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Daniel Penny cleared of all charges

If that’s your take…good for you. Neither has anything to do with the other. Biden didn’t kill anyone whereas this guy did.
The homeless guy basically killed himself when he chose to threaten to kill everyone on the subway. His history of violence clearly indicates he would have killed someone given the opportunity. I LOL when I saw his old man on the news tonight, saying his boy was just turning his life around (same old song). The dead homeless guy's dad is listed as one of the top 40 most violent homeless people in NYC. The apple surely didn't fall to far from the tree in this case.
 
You mean like when the jury acquits you? You’re the one saying one of them committed a crime and somehow the other one didn’t while neither being found guilty of one.
No. The state (who prosecutes capitol cases in America) decided there was no prosecutable case here against Biden. However, they did decide there was a prosecutable case vs. Trump in Florida.
The jury found this guy “not guilty” of the crime charged for whatever reasons ( extenuating circumstances?)…they didn’t find him “innocent” of murder or manslaughter.
 
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No. The state (who prosecutes capitol cases in America) decided there was no prosecutable case here against Biden. However, they did decide there was a prosecutable case vs. Trump in Florida.
The jury found this guy “not guilty” of the crime charged for whatever reasons ( extenuating circumstances?)…they didn’t find him “innocent” of murder or manslaughter.
Oh…so you’re saying since the state has decided not to bring any charges against Trump for J6 and now the classified documents case has been dropped, Trump hasn’t committed any crimes in those areas. Ok. Gotcha now.
 
Oh…so you’re saying since the state has decided not to bring any charges against Trump for J6 and now the classified documents case has been dropped, Trump hasn’t committed any crimes in those areas. Ok. Gotcha now.
The AG has made his decision. To indict a sitting President is much more complicated than filing charges at the rare level about a perceived criminal act. You understand this FAU. There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that would have made for an interesting trial regarding Trump however. Plus… the votes for a Senate Trial were questionable…a Congressional trial is much more about politics than it is the law.
 
The AG has made his decision. To indict a sitting President is much more complicated than filing charges at the rare level about a perceived criminal act. You understand this FAU. There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that would have made for an interesting trial regarding Trump however. Plus… the votes for a Senate Trial were questionable…a Congressional trial is much more about politics than it is the law.
Moonwalk much?
 
Bullshit. In America we do not reward vigilante ante justice. The days of the Old West are long behind us…or should be. This guy deserved to be charged and taken to trial. The rest is up to the jury. But make no mistake, vigilantism cannot be tolerated in America.
Oh, old man, you are out of your element here. Bet you’d be singing a different tune if it was your old ass in that train pissing down your depends as some crackhead threatens your life. when someone threatens to kill you, they have committed assault and a choke hold is reasonable self defense, as a reasonable person would believe that threat to be serious. Maybe not on the farm, but we out here dealing with loose cannon crackheads in these cities; ain’t nobody got time to worry about anything other than survival once death threats are issued.
 
Oh, old man, you are out of your element here. Bet you’d be singing a different tune if it was your old ass in that train pissing down your depends as some crackhead threatens your life. when someone threatens to kill you, they have committed assault and a choke hold is reasonable self defense, as a reasonable person would believe that threat to be serious. Maybe not on the farm, but we out here dealing with loose cannon crackheads in these cities; ain’t nobody got time to worry about anything other than survival once death threats are issued.
Sorry. He killed the guy. Either intentionally or accidently, he was responsible for the guy’s death. The jury “bought” his story. The DA was prosecuting tge crime that was committed.
But back to the original point here, “vigilante-ism” cannot be tolerated in America. The DA 100% did his job in prosecuting here.
(I’m assuming Phil your use of “old man” was derogatory or meant to intimidate me? Nice try.)
 
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While not directly a shot a Joe or Joel, whatever your name is, this ideation is why people pull out their phones when a 16 year beats a teacher until she looses her eye sight for taking his phone instead of actually stopping the kid.

The democratic mind creates so many problems for itself because it doesn't like addressing confrontation upfront.

There are facts. And there are the D version of the facts.
 
