Covid again: There was NEVER any scientific consensus for lockdowns

[stanzithemanzi12]

A little info for you, while you don't care, most people do. And just because you're willing to accept more deaths, others aren't. With the virus there was never going to be a "normal". Your odd thinking is not the norm. Even if the president had said, continue as usual, it wouldn't have happened. It's time to accept this fact and move on, or you can continue to be angry for the rest of your life.

I'm not angry because I refused to change my way of life and fortunately we have a fantastic governor in Iowa who was at the forefront of forcing the "others", who weren't part of the norm, to get back to life as normal.

In Iowa, the "norm" was wanting to get back to normal life without masks, without teachers unions moaning and groaning. The ones who didn't want this were the outliers. Polk, Johnson, and Linn county tried hard to kick and scream like little babies, but their hands were forced because we have a great governor.

 

[BGHAWK]

Remember when biden and Harris tried to illegally mandate the clot shots on any business with over 100 employees? Scum bags

Remember when trump told Bob Woodward, and it's on tape, that he downplayed the pandemic? Multiple studies have shown trump was liable for over 400,000 unnecessary American deaths.

 

[seminole97]

How many of those voices were speaking based on little or no evidence at that time?

How do you know if the government quietly conspires to silence them?

You’re seemingly arguing that proponents of lockdowns were ignoring everything that disagreed with them, when historically, quarantines have been an effective method of fighting or at least slowing the spread of an outbreak.

I'm arguing that proponents of lockdowns were silencing everyone that disagreed with them.

I'd like to be able to hear from a Stanford PhD on infectious diseases without the government trying to silence him.

The vast majority of posts I’ve seen since Covid decrying the mandates do so with the benefit of hindsight.

Because the government worked to silence those voices during COVID.
You're unwittingly highlighting the censorship, and how it affected public policy decisions.

 

[stanzithemanzi12]

Remember when trump told Bob Woodward, and it's on tape, that he downplayed the pandemic? Multiple studies have shown trump was liable for over 400,000 unnecessary American deaths.

Whatever. Remember when lots of people probably wish he had downplayed it even more even if it meant more than unnecessary deaths?

 

[Scruddy]

Remember when trump told Bob Woodward, and it's on tape, that he downplayed the pandemic? Multiple studies have shown trump was liable for over 400,000 unnecessary American deaths.

More people died under biden (who illegally tried to coerce me into taking an experimental jab linked to all kinds of health issues now). Shoo, cockroach.

 

[BGHAWK]

Don't forget Obama's big birthday bash

And trump's so called press conference and big get together introducing Amy Coney Barret to the SC.

 

[BGHAWK]

Whatever. Remember when lots of people probably wish he had downplayed it even more even if it meant more than unnecessary deaths?

Whatever? What a stupid comment for so many reasons. And no I don't remember your ?

 

[MichaelKeller99]

What does 'may ultimately' mean in your world?


Morons, all of you'll are fvcking morons.

What does sequencing mean in your world?

How does the ‘world’s leading immunologist’ * go from saying we NEED a vaccine for a completely unknown virus to two months later saying “Meh, it really doesn’t seem that bad…” to then sounding the alarm months later that it could be ‘historic and devastating’? Screw that 🤡


* BWAHAHAHA!!!

 

[BGHAWK]

More people died under biden (who illegally tried to coerce me into taking an experimental jab linked to all kinds of health issues now). Shoo, cockroach.

Yet nowhere can you provide where Biden is blamed for covid deaths, unlike the 400,000+ unnecessary deaths attributed to trump. As usual you do have something, but it's worthless.

 

[Scruddy]

Yet nowhere can you provide where Biden is blamed for covid deaths, unlike the 400,000+ unnecessary deaths attributed to trump. As usual you do have something, but it's worthless.

I literally just blamed him for the covid deaths. Ez check mate. You are an idiot.

 

[sober_teacher]

How do you know if the government quietly conspires to silence them?



I'm arguing that proponents of lockdowns were silencing everyone that disagreed with them.

I'd like to be able to hear from a Stanford PhD on infectious diseases without the government trying to silence him.

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Because the government worked to silence those voices during COVID.
You're unwittingly highlighting the censorship, and how it affected public policy decisions.

