the initial policy “worked.”

If more than 5,000 dead was success, what would failure look like?

Cuomo’s reversal included forcing nursing homes to test staff and administrators twice a week, at the homes’ own expense. There was no explanation why testing was not required all along, or how it would work when labs say they cannot process the needed 410,000 weekly tests.

Despite the enormous consequences of Cuomo’s arbitrary decision-making, only a few New York lawmakers have dared to call for investigations about what went wrong.

Nursing-home executives, meanwhile, complain privately that Cuomo should have known his mandate would be a killer, but they were never consulted and got no notice before being swamped with infected patients. As one owner put it, long-time residents began “dropping like flies” soon afterward.

These same executives will not go public with their complaints because they fear Cuomo will punish them with fines and take their licenses. Some see the sudden testing regime and a probe he started with the state attorney general as a way to blame them for his mistakes.

All the more reason why federal officials with nothing to fear must step in and find the facts. A designated US attorney, for example, could use a grand jury to demand answers about why so many elderly people were put in harm’s way despite the warnings and simple common sense.

As for witnesses willing and eager to come forward, the feds should start with grieving families. For each of the 28,000 dead, there are relatives whose stories of heartbreak and rage will move the nation.

The families want answers and they want action. They deserve both.
 
I’ve been astonished at our inability to protect nursing homes. It was obvious in March that this was where half the deaths were occurring. We tried to quarantine the whole country but didn’t quarantine them.
 
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The virus got inside because workers didn’t protect themselves outside of work.

I wouldn’t blame the governors for that. Stay at home orders were issued and it’s not their fault if people didn’t follow it.
 
The virus got inside because workers didn’t protect themselves outside of work.

I wouldn’t blame the governors for that. Stay at home orders were issued and it’s not their fault if people didn’t follow it.

You’re acting like Trump; just saying something you want to be true, then assuming it is true because you said it.

There were strategies available, but few governors have done a single thing.
 
You’re acting like Trump; just saying something you want to be true, then assuming it is true because you said it.

There were strategies available, but few governors have done a single thing.
If I were acting like Trump I’d call it the flu and tell everyone to just go to work.

The virus didn’t start inside those homes.
 
No country in the world has protected their nursing homes well.

There are certainly some states that have done better than others in handling this and keeping the vulnerable safe. And there are governors like Cuomo who made decisions which actively harmed them.
 
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There are certainly some states that have done better than others in handling this and keeping the vulnerable safe. And there are governors like Cuomo who made decisions which actively harmed them.
You sound like someone trying to drum up a hit piece.

What all do you know about the nursing home industry in the US?
 
They didn't have to accept them, though.

This story goes a lot deeper than you are trying to make it.

btw, where was the Federal Leadership during all of this? Playing golf?
 
Which is why, you know, they should have been quarantined.
When you say quarantined, what would you have done differently? I know the residents in the local nursing home are not leaving their rooms for meals or gatherings. No visitors are allowed.
 
I said long ago (got the idea from Trad) they should have paid top $$$ for staff to live on-site for four to six week shifts. Not letting infected hospital patients in is something I would have been against, had I known about that.
 
Which is why, you know, they should have been quarantined.

The problem though was that there was no place to quarantine them, as area hospitals had already hit their peak capacity at that time. Also, nursing homes could refuse to accept them.

Long Island hospitals sent hundreds of COVID-19 patients to nursing homes and rehabs during the peak of the health crisis in March and April, according to figures from area hospitals.

The wave of patients was largely facilitated by a state order on March 25, which said nursing homes could not refuse a person simply because they were COVID-19 positive. Nursing homes, however, did not have to accept the patients if they could not care for them safely, the order said.

The state’s mandate came under withering criticism from nursing home officials and families of residents, who say the move introduced sick people into settings ill-prepared to protect the most vulnerable people.

Nassau and Suffolk counties have more than 1,200 confirmed and presumed COVID-19 deaths reported at nursing homes and adult facilities.

A scramble in mid-March
The surge of patients into nursing homes is slowing as the numbers of new COVID-19 cases and hospitalizations decrease over time, hospital officials said. And on May 10, Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo announced that COVID-19 patients must test negative for the virus before entering a nursing home.

But by the middle of March, coronavirus was sickening thousands of New Yorkers, sometimes in a single day. Long Island hospitals were scrambling to expand bed capacity, building field hospitals, and transforming operating rooms, conference centers and recovery units into COVID-19 areas for patients.

There was pressure to “help an unprecedented hospital bed capacity issue,” said Dr. Maria Carney, medical director of post-acute medicine at Northwell Health.

