Colorado Springs PP shooter: "I am a warrior for the babies"

[Joes Place]

...pretty much seals the deal that this was a guy motivated/manipulated by the overblown rhetoric surrouding PP and tissue donations.

Yes, he is batshit crazy and not normal.
But that's the entire point: when you spew an inaccurate and overblown message to villianize a group you disagree with, you provide the motivation for people like this to take you seriously.

 

[IACub]

While I agree that the rhetoric against PP is extreme and overblown, I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for this clearly crazy dude.

 

[cigaretteman]

While I agree that the rhetoric against PP is extreme and overblown, I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for this clearly crazy dude.

Maybe not, but Republican candidates and the echo chamber have been making irresponsible and inflammatory statements around PP for years, which encourages individual such as this clearly crazy dude in their delusions, and, in their twisted minds, legitimizes their actions.

 

[TexMichFan]

Usually your post are a lot more logic and fact based even if I do disagree with them. This one missed the marked for me.

 

[jscott78]

...pretty much seals the deal that this was a guy motivated/manipulated by the overblown rhetoric surrouding PP and tissue donations.

Yes, he is batshit crazy and not normal.
But that's the entire point: when you spew an inaccurate and overblown message to villianize a group you disagree with, you provide the motivation for people like this to take you seriously.

So proud, GOP, so proud.

 

[SIXERS24]

You can make this argument as long as you agree that Democratic rhetoric is causing people to kill police officers!

 

[naturalmwa]

What? This guy is crazy? Who would guess?

 

[naturalmwa]

You can make this argument as long as you agree that Democratic rhetoric is causing people to kill police officers!

Isn't that argued often?

 

[IACub]

What? This guy is crazy? Who would guess?

This is essentially what I assume OiT looks like. (Note: I do not assume OiT has murderous tendencies.)

 

[TexMichFan]

What? This guy is crazy? Who would guess?

I wonder if this picture was before or after his lawyer poisoned him like he claimed.

 

[22*43*51]

Maybe not, but Republican candidates and the echo chamber have been making irresponsible and inflammatory statements around PP for years, which encourages individual such as this clearly crazy dude in their delusions, and, in their twisted minds, legitimizes their actions.

...And Dems have been making irresponsible comments about LEO's. Should we blame them for all cop killings?

 

[Run&Blade]

Should have blamed it on global warming.

Get the crazies from both sides worked up.

 

[fredjr82]

...And Dems have been making irresponsible comments about LEO's. Should we blame them for all cop killings?

Link to the highly edited video?

 

[cigaretteman]

...And Dems have been making irresponsible comments about LEO's. Should we blame them for all cop killings?

\
Um, no, they have not, and no, they should not. There's that darn false equivalency rearing its ugly head once again.

 

[theIowaHawk]

While I agree that the rhetoric against PP is extreme and overblown, I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for this clearly crazy dude.

Why is he "clearly crazy"? Serious question.

 

[The Tradition]

Why is he "clearly crazy"? Serious question.

It's the eyes, man.

Here's another example:

If we locked up everybody with such crazy eyes, I bet most of these shootings would end.

 

[naturalmwa]

It's the eyes, man.

Here's another example:

If we locked up everybody with such crazy eyes, I bet most of these shootings would end.

Oh good, we could employ the same type of people who work at TSA to be government eye minders. Winning!

 

[theIowaHawk]

It's the eyes, man.

Here's another example:




If we locked up everybody with such crazy eyes, I bet most of these shootings would end.

Appreciate the serious answer. We need to stop calling everyone we don't "understand" crazy, it simply doesn't help, largely because we only "realize" they are crazy after they commit the act. It is a cop-out plain and simple.

As your picture: a person with educated parents brought up properly, intelligent, went to college, dated, worked, etc. But he wanted to kill people. Therefore he is crazy? His actions in preparation are not that of a "crazy" person, and the government spent a hell of a lot of money arguing just that.

Wanting to kill =/= crazy.

 

[moral_victory]

 

[The Tradition]

Appreciate the serious answer. We need to stop calling everyone we don't "understand" crazy, it simply doesn't help, largely because we only "realize" they are crazy after they commit the act. It is a cop-out plain and simple.

As your picture: a person with educated parents brought up properly, intelligent, went to college, dated, worked, etc. But he wanted to kill people. Therefore he is crazy? His actions in preparation are not that of a "crazy" person, and the government spent a hell of a lot of money arguing just that.

Wanting to kill =/= crazy.

There's the legal definition of crazy and the common definition of crazy, and the movie shooter guy was freaking crazy.

