Country group Lady Antebellum changes name to Lady A

[z_ape]

That’s the part I don’t understand. It’s like if I named my organization Jim Crow and years later realized that was racist. I don’t understand how they couldn’t know so I don’t really believe there was no malicious internet. I think it’s more likely they knew what they were doing and are now saying they were ignorant as a cover.

I don't know about that. Convince me. I know of the notion of the Antebellum south, but, aside from saying it was a long time ago, and the south... have no real knowledge of what that means.

Could I infer that there were real problems with racism in that region and time period? Sure.

But do I know that "Antebellum" is speaking to something race specific? No.

Is it?

And then... are we to believe that any time a reference to that place and period is spoken or written that it's ought to be viewed as problematic unless the attendant "was racist" asterisk is attached?

Is that the standard by which we must abide now? Is that reasonable?

 

[strummingram]

I've been thinking the same thing all week. This band has been around for a while and they are just now changing their name because it may be offensive to some? All these new social justice warriors who didn't give a shit two weeks ago are now posting all kinds of things telling everyone else what they should be doing and how they can help. It's sad that most of them are only doing it because it is a trend and they don't want to appear as a racist for not posting something. I'd love to see some of them actually do more than post on social media. Maybe call a community center and see if you can be a mentor or a tutor or something.

Doing it NOW is more offensive, on more levels, than leaving it alone.

 

[strummingram]

I don't know about that. Convince me. I know of the notion of the Antebellum south, but, aside from saying it was a long time ago, and the south... have no real knowledge of what that means.

Could I infer that there were real problems with racism in that region and time period? Sure.

But do I know that "Antebellum" is speaking to something race specific? No.

Is it?

And then... are we to believe that any time a reference to that place and period is spoken or written that it's ought to be viewed as problematic unless the attendant "was racist" asterisk is attached?

Is that the standard by which we must abide now? Is that reasonable?

"America" is racist.

 

[Jerome Silberman]

The South wanted to secede peacefully, but nooooooo....

No they didn't.

 

[z_ape]

"America" is racist.

Hurricanes are racist. Disproportionately negatively affecting African Americans.

Covid-19 is racist too.

(since intent doesn't necessarily matter)

All a part of systematic racism.

 

[naturalmwa]

I don't know about that. Convince me. I know of the notion of the Antebellum south, but, aside from saying it was a long time ago, and the south... have no real knowledge of what that means.

Could I infer that there were real problems with racism in that region and time period? Sure.

But do I know that "Antebellum" is speaking to something race specific? No.

Is it?

And then... are we to believe that any time a reference to that place and period is spoken or written that it's ought to be viewed as problematic unless the attendant "was racist" asterisk is attached?

Is that the standard by which we must abide now? Is that reasonable?

Antebellum is more specific so yes it has an inherently racist connotation.

 

[z_ape]

Antebellum is more specific so yes it has an inherently racist connotation.

What is it then? I went to wikipedia and they just referenced a time period.

 

[alaskanseminole]

Personally, I wish we'd focus on that actual fracking problem...educate the ignorant on how we got here and figure out a dadgum plan to change course. Changing names, pulling down statues, hashtaging phrases--while well intended--isn't going to fix a damn thing.

"Oh wow, your name is Lady A now...AWESOME! Now maybe I can walk the streets alone at night", said no black man ever.

Racism isn't even the biggest issue in 2020...racist policies enacted 100+ years ago that navigated the African American people to where they are today is the bigger issue. How the frack do we tangibly fix this?

 

[strummingram]

Hurricanes are racist. Disproportionately negatively affecting African Americans.

Covid-19 is racist too.

(since intent doesn't necessarily matter)

All a part of systematic racism.

The wrong white people are the ones showing the most guilt and blame! The members of Lady Antebellum aren't prejudiced toward blacks at all. This gesture will only piss off the people who actually ARE prejudiced even more.

The WORD "Dixie" or "Antebellum" or anything else doesn't actually mean anything negative without the help of people's intent.

 

[naturalmwa]

What is it then? I went to wikipedia and they just referenced a time period.

It’s the time period marked by slavery. That’s the defining characteristic.

 

[strummingram]

Personally, I wish we'd focus on that actual fracking problem...educate the ignorant on how we got here and figure out a dadgum plan to change course. Changing names, pulling down statues, hashtaging phrases--while well intended--isn't going to fix a damn thing.

"Oh wow, your name is Lady A now...AWESOME! Now maybe I can walk the streets alone at night", said no black man ever.

Racism isn't even the biggest issue in 2020...racist policies enacted 100+ years ago that navigated the African American people to where they are today is the bigger issue. How the frack do we tangibly fix this?