In addition, the hospitals found that many COVID-19 patients, especially the elderly, required significant care even after they were discharged from the hospital, Carney said
.

Northwell, which has 12 of its 19 hospitals on the Island, said it released a total of 1,006 of its 9,498 COVID-19 discharges, or 10.6%, to nursing homes and rehabs from March 1 to May 3, officials said.

Catholic Health System, composed of six hospitals on Long Island, sent 530 of its 2,291 discharges, or 23%, to nursing homes or rehabs in March and April, officials said. CHS went so far as to create a Post-Hospital COVID-19 Discharge Unit to smooth the transition.

CHS executive vice president Dennis Verzi praised Cuomo’s latest order as positive step toward protecting a fragile population.

“Although there might be a slight increase in the length of hospital stays as a result of this order, we don’t anticipate a significant negative impact on the number of hospital beds available,” Verzi said.

Stony Brook University Hospital released 167 of its 1,085 COVID-19 discharges, or 15%, to nursing homes or rehabs in March and April, officials said. Mount Sinai South Nassau hospital said it released 256 of its 737 discharges, or 35%, to nursing homes and rehab during that period. Nassau University Medical Center said it released 56 of its 537 discharges, or 10%, to nursing homes and rehab for the same time frame.

Carney, of Northwell Health, said it’s too early to anticipate the full impact of Cuomo’s latest order. She said she expects some patients will end up staying in the hospital longer.

Carney said the hospitals are finding that some elderly patients are still testing positive for as long as six weeks. Some are testing positive even though they are no longer contagious, she said. She believes these people are a small percentage of the COVID-19 patients.

“We’re trying to quantify this population and determine the safest plan,” Carney said. “Whether we should keep them where they are, transfer to an alternative care site, or try to identify skilled nursing facilities that can be COVID-safe.”

Hospitals sent a total of 58 COVID-19 patients to Gurwin Jewish Nursing and Rehabilitation Center in Commack in March and April, said facility president Stuart Almer.

Almer said Gurwin is suffering financially because of the added expenses of treating these residents, such as creating an isolated unit for them and paying for some ventilators as well as overtime and hazard pay for staff. Moreover, the nursing home is not seeing people come in for rehabilitation after elective surgeries such as knee and hip replacements, because hospitals have largely stopped doing these operations amid the crisis, he said.

He said the 460-bed facility is customarily full but is currently down 104 beds. A total of 49 residents there died due to COVID-19, he said.

Beyond that, Almer said he worries about the new state mandate that calls for testing staff twice a week, which he said could cost the facility $300,000 a week.

“This is an impact in the millions,” he said.

This is a prime example of where we could have used Federal leadership to help cope with a problem that state and local governments were ill-equipped to deal with. And, where was that leadership? In total denial? Or playing golf?

If only someone had had the foresight to see this kind of problem.

If only.


https://www.newsday.com/news/health/coronavirus/nursing-homes-coronavirus-1.44701556
 
I’ve been astonished at our inability to protect nursing homes. It was obvious in March that this was where half the deaths were occurring. We tried to quarantine the whole country but didn’t quarantine them.
many states did. Some state not did not protect and a few put them in danger
 
The "money vs. death" argument fails on this point, especially for pukes er uh people that have made this entire event political. If you've made this argument and haven't called these governors out for their long term care Covid patient policies, you're a flaming hypocrite.
 
The "money vs. death" argument fails on this point, especially for pukes er uh people that have made this entire event political. If you've made this argument and haven't called these governors out for their long term care Covid patient policies, you're a flaming hypocrite.
Can you explain your point further? Maybe you have some stories/links to back up your points?

tia
 
Did they really go to press on Saturday morning when the once weekly report is released Saturday morning?

Nursing home deaths went up 15% in that week and stand at 45% of all Florida deaths.
 
You sound like someone trying to drum up a hit piece.

What all do you know about the nursing home industry in the US?

I know they house a population especially vulnerable to this virus and far too many of our leaders (including Trump and many state governors) did a shitty job protecting them. That should piss everyone off and our leaders should have to answer for their failure to act.
 
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I know they house a population especially vulnerable to this virus and far too many of our leaders (including Trump and many state governors) did a shitty job protecting them. That should piss everyone off and our leaders should have to answer for their failure to act.
Do you agree that it starts at the Top, though?
 
Trump deserves every bit of blame for his failures. You won't find posts during this pandemic where I defend him. State governors, like Cuomo and others, also bear significant blame for decisions they have made as well. I care very little for the "team" aspect of politics where we hold different people to different standards based on political affiliation.
 
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Bring it on.

And bring your A game, if you have one.

Didn't you read the OP?