No. The state (who prosecutes capitol cases in America) decided there was no prosecutable case here against Biden. However, they did decide there was a prosecutable case vs. Trump in Florida.
The jury found this guy “not guilty” of the crime charged for whatever reasons ( extenuating circumstances?)…they didn’t find him “innocent” of murder or manslaughter.
Nice troll job! You even got me for a few posts. No one is this stupid so you must be faking this to get responses. Well done!!!

In case you ARE this stupid, let me help you out. He was already innocent until proven guilty. He was not guilty, therefore he was still innocent.

Juries never find anyone innocent because they are already presumed innocent. I'm sure in your 150 years you have probably heard that somewhere.
 
Nice troll job! You even got me for a few posts. No one is this stupid so you must be faking this to get responses. Well done!!!

In case you ARE this stupid, let me help you out. He was already innocent until proven guilty. He was not guilty, therefore he was still innocent.

Juries never find anyone innocent because they are already presumed innocent. I'm sure in your 150 years you have probably heard that somewhere.
Juries react to the prosecutors charges. Not to the “innocence” of the defendant. The defendants presumed innocence is key to him/her receiving a fair trial…it is not evidence, per se. the state determines whether or not there is evidence /proof of a crime and presents its facts at trial… the jury decides the viability of the facts and decides accordingly. Far from a flawless system but one that is “fair” to both sides. As long as you are willing to accept verdicts such as OJ’s and this one. It ain’t perfect.
 
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Juries react to the prosecutors charges. Not to the “innocence” of the defendant. The defendants presumed innocence is key to him/her receiving a fair trial…it is not evidence, per se. the state determines whether or not there is evidence /proof of a crime and presents its facts at trial… the jury decides the viability of the facts and decides accordingly. Far from a flawless system but one that is “fair” to both sides. As long as you are willing to accept verdicts such as OJ’s and this one. It ain’t perfect.
Good lord. Comparing OJ and Penny.
 
Juries react to the prosecutors charges. Not to the “innocence” of the defendant. The defendants presumed innocence is key to him/her receiving a fair trial…it is not evidence, per se. the state determines whether or not there is evidence /proof of a crime and presents its facts at trial… the jury decides the viability of the facts and decides accordingly. Far from a flawless system but one that is “fair” to both sides. As long as you are willing to accept verdicts such as OJ’s and this one. It ain’t perfect.
JFC! Just STFU already you dumb shit imbecile.
 
Good lord. Comparing OJ and Penny.
Just the verdicts…both “not guilty” via the American justice system…in both cases, someone died… one case intentional and the other accidental… but the jury agreed with the defendants arguments both times despite strong evidence presented by the State. In reality, I think the mindset of both juries was quite similar going into verdict. However, this is our system of justice.
 
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Feel free to white knight foe the guy who told people he was going to kill someone and was ready to spend the rest of his life in jail.

I however will be laughing at all the shit they are finding out about his father who abandoned him that is now making a royal ass of himself.
 
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😃



It's true

Sorry. He killed the guy. Either intentionally or accidently, he was responsible for the guy’s death. The jury “bought” his story. The DA was prosecuting tge crime that was committed.
But back to the original point here, “vigilante-ism” cannot be tolerated in America. The DA 100% did his job in prosecuting here.
(I’m assuming Phil your use of “old man” was derogatory or meant to intimidate me? Nice try.)
I think there is a difference between vigilante justice and someone’s stepping in to defend . Vigilante is post incident, this was in the moment of crisis. For example, if i shot amd killed am armed bank robber during his active crime, that isn’t the same as me hunting him down later and liking him.
 
I think there is a difference between vigilante justice and someone’s stepping in to defend . Vigilante is post incident, this was in the moment of crisis.
I disagree. This guy KILLED a person. Probably a person who was mentally ill. He could have “relaxed” his chokehold and the guy would still be alive. Remember the police incident in Minneapolis…the cop was sent to jail for doing the same thing. I am not disagreeing with that verdict but I am saying that vigilante justice just cannot be tolerated if we do want to live in a civilized society. There just Cannot be exceptions.
 
