Iowa’s Flagship University

[ProgressiveIowaAlumnus]

While my dog was getting surgery at ISU, I had a chance to spend three days in Ames. My business partner has a PhD in mechanical engineering from ISU, and we’ve worked with faculty in their college of engineering over t years, and I’ve mentored or known a bunch of middle and high school students who have gone on to study there, so I have had a range of experiences.

First, Ames isn’t awful. There are some really nice areas. Liked the coffeehouse downtown. The main one in campus town closed, and is as dead as the rest of campus town now. Most of the city is just mediocre. Several of the parks are pretty. Some good rec trails, but none link to very interesting places. (I compare it to iowa city’s trail system that heads 10 miles to the state park)

Here is what The Independent newspaper in the UK called “The best thing on the Internet” (the hooray for Ames video won the internet - so that’s one thing called “world class” that ISU/Ames can claim, right?

This promotional music video for the city of Ames, Iowa is about the

Hooray for clean water and changeable weather!

www.independent.co.uk

the Hooray for Ames video:



What’s great about ISU/Ames?

I’d heard a number of times over the years that the ISU veterinary med program was the best in the country, or one of the best. Was told that it’s probably what ISU is most famous.

I looked up the rankings. (All are from US News, the rankings most people pay attention to, so if you want to verify, go right ahead. Not riddling this post made on my phone here in Ames with too many links).

ISUs vet med program is ranked 14th of 28 programs in the country.

Solid grade of C.

Average. Mediocre. Sure, it’s best in a small state (meaning: the only such program), but how is that a big deal?

ISUs college of engineering is ranked 47th of 328 engineering programs in the country.

Solid grade is B, possibly a B+.

(The UI’s comes in at 84 of 328, putting them at a grade of B-, not much of a gap with ISU as many seem to think. Iowas college of engineering is ranked ahead of half of the B12 btw. The B10 has 3 schools in the top 10, and 9 in the top 35. The B12 only has 2 in the top 35. Iowa benefits from collaboration within its conference. So no contest here.).


Lets look at a few things Iowa is famous for.

Iowa has the #1 fiction, poetry, creative nonfiction programs not just nationally, but IN THE WORLD. Nothing in Ames comes close to being world’s best.

Grade of A+++ for each of these programs

Iowa’s medical school is ranked 22nd, tied with Stanford, for primary care, and 39th for research of 199 med schools rated nationally. Those are the two general rankings US News does.

Solid A

There are 237 law schools in the USA.

Iowais ranked 29th.

Solid A.

For overall undergrad, US News ranks Iowa 88, and ISU is 118 of 388 national universities.



Iowa City is leagues above Ames in every discernable category, though Ames is nice. I really do kinda like Ames. It’s just not nearly as good as Iowa City.

Iowa’s top academic scholarship is called the Flagship Award (students can qualify with a 33 or higher ACT and an unweighted 3.8/4.0 gpa.

Flagship. Exactly.

That’s how the rankings see The University of Iowa, and how it’s seen globally. Ag and tech schools nationally (Texas tech or A&M, MSU, Kansas state, Minnesota state, Illinois state, iowa state, cal state schools) are never as good as the flagships (UT Austin, Michigan, Iowa, Illinois, university of California schools (Berkeley, UCSF, UC Irvine, UCLA, etc)

Conclusion: there is only one Flagship university in the Hawkeye State.

 

[NevadaHawk]

Fascinating.

 

[NorthDSMHawk]

 

[kceasthawk]

While my dog was getting surgery at ISU, I had a chance to spend three days in Ames. My business partner has a PhD in mechanical engineering from ISU, and we’ve worked with faculty in their college of engineering over tur years, and I’ve mentored or known a bunch of middle and high school students who have gone on to study there, so I have had a range of experiences.

First, Ames isn’t awful. There are some really nice areas. Liked the coffeehouse downtown. The main one in campus town closed, and is as dead as the rest of campus town now. Most of the city is just mediocre. Several of the parks are pretty. Some good rec trails, but none link to very interesting places. (I compare it to iowa city’s trail system that heads 10 miles

OKAY??????????

 

[Legend12]

Your dog should be put down for us having to read that post.

