There seems to be a consensus that Iowa needs to improve its defensive rebounding in order to keep winning against higher level competition. The concern is how to do that without detracting from other aspects of the game like shooting, quickness, the ability to guard multiple positions and switch on defense, and ballhandling. In particular, some have called for Josh O to get extended minutes, giving Iowa more size, and presumably better interior defense and defensive rebounding.
Defensive Rebounding and use of JoshO
- Thread starter HoustonREDHawk
- Start date
O If Josh has gotten to work over the last 2+ years with the National POY daily in practice...........against one of the top NBA rookies..... along with another (Murray) who is looking like one of the best players in the country ........ and still hasn't improved his game in the time he's been here, his playing time should go to someone whose game will show development.
He's not a better rebounder than anyone he might take minutes from, so no, he doesn't need more minutes.
He's the 3rd best rebounder on the team after Kris and Rebraca. Like everyone I wish he was in better shape but I'm fine with him spelling Rebraca on a regular basis. IMO, his metrics are better than the perceptions of people on this board.
Four minutes per half, imo. Fran has done a really good job of letting Josh play as long as he is effective, but it becomes pretty evident that around the 3-4 minute mark, he gets tired and starts walking around and getting sloppy
1-3 minute spurt Big O is a valuable contributor on this team. 4 minute+ Big O is not
I guess that puts me in the C group, especially since Mulvey should currently not be receiving any minutes against quality competition, let alone minutes at the 4… that’s a scary thought
1-3 minute spurt Big O is a valuable contributor on this team. 4 minute+ Big O is not
I guess that puts me in the C group, especially since Mulvey should currently not be receiving any minutes against quality competition, let alone minutes at the 4… that’s a scary thought
If the ball is contained, rebounding takes care of itself to at least an adequate level regardless of size.
Hopefully the guys are locked in able to keep the ball in front of them vs Duke
Hopefully the guys are locked in able to keep the ball in front of them vs Duke
Defensive rebounding stats can be very deceiving, especially if you look at the "per 40 minutes" stats. Yes, JO Is averaging 11.2 boards per 40 minutes, while playing 8.6 minutes, but Kingsbury is averaging 20 boards playing 3.3. Should Kingsbury play more?
And how many defensive rebounds are practically uncontested? So, whoever gets the board is essentially taking it from another Hawk? Or a 3 pointer bounces into the corner and PMac tracks it down - still counts as a rebound.
I still trust Fran to put the 5 guys out there at any one time to help the Hawks win.
And how many defensive rebounds are practically uncontested? So, whoever gets the board is essentially taking it from another Hawk? Or a 3 pointer bounces into the corner and PMac tracks it down - still counts as a rebound.
I still trust Fran to put the 5 guys out there at any one time to help the Hawks win.
He has flashes of brilliance to his game but the cardio still seems to be holding him back. It was reported, and I don't know if it's accurate, that he has some ongoing health issues that are the issue. He definitely has some talent and seems like a likable kid but without better cardio, he ends up being more of a detriment when he's in there.
I agree with all of this. I don't think Big O can maintain his level of play at more than 1-3 minutes at a time.
I also don't think he should be playing much, if at all, against smaller, athletic front lines like Seton Hall and GT.
And Mulvey definitely shouldn't be playing. I would be shocked if he is back next year unless things start clicking for him at some point this year.
For teams with size, as long as JO or Mulvey can play with maintained focus and effort, and Connor on the floor to direct, they should be able to provide 6ish minutes per half if needed. With a TV TO mixed in, that should hopefully provide enough rest for Filip and Kris when needed.
I agree on Josh O playing 4-5 minutes per half possibly. No way on Mulvey right now. He plays like he is 5-11, not 6-11.
This....
Then he's expected to come in during games where the opposing teams have great interior players, without having gotten experience in other games. He has been solid in the games he's played.
To an extent you are correct in that minutes matter. When a player like Kingsbury plays only a few minutes during blowouts the minutes are meaningless. He's also the top 3 point shooter on the team. He hasn't missed! Of course he's only taken one shot.