You’re also ignoring that ALOT of crackpots were out there also proposing miracle cures/treatments that could have gotten a lot of people killed as well. I’ll be honest and say I don’t know what the right answer here is. There was so much false and/or misleading information being pushed along with the legit medical sources…often enough coming from Trump and members of his administration. Total freedom of anyone to share anything they want during an emergency like Covid can be just as harmful as government censorship.

This also ignores the distinction that needs to be made here - this wasn’t government censorship. This was Twitter censoring users when requested by government agencies. Subtle perhaps, but there is a difference there.

Most won’t ever do so publicly, but I think it’s fair to say that many of the medical experts, from fauci on down, would handle things different if they had to do so knowing then what they know now.

And frankly, it had to be an absolute nightmare trying to fight a pandemic at the same time as spending a ridiculous amount of time having to correct statements from Trump in particular.

 

[BGHAWK]

I literally just blamed him for the covid deaths. Ez check mate. You are an idiot.

Well prove where he was responsible for all of those covid deaths. You probably shouldn't be calling anyone other than yourself an idiot.

 

[Scruddy]

Well prove where he was responsible for all of those covid deaths. You probably shouldn't be calling anyone other than yourself an idiot.

You didn't prove anything yourself, dingus. You basically just said "leftist fact checkers said he was". Learn your place.

 

[runkpanole]

15 days

15 Days to Slow the Spread – The White House

trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov

 

[Finance85]

Government Misinformation.

Do Joe Biden & Anthony Fauci need to be arrested like Tim Walz and Hillary Clinton suggest?

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Joes Place opinion is the only opinion that matters. Just ask him, he'll tell you.

 

[Finance85]

How about better safe than sorry? It could have got ugly if it was just the Spanish Flu.

Fauci already had the genetic sequence, and lab data going back to 2014.

 

[SB_SB]

I'm not angry because I refused to change my way of life and fortunately we have a fantastic governor in Iowa who was at the forefront of forcing the "others", who weren't part of the norm, to get back to life as normal.

In Iowa, the "norm" was wanting to get back to normal life without masks, without teachers unions moaning and groaning. The ones who didn't want this were the outliers. Polk, Johnson, and Linn county tried hard to kick and scream like little babies, but their hands were forced because we have a great governor.

You said you don't care about how many people died as long you got to maintain your normal. You didn't get your normal because at the time the normal was to isolate and reduce the spread, and then wait for the virus to hopefully get less deadly. That's exactly what happened. You can bitch and moan all your want but the right thing to do was done, whether you liked it or not.

 

[seminole97]

You’re also ignoring that ALOT of crackpots were out there also proposing miracle cures/treatments that could have gotten a lot of people killed as well. I’ll be honest and say I don’t know what the right answer here is. There was so much false and/or misleading information being pushed along with the legit medical sources…often enough coming from Trump and members of his administration. Total freedom of anyone to share anything they want during an emergency like Covid can be just as harmful as government censorship.

False and misleading information was being pushed by authorities, at the same time they were working to silence dissent.

I'll risk freedom over the 'safety' of censorship. I'm an American.

This also ignores the distinction that needs to be made here - this wasn’t government censorship. This was Twitter censoring users when requested by government agencies. Subtle perhaps, but there is a difference there.

What is the difference to the person censored, and to the public that can't hear from them?

The backdrop of the government 'asking' for people to be censored are statements like this:

“We could regulate you out of business if we wanted to,” - Senator Thom Tillis, R-N.C.

Most won’t ever do so publicly, but I think it’s fair to say that many of the medical experts, from fauci on down, would handle things different if they had to do so knowing then what they know now.

Why do you think they won't do so publicly?
Afraid to puncture the impeccable prestige of an unerring government?

 

[sober_teacher]

False and misleading information was being pushed by authorities, at the same time they were working to silence dissent.

I'll risk freedom over the 'safety' of censorship. I'm an American.



What is the difference to the person censored, and to the public that can't hear from them?

The backdrop of the government 'asking' for people to be censored are statements like this:

“We could regulate you out of business if we wanted to,” - Senator Thom Tillis, R-N.C.



Why do you think they won't do so publicly?
Afraid to puncture the impeccable prestige of an unerring government?

Bad info was coming from everywhere, you can’t just blame the government on this one.