The striking contrast between Florida on one hand and New York and New Jersey on the other can be traced largely to policy decisions by their governors. Gov. Andrew Cuomo of New York and Gov. Phil Murphy of New Jersey issued almost identical orders in late March requiring nursing homes to accept COVID-19 patients being discharged from hospitals. The orders barred the homes from even asking if the patients had the virus, lest they be discriminated against.
 
Didn't you read the OP?

The striking contrast between Florida on one hand and New York and New Jersey on the other can be traced largely to policy decisions by their governors. Gov. Andrew Cuomo of New York and Gov. Phil Murphy of New Jersey issued almost identical orders in late March requiring nursing homes to accept COVID-19 patients being discharged from hospitals. The orders barred the homes from even asking if the patients had the virus, lest they be discriminated against.
You obviously did not read my response to the OP.

Please try again.
 
Trump deserves every bit of blame for his failures. You won't find posts during this pandemic where I defend him. State governors, like Cuomo and others, also bear significant blame for decisions they have made as well. I care very little for the "team" aspect of politics where we hold different people to different standards based on political affiliation.

Here. At least read this part of my response again.

This is a prime example of where we could have used Federal leadership to help cope with a problem that state and local governments were ill-equipped to deal with. And, where was that leadership? In total denial? Or playing golf?

If only someone had had the foresight to see this kind of problem.

If only.


It all goes back to the Top. Governors do not have the same intel that our president is privy to, thus they make their decisions on the "best" intelligence they have access to, not the best intel our president has, and has repeatedly denied.

Nursing Homes are mostly private enterprises that are regulated by FEDERAL rules, not state regulations. There is an agency called the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS), that is under the guidance of our national Health and Human Services (HHS) department that provides the oversight of nursing homes and long term health care facilities, since they are largely tied to Medicare and Medicaid. These nursing home facilities are largely for-profit enterprises, so they probably have to be able to cut their costs at some point, or else, they lose money. Given that, they do not always provide the care they are required to provide. Go figure. I think it has something to do with the laws of capitalism, but I digress.

It seems that there is a movement to go after Governor Cuomo of NY and Governor Murphy of NJ for their lack of "leadership" in the Nursing Home problems. Excuse me while I laugh. I believe they probably did the best with the resources and intelligence they had at hand, and given that President Trump has relinquished his Responsibility for all things COVID-19 related, I guess it automatically falls into their laps. How convenient. lol

But, those governors, are not alone, not by a long shot. There are governors in other states (at least 48) that have had large losses in nursing homes as well, both Red and Blue. At least 1 in 4 nursing homes in this country (over 3900 as of May 15th) https://wpinvestigative.github.io/nursing_homes_covid19/index.html have had documented cases of COVID-19 in their homes. It's not just NY and NJ.

Here are other examples:

Major nursing home chain violated federal standards meant to stop spread of disease even after start of covid-19, records show

https://www.washingtonpost.com/inve...um=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most

Coronavirus cases in U.S. nursing homes


https://wpinvestigative.github.io/nursing_homes_covid19/index.html



49 of 50 governors have better coronavirus poll numbers than Trump
 
Here. At least read this part of my response again.

This is a prime example of where we could have used Federal leadership to help cope with a problem that state and local governments were ill-equipped to deal with. And, where was that leadership? In total denial? Or playing golf?

If only someone had had the foresight to see this kind of problem.

If only.


It all goes back to the Top. Governors do not have the same intel that our president is privy to, thus they make their decisions on the "best" intelligence they have access to, not the best intel our president has, and has repeatedly denied.

Nursing Homes are mostly private enterprises that are regulated by FEDERAL rules, not state regulations. There is an agency called the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS), that is under the guidance of our national Health and Human Services (HHS) department that provides the oversight of nursing homes and long term health care facilities, since they are largely tied to Medicare and Medicaid. These nursing home facilities are largely for-profit enterprises, so they probably have to be able to cut their costs at some point, or else, they lose money. Given that, they do not always provide the care they are required to provide. Go figure. I think it has something to do with the laws of capitalism, but I digress.

It seems that there is a movement to go after Governor Cuomo of NY and Governor Murphy of NJ for their lack of "leadership" in the Nursing Home problems. Excuse me while I laugh. I believe they probably did the best with the resources and intelligence they had at hand, and given that President Trump has relinquished his Responsibility for all things COVID-19 related, I guess it automatically falls into their laps. How convenient. lol

But, those governors, are not alone, not by a long shot. There are governors in other states (at least 48) that have had large losses in nursing homes as well, both Red and Blue. At least 1 in 4 nursing homes in this country (over 3900 as of May 15th) https://wpinvestigative.github.io/nursing_homes_covid19/index.html have had documented cases of COVID-19 in their homes. It's not just NY and NJ.