Joelbc let’s reverse the situation and see if this changes your thoughts…….. let’s say the guy threatening everyone had you in a chokehold and someone steps in to help you but the bad guy was killed. He helped you out so would you still say it’s murder?
 
Doesn’t mean he didn’t commit a crime… the state thought he dud…. The jury just agreed with the defendants action…but someone died a natural death and some one was responsible for that death.
It means exactly that.
Are you on drugs? Are your brains leaking out of the hole in your head?

"Not guilty" of committing a crime!!!! Wtf!? Lol
Joel is either trolling or may actually have an extra chromosome.
 
I disagree. This guy KILLED a person. Probably a person who was mentally ill. He could have “relaxed” his chokehold and the guy would still be alive. Remember the police incident in Minneapolis…the cop was sent to jail for doing the same thing. I am not disagreeing with that verdict but I am saying that vigilante justice just cannot be tolerated if we do want to live in a civilized society. There just Cannot be exceptions.
It's not vigilantism, for fvck's sake. Vigilante's go out looking for trouble. This guy was riding to work when a person screamed he was about to murder people on a train and this dude reacted to that. I suppose you're against people running into burning building's to save old ladies as well. Leave it to the pros, right? Let the lady die! We don't need any of those fire vigilantes!
 
Until he failed to act responsibly and back off the choke hold, you might have had an argument. Then he committed murder or manslaughter if some such thing. As he choked the life out of the criminal, he exceeded his obligation/ duty to those in the car with him. Sorry. There was a crime or two committed here that deserved a trial.

Once you admit the guy was a threat, I don't think we should second guess the actions of the person defending against that threat.

It's virtually impossible to tell in the moment if someone is still a threat or not unless they are clearly severely injured. No one should be forced to give up an advantageous position over a threat to their and other people's safety until they know that there is 100% no chance that the person can resume being a threat.

Penny was likely fighting for his life and potentially other lives that day. If you are fighting for your life and you have the threat in a choke hold. Do not let go until police can restrain him. 6 minutes. . . I wouldn't care if he hung on for 6 hours if that's what it takes to protect himself and others.

It's just as simple as don't threaten people really. You threaten people you are risking your life.
 
I disagree. This guy KILLED a person. Probably a person who was mentally ill. He could have “relaxed” his chokehold and the guy would still be alive. Remember the police incident in Minneapolis…the cop was sent to jail for doing the same thing. I am not disagreeing with that verdict but I am saying that vigilante justice just cannot be tolerated if we do want to live in a civilized society. There just Cannot be exceptions.
I'm saying this wasn't vigilante style justice. The officer you refer to was going to be found guilty no matter what, due to the politics of it.
 
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I'm saying this wasn't vigilante style justice. The officer you refer to was going to be found guilty no matter what, due to the politics of it.
Can you admit the officer in Minneapolis intentionally killed the man when he refused to ease the chokehold…. Much like the guy in NYC? The Minneapolis officer’s biggest sin is that he had been trained to act “professionally” and he was using an illegal/ outlawed restraint on his perp. He was found “guilty” because he was guilty, perhaps? You make an unproven assumption that has no merit in the facts and judgement of the case.
 
Can you admit the officer in Minneapolis intentionally killed the man when he refused to ease the chokehold…. Much like the guy in NYC? The Minneapolis officer’s biggest sin is that he had been trained to act “professionally” and he was using an illegal/ outlawed restraint on his perp. He was found “guilty” because he was guilty, perhaps? You make an unproven assumption that has no merit in the facts and judgement of the case.
You mean the drug addict od'ing on fentynyl? George Floyd committed suicide.
 
Can you admit the officer in Minneapolis intentionally killed the man when he refused to ease the chokehold…. Much like the guy in NYC? The Minneapolis officer’s biggest sin is that he had been trained to act “professionally” and he was using an illegal/ outlawed restraint on his perp. He was found “guilty” because he was guilty, perhaps? You make an unproven assumption that has no merit in the facts and judgement of the case.
I don't think he intended to kill, no. I think he shouldn't have had the knee there, but the drugs in St. George's system contributed to his demise as much as the knee. Take one of those things away, either one, and he's alive, probably in and out of jail.
 
