LEISTIKOW: WALK-0N U
- Thread starter GnarlyBoy
- Start date
It's awesome, particularly coming off of a 12-2 season when many of those players were contributors...However, juco kid or Iowa kid, I'll cheer on both, but I ultimately just want wins.
While I like to see Iowa kids do well ... I don't necessarily think it is a good thing if we truly do have 16 walks ons in the 2-deeps. Yes, we have done a great job at identifying talent ... But this isn't Drake. You want to go out and get the best talent out there ... When you see a school like Stanford completely dominate Iowa in every facet of the game, you see where the talent gap exists ... Walkons are great ... Lots of success stories ... But having them fill 16 slots of your two-deep may mean you need to up your recruiting evaluation a bit ... Just my two cents ... (I am not bashing walk ons ... My point is that I would hope a Big 10 school with the facilities we have, etc., wouldn't rely so heavily on walkons)
JUST got the facilities completed to utilize for this past season! They are and will pay off but we had poor facilities prior to last season!
I want to be the team that has a few walk-ons that develop into stars, not a team that depends on them to contribute.
What you do as an athlete between the ages of 18-20 is more important that what you do between 16-18. To be a walk-on at a Power 5 school when you could probably get a scholly at somewhere smaller means you likely have the heart of a lion. You have confidence in your own abilities and are willing to "go for it".
I love walk-on's.
They are GREAT for a football program. Didn't you guys watch Rudy?
I love walk-on's.
They are GREAT for a football program. Didn't you guys watch Rudy?
It raises an eyebrow or two for the obvious reasons:
1-are the scholarship kids not as good as our evaluators thought and are now getting beat out by "kids nobody wanted" (yes, I know, but please understand the jist of that phrase).
2-if indeed the walk-ons are that good, how did we miss this potential during evaluations for handing out rides? (yes, I also realize other programs then did too).
3-as was alluded to earlier; I'm guessing if there are that many WO's on the 2-deeps, NONE of our guys are an upgrade from the athletic disparity showcased in Pasadena.
1-are the scholarship kids not as good as our evaluators thought and are now getting beat out by "kids nobody wanted" (yes, I know, but please understand the jist of that phrase).
2-if indeed the walk-ons are that good, how did we miss this potential during evaluations for handing out rides? (yes, I also realize other programs then did too).
3-as was alluded to earlier; I'm guessing if there are that many WO's on the 2-deeps, NONE of our guys are an upgrade from the athletic disparity showcased in Pasadena.
Wisconsin had 5 starting last year. I guess I don't really care if they are good.
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The article mentioned former players such as Sean Considine, Derek Pagel and Dallas Clark each who initially came to Iowa as walk-on players. There is nothing wrong with it at all.
Back in the day, programs such as Nebraska, Oklahoma and others were able to stockpile bodies keeping potential later developing athletes from playing at other schools. When scholarship limits were imposed, it created more opportunities for those marginal (evaluated) players to find playing time. The Iowa program under Coaches Fry and Ferentz has taken great pride in keeping the doors open to those with the desire to play at the highest level. Circumstances make it that there are a finite amount of scholarships and in any given recruitment, there may not be ample rides available.
The Stanford game may not be the best example. Yes, they won and won convincingly on January 1st. However, using that as the sole determinant of how good/not so good Iowa recruiting is is a stretch.
I started a similar thread on this on the general Hawkeye board a couple of days ago, mainly as a testament to the recruiting skills of Coach Morgan. Some good comments there, but the overall conclusions are similar.
https://iowa.forums.rivals.com/thre...-are-iowans-recruited-by-reese-morgan.120585/
Yes, you are bashing walk-ons. And using Drake as an example is well past just you being stupid about football.
Which of those positions, fullback, long snapper, punter and kicker, are not important?
All of them are important...I was asking because I thought Iowa would be using walk ons at a majority of those positions.
Man come on, nobody is "bashing" walk-ons, and there are plenty people on here "stupid about football" , but this Rusty dude isn't wrong, and I can't imagine anyone whose been involved athletics, football especially, to think it's a promising deal to have that many walk-ons... Seriously man, I'm all for some good kids getting their chance out there, but put me in the camp with talent first ,over this small town Iowa walk on guy...
Yes, it would be nice to have a team loaded with 4 and 5 stars. My point in starting this thread is that the Hawks have a roster loaded with Iowa kids from Iowa families, and kids that grew up with Hawkeye in their blood. High school kids that were D1 qualifiers, as opposed to short-timer jucos and transfers who just slap on a jersey for a couple years. 4 year students who are actually invested in the University itself, not just the football program. I can't help but think it strengthens the team chemistry to have kids like this on the team, fighting for playing time and contributing.