 

[Madman_1]

...pretty much seals the deal that this was a guy motivated/manipulated by the overblown rhetoric surrouding PP and tissue donations.

Yes, he is batshit crazy and not normal.
But that's the entire point: when you spew an inaccurate and overblown message to villianize a group you disagree with, you provide the motivation for people like this to take you seriously.

Planned Parenthood kills unborn humans. Why do you believe it had to be "rhetoric" that motivated this guy?

.

 

[joelbc1]

...pretty much seals the deal that this was a guy motivated/manipulated by the overblown rhetoric surrouding PP and tissue donations.

Yes, he is batshit crazy and not normal.
But that's the entire point: when you spew an inaccurate and overblown message to villianize a group you disagree with, you provide the motivation for people like this to take you seriously.

A 21st century answer to John Brown. God bless him.

 

[22*43*51]

Link to the highly edited video?

I submit all of the NYC cops turning their backs on Belasio for his reckless comments.

 

[joelbc1]

I submit all of the NYC cops turning their backs on Belasio for his reckless comments.

One of NY "finest" worst moments, ever.

 

[joelbc1]

Planned Parenthood kills unborn humans. Why do you believe it had to be "rhetoric" that motivated this guy?

.

How do you kill something that is not yet born?

 

[The Tradition]

How do you kill something that is not yet born?

How do you charge someone who kills a pregnant woman with two counts of murder?

 

[unIowa]

How do you charge someone who kills a pregnant woman with two counts of murder?

Let the circular arguments now commence!

 

[IACub]

Why is he "clearly crazy"? Serious question.

Well, for one thing he killed a bunch of people. Second, he made some pretty outlandish statements, like interrupting the court multiple times before his public defenders "drugged him up" like they did the Aurora theater shooter. Third, he passes the "eye test."

 

[Bulldogs1974]

Why is he "clearly crazy"? Serious question.

Do you always take the contrarian position just to be a douche?

 

[Walleye70]

Did he actually shoot anyone inside PP? I thought he shot outside and then hid there?

 

[timinatoria]

Isn't that argued often?

By the OP? I don t think so.

 

[TJ8869]

Maybe not, but Republican candidates and the echo chamber have been making irresponsible and inflammatory statements around PP for years, which encourages individual such as this clearly crazy dude in their delusions, and, in their twisted minds, legitimizes their actions.

Can you provide some examples of Republican leaders making statements that could reasonably be construed as inciting violence? I've seen many Republicans calling for Congress to defund Planned Parenthood, but it takes a pretty vivid imagination to think that somehow equates to mass murder.

 

[theIowaHawk]

Do you always take the contrarian position just to be a douche?

No, this is important. I usually take the contrarian position, but not here, at least not to be a douche.

If apples kept falling on our heads and our response was to keep calling it "magic", it would be pretty goddamn pointless, wouldn't it?

So people, rational, working, educated people go out and commit murder and our response is to call them "crazy". Goddamn pointless.

Sure, some people are crazy, and we have ways of determining that. Our way of determining these guys are crazy is to look at their crime, or look at their eyes, and bingo bongo we got ourselves a crazy.

Ted Bundy wasn't crazy. John Wayne Gacy wasn't crazy. I doubt this guy is crazy, he is sure hell bent on claiming he isn't. The Aurora guy wasn't crazy.

By calling them and their actions crazy we are refusing to actually analyze what is going on. It is a pathetic cop-out to make ourselves feel better. Because we all know people with a lot of guns. These were guys with a lot of guns. If these guys are crazy...then we don't have to believe our friends are (or ourselves).

Take this as a PERFECT EXAMPLE:

Well, for one thing he killed a bunch of people.

This has absolutely no bearing on sanity ... if it did we would never be able to incarcerate nor execute our prisoners. It shouldn't have any bearing on sanity. It can be an entirely rational decision to go kill people. Do you mean it is unusual? Out of the norm? Sure, so is deciding to climb Mt. Everest.

Second, he made some pretty outlandish statements, like interrupting the court multiple times before his public defenders "drugged him up" like they did the Aurora theater shooter. Third, he passes the "eye test."

Did you read what he was saying when he interrupted court? That he wasn't crazy, he doesn't want a psych eval, he doesn't want to become the Aurora shooter trying for an insanity defense. His interruptions are saying that he is guilty and doesn't want to plea insanity. I see nothing wrong with that.

And then there is the eye test.

I'm sure the MMPI and all the other tests take these three striking characteristics into account ...

 

[theIowaHawk]

There's the legal definition of crazy and the common definition of crazy, and the movie shooter guy was freaking crazy.