Ogundele has played 43 minutes (vs 10 for Kingsbury) and a decent amount of those minutes were in contested games. It's not a huge sample but big enough to know that he can rebound effectively, especially when combined with last year which presented similar rebound rates over the course of 98 minutes. Unless Josh is able to improve his conditioning, he's never going to be more than an 8-10 minute guy. At the same time I think he's shown he belongs, especially from a defensive and rebounding perspective against traditional bigs.
Josh has 12 rebounds for the season. I'm sure some of those were in garbage time.
I'd be happy to see JO log some minutes against some big guys. I think that can be a role for him. But it was very discouraging to see so little of Josh and Mulvey in the early games. I would have thought that if Fran thought they were going to play important roles this season we would have seen more of them.
I still trust Fran's rotations.
Did you “trust Fran's rotations”
- At Oregon when Jobo, CMac and CJ played ahead of Keegan and Kris?
- at Richmond when Jobo, CMac, Pmac played ahead of Kris?
- Clearly rotation blunders
I am surprised that even 4 voters picked #4. I was in #2 and could have been in #3. I believe Josh can be valuable as a short-term sub, especially against teams with imposing center, but I am baffled by those who believe he has demonstrated that he should get extended minutes. Fran would be benching a much more talented player, and playing Josh instead. Quoting the team's weak defensive rebounding stats or Josh's stats over a total of 43 minutes, mostly not meaningful minutes, doesn't make Josh more than what he is.
KcTo voted for option 4 with his main and burner profiles, I’m sure
Number 4 became unsuitable when you included "even moving Mulvey to 4, and Kris to 3". Mulvey at the 4 with Josh at the 5? I don't think so.
Yeah, I still trust Fran over what others think. That doesn't mean he can't be criticized.
We don't know what he knows.
I trust Fran, I don’t want a change
I don’t trust all of his decisions or all of his dogma
Mulvey needs to put in the time and effort. Last year was regularly the first player to leave practice.
The couple of times they ran the offense thru him, he did a pretty good job finding cutters and open guys. If he's in, that's the play. Play thru him and if they are not going to double him, he has to score and at the very least rebound.
Given how he looks in game, his conditioning is so poor that about 3 minutes at a time is all that he can give with at least acceptable level of effort. I'd rather have him out there for 3 or 4 short bursts that he goes "all out" than trying to keep him on the floor longer. If he can give 8-10 minutes total of decent play in a game I think that's about all that can be expected.
Yeah, I was one of those who was hopeful that last year Mulvey was just adjusting to college life and his new body with the extra weight and he was still pretty young ... but he seems very content just to be the cheerleader on the bench. I am assuming if the rest of the year goes like this, Fran will be very clear with him.
Agree he’s gassed after 3-4 minutes and level of play will fall in extended minutes, 6 10” and 280.
even in that thinking that still gives Fran the ability to play OgundeJelly 2x a half and 12-16 minutes a game.
this would turn a net rebounding deficiency into at least neutral even rate.
agreeing That any inclusion of Mulvey makes this a near non starter, but an option of OgundeJelly and Rebraca would be very much a possible rotation to play against team with multiple bigs. Certainly rim, paint and defensive rebounding would be more difficult to exploit
I screwed up in my choices, I meant to say Rebraca moving to 4, not Mulvey. I still don't think that is a good line up against most teams.
BTW, I did pick #4 because I knew exactly what your intended meaning was.
Also, no apologies for screwing up, as stretching your boundaries, even though outcome is not perfect, is how you learn and progress in life….keep stretching
Really? That's amazing. What am I thinking right now?
after looking at the progression on the 1st 3 options, it seemed that the next logical option would be Ogundele and Rebraca, not Mulvey, as Mulvey hasn’t been included in any part of this discussion, while Ogundele + Rebraca together has been posited as an option,
given the lack of pretext in your question, its impossible to say what you might be thinking
Bowen is the only difference maker that I have seen that should be getting more minutes imo. Josh is more situational.
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