I did not and am not bashing walkons (again, I will state that clearly - despite the fact you want to convict me of doing just that) ... My entire point being we have scholarships to offer. We have some of the best facilities in college football. We have the coaches in place ... There's no reason we shouldn't have elite talent to go along with the environment we have at Iowa ... And so 16 of our top players shouldn't be walkons. But if you want to be a dbag and trash on my message ... well ... I won't argue with someone who has 43,000 posts on a message board ... I don't have that sort of time ...
Well as I've said a gazillion times Wisconsin had five starting for them last year in fact routinely many of their best players are walkons. It seems to work for them and has seemed to work for us as well.
I would imagine if soybean got upset it's because he feels like me it's such a tired tired argument or thought process and quite frankly is only fueled by the lack of knowledge of the teams around us. Pretty common practice really by upper level landlocked universities like us, Wisconsin, Nebraska. I would imagine it happens way way way more than the typical fan understands that's why it gets so tired. The funniest part is people make the statements and then wonder why people are all upset like all they did was just make a watered-down statement. Thats not what you're doing, what you're doing is Saying Iowa can't continue to succeed by having that many Walkon's and the truth of the matter is they can and they have. And they aren't alone.
I bet if you knew the truth you'd find out a lot of the teams like us again Wisconsin, Boise State etc. etc. Texas Christian for example have flourishing walk on programs and what you should be saying is wow that's cool....
I would imagine if soybean got upset it's because he feels like me it's such a tired tired argument or thought process and quite frankly is only fueled by the lack of knowledge of the teams around us. Pretty common practice really by upper level landlocked universities like us, Wisconsin, Nebraska. I would imagine it happens way way way more than the typical fan understands that's why it gets so tired. The funniest part is people make the statements and then wonder why people are all upset like all they did was just make a watered-down statement. Thats not what you're doing, what you're doing is Saying Iowa can't continue to succeed by having that many Walkon's and the truth of the matter is they can and they have. And they aren't alone.
I bet if you knew the truth you'd find out a lot of the teams like us again Wisconsin, Boise State etc. etc. Texas Christian for example have flourishing walk on programs and what you should be saying is wow that's cool....
Another thing I don't think people appreciate is a lot of these late 2-star offers Like Josey Jewel, Parker Hessey Jake Knott from Iowa State, AJ Klein from Iowa State, David Johnson that went to UNI could've easily have been a walkon but decided to go that route the point is you're talking hundreds even 1000s of kids that have been Walkons and been awesome thought out college football history. Heck we've had what 10 plus in the last 15 years that have earned all conference awards I'll wager. Maybe more..
It all comes down to that perspective thing I talk about all the time, truly people just don't know what is "reality" so they make ignorant claims.
It all comes down to that perspective thing I talk about all the time, truly people just don't know what is "reality" so they make ignorant claims.
We JUST completed our facility upgrade! It didn't pay off 1, 2, 3 ,4 ,5 years ago because it wasn't yet complete. Judge the recruiting from this year moving forward please!
Don't think AJ Klein belongs on your list. He was not a 2 star recruit nor a "late" offer for the Clones..
I like walk-on players for a couple reasons. Yes, we would all like to have a team full of highly rated players but , some of those players never live up to their expectations. Over the years, we have had our share of those kind of players. We all know their names. Walk-ons are usually highly motivated, accept coaching and work their tails off. The real value for walk-ons is they fill a void left by scholarship players who never quite measure up. And they are almost always great role players, those guys who get little attention for their contributions but still go out week after week and give it everything they have. I hope we always have a walk-on program.
Another program that has traditionally relied on quite a few walk ons is KSU, under Bill Snyder.
Thanks Sarge you're awful helpful pointing things out I appreciate it. Incidentally the confusion Must have come from the fact that 2 recruiting gurus who know how do identify talent in Iowa and Wisconsin both passed on offering him and it seems that he only had four offers total 2 to the Mac one to Wyoming and one Iowa State? So yo u can my confusion.
I can assume you're fact checked my other stuff and it cleared, right?
There best LB included. Didn't Green Bay miss there #1 WR all season in 2015. Wasn't he a former walk-on at K-State, let alone the starting QB at Green Bay sole invite to Big Ten was as a walk-on at Illinois. He choose a better path.
It is more about who is a football player and who is not?
Some 16-18 year olds max out before or in college. Maurice Fleming was Iowa's top rated DB, but couldn't consistently crack the first unit.
Transferring to start some where as 5th year senior.
Iowa has a good mix of walk-ons and recruited scholarship players.
Need to up it again ...
Cid, you are one of the finest posters I have every read cruising the Hawkeye scene. I literally only logged back in to say just that. I've had enough of the message boards again for the next year but posters like you, Heatdog, Freyvet, Homerhawkeye (is he still around) Soybean another super highly respected long time guy, NevedaHawk, etc... I know I've missed many that have been good positive posters and have supported some of the things I've said.