Freedom over censorship is a wonderful ideal, but ignores that many times in American history we’ve bent on this during times of crisis. We’ve survived those stretches.

As to why they won’t do so publicly? For some, far too many are just not willing to admit to being wrong - people like Trump see admitting a mistake is a sign of weakness. When it comes to doctors, I honestly think in their profession they work so hard at creating that sense of infallibility that they don’t admit to being wrong because it would pierce that for them plays a role.

Then too, a lot of them were also under attack constantly from all sides so they developed a bunker mentality imo. Fauci for example, was constantly being attacked by Rand Paul, who seemingly was more interested in finding someone to blame than he was in finding solutions.

You want to paint this as everything the government did was bad here seemingly. I think there were bad actors all around. Imo, FEMA, CDC, Fauci, etc did the best they could, with what they had, knowing what they did AT THAT TIME. Were they right in all respects? No. Could they have done things better? Of course.

 

[runkpanole]

Fauci already had the genetic sequence, and lab data going back to 2014.

Did you fall into the MAGA cult that is northwest Florida?

 

[SB_SB]

Bad info was coming from everywhere, you can’t just blame the government on this one.

Freedom over censorship is a wonderful ideal, but ignores that many times in American history we’ve bent on this during times of crisis. We’ve survived those stretches.

As to why they won’t do so publicly? For some, far too many are just not willing to admit to being wrong - people like Trump see admitting a mistake is a sign of weakness. When it comes to doctors, I honestly think in their profession they work so hard at creating that sense of infallibility that they don’t admit to being wrong because it would pierce that for them plays a role.

Then too, a lot of them were also under attack constantly from all sides so they developed a bunker mentality imo. Fauci for example, was constantly being attacked by Rand Paul, who seemingly was more interested in finding someone to blame than he was in finding solutions.

You want to paint this as everything the government did was bad here seemingly. I think there were bad actors all around. Imo, FEMA, CDC, Fauci, etc did the best they could, with what they had, knowing what they did AT THAT TIME. Were they right in all respects? No. Could they have done things better? Of course.

These (the government lied) people are like Florida residents that refuse to leave their home during a hurricane and are mad when others leave. Some of them will die, some will have no damage and say, see I told you, and other will have to be evacuated. There's multiple outcomes for covid just like the hurricanes, but some of these people just don't get it and think it's a one size fits all.

 

[MichaelKeller99]

These (the government lied) people are like Florida residents that refuse to leave their home during a hurricane and are mad when others leave. Some of them will die, some will have no damage and say, see I told you, and other will have to be evacuated. There's multiple outcomes for covid just like the hurricanes, but some of these people just don't get it and think it's a one size fits all.

Your ‘one size fits all’ take is quite ironic.

We were told everyone had to stay home unless it was absolutely necessary to leave the house.

We were told everyone had to socially distance.

We were told everyone had to get vaccinated.

We were told everyone had to wear a mask.

We were told everyone had to be isolated in nursing homes; to die alone and afraid, if need be.

To all those ‘tellers’ I say piss off.

 

[runkpanole]

Your ‘one size fits all’ take is quite ironic.

We were told everyone had to stay home unless it was absolutely necessary to leave the house.

We were told everyone had to socially distance.

We were told everyone had to get vaccinated.

We were told everyone had to wear a mask.

We were told everyone had to be isolated in nursing homes; to die alone and afraid, if need be.

To all those ‘tellers’ I say piss off.

Who was the leader of our government when those things were told to us?

 

[MichaelKeller99]

Who was the leader of our government when those things were told to us?

The guy I’m not voting for.

Not like it matters; they’re all peas in a pod.

 

[SB_SB]

Your ‘one size fits all’ take is quite ironic.

We were told everyone had to stay home unless it was absolutely necessary to leave the house.

We were told everyone had to socially distance.

We were told everyone had to get vaccinated.

We were told everyone had to wear a mask.

We were told everyone had to be isolated in nursing homes; to die alone and afraid, if need be.

To all those ‘tellers’ I say piss off.

So you're mad that someone told you to do something. You were free to leave the house. You were free to meet with whoever would meet with you. You were free to not get vaccinated. you were free to not wear a mask except where required. You were free to remove your family member from the nursing home and take them home to die. If you want to leave them in the nursing home, then you have to follow the nursing home rules. Is it really that hard to understand.

