Mich vs PSU
- Thread starter Gobblin
- Start date
AZ, This assumes Rasheed beats out McCutcheon. Possible, not likely.
And I think Cassar has a good bead on 197, he totally remade his body this year.
Cenzo may be the odd man out. He went to a couple tournaments this year signed up at 149 and didn't make weight. I would guess he's in the doghouse.
And what weight is he going for? I don't know if Nolf will stay down at 157. He's kinda skinny.
But the theme here is true, this is a mess. Add Manville, Hall, and two more Nevills brothers to the mix will not make everybody happy.
Just a thought on the PSU mess for trying to find guys a spot, isn't this a lot like what we had at Iowa in the 80s and 90s with top level guys sitting back up to other top guys. Year after year it was a how can they be getting these good guys to come sit back up but they did and each year we just reloaded the lineup with studs. I can remember watching the Iowa teams back then and it wasn't ever a worry about who graduated because the back up would move into the spot and make the ncaa tourney and then make the podium.
Joseph couldn't make 157 at the tournaments he missed. If Nolf stays put, 165 seems to be his best bet for next year.
I don't recall that we ever double booked top 10 studs. Maybe somebody can remember, but I can't. I know when Gable settled on the Brands bothers he passed on Alan Fried.
Cenzo missed 157 twice and I'm hearing that weight will be a distant memory for him. Great problems to have.
Iowa attracted a lot of top tier talent back in the day. But not near what PSU is able to pull off these days with the slew of 5 star level recruits they are getting for what must be about 25% scholarships.
Iowa used to get these types. Maybe 1, 2 even 3 a team Mac / Williams / McGuiness... but make no mistake. These guys usually demanded a lot of scholarship money.
I think what lead to a lot of battles for starting spots was that they had a ton of 2/3 star type talent become studs. This lead to a lot of battles for spots. Moreso then getting a bunch of 4 star guys at the same weights. For instance I bet guys like Brands, Ironside, Schwab,Weber, Whitmer... would have been hard pressed to be in the top 25 in their recruiting classes.
Iowa used to get these types. Maybe 1, 2 even 3 a team Mac / Williams / McGuiness... but make no mistake. These guys usually demanded a lot of scholarship money.
I think what lead to a lot of battles for starting spots was that they had a ton of 2/3 star type talent become studs. This lead to a lot of battles for spots. Moreso then getting a bunch of 4 star guys at the same weights. For instance I bet guys like Brands, Ironside, Schwab,Weber, Whitmer... would have been hard pressed to be in the top 25 in their recruiting classes.
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They will have quite the log jam there. I think at some point Nickal moves up to 84 for sure. Mark Hall will be 65 or 74...Nolf is tall and has continuously moved up in weight over the years..I still remember him putting it on little Joey McKenna at like 132. Before the season he was slotted at 57 or 65. I'm guessing this is the last season Rasheed sees the lineup.
Every team has injuries. I'm sure losing a possible championship run in 2015 due to the Altons' injuries -- after a pretty good stretch injury wise -- just reinforced the need to have the best backups. Likewise kids know that they could be called on, so even if they fall a little short of being Option A there's still a chance of being in that championship lineup (James English) as Option B. Most kids and parents aren't dumb.
Thats my take as well.
Nolf stays put at 157
Cenzo slides into 165
Nickal stays 174 unless Rasheed slides into 174. then nickal 184, McCutcheon then is bumped to 197 then what about Casser?
One way or the other btween, Cenzo, Rasheed, McCutcheon or Casser. One or 2 of them are for sitting. Im also not so sure Nickal could beat McCutcheon even if he went up. The perfect world is Rasheed holds 165 next season but i dont see any why that can ever happen without an amputation. Rasheed is bigger than Nickal when they stand next to each other.
Manville is likely a 149 so matches up good when Zain leaves.
The whole mark hall thing is a bit odd to me. I know its been explained but i dont buy into the whole 2 years before your clock starts unless its a morman mission. Many kids never make it back to their original commitiment and some just dont pan out without a ton of structure like McCauley. Others like Montell Marion meets a coach at OTC who takes them under their wings. Terry pouched a UNI commit in Marion.
I have no reason to belive Mark Hall wont be a multi champ stud but the wont pan out warning signs are there. First the Apple Valley kids never seem to translate to D1 like they are advertised. 2nd the OTC thing is always a red flag to watch, 3 IMO Hall has always just seemed more mature than other kids. I just think soem elite kids will close that gap in the 2 years Hall is being pampered for freestyle. We shall see. THing is though, Cael would be just fine even if Hall doesnt work out. Hes overrecruited.
No most parents want their kids to be starters and happy. The elite kid who waits aound for just a possible 1 or 2 years of starters is not normal because they can get more $ and more years starting elsewhere. Selling a kid on coming to Happy Valley is a different animal than looking a kid in the face and telling him to wait around to be called on is in his best interest. A guy like Cenzo could win a title at PITT and not deal with the waiting around BS.
Agree with most, but if Nickal goes to 184 then McCutcheon either goes to 197 or cuts off a limb and heads down to 174 for a year.
At this point, I would think McCutcheon over Cassar for 97 with no problem, unless Cassar has another jump in development. Who knows?