 

[rfgiowa]

 

[HawkIDrummer]

 

[Hawkeyes4Life32]

 

[Obviously Oblivious]

I agree with OP. ISU sucks!

 

[rchawk]

So OP, how is your dog doing?

 

[Gonzo Bloor]

The ISU campus is really nice. Much different from Iowa's. Wife and I are Iowa grads and loved it, love IC. Our older daughter goes to ISU and loves it. The campus is self contained and really nice. Honestly don't know much about the rest of Ames.

 

[BBHawk]

Your dog should be put down for us having to read that post.

Don't blame the dog!

 

[MepoDawg#]

Didn’t need all of that to tell us what we already know.

 

[CeMar_Clone]

The ISU campus is really nice. Much different from Iowa's. Wife and I are Iowa grads and loved it, love IC. Our older daughter goes to ISU and loves it. The campus is self contained and really nice. Honestly don't know much about the rest of Ames.

ISU campus was designed by the company that designed Central Park. Iowa Campus, really does not have a true design plan. They inherited the State capital area and had to build around it. It really is 2 campuses separated by a river. I work for the hospital, and we are working again to get approval to build a new Hospital in North Liberty, something like 80 acres near the North Liberty Hy-Vee. Reason for trying to create a North Liberty Hospital? Because the Hospital campus sucks now. Really, patient surveys tell us that patients and visitors to the hospital find it way to inconvenient and congested and would prefer to not have to come to the Hospital Campus.

 

[ketelmeister]

Nice for the Op to post with no facts. There is a Starbucks in campus along with too many other coffee houses just like any other University. most of the area has been rebuilt and is new, not old as you say. There are a lot of bars, restaurants and pizza shops, along with shopping for Cyclone gear. Again, like virtually any University campus area. Maybe you dreamed of going there. But that’s about it.

 

[elipse]

Picture of Dog?

 

[Gonzo Bloor]

ISU campus was designed by the company that designed Central Park. Iowa Campus, really does not have a true design plan. They inherited the State capital area and had to build around it. It really is 2 campuses separated by a river. I work for the hospital, and we are working again to get approval to build a new Hospital in North Liberty, something like 80 acres near the North Liberty Hy-Vee. Reason for trying to create a North Liberty Hospital? Because the Hospital campus sucks now. Really, patient surveys tell us that patients and visitors to the hospital find it way to inconvenient and congested and would prefer to not have to come to the Hospital Campus.

They're both cool, just completely different. I loved Iowa's campus and the feel that it's embedded within a "city" and the Ped Mall, which was designed by the guy who did the ped mall in Boulder. ISU's is the more traditional self contained "campus", very pretty and very well maintained.

 

[elipse]

ISU is the prototypical college campus - generic.
Iowa’s campus is unique with much more personality and interest.

 

[hawkisak]

ISU campus was designed by the company that designed Central Park. Iowa Campus, really does not have a true design plan. They inherited the State capital area and had to build around it. It really is 2 campuses separated by a river. I work for the hospital, and we are working again to get approval to build a new Hospital in North Liberty, something like 80 acres near the North Liberty Hy-Vee. Reason for trying to create a North Liberty Hospital? Because the Hospital campus sucks now. Really, patient surveys tell us that patients and visitors to the hospital find it way to inconvenient and congested and would prefer to not have to come to the Hospital Campus.

Not being instate, I've not heard about this. How realistic is that this 80 acre project happens? It would certainly fuel even more growth north and help with congestion. I appreciate your thoughts.

 

[Franisdaman]

A Clown fan acquaintance once referred to IS Who as the flag ship university of the state of Iowa simply because the student population was higher than Iowa's. I laughed and told him he was ignorant because the designation of flag ship has nothing to do with enrollment but which university has a law school and a medical school.

 

[NevadaHawk]

Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder but I'll take Iowa's campus over ISU's any day of the week.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

While my dog was getting surgery at ISU, I had a chance to spend three days in Ames. My business partner has a PhD in mechanical engineering from ISU, and we’ve worked with faculty in their college of engineering over t years, and I’ve mentored or known a bunch of middle and high school students who have gone on to study there, so I have had a range of experiences.