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I don't think he intended to kill, no. I think he shouldn't have had the knee there, but the drugs in St. George's system contributed to his demise as much as the knee. Take one of those things away, either one, and he's alive, probably in and out of jail.
He'd be free to point guns at more pregnant women's stomachs
What if we told him Neely was still alive after the choke hold was released, and that multiple police officers refused to perform cpr on him after he stopped breathing.

I am surprised that hasn't been brought up in this thread.
Pesky facts
 
Can you admit the officer in Minneapolis intentionally killed the man when he refused to ease the chokehold…. Much like the guy in NYC? The Minneapolis officer’s biggest sin is that he had been trained to act “professionally” and he was using an illegal/ outlawed restraint on his perp. He was found “guilty” because he was guilty, perhaps? You make an unproven assumption that has no merit in the facts and judgement of the case.

There is a huge difference beyond one being a trained police officer.

George Floyd wasn't threatening to kill anyone. George Floyd was already restrained with handcuffs.

Neely was threatening to kill someone that was agreed upon by everyone at the scene including if you watch the body cam videos 2 black people. Another black person who was helping Penny restrain Neely I'm guessing agreed as well. No one who was there seemed to think Neely was just some young kid trying to kill a black guy. Instead they saw him as taking down someone who was threatening to kill them.

Also no one had handcuffs to restrain Neely. You should watch the below video, it has the video of Neely being restrained and it has body cam videos of cops asking questions of passengers. They all tell basically the same story, 2 of them are clearly black and made it very clear that they considered Neely to be a threat.

 
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There is a huge difference beyond one being a trained police officer.

George Floyd wasn't threatening to kill anyone. George Floyd was already restrained with handcuffs.

Neely was threatening to kill someone that was agreed upon by everyone at the scene including if you watch the body cam videos 2 black people. Another black person who was helping Penny restrain Neely I'm guessing agreed as well.

Also no one had handcuffs to restrain Neely. You should watch the below video, it has the video of Neely being restrained and it has body cam videos of cops asking questions of passengers. They all tell basically the same story, 2 of them are clearly black and made it very clear that they considered Neely to be a threat.

George Floyd also said he couldn't breathe in the car and asked to be laid on the ground
 
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There is a huge difference beyond one being a trained police officer.

George Floyd wasn't threatening to kill anyone. George Floyd was already restrained with handcuffs.

Neely was threatening to kill someone that was agreed upon by everyone at the scene including if you watch the body cam videos 2 black people. Another black person who was helping Penny restrain Neely I'm guessing agreed as well. No one who was there seemed to think Neely was just some young kid trying to kill a black guy. Instead they saw him as taking down someone who was threatening to kill them.

Also no one had handcuffs to restrain Neely. You should watch the below video, it has the video of Neely being restrained and it has body cam videos of cops asking questions of passengers. They all tell basically the same story, 2 of them are clearly black and made it very clear that they considered Neely to be a threat.

Yeah, when someone threatens to kill, that should be taken seriously. I think it’s still pretty tragic as Neely obviously had some major (untreated) mental health issues. But I definitely don’t think it’s murder, and I’m pretty okay with him not being found guilty of manslaughter too.
 
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Doesn’t mean a damn thing….it could be the correct opinion though… the masses are frequently the asses. If it opposes your view Hans, I’m thinking I’m more correct than incorrect…no offense.
I’m done with this topic…just glad there were no riots after this justified outcome.
 
Yeah, when someone threatens to kill, that should be taken seriously. I think it’s still pretty tragic as Neely obviously had some major (untreated) mental health issues. But I definitely don’t think it’s murder, and I’m pretty okay with him not being found guilty of manslaughter too.

Penny committed no crime.

The system did fail Neely in multiple ways but that's not Penny's problem. Penny didn't cause those problems.
 
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When the beloved Marine Corps Hymn was penned, Daniel Penney, is the type of Marine the author envisioned when he arrived at this point in the lyrics:

If the Army and the Navy
Ever look on Heaven's scenes;
They will find the streets are guarded
By United States Marines.
 
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