Manville could be 149 in 3 years, or 157 could be open in 3 years. Unsure, but that's a long way off.
Hall signed his LOI. That is binding until you complete your first enrolled year at the institution. He can't be "poached" without being treated as a transfer. Not sure if this was the case with Marion, but even if it was, Marion was not subject to the B1G loss of a year of eligibility because he came from UNI, so with a release he was good to go. With a release Mark Hall would probably be looking at only non-B1G schools.
If I ever become curious about what Penn State's lineup will be in upcoming years, somebody please come and shot me in the head.
I thought LOI's expire?
If not then Mark Hall is screwed if he ever does have a change of heart. Cael would never let him out of that. its always been a one way street with Cael on those. That is unless he doesnt see you starting on his team anymore. But if your a starter he needs, you are f'd
If not then Mark Hall is screwed if he ever does have a change of heart. Cael would never let him out of that. its always been a one way street with Cael on those. That is unless he doesnt see you starting on his team anymore. But if your a starter he needs, you are f'd
LOI's do not expire (well technically they do when your eligibility is up). Look it up on the NCAA Q & A. When you sign one, you owe the school an academic year of enrollment (not an eligibility year). If you decide not to enroll you are basically a transfer. Subject to a release and what not.
Who is the PSU wrestler that was not granted a release upon request to transfer that you are referring to? The reason I stated Mark Hall would be looking at non-B1G schools is that there is a B1G rule that you lose a year of eligibility with a transfer to another B1G institution. There is NO release for this (although there is an appeal, which has only been granted 1 time under circumstances which are really not clear - Micic).
I think Bubba. Cael, so the legend goes, would not release him to a Big 10 school or Iowa State. But at least the story had a happy ending. I tear up when I think of it.
Bubba could not be released to a B1G school, so legend must be wrong. If he transferred in the B1G, he would have been out of eligibility.
Did Bubba not transfer? What am I missing here? Also, the premise is completely wrong - was Cael trying to KEEP Bubba on the team???? After Bubba purposely missed weight to make himself ineligible for the weight Cael wanted him to compete at. I always ask myself how Brands would have reacted to that.
I believe that was the graduate transfer ruleWasn't Jake Rudock released by Iowa to play at Michigan? Impossible you say.
Thanks. I can't believe I didn't know that.
Same thing with Blaise Butler...UVA to Mizzou.
So how do we get this rule to work to get Metcalf to 141.
Hell...I thought we were telling him to go 74 KG...I'm so confused
Jenkins was restricted to schools that couldn't challenge for the NCAA Championship. I am pretty sure OkState or ISU were not options..............
Who is the PSU wrestler that was not granted a release upon request to transfer that you are referring to? QUOTE said:
Exactly. IIRC Jenkins was interested in wrestling for KJ at ISU that year. And I believe there was a spot for him in the lineup with Reader moving up that year to 174.
I stand by its a one way street with Cael. I really wish ISU would have blocked Taylor, Brown, Cyler or Long and not given the releases. Taylor one made sense to let him go since he wasnt on campus yet but the Long would have cost PSU a title. Still cant believe KJ did that one.
Thats right Cael wanted to dictate where Bubba went but threw a fit when the OU coach wasnt going to release Kemerer to PSU. I believe the OU coach finally released him but I remember it being quite the deal. He ended up not being very good, no wonder he got a release from Cael the 2nd time
Curious Dunke, what weight was Jake wrestling at then when he cam back to PSU for Cael? Didnt Sunderland give him the first release?
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Has nothing to do with that. Room guys know who they are. This is about stock piling #1 recruits. Its one thing for Joey Gunther to be on the bench in his 3rd year in the program waiting for a chance. I wouldnt expect either Cenzo or Rasheed to have that same level of expectation. They shouldnt be on anyones bench. Should be interesting to see if Cael pulls this off next season.
Dont get me wrong dunke. One heck of a good problem to have. I just dont think even Cael can sweet talk either on of those kids or their parents that there best place they could be is on that bench hoping for a starter to get hurt.
Rasheed largely came out of nowhere as far as recruiting goes. I wouldn't be surprised if Penn State was the only Big Ten team to show any interest in him at all. I would think that sort of attention from Cael earned some loyalty from Rasheed. He is a viable candidate to wrestle 84 next year, just like Joseph could fit in at 65.
When these guys signed on to Penn State they knew there was a possibility a starting spot wouldn't be handed to them. When Joseph signed his LOI, all of the wrestlers you've mentioned were already in the program and he had to be deluded to think Cael wouldn't target Mark Hall. Maybe Penn State is just a great program to wrestle for and these kids are eager to beat out other exceedingly talented wrestlers to earn their starting spot.
When these guys signed on to Penn State they knew there was a possibility a starting spot wouldn't be handed to them. When Joseph signed his LOI, all of the wrestlers you've mentioned were already in the program and he had to be deluded to think Cael wouldn't target Mark Hall. Maybe Penn State is just a great program to wrestle for and these kids are eager to beat out other exceedingly talented wrestlers to earn their starting spot.
Does anybody know if Hall actually signed a NLI? All I can find, is his verbal on 11-11-15 and he's "going to" sign one.
Jake Kemerer never stepped foot on Oklahoma. He did however sign a LOI to attend OU.
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