Every person with a pulse is also a racist. Human beings are taught tribalism from the moment they're born. God only knows how much of it is genetic.

The language is just a vessel for the thoughts. Getting the species to reprogram so those thoughts aren't generated is necessary. What I say is just letting people know what I'm thinking. And, it's up to the listener to have some ability to understand and comprehend and not project THEIR thoughts into MY language!

 

[Jan Itor]

Why is that? Is south off the charts?

Stop it. It was funny and true.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

I would have gone cause belli all over circa 10 years ago. Then, she clarksoned herself by discovering food and success. Now, nyet.

..................................................................wut?

 

[Jerome Silberman]

What is it then? I went to wikipedia and they just referenced a time period.

The Antebellum South is also known as the Plantation Period. It's a period of economic growth largely due to slave labor.

 

[srams21]

Dixie is a reference to Jeremiah Dixon who was a surveyor of the border between Maryland and Pennsylevannia

Antebellum however is a reference the pre-war (Ante - Before, Bellum - War) South which was economically dependent upon slavery.

Naming your group "Lady Antebellum" can be seen a celebration of the pre-war South.

The South loves to celebrate their "heritage" like when they wanted to secede from the country. Yet they also claim to be vastly "patriotic".

The South is fu*king weird.

 

[strummingram]

The Antebellum South is also known as the Plantation Period. It's a period of economic growth largely due to slave labor.

Don't say "Plantation", that's offensive.

 

[hawkcub]

This was about promoting themselves.

 

[Hoosierhawkeye]

The South loves to celebrate their "heritage" like when they wanted to secede from the country. Yet they also claim to be vastly "patriotic".

The South is fu*king weird.

It's amazing how much of southern heritage is involved with either slavery or jim crow. And the thing that is crazy is that it simply doesn't have to be like that.

Shoot Indiana has a history of being a KKK state. My own alma-mater came extremely close to being KKK University for example, the Roman Catholic Church gave the Lutherans (whom they were probably not fond of at the time) a loan just to prevent the KKK from buying Valparaiso University. (The KKK was so powerful here they were in position to buy their own university) All of this stuff I only know from living here and reading/learning history. We don't parade that stuff around in Indiana. There are no memorials or statues of DC Stephenson to my knowledge.

 

[Jerome Silberman]

Don't say "Plantation", that's offensive.

Large-scale agrarian centers specializing in forced volunteerism?

 

[strummingram]

This was about promoting themselves.

Doesn't hurt, does it?

 

[mcgrawfsu]

Doing it NOW is more offensive, on more levels, than leaving it alone.

I agree with you 100%. It comes across as so fake.

 

[strummingram]

Large-scale agrarian centers specializing in forced volunteerism?

I'm fvcking with you. I would never censor ANY language. I was trying to illustrate how the words, themselves, are just words... unless we empower them to be more and restrict language, and restrict thought.

You offered a very compelling euphemism, however. You could work for the government with that gift. "The N Word" is a euphemism... euphemisms suck. Euphemisms allow the offensive, inappropriate INTENT found in the so-called "slur", to live and flourish and become action and reality more and more.

 

[z_ape]

It’s the time period marked by slavery. That’s the defining characteristic.

Reading more...

Before the war, at least on webster. (obviously the war being over slavery)

So it represented that time period. I can understand how seeing that word one could associate it with the slavery era.

At any rate, still a period.

What was behind the naming of Lady Antebellum?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_A
On the BBC Radio 2 Drivetime Show August 9, 2010, the band explained that the name comes from when the group did a photo shoot in historical costumes at antebellum houses. In American history, the Antebellum era was the period before the Civil War in the Southern United States.

I'm sure the pre civil-war south offers plenty of interesting cultural analysis. You could talk about the dress and houses from the era. The elongated tree lined lanes on southern plantations. Maybe some of it was nice or attractive. Like you saw on Forest Gump. I know tours are still given today.

Interesting cultural artifacts from the period, at any rate.

That was the origin of this name.

Did it occur within an era demarcated by plantations and a war over slavery? Yes.

But the name itself obviously wasn't honoring that.

So if the name needn't necessarily be considered offensive, we're left with subjective interpretation of what you think when you see that title.

 

[z_ape]

I'll also add -- Antebellum is a very elegant word. In tandem with "Lady" you get quite a band name. When bands select names elegance of word matters.

 

[z_ape]

Reading more...

Before the war, at least on webster. (obviously the war being over slavery)

So it represented that time period. I can understand how seeing that word one could associate it with the slavery era.

At any rate, still a period.

