Fran has done a good job recruiting.
- Thread starter DEREKoh2
- Start date
No, a stalker searches someone out. I just respond to your ridiculous takes.
I hope Fran keeps the roster tight but also encourages a bit more agressive defense for everyone except JoBo and JW...we have fouls to give and bodies to contribute incase anyone gets in foul trouble.
College basketball recruiting is dam difficult. First, you only get 13 scholly's, so maybe you get to add 2-4 players a year, which also means recruiting mistakes can be a killer. We've seen that with Fran.
Then, there is a ton of competition. D1 has, what, 340 schools? Not every player feels like they must go P5.
Then there are all the "close to home" kids. When Iowa recruits kids with 300 miles, they can still be close to home. But, there is a lot of competition in that circle. It would be nice if Iowa produced more D1 talent, because you're not going to get them all.
Finally, you have the kids that will travel anywhere - when Iowa recruits those kids, they are competing against everyone.
So, having said all that, I think Fran is a "good" recruiter. Not great, not mediocre. What Iowa needs is for a "good recruit" to develop into a great talent. That's when the Hawks can do some damage in the B1G or the Tourney.
Then, there is a ton of competition. D1 has, what, 340 schools? Not every player feels like they must go P5.
Then there are all the "close to home" kids. When Iowa recruits kids with 300 miles, they can still be close to home. But, there is a lot of competition in that circle. It would be nice if Iowa produced more D1 talent, because you're not going to get them all.
Finally, you have the kids that will travel anywhere - when Iowa recruits those kids, they are competing against everyone.
So, having said all that, I think Fran is a "good" recruiter. Not great, not mediocre. What Iowa needs is for a "good recruit" to develop into a great talent. That's when the Hawks can do some damage in the B1G or the Tourney.
It didn't take years to make the connections. It took years to elevate the program to a point at which Iowa was an attractive destination for four star players. That's why you have to look at the gutter dwelling 10 win seasons that F McC inherited. We had just run off the last two coaches, the most recent of whom had been NCoY the season before he came to Iowa. Hadn't seen the second round in a decade; the last winning season was so unimpressive that a 4th place finish in the Big Ten didn't even merit an NIT invite. The last NCAA ended in a near historic collapse in the 3/14 bracket (as in few 3s had lost since the field went to 64) that further killed an already apathetic to hostile fan base.
Its not like turning around the occasional bad year or two at Indiana or Purdue, the Michigan schools or Maryland. The name on the business card gets you into the high four star and five star players that probably still don't return Fran's calls.
All five starters top 120 or better nationally. At least two bench players and possibly three top 120 or better. Carton will be a much smaller loss if Joey T is anywhere near the very high expectations some fans have for him. Obviously Joey T's trajectory is good. Climbing the ESPN ranks AFTER committing to Iowa is very rare. Another incoming player was the Kentucky PoY, not dispositive but certainly coming from a state that produces a lot of D1 talent.
From a different perspective, Iowa has had 23 or more wins only 4 times in the last 20 years: 2006 where the 25 wins included a first round loss to the 14 seed; 2013 where 25 wins included four or five NIT wins and 2001, the other 23 win team that had a losing conference record, got hot and made it to the round of 32. That 2001 team is now so remote that it had two starters left from Dr. Davis's recruits.
F McC has more to sell recruits and he's selling better players who are winning more games than their predecessors. So I'm not sure I understand the meme that F McC has done a poor job of recruiting.
And are a team without a blueood tradition of basketball excellence. They are a football school that has had a few years of glory sprinkled among a lot of mediocrity. They are not guaranteed success in recruiting based on who they are.
The name on the business card gets you into the high four star and five star players that probably still don't return Fran's calls.
Excellent post! Fortunately there are starting to be four/five stars that are returning his calls....just not all of them. I HOPE that our success this year and the success next year that I anticipate, result in the 2020 and 2021 recruiting classes being really strong....
Actually, we really didn't 'Loose' that many games, when you
WIN 22 or so, making the Big Dance.............
GO HAWKS !!
Recruiting of great high school basketball players has changed. Their not looking for three or four years of college and maybe a chance to make it to the NBA. Great high school players want to go with a coach who will get them into the NBA in a couple of years. McCaffery is not one of those coaches so he gathers good players under his wing to have a winning program. Joe Weiscamp is the closest to making the NBA in a couple of years. Great players overlook Iowa because Fran doesn't have a history of getting players into the NBA, Close but just short. Miles at Nebraska was the same. Too much home-spun basketball never got the elite kid. Many ask why Hoiberg would go to Nebraska. I believe great high school players or even transfers see a path that he brings to the NBA having worked there. He can turn a program around.