 

[BGHAWK]

You didn't prove anything yourself, dingus. You basically just said "leftist fact checkers said he was". Learn your place.

Your responses sound just like trump, they wander off into oblivion that nobody can understand, and like trump, when you have nothing, and you have nothing, you revert to your childlike ways of name calling.

 

[Scruddy]

Your responses sound just like trump, they wander off into oblivion that nobody can understand, and like trump, when you have nothing, and you have nothing, you revert to your childlike ways of name calling.

You offered nothing of substance to begin with lol ironic that you go to your version of name calling in the same sentence you call name calling childish. You never fail to amaze.

 

[seminole97]

You want to paint this as everything the government did was bad here seemingly. I think there were bad actors all around. Imo, FEMA, CDC, Fauci, etc did the best they could, with what they had, knowing what they did AT THAT TIME. Were they right in all respects? No. Could they have done things better? Of course.

They did the 'best they could' to hide what they had done in supporting the gain of function research with bat corona viruses in Wuhan.
I'd certainly agree on that.

 

[sober_teacher]

They did the 'best they could' to hide what they had done in supporting the gain of function research with bat corona viruses in Wuhan.
I'd certainly agree on that.

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Nice deflection.

 

[alaskanseminole]

Wasn't it Trump who locked down Joe? I could have sworn Donald was president in 2020. Maybe I'm just getting old and senile.

 

[Joes Place]

Wasn't it Trump who locked down

There weren't any "lockdowns".

What/who was "locked down"?
China locked people in their apartments and homes; that simply never happened in the US (or anywhere in the West)

 

[Joes Place]

We were told everyone had to stay home unless it was absolutely necessary to leave the house.

We were told everyone had to socially distance.

We were told everyone had to get vaccinated.

We were told everyone had to wear a mask.

We were told everyone had to be isolated in nursing homes; to die alone and afraid, if need be.

I'm seeing ZERO "lockdowns" in any of this.

 

[alaskanseminole]

There weren't any "lockdowns".

What/who was "locked down"?
China locked people in their apartments and homes; that simply never happened in the US (or anywhere in the West)

Well, now you're playing semantics...no different than the "border czar" mental gymnastics people do.

In 2020, the lockdowns in the United States due to COVID-19 were commonly referred to as "stay-at-home orders" or "shelter-in-place orders." These orders varied by state and locality but generally required residents to remain in their homes except for essential activities such as grocery shopping, medical appointments, and outdoor exercise while maintaining social distancing. Some states and regions also used terms like "safer-at-home orders" to describe their specific restrictions.

 

[MichaelKeller99]

Depends on what your definition of lockdown is. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck then…well…you know, you know the THING! 🧐

lockdown​

noun​

lock·down ˈläk-ˌdau̇n

: a temporary condition imposed by governmental authorities (as during the outbreak of an epidemic disease) in which most people are required to refrain from or limit activities outside the home involving public contact (such as dining out or attending large gatherings)
Authorities placed the central Chinese city under lockdown on Jan. 23 after the virus had infected hundreds of residents and was just starting its spread across the globe.—Darryl Coote

The San Francisco Bay Area lockdown and national guidelines signal a rapid escalation of government and business efforts to halt the coronavirus spread via restrictions that will slam the brakes on economic activity.—Ed Carson

While most people are at home during lockdown, essential workers are still on the front lines and need their children to be looked after.—George Heagney

 

[Finance85]

Bad info was coming from everywhere, you can’t just blame the government on this one.

Freedom over censorship is a wonderful ideal, but ignores that many times in American history we’ve bent on this during times of crisis. We’ve survived those stretches.

As to why they won’t do so publicly? For some, far too many are just not willing to admit to being wrong - people like Trump see admitting a mistake is a sign of weakness. When it comes to doctors, I honestly think in their profession they work so hard at creating that sense of infallibility that they don’t admit to being wrong because it would pierce that for them plays a role.

Then too, a lot of them were also under attack constantly from all sides so they developed a bunker mentality imo. Fauci for example, was constantly being attacked by Rand Paul, who seemingly was more interested in finding someone to blame than he was in finding solutions.