First, Ames isn’t awful. There are some really nice areas. Liked the coffeehouse downtown. The main one in campus town closed, and is as dead as the rest of campus town now. Most of the city is just mediocre. Several of the parks are pretty. Some good rec trails, but none link to very interesting places. (I compare it to iowa city’s trail system that heads 10 miles to the state park)

Here is what The Independent newspaper in the UK called “The best thing on the Internet” (the hooray for Ames video won the internet - so that’s one thing called “world class” that ISU/Ames can claim, right?

This promotional music video for the city of Ames, Iowa is about the

Hooray for clean water and changeable weather!

www.independent.co.uk

the Hooray for Ames video:

View embedded media

What’s great about ISU/Ames?

I’d heard a number of times over the years that the ISU veterinary med program was the best in the country, or one of the best. Was told that it’s probably what ISU is most famous.

I looked up the rankings. (All are from US News, the rankings most people pay attention to, so if you want to verify, go right ahead. Not riddling this post made on my phone here in Ames with too many links).

ISUs vet med program is ranked 14th of 28 programs in the country.

Solid grade of C.

Average. Mediocre. Sure, it’s best in a small state (meaning: the only such program), but how is that a big deal?

ISUs college of engineering is ranked 47th of 328 engineering programs in the country.

Solid grade is B, possibly a B+.

(The UI’s comes in at 84 of 328, putting them at a grade of B-, not much of a gap with ISU as many seem to think. Iowas college of engineering is ranked ahead of half of the B12 btw. The B10 has 3 schools in the top 10, and 9 in the top 35. The B12 only has 2 in the top 35. Iowa benefits from collaboration within its conference. So no contest here.).


Lets look at a few things Iowa is famous for.

Iowa has the #1 fiction, poetry, creative nonfiction programs not just nationally, but IN THE WORLD. Nothing in Ames comes close to being world’s best.

Grade of A+++ for each of these programs

Iowa’s medical school is ranked 22nd, tied with Stanford, for primary care, and 39th for research of 199 med schools rated nationally. Those are the two general rankings US News does.

Solid A

There are 237 law schools in the USA.

Iowais ranked 29th.

Solid A.

For overall undergrad, US News ranks Iowa 88, and ISU is 118 of 388 national universities.



Iowa City is leagues above Ames in every discernable category, though Ames is nice. I really do kinda like Ames. It’s just not nearly as good as Iowa City.

Iowa’s top academic scholarship is called the Flagship Award (students can qualify with a 33 or higher ACT and an unweighted 3.8/4.0 gpa.

Flagship. Exactly.

That’s how the rankings see The University of Iowa, and how it’s seen globally. Ag and tech schools nationally (Texas tech or A&M, MSU, Kansas state, Minnesota state, Illinois state, iowa state, cal state schools) are never as good as the flagships (UT Austin, Michigan, Iowa, Illinois, university of California schools (Berkeley, UCSF, UC Irvine, UCLA, etc)

Conclusion: there is only one Flagship university in the Hawkeye State.

BAU.......

 

[rchawk]

Picture of Dog?

You are a sick, sick man

 

[OutbackBowl2017]

Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder but I'll take Iowa's campus over ISU's any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

FIFY

 

[Pawkhawk1]

Your dog should be put down for us having to read that post.

Bullshit. I love the OP post. Really good information I can retaliate with when needed!

 

[ProgressiveIowaAlumnus]

ISU campus was designed by the company that designed Central Park. Iowa Campus, really does not have a true design plan. They inherited the State capital area and had to build around it. It really is 2 campuses separated by a river. I work for the hospital, and we are working again to get approval to build a new Hospital in North Liberty, something like 80 acres near the North Liberty Hy-Vee. Reason for trying to create a North Liberty Hospital? Because the Hospital campus sucks now. Really, patient surveys tell us that patients and visitors to the hospital find it way to inconvenient and congested and would prefer to not have to come to the Hospital Campus.

ISUs campus is beautiful. Especially like the sculpture.
Iowas campus is wonderful exactly because of the iowa River. It’s part of the campus and downtown. (The $200 million apartment/retail/park complex to which Big Grove Brewery is central, is another example of how the river isn’t a divider, but integral.). Iowas boathouse is on the Iowa River in city park. Rowers at ISU have to drive some miles out of town to get to a lake). Lots of great universities are built along or bisected by a River. Ever hear of Cambridge or Oxford?

