I was ready for a cozy winter of hawk bb
- Thread starter Kurt Warner
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I really didn't understand the excitement over this team. Granted, I think they'll be better than tonight, but this was still an NIT team coming into the season.
Some of you dumb muthaf&ckers who ragged on Tyler Cook all of last year are going to realize just how much of a loss he is.
Some of you dumb muthaf&ckers who ragged on Tyler Cook all of last year are going to realize just how much of a loss he is.
We weren't wrong though.
He sandbagged a f*** ton and it was a detriment Iowa would still have to overcome. Sometimes they did.....sometimes they didn't.
Truth.
I'm not saying you're wrong, but he was the most athletic player Iowa had.
Oh, and he led the team in scoring and rebounds.
For he and Moss's sins, they combined for 25 points/game. And fans were expecting Nunge and CJF to exceed that. Ridiculous.
Yes, but you're talking about replacing that with two kids who at best have marginal P5 talent. CJF might be okay, but Nunge is definitely not a B1G Ten player.
Meh, we're still gonna win the national championship this year.
Meh, we're still gonna win the national championship this year.
If we had Monkey and Lil' Lick, I'd be with you.
I'm going to go conservative and predict an Elite 8, though. Unless you're coming out of retirement?
I finally got new shoes last year and never really used them, so I just may have to...........
I never said that bc I have never seen anything to make me believe that Nunge was any good. Fran still has faith in him so hopefully he proves me wrong I just don’t think he has the mentality to be a great college player regardless of his skill level.
I am starting to think CJF May be better overall than Moss and I was a Moss fan. Have been very happy with how he is able to stay in front of his man, his handles are way better than Moss and when he finally did decide to go get himself some buckets he did so efficiently while staying within the offense...we are gonna love this kid 4 years from now (he is essentially another Aaron White, smart and scrappy w a plus offensive game, but playing the 2).
I LOVE CJ Fredrick so far. Yes it's early but he has game. His stats will be better than Moss', his defense is already better than Moss' and he plays hard the whole time he's in. He is a GREAT get for Fran.
You can still have that cozy winter of watching hawk basketball. You may not enjoy it much, but it will still be there for your viewing.
I will have to express an outside the box opinion and have to agree with you on this. Cook without a doubt helped the team at times but especially on the defensive end he never seemed like he gave 100%. Win or lose I want to see kids busting their ass out there and we saw very little of that from him.
That said I think we miss Cook on the boards. And he did get to the free throw line quite a bit which jives with how Fran wants to play. But not a black or white proposition about how much of a positive impact he made given how much he dogged it on defense.
Moss may have been the bigger loss, honestly. He looked like a difference maker at the end of the season, prepared to be the guy to take over the team. Fran, rather stupidly IMO, kept pumping up Joe Weiskamp instead of Moss. An athletic fifth year senior coming into his own or a complementary sophomore still trying to find his game? Fran was a dipshit not trumpeting Moss as this year's version of Jok. Horrible judgment on that one.
Im not sure CJF is not already a better all around player than Moss in the first couple games I have seen. He plays defense Aaron Craft like moves his feet always in right spot and dude just cares on defense. Offensively we have seen him score on drives, pull ups, catch and shoot threes , and shot fake one dribble pull ups. Im super high on him and he can actually dribble and IM struggled with that. He must be a top 3 scorer on this team to have a shot. He makes plays for others and this team lacks that.
Exactly. Everybody wants to talk about how much of an upgrade CJF is over Moss. We could have had Fredrick starting at the point this year instead of CM, Moss at the 2, Wieskamp at the 3, and so on. Then, have JT back up Fredrick, and slide CM to the backup 2 (depending on Bohannon). That is a very strong backcourt. If Moss left because of playing time concerns, it’s really a shame
We all knew Cook would leave but I thought at the time I hope Moss doesn't transfer. His decision in my mind seemed a red flag that something may seem amiss in the program. I too thought he seemed to come on at the end of the season and he even showed a bit of a dribble drive game to boot. He would have had a fine senior season here and without Bohannon become the focal point. Not a great player and Frederick may well end up the better of the two but not a player we could afford to lose either with such a young backcourt. Moss sitting while Connor ran the point as much as he did last season may come back to bite us.
I will be interested to see how good DePaul is. I was impressed with their guards and their bigs. Maybe is was Iowa’s defense that made it easy on them. I’m not so sure yet.
DePaul hit lights out. Yes, perimeter defense was poor too. Iowa shot very poorly. Bad combo made for a bad night. I expect it to be up and down with an average team.
I am personally glad that we got back to the tournament and won a game, but that’s just me.