You want to paint this as everything the government did was bad here seemingly. I think there were bad actors all around. Imo, FEMA, CDC, Fauci, etc did the best they could, with what they had, knowing what they did AT THAT TIME. Were they right in all respects? No. Could they have done things better? Of course.

You are actually ignoring factual evidence to the contrary, particularly what Fauci knew at the time. Rand Paul turned out to be right, and getting to the truth about the origin may have been the best way to find a solution. It must suck to only see the color blue. It must also suck to have an unwavering faith that government is infallible and only cares about taking care of all of us. They really don't.

 

[fsu1jreed]

You are actually ignoring factual evidence to the contrary, particularly what Fauci knew at the time. Rand Paul turned out to be right, and getting to the truth about the origin may have been the best way to find a solution. It must suck to only see the color blue. It must also suck to have an unwavering faith that government is infallible and only cares about taking care of all of us. They really don't.

He knew, then why would he say 'may ultimately' if he knew? And did you really bring up Rand Paul? Excuse me if your logic is questionable about a topic that you have no education in after you said mass deportation would have no affect, a topic you're supposed to be somewhat knowledgeable in

 

[sober_teacher]

You are actually ignoring factual evidence to the contrary, particularly what Fauci knew at the time. Rand Paul turned out to be right, and getting to the truth about the origin may have been the best way to find a solution. It must suck to only see the color blue. It must also suck to have an unwavering faith that government is infallible and only cares about taking care of all of us. They really don't.

I just love broad statements that ignore so many posts I’ve ever made. Find me a post where I’ve ever said government was infallible. Just one.

As for Paul, his behavior consistently to me came across as someone who want to pin the blame for covid entirely on Fauci….he never seemed interested in solutions.

Don’t understand your point for that; assuming for a moment that we were able to positively ID the origins of Covid, how would that have helped in the moment? The virus was already out, and efforts were already underway to develop vaccines. And of course, making any definitive conclusions would need assistance from the Chinese.

 

[BGHAWK]

You offered nothing of substance to begin with lol ironic that you go to your version of name calling in the same sentence you call name calling childish. You never fail to amaze.

Fact: trump was responsible to more than 400,000 unnecessary American covid deaths according to multiple studies. Biden was not accused of causing any unnecessary American covid deaths.

 

[BGHAWK]

Depends on what your definition of lockdown is. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck then…well…you know, you know the THING! 🧐

lockdown​

noun​

lock·down ˈläk-ˌdau̇n

: a temporary condition imposed by governmental authorities (as during the outbreak of an epidemic disease) in which most people are required to refrain from or limit activities outside the home involving public contact (such as dining out or attending large gatherings)
Authorities placed the central Chinese city under lockdown on Jan. 23 after the virus had infected hundreds of residents and was just starting its spread across the globe.—Darryl Coote

The San Francisco Bay Area lockdown and national guidelines signal a rapid escalation of government and business efforts to halt the coronavirus spread via restrictions that will slam the brakes on economic activity.—Ed Carson

While most people are at home during lockdown, essential workers are still on the front lines and need their children to be looked after.—George Heagney

Your problem is that in your post #62, you used the words "had to" multiple times which seems to imply mandatory.

 

[SB_SB]

Depends on what your definition of lockdown is. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck then…well…you know, you know the THING! 🧐

lockdown​

noun​

lock·down ˈläk-ˌdau̇n

: a temporary condition imposed by governmental authorities (as during the outbreak of an epidemic disease) in which most people are required to refrain from or limit activities outside the home involving public contact (such as dining out or attending large gatherings)
Authorities placed the central Chinese city under lockdown on Jan. 23 after the virus had infected hundreds of residents and was just starting its spread across the globe.—Darryl Coote

The San Francisco Bay Area lockdown and national guidelines signal a rapid escalation of government and business efforts to halt the coronavirus spread via restrictions that will slam the brakes on economic activity.—Ed Carson

While most people are at home during lockdown, essential workers are still on the front lines and need their children to be looked after.—George Heagney

As you can see from your own description, there are multiple meanings for lockdown. China handled it different than the U.S., and the states handled it differently. Individuals handled it differently. You maybe didn't agree with how your town handled it but that's your problem and you might want to seek help trying to get over it because it's 2024 and it's still consuming your life.