Iowas campus is integrated with the city though, unlike isu. (Campustown isn’t downtown, sorry). Much of Iowas campus IS downtown. Like Ann Arbor or Cambridge, MA with mit and Harvard. That’s not a detriment. It’s a strength. For example, the new school of music building (one of the best music facilities I’ve ever seen - stunning) hosts hundreds of concerts every year. It’s right downtown. Go to a concert and can get a cocktail in a bar during admission, or stroll to a fine restaurant afterward. Brings the culture to one place, like any great city does. The new art museum will open this year I think and it’s also right downtown, across the street from the campus rec facility which still has the second highest climbing wall in the country (the geeks at Purdue built theirs one centimeter higher to beat their “arch rivals”).

Well over $1 billion in new Iowa facilities due to the flood, a tragedy that has proven to be a huge boon to the city and university, plus a few hundred million in unrelated construction on campus and downtown just in last few years

Hancher is one of the best performing arts facilities I’ve ever seen, not just on campuses, but in capital cities and major metro areas in Europe and the US. Meanwhile iowa state can’t even fund needed upgrades to stevens auditorium, and it had to be handed over to the athletic department since it’s unsustainable. Stevens is acoustically quite fine but kind of a concrete dinosaur. And a white elephant.

How relevant are IC and the new Hancher? Ask Saturday night live. One of the all time most hilarious snl skits was set there.



Sure, the UIHC is growing and crowded, like every major national hospital. (It’s been ranked among the top 30 in the nation, among thousands of hospitals). Opening up branch facilities around the area is a good thing. It’s just more evidence of the status of Iowa as the Flagship institution.

ISU has a small pet hospital and vet program that’s ranked 18th of 28.

There’s just really no comparison. The UI is in an entirely different league.

falling back on “well, we just love ISU anyway” is just homerism. Totally ignores the facts. That’s why I looked up national rankings.

Again, Flagship. Hawkeye State. Just not debatable if we are being honest.

 

[LarryMullenJr.]

You lost me at "Progressive"

 

[rchawk]

You lost me at "Progressive"

I liked getting out of Modern Astronomy in the afternoon and crossing the street to Joe's Place for dollar pitchers.

The Iowa River is picturesque, and the girls sunbathing on it's banks were hot. I tried not to ogle, but I ogled anyway. The drawback was crossing the Iowa River in December, January and February to get to class. The cold was wicked, bitter, biting. You get the idea.

 

[WhiskeyDick]

I don't like places where they put literally everything on the same street so Ames (Duff) and Ankeny (Delaware) are two places I tend to avoid.

 

[Gonzo Bloor]

There’s just really no comparison. The UI is in an entirely different league.

falling back on “well, we just love ISU anyway” is just homerism. Totally ignores the facts. That’s why I looked up national rankings.

Again, Flagship. Hawkeye State. Just not debatable if we are being honest.

Unless you're talking about the truly elite offerings like some of the UIHC specialization areas and the Writer's Workshop, comparing US News rankings between schools like Iowa and ISU is pretty silly. I do think uninformed parents probably find some value in them but in reality they're taken by most with a grain of salt. If I want to go into engineering or ag or vet med or graphic design, I'm going to Ames. If I want to go into business or medicine/nursing or polysci/law or fine arts, I'm going to IC. Most of the other undergraduate programs that are offered by both are going to be pretty comparable.

 

[Hans81]

Unless you're talking about the truly elite offerings like some of the UIHC specialization areas and the Writer's Workshop, comparing US News rankings between schools like Iowa and ISU is pretty silly. I do think uninformed parents probably find some value in them but in reality they're taken by most with a grain of salt. If I want to go into engineering or ag or vet med or graphic design, I'm going to Ames. If I want to go into business or medicine/nursing or polysci/law or fine arts, I'm going to IC. Most of the other undergraduate programs that are offered by both are going to be pretty comparable.