Here are other examples:

Major nursing home chain violated federal standards meant to stop spread of disease even after start of covid-19, records show

https://www.washingtonpost.com/inve...um=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most

Coronavirus cases in U.S. nursing homes


https://wpinvestigative.github.io/nursing_homes_covid19/index.html



49 of 50 governors have better coronavirus poll numbers than Trump

I dont really care about poll numbers. I dont think we disagree much on Trump either. Where we part ways is I dont think Trump's failures absolve the governors of the mistakes they have made. I dont think you need much inside info to know that sending covid positive elderly into nursing homes was a bad idea. You also dont need inside info to realize that the subways needed to be cleaned much more aggressively, especially with the huge numbers of people riding them every day.
 
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You’re acting like Trump; just saying something you want to be true, then assuming it is true because you said it.

There were strategies available, but few governors have done a single thing.

Wouldn't we have to take away their civil liberties? Tell those nursing home workers what they could and couldn’t do.
 
I dont really care about poll numbers. I dont think we disagree much on Trump either. Where we part ways is I dont think Trump's failures absolve the governors of the mistakes they have made. I dont think you need much inside info to know that sending covid positive elderly into nursing homes was a bad idea. You also dont need inside info to realize that the subways needed to be cleaned much more aggressively, especially with the huge numbers of people riding them every day.
Well, if you are going to introduce subways, I won't disagree.

But, ultimately, everything SHOULD go back to the top, and His lack of leadership.

There was a total lack of understanding exactly what this pandemic meant, at least to the people at street level. Those Above us should have come forward sooner.
 
No country in the world has protected their nursing homes well.

One story I read a while back on Sweden mentioned the comparatively fewer deaths in Finland and noted not only the Swedish nursing home hot spots, but the different elderly care models in place. It made it seem like the Swedish facilities were large wards, but the Finnish were in like small, group homes.
 
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Well, if you are going to introduce subways, I won't disagree.

But, ultimately, everything SHOULD go back to the top, and His lack of leadership.

There was a total lack of understanding exactly what this pandemic meant, at least to the people at street level. Those Above us should have come forward sooner.

Again, I don't really have any objection to the criticisms of Trump. I didn't vote for him in 2016 and will not be voting for him in 2020 (not sure if I'll vote Biden, go 3rd party, or just not vote for president). But I also have very little respect for Cuomo and de Blasio. Their mistakes, either in terms of the steps they took or, more accurately, failed to take, cost thousands of lives in their state. When you are a leader, you need to take responsibility for the people under you. Trump is an abject failure in this regard, but Cuomo and de Blasio have not done well either.
 
The problem though was that there was no place to quarantine them, as area hospitals had already hit their peak capacity at that time. Also, nursing homes could refuse to accept them.

Long Island hospitals sent hundreds of COVID-19 patients to nursing homes and rehabs during the peak of the health crisis in March and April, according to figures from area hospitals.

The wave of patients was largely facilitated by a state order on March 25, which said nursing homes could not refuse a person simply because they were COVID-19 positive. Nursing homes, however, did not have to accept the patients if they could not care for them safely, the order said.

The state’s mandate came under withering criticism from nursing home officials and families of residents, who say the move introduced sick people into settings ill-prepared to protect the most vulnerable people.

Nassau and Suffolk counties have more than 1,200 confirmed and presumed COVID-19 deaths reported at nursing homes and adult facilities.

A scramble in mid-March
The surge of patients into nursing homes is slowing as the numbers of new COVID-19 cases and hospitalizations decrease over time, hospital officials said. And on May 10, Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo announced that COVID-19 patients must test negative for the virus before entering a nursing home.

But by the middle of March, coronavirus was sickening thousands of New Yorkers, sometimes in a single day. Long Island hospitals were scrambling to expand bed capacity, building field hospitals, and transforming operating rooms, conference centers and recovery units into COVID-19 areas for patients.

There was pressure to “help an unprecedented hospital bed capacity issue,” said Dr. Maria Carney, medical director of post-acute medicine at Northwell Health.

In addition, the hospitals found that many COVID-19 patients, especially the elderly, required significant care even after they were discharged from the hospital, Carney said
.

Northwell, which has 12 of its 19 hospitals on the Island, said it released a total of 1,006 of its 9,498 COVID-19 discharges, or 10.6%, to nursing homes and rehabs from March 1 to May 3, officials said.