Which is part of the problem. The more "common" people can chalk it up as crazy the more we can simply ignore it and get on with our lives.

 

[The Tradition]

No, this is important. I usually take the contrarian position, but not here, at least not to be a douche.

If apples kept falling on our heads and our response was to keep calling it "magic", it would be pretty goddamn pointless, wouldn't it?

So people, rational, working, educated people go out and commit murder and our response is to call them "crazy". Goddamn pointless.

Sure, some people are crazy, and we have ways of determining that. Our way of determining these guys are crazy is to look at their crime, or look at their eyes, and bingo bongo we got ourselves a crazy.

Ted Bundy wasn't crazy. John Wayne Gacy wasn't crazy. I doubt this guy is crazy, he is sure hell bent on claiming he isn't. The Aurora guy wasn't crazy.

By calling them and their actions crazy we are refusing to actually analyze what is going on. It is a pathetic cop-out to make ourselves feel better. Because we all know people with a lot of guns. These were guys with a lot of guns. If these guys are crazy...then we don't have to believe our friends are (or ourselves).

Take this as a PERFECT EXAMPLE:



This has absolutely no bearing on sanity ... if it did we would never be able to incarcerate nor execute our prisoners. It shouldn't have any bearing on sanity. It can be an entirely rational decision to go kill people. Do you mean it is unusual? Out of the norm? Sure, so is deciding to climb Mt. Everest.



Did you read what he was saying when he interrupted court? That he wasn't crazy, he doesn't want a psych eval, he doesn't want to become the Aurora shooter trying for an insanity defense. His interruptions are saying that he is guilty and doesn't want to plea insanity. I see nothing wrong with that.

And then there is the eye test.

I'm sure the MMPI and all the other tests take these three striking characteristics into account ...

You're ignoring that the legal definition of crazy is not what ordinary people think of as crazy.

 

[theIowaHawk]

You're ignoring that the legal definition of crazy is not what ordinary people think of as crazy.

See my above post, but no, I'm not. I'm not using the word insane, I'm not using a legal definition. I'm specifically complaining about the "common" or "ordinary" usage of crazy to define these people.

"My neighbor wouldn't lock three women in his basement for decades because he isn't crazy."

"Oh shit! My neighbor was crazy, he did lock up women in his basement!"

What is the difference? Simply finding out about the act. Now how do you do anything about the first one, if you only believe he is "crazy" after the second? You can't.

 

[Joes Place]

You can make this argument as long as you agree that Democratic rhetoric is causing people to kill police officers!

A) I've never defended 'Democratic rhetoric' either.

B) When any of the Democratic presidential candidates starts pushing edited/mis-identified videos of fake police violence against minorities, we can call it apples-apples. As of today, only the Republican candidates have directly engaged in this. Certainly, activists on both sides push their propaganda, but I have yet to see any of the Dem candidates pushing fake videos supporting it, or doubling down on their side's "crazies" and legitimizing those groups.

 

[timinatoria]

A) I've never defended 'Democratic rhetoric' either.

B) When any of the Democratic presidential candidates starts pushing edited/mis-identified videos of fake police violence against minorities, we can call it apples-apples. As of today, only the Republican candidates have directly engaged in this. Certainly, activists on both sides push their propaganda, but I have yet to see any of the Dem candidates pushing fake videos supporting it, or doubling down on their side's "crazies" and legitimizing those groups.

Hands up, don't shoot.

 

[theIowaHawk]

A) I've never defended 'Democratic rhetoric' either.

B) When any of the Democratic presidential candidates starts pushing edited/mis-identified videos of fake police violence against minorities, we can call it apples-apples. As of today, only the Republican candidates have directly engaged in this. Certainly, activists on both sides push their propaganda, but I have yet to see any of the Dem candidates pushing fake videos supporting it, or doubling down on their side's "crazies" and legitimizing those groups.

Exactly, most of the "cop hate" is pointing out and pushing evidence where cops were, you know, wrong, or acted excessively, or whatever. Sure you couldn't take a different viewpoint on it, but it didn't contain blatant lies and mischaracterizations.

People were mostly upset by what they saw on the videos and the response of the police/law enforcement/government themselves.

This simply isn't apples/apples.

 

[NoleSoup4U]

...pretty much seals the deal that this was a guy motivated/manipulated by the overblown rhetoric surrouding PP and tissue donations.

Yes, he is batshit crazy and not normal.
But that's the entire point: when you spew an inaccurate and overblown message to villianize a group you disagree with, you provide the motivation for people like this to take you seriously.

And now you know why people don't take you seriously.