So did everyone. Hell, Cuanzo Martin dumped him twice. McC tried to recruit him but he turned Iowa down. Not McC's fault.
BirdistheWord
HB Legend
Sadly, the George Raveling recruiting window was more of an anomaly for Iowa basketball. Admittedly, I am not as familiar with Lute Olsen's teams in detail, but every coach since Raveling was not nearly as good at bringing in elite talent in bunches (obvious).
I ranked their recruiting ability on scale from 1-10 (Raveling would be a 9.5)
7.5 Dr Tom: Very Good+ Recruiter/Consistent - Not quite enough elite athletes for his system, but getting to round of 32 every year is nothing to sneeze at
7.0 Alfraud: Good to Very Good recruiter - Able to land occasional elite talent, but too many mid major type guys like Brody Boyd, JR Angle, Tony Freeman, etc.
5.0 Lick: Fair to Good, virtually no elite talent, high attrition.
7.0 (5.5 Guards and 8.0 F/C) Fran: Good to Very Good recruiter - I would say Fran has been only Average to Good with recruiting guards, and Very Good to Excellent at recruiting bigs 3/4/5.
I ranked their recruiting ability on scale from 1-10 (Raveling would be a 9.5)
7.5 Dr Tom: Very Good+ Recruiter/Consistent - Not quite enough elite athletes for his system, but getting to round of 32 every year is nothing to sneeze at
7.0 Alfraud: Good to Very Good recruiter - Able to land occasional elite talent, but too many mid major type guys like Brody Boyd, JR Angle, Tony Freeman, etc.
5.0 Lick: Fair to Good, virtually no elite talent, high attrition.
7.0 (5.5 Guards and 8.0 F/C) Fran: Good to Very Good recruiter - I would say Fran has been only Average to Good with recruiting guards, and Very Good to Excellent at recruiting bigs 3/4/5.
I'll credit a guy from a badger board for giving me an idea. He provided a graph that quantified the "talent" of the B1G teams in comparison. I decided to look at how Iowa compared in Fran's tenure. From what I can gather, the metric only weighs the recruiting profile and minutes played. For example a 4 star that doesn't play won't contribute anything.
2019: 13th out of 14
2018: 13th out of 14
2017: 13th out of 14
2016: 10th out of 14
2015: 10th out of 14
2014: 8th out of 12
2013: 8th out of 12
2012: 8th out of 12
2011: 8th out of 11
Even though we were 13th this year that's a little misleading. The previous two years there was a clear gap between Iowa and 12th place. The gap between 7th and 13th was tiny this year in comparison. Next year might be the first year Iowa enters the top half in this metric.
Here are the talent scores for this year. (MSU and purdue's will change a little when they play)
1. Mich - 80.43
2. Mary - 78.82
3. Minny - 73.56
4. IU - 70.56
5. MSU - 70.16
6. Neb - 62.98
7. Wisconsin - 59.60
8. Penn St - 57.52
9. NW - 56.49
10. Ohio st - 56.42
11. Ill - 56.24
12. Purdue - 56.07
13. Iowa - 55.65
14. Rutgers - 30.79
http://barttorvik.com/team-maps.php?year=2019
If you want to get any numbers just change the parameters so you can see the value for talent and hover over the dots.
2019: 13th out of 14
2018: 13th out of 14
2017: 13th out of 14
2016: 10th out of 14
2015: 10th out of 14
2014: 8th out of 12
2013: 8th out of 12
2012: 8th out of 12
2011: 8th out of 11
Even though we were 13th this year that's a little misleading. The previous two years there was a clear gap between Iowa and 12th place. The gap between 7th and 13th was tiny this year in comparison. Next year might be the first year Iowa enters the top half in this metric.
Here are the talent scores for this year. (MSU and purdue's will change a little when they play)
1. Mich - 80.43
2. Mary - 78.82
3. Minny - 73.56
4. IU - 70.56
5. MSU - 70.16
6. Neb - 62.98
7. Wisconsin - 59.60
8. Penn St - 57.52
9. NW - 56.49
10. Ohio st - 56.42
11. Ill - 56.24
12. Purdue - 56.07
13. Iowa - 55.65
14. Rutgers - 30.79
http://barttorvik.com/team-maps.php?year=2019
If you want to get any numbers just change the parameters so you can see the value for talent and hover over the dots.