What was behind the naming of Lady Antebellum?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_A
On the BBC Radio 2 Drivetime Show August 9, 2010, the band explained that the name comes from when the group did a photo shoot in historical costumes at antebellum houses. In American history, the Antebellum era was the period before the Civil War in the Southern United States.

I'm sure the pre civil-war south offers plenty of interesting cultural analysis. You could talk about the dress and houses from the era. The elongated tree lined lanes on southern plantations. Maybe some of it was nice or attractive. Like you saw on Forest Gump. I know tours are still given today.

Interesting cultural artifacts from the period, at any rate.

That was the origin of this name.

Did it occur within an era demarcated by plantations and a war over slavery? Yes.

But the name itself obviously wasn't honoring that.

So if the name needn't necessarily be considered offensive, we're left with subjective interpretation of what you think when you see that title.

So where's that leave us?

Where's the wrong live? Can you get me there?

I guess all I can come up with is that some people might see the phrase as speaking fondly about the period. Specifically, certain negative aspects of the period that were primary in demarcating it.

But obviously, as noted in my analysis above, we might reference "Antebellum" in any number of contexts that clearly don't speak fondly of the era's negatives. But rather, to other observations encapsulated in the era that surely can't in and of themselves, be problematic.

 

[strummingram]

One of my all-time favorite bands... won't be following Lady "A's" lead.

Rick Rubin- the NYC producer mogul- encouraged them, before their first album release, to call themselves the Kobb Kounty Krowes.

 

[SpyderHawk]

I'll also add -- Antebellum is a very elegant word. In tandem with "Lady" you get quite a band name. When bands select names elegance of word matters.

I agree. Barenaked Ladies does have a certain ring to it tho.

 

[strummingram]

So where's that leave us?

Where's the wrong live? Can you get me there?

I guess all I can come up with is that some people might see the phrase as speaking fondly about the period. Specifically, certain negative aspects of the period that were primary in demarcating it.

But obviously, as noted in my analysis above, we might reference "Antebellum" in any number of contexts that clearly don't speak fondly of the era's negatives. But rather, to other observations encapsulated in the era that surely can't in and of themselves, be problematic.

It's ALL or NOTHING with some people. It really is.

 

[z_ape]

Are you doing something wrong if you have an appreciation for Antebellum architecture?

If you speak fondly of it. Is that a problem? Is the era so tinged by slavery that we can't do this? How should we think here?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antebellum_architecture

 

[srams21]

I'll also add -- Antebellum is a very elegant word. In tandem with "Lady" you get quite a band name. When bands select names elegance of word matters.

Too bad an elegant name is that of a shitty pop country band.

 

[z_ape]

Should Antebellum houses -- insomuch as they symbolize the slavery era south -- be demolished?

Symbolically couldn't you argue that this is primary when one glances upon an Antebellum house?

 

[z_ape]

How's this work kids? What's reasonable and what isn't? Why?

 

[z_ape]

I don't think we have discussions of the nature I just asked for in classrooms anymore. Or am I wrong?

Am I wrong in assuming that the default here across college classrooms in America would be to of-course condemn the naming of the band. Not to explore the complexities associated with subjective interpretation of a word linked to a problematic past and all its contextual interpretations.

The vanquishing of intellectual curiosity for the adherence to the here-and-now of an emotionally and politically charged antiracism movement?

Isn't that a big problem for a place of higher learning, higher thought? Aren't we losing something important?

 

[strummingram]

I don't think we have discussions of the nature I just asked for in classrooms anymore. Or am I wrong?

Am I wrong in assuming that the default here across college classrooms in America would be to of-course condemn the naming of the band. Not to explore the complexities associated with subjective interpretation of a word linked to a problematic past and all its contextual interpretations.

The vanquishing of intellectual curiosity for the adherence to the here-and-now of an emotionally and politically charged antiracism movement?

Isn't that a big problem for a place of higher learning, higher thought?

I think you won the argument.

 

[Jerome Silberman]

I don't think we have discussions of the nature I just asked for in classrooms anymore. Or am I wrong?

Am I wrong in assuming that the default here across college classrooms in America would be to of-course condemn the naming of the band. Not to explore the complexities associated with subjective interpretation of a word linked to a problematic past and all its contextual interpretations.

The vanquishing of intellectual curiosity for the adherence to the here-and-now of an emotionally and politically charged antiracism movement?

Isn't that a big problem for a place of higher learning, higher thought? Aren't we losing something important?

I think there is a difference between studying and discussing the Antebellum era, and its historic significance, and naming a band after said era.

 

[SpyderHawk]

Lady Gaga sounds good. Got to make it to the top somehow.

 

[Johnsoda123]

So they’re trying to steal Lindsey Graham’s thunder?

Pic(s)?