Catholic Health System, composed of six hospitals on Long Island, sent 530 of its 2,291 discharges, or 23%, to nursing homes or rehabs in March and April, officials said. CHS went so far as to create a Post-Hospital COVID-19 Discharge Unit to smooth the transition.

CHS executive vice president Dennis Verzi praised Cuomo’s latest order as positive step toward protecting a fragile population.

“Although there might be a slight increase in the length of hospital stays as a result of this order, we don’t anticipate a significant negative impact on the number of hospital beds available,” Verzi said.

Stony Brook University Hospital released 167 of its 1,085 COVID-19 discharges, or 15%, to nursing homes or rehabs in March and April, officials said. Mount Sinai South Nassau hospital said it released 256 of its 737 discharges, or 35%, to nursing homes and rehab during that period. Nassau University Medical Center said it released 56 of its 537 discharges, or 10%, to nursing homes and rehab for the same time frame.

Carney, of Northwell Health, said it’s too early to anticipate the full impact of Cuomo’s latest order. She said she expects some patients will end up staying in the hospital longer.

Carney said the hospitals are finding that some elderly patients are still testing positive for as long as six weeks. Some are testing positive even though they are no longer contagious, she said. She believes these people are a small percentage of the COVID-19 patients.

“We’re trying to quantify this population and determine the safest plan,” Carney said. “Whether we should keep them where they are, transfer to an alternative care site, or try to identify skilled nursing facilities that can be COVID-safe.”

Hospitals sent a total of 58 COVID-19 patients to Gurwin Jewish Nursing and Rehabilitation Center in Commack in March and April, said facility president Stuart Almer.

Almer said Gurwin is suffering financially because of the added expenses of treating these residents, such as creating an isolated unit for them and paying for some ventilators as well as overtime and hazard pay for staff. Moreover, the nursing home is not seeing people come in for rehabilitation after elective surgeries such as knee and hip replacements, because hospitals have largely stopped doing these operations amid the crisis, he said.

He said the 460-bed facility is customarily full but is currently down 104 beds. A total of 49 residents there died due to COVID-19, he said.

Beyond that, Almer said he worries about the new state mandate that calls for testing staff twice a week, which he said could cost the facility $300,000 a week.

“This is an impact in the millions,” he said.

This is a prime example of where we could have used Federal leadership to help cope with a problem that state and local governments were ill-equipped to deal with. And, where was that leadership? In total denial? Or playing golf?

If only someone had had the foresight to see this kind of problem.

If only.


https://www.newsday.com/news/health/coronavirus/nursing-homes-coronavirus-1.44701556
The problem though was that there was no place to quarantine them, as area hospitals had already hit their peak capacity at that time. Also, nursing homes could refuse to accept them.

Sure, they could refuse to accept a Covid patient; but those patients weren't going back to the hospital:

"Governor Cuomo said repeatedly on Thursday that if a nursing home cannot provide the required care for any patient, the nursing home could decline admission. But in the case of a COVID patient, it would mean moving that person to another nursing home, transferring the issue of an infected person entering a facility with a vulnerable population."

Can't spell Andy Cuomo without C Y A.
https://www.wgrz.com/article/news/h...virus/71-370ce285-0a0d-4df1-90c5-b5af508444df
 
Wouldn't we have to take away their civil liberties? Tell those nursing home workers what they could and couldn’t do.

No, we would not have. As I said, for starters the fed and states could have offered a huge bonus to staff members willing to live on site. A full on quarantine would have been, and still is, a viable option.

I don’t even understand the motivation for arguing against such an obvious point.
 
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The quality of care in nursing facilities seem marginal at best. When my time comes I’ll just instinctively wander off to a secluded graveyard like elephants.
 
No, we would not have. As I said, for starters the fed and states could have offered a huge bonus to staff members willing to live on site. A full on quarantine would have been, and still is, a viable option.

I don’t even understand the motivation for arguing against such an obvious point.

I agree that would make sense. Maybe I am confused but wouldn’t that still be taking away civil liberties (in your mind) by keeping people at the nursing facility.
 
I agree that would make sense. Maybe I am confused but wouldn’t that still be taking away civil liberties (in your mind) by keeping people at the nursing facility.

Which people? The patients aren’t going out to restaurants. The staff would be paid to live on site. Presumably given enough financial incentives staff would do it voluntarily.

Not sure whose rights you believe would be violated. As with so much if this, some of you seem more interested in scoring political points and calling out the other “side” than anything else.
 
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Not offered as an excuse, but at the time both New York and New Jersey were scared to death that their hospitals were going to be overwhelmed,.. so any Covid19 patient that qualified for hospital discharge was going to be sent home come hell or high water,... even if "home" was a nursing facility...
 
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