This will be a cozy winter of Hawkeye basketball rebuilding,... might take a month, might take the whole season,.. just sit back and enjoy it....
I don't have very high expectations this year. It could be an interesting team to watch grow and develop. Guys like Joe T, CJ Fredrick might not make us a tournament team but they can at least give us some hope for better days ahead if they progress at the guard spots.
What I won't be able to stomach is if the defense is as bad as it was two years ago. That team was as awful to watch as a Lick era team. Different, but still awful because anybody could get an open look or a layup if they ran their offense for 15 seconds against us.
If this team competes and grows as the season moves on I'll watch and be on Fran's side even if the record hovers around .500
What I won't be able to stomach is if the defense is as bad as it was two years ago. That team was as awful to watch as a Lick era team. Different, but still awful because anybody could get an open look or a layup if they ran their offense for 15 seconds against us.
If this team competes and grows as the season moves on I'll watch and be on Fran's side even if the record hovers around .500
If we have defensive issues similar to two seasons ago it would likely be more to do with youth and experience than anything else. We have some capable and willing defenders on the team, it’s just rare to find young guys that are really good at defense.
People are talking about CJF as an upgrade?!!! They need to watch what Moss did in the NCAA tournament last year. He was clearly Iowa's best player at the end of the year.
I think it’s fair to say that CJ does some things better than Moss, but overall, I’m taking the Senior with experience in clutch situations and the tournament
Iowa fans like to cannibalize their own. I've seen it in the past with guys like Ricky Davis, Luke Recker and Reggie Evans, Peter Jok, Devyn Marble, and now Tyler Cook. I don't need to get into specifics, but never mind that they were the best players on the team, or at times, the only guys that were producing anything at all, but I remember specific accusations about all of these guys either being head cases, ball hogs, sandbaggers, yada yada and that we'd be better when they were gone.
Anyhow, regarding this year's team, granted I am pretty jaded and skeptical these days, but I think there's also a lot of homerism regarding the talent level of this year's team. There are a few good pieces, but I don't think this team is near as talented overall as some people seem to think.
I hope to be wrong of course, but my preseason pick was NIT a best. Without Moss, Cook and a healthy JBo, that's a lot to lose from last year's 10 seed. I don't see how we're going to match that, or even improve, unless there are some real surprises from certain players.
The comparison isnt fair to either kid. IM had a very productive career. He was limited on defense and offensively creating for others. However he was a high level catch and shoot kid. I think we all see that Frederick has a much better all around game....Defense, drive create for others, Higher bball IQ and he can catch and shoot. But I would love to have them both playing together this year because IM would of gotten plenty of good looks with Joey Luka Jobo CJ Conner JT EB
I agree with most of your post, but Moss’ defensive struggles are overblown. He was a very good on-ball/man defender. However, because Iowa has lacked the athletes to consistently play man defense for pretty much all of Fran’s tenure, they have been forced to stick with zone. Isaiah struggles with defensive rotations and off-ball, specifically with zone defense which, IMO, contributed to the bad rap he gets from our fans for his defense.
I’m not trying to justify poor performance, just pointing out that he wasn’t necessarily a good fit for Iowa’s defensive philosophy
You have a good point here that Iowa fans do seem overly critical of their own players heightened by the avenues we have in social media now like here. I for one took issue with Cook's effort level especially on defense and considered that calling it like I see it. That doesn't seem the same to me as attacking the player.
Cook came to Iowa with the aspiration of getting payed to play. I don't think he really enjoyed the college experience that much which sometimes showed up on the court. Seemed like a good young man and I know has come back for football games at times this fall. Tyler made a decision I think for the best for all parties involved and I hope he has success playing for a living at whatever level.
I'll give you might have underestimated Cook (it was brutal watching him not try sometimes and making terrible decisions trying to be the man in big situations) and overestimated Nunge - time will tell but the early showing doesn't look promising.
But putting Moss at that same level and calling CJF a marginal P5 player seems way off at this point. CJF looks like a more complete player than Moss 3 games in than Moss looked his whole career. In fact, from the limited amount we have seen, I am not sure if Moss does anything better than CJF. I think that is one area they definitely upgraded.
I thought Baer would be a big loss as well and still feel that way. Any good team has to have a glue guy, a guy willing to do the dirty work and has those intangibles. I was worried losing Baer would be big if no one could step in and do those things ... and right now not sure who is willing/able to be that kind of player.
Also, Bohannon obviously isn't himself. For his faults as a player, not having his swagger and big-moment confidence hurts. I hope they shut him down rather than try to have him play as a shell of himself.
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