Funny story...I know of several friend’s kids who went to ISU (for some of the aforementioned majors), but remained Hawk fans in college. For instance, decorating their dorm rooms with Hawk items and wearing Hawkeye clothes around ISU campus. I’m wondering if there are many reverse cases where ISU fans attend Iowa and wear clone stuff, etc? I doubt it, but suppose it has happened.

 

[Clownhater]

I love the Iowa campus, but I do wish they would do some work along the river through campus. There were some limestone walls right at river level that were built by the Civilian Conservation Corps, or WPA back in the 30s', but they are gone, or in disrepair. I think Iowa missed an opportunity by not redoing them after the '08 flood.

 

[ProgressiveIowaAlumnus]

I love the Iowa campus, but I do wish they would do some work along the river through campus. There were some limestone walls right at river level that were built by the Civilian Conservation Corps, or WPA back in the 30s', but they are gone, or in disrepair. I think Iowa missed an opportunity by not redoing them after the '08 flood.

There is no real river in Ames, first of all. Nice little pond though.

As for Iowa, over the last ten years, new bridges were built and about a dozen new buildings along the river, as well as parks built. Have you been here since 2008 and walked around?

Also, these aren’t just “buildings”. They are considered to be masterpieces of architecture, designed by several of the most famous architects in the world (Frank Gehry, Cesar Pelli, Steven Holl - look up their wiki pages if you don’t know their names) and the Iowa buildings have won scores of national and international awards.

Facilities

The University of Iowa School of Art and Art History is home to two of the finest academic arts facilities in the country, Art Building West designed by Steven Holl and Visual Arts Building designed by Steven Holl Architesct in collaboration with BNIM.

art.uiowa.edu

(Art building west library for example is built on cantilever over thst pond is arguably the most beautiful building on a campus I’ve ever seen. ISUs pond is nice. This pond has a building as the sculpture. It’s just an entirely different level vs ISUs campus. No comparison. And it’s based on a Picasso painting if seen from above. The cantilever - the part that sticks out - is the guitar. Amazing building. Rivals buildings in NYC or London or anywhere

The Old Guitarist - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

And here are some of the awards won by the new Hancher. Plus info on new music building

Hancher, Voxman buildings win 2018 American Architecture Awards

Hancher Auditorium and Voxman Music Building on the University of Iowa campus were named winners of the prestigious 2018 American Architecture Awards for the best new buildings designed and constructed by American architects in the U.S. and abroad and by international architects for buildings

now.uiowa.edu

And I mentioned but didn’t name the major new set of developments in the Riverfront Crossings District which borders the UI campus. It’s turned a forgotten industrial area into yet another great park, playgrounds, concert amphitheatertrails, hundreds of millions in new residential and retail space, etc.

Downtown and Riverfront Crossings | City of Iowa City

www.icgov.org

Isu and Ames have nothing like it. Ames has a creek near campus though. And a really busy railroad track. And downtown Ames features a horrific looking grain elevator thing. As ugly as it gets. I’m sorry, but that’s a fact.

Iowa has one Flagship university, and Iowa has one major cultural center, and it’s not in Des Moines or Ames.

And Iowa City’s drinking water is better, even though when I think of Ames, I always hear “hooray!”

 

[ProgressiveIowaAlumnus]

Unless you're talking about the truly elite offerings like some of the UIHC specialization areas and the Writer's Workshop, comparing US News rankings between schools like Iowa and ISU is pretty silly. I do think uninformed parents probably find some value in them but in reality they're taken by most with a grain of salt. If I want to go into engineering or ag or vet med or graphic design, I'm going to Ames. If I want to go into business or medicine/nursing or polysci/law or fine arts, I'm going to IC. Most of the other undergraduate programs that are offered by both are going to be pretty comparable.

iowas programs generally rank significantly better than ISUs. That’s why US news ranks Iowa THIRTY spots ahead of ISU in overall national university rankings. That’s an entire tier above.

Some of Iowas departments and programs are better than those in the Ivy League.

to my knowledge, ISU can’t even say that about their “famous” programs like vet med. ISUs ranked in the middle of the pack nationally. UPenn and Cornell actually have top tier vet med programs. And the B10 is better for vet med, as well as ag, and as I’ve shown, engineering and STEM in genreral. tOSU and Minnesota vet med are top five and top ten.