You guys are informative and make the message boards what I truly think they ought to be. A place to share discourse, share information and talk about football. Quite frankly I don't need to hear a lot of negativity, anger, hostility, finger-pointing or "coaching expertise" from a guy I don't know and for all I know couldn't lead a horse to the water trough. I get plenty of that in my real life, football/message boards isn't real life.
It would be different if you could tell people had a general understanding of football history and what is reality but you can tell even in this very thread they just don't have a clue. There are some historical universities of which Iowa and again Wisconsin are two of them. That have had high levels of walkons that honestly should've never had to walk on but they did.
College football is not a one-size-fits-all thing in fact sports in general is not a one-size-fits-all thing. But they're incapable of seeing that & quite frankly they're super incapable of seeing anything but their own agenda. I don't surround myself with those kind of people, that is what makes these message boards honestly not that much fun. But again guys like you Cid & aforementioned, kudos and carry-on!!!
I am so tired of people pointing to the early KF guys as proof that stars don't mean anything or that walk ons are a fine way to build a program.
A HUGE reality is that when Clark, Gallery, Sanders, etc were being recruited, recruiting services and Internet videos were not out on just any kid who has a big hit or runs a 4.40 40 yard dash. It is harder for kids to slip through the cracks than it used to be. Yes there are the guys like Sherff, King, and Jewel who still develop into good players. HOWEVER, a consistent winner can't be build relying on this strategy year after year. Yes we'll have a couple nice years enjoying guys like King and Jewel but then what? Eventually, someone has to take their spot and will they also Exceed expectations over and over? I hope I'm wrong but I'm afraid Iowa must raise the stankard of guys they offer and accept commitments from at least early in the process or we will fall back to mediocrity. Like I said, I hope I'm wrongoing but this is the only way I can explain the constantly repeating trend of one very good year out of four over the past decade with KF.
Well they have at Wisconsn over and over. By the by Iowa has put in about 20 more 2-star/walk on's into the NFL since those after mentioned people so I think you're probably going to keep getting tired...just sayin!
As I have said in previous years, I frankly don't care much about our NFL success as KF isn't paid to use Iowa as a minor league NFL team to prep players for the next level; he's paid to win games at the University of Iowa. IMHO, such stats do not offer much in terms of moral victories. Alabama hasn't had a QB do well in the NFL in decades, I'd still trade that for a couple national titles. I'm so very proud (I know I know lol) of what our team did last year and god willing we will do even better this year. But as a long time fan, I've ridden this roller coaster before and would like to maintain the high level of consistency.
Well friend if it can't happen at places like Texas, USC, UCLA, Tennesee, Michigan, ND, actually pretty much everywhere, it isn't likely to happen here. Hell from 97 to 2007 before Saban got there Alabama won 10 plus games 3 times and was sub .500 4 or 5. Point is that's how it works it's a wildly up-and-down cycle. Everyone cycles down eventually & Saban can't coach forever. I just hope our next coach is more Kirk Ferentz and less Bob Cummings or RIch Rodrigues or Brady Hoke or or or......pretty fine line between good and bad.
Ps.. Alabama has had way, way better guarterback play than us. And I believe both their national championship quarterbacks most assuredly got looks in the NFL & may both still be there for all I remember.
The point is we had plenty of talent we had some horrendous inconsistencies at spots especially quarterback play and very lousy leadership. I think we kind of figured that out by everything the guys said in interviews from last year.
LSU is the poster child for talented football teams. No one puts more kids in the NFL than them especially skill players but honestly every position except for quarterbacks, their quarterback play has been terrible and that's where they can't beat Alabama. When they've had good quarterback play they're very tough to beat.
We definitely need to start recruiting better quarterbacks!!
The point is we had plenty of talent we had some horrendous inconsistencies at spots especially quarterback play and very lousy leadership. I think we kind of figured that out by everything the guys said in interviews from last year.
LSU is the poster child for talented football teams. No one puts more kids in the NFL than them especially skill players but honestly every position except for quarterbacks, their quarterback play has been terrible and that's where they can't beat Alabama. When they've had good quarterback play they're very tough to beat.
We definitely need to start recruiting better quarterbacks!!
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First off don't use that excuse. Recruits have heard about it and seen construction progress for years. Going back to 2013 kids knew about the future facilities.
SECONDLY, IT HAS HELPED AND IS HELPING. Recent classes helped in last years 12-2 campaign.
It's like fans are unaware of current events. Sheesh.
Your opinion. Mine is that a completed project certainly pays off far more BUT it certainly didn't hurt leading up to completion. Weight room, dining facilities, etc also help team training, chemistry, etc.