ISU is so much more mediocre than Id been told by ISU homers all these years.

 

[herkyhawkeye76]

Iowa grad and I'll take every opportunity to poke fun at the Clowns, but US News and Reports is a very flawed analytic. It weighs heavily on exclusivity on admission standards.

I wouldn't weigh it to heavily as both Iowa and ISU continually drop on it because they both have progressive admission policies that push for access to higher education. We should be thankful we have two top notch public institution s(3 if you include UNI)

 

[ProgressiveIowaAlumnus]

Iowa grad and I'll take every opportunity to poke fun at the Clowns, but US News and Reports is a very flawed analytic. It weighs heavily on exclusivity on admission standards.

I wouldn't weigh it to heavily as both Iowa and ISU continually drop on it because they both have progressive admission policies that push for access to higher education. We should be thankful we have two top notch public institution s(3 if you include UNI)

You’re right that the Regents policies that preference Iowa residents for admissions have killed iowa in the rankings. The UI has suffered most because traditionally the UI would attract out of state and international students. The UI has a much bigger national and international brand and academic/cultural reputation

But US news looks at a wide range of metrics, including publications, research, funding, peer reputation, retention, test scores of applicants, etc. etc. DOZENS of categories and metrics in fact. Their methodology is widely discussed.

Everyone pays attention to those rankings, like them or not.

the UI significantly outperforms ISU in just about every category, and even the “best” ISU programs are surprisingly mediocre compared with other programs nationally.

I cited way more than rankings though. My points still stand, rankings or no rankings.

 

[Clownhater]

There is no real river in Ames, first of all. Nice little pond though.

As for Iowa, over the last ten years, new bridges were built and about a dozen new buildings along the river, as well as parks built. Have you been here since 2008 and walked around?

Also, these aren’t just “buildings”. They are considered to be masterpieces of architecture, designed by several of the most famous architects in the world (Frank Gehry, Cesar Pelli, Steven Holl - look up their wiki pages if you don’t know their names) and the Iowa buildings have won scores of national and international awards.

Facilities

The University of Iowa School of Art and Art History is home to two of the finest academic arts facilities in the country, Art Building West designed by Steven Holl and Visual Arts Building designed by Steven Holl Architesct in collaboration with BNIM.

art.uiowa.edu

(Art building west library for example is built on cantilever over thst pond is arguably the most beautiful building on a campus I’ve ever seen. ISUs pond is nice. This pond has a building as the sculpture. It’s just an entirely different level vs ISUs campus. No comparison. And it’s based on a Picasso painting if seen from above. The cantilever - the part that sticks out - is the guitar. Amazing building. Rivals buildings in NYC or London or anywhere

The Old Guitarist - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

And here are some of the awards won by the new Hancher. Plus info on new music building

Hancher, Voxman buildings win 2018 American Architecture Awards

Hancher Auditorium and Voxman Music Building on the University of Iowa campus were named winners of the prestigious 2018 American Architecture Awards for the best new buildings designed and constructed by American architects in the U.S. and abroad and by international architects for buildings

now.uiowa.edu

And I mentioned but didn’t name the major new set of developments in the Riverfront Crossings District which borders the UI campus. It’s turned a forgotten industrial area into yet another great park, playgrounds, concert amphitheatertrails, hundreds of millions in new residential and retail space, etc.

Downtown and Riverfront Crossings | City of Iowa City

www.icgov.org

Isu and Ames have nothing like it. Ames has a creek near campus though. And a really busy railroad track. And downtown Ames features a horrific looking grain elevator thing. As ugly as it gets. I’m sorry, but that’s a fact.

Iowa has one Flagship university, and Iowa has one major cultural center, and it’s not in Des Moines or Ames.

And Iowa City’s drinking water is better, even though when I think of Ames, I always hear “hooray!”

Yes I live in IC, my point was that the river bank itself looks like shit.

 

[ConvenientParking]

Slaughterhouse-Five >>>>> peanut butter.

About all there is to it.

 

[Frosty7130]

Who gives a **** about ISU?

 

[elipse]

I trust that we can all agree ........
ISU sucks