Joe Toussaint is shooting 45% on the year from 3, but is taking only 0.8 per game. Should Fran give him more of a green light from deep? I wonder how he's shooting in practice.
More Toussaint From Deep?
- Thread starter hawkeyeguy44
- Start date
I heard he was shooting underhanded in practice.
Not a bad idea for FTs, they are likely more accurate:
Rick Barry’s Underhand Free Throws and Why NBA Players Today Don’t Follow Suit
Rick Barry successfully mastered the art of the underhand free throw, but the NBA players of today aren't following suit.
www.sportscasting.com
It's too small of a sample size (5-11) to make a proclamation one way or the other. Dom Uhl had a stretch in 2016 where he made 11-17 3's over a 7 game stretch. For the entire year he was over 40%, but that stretch certainly skewed his numbers. The next year he made 23% of his 3's and the following year he barely played.
I don't know that necessarily he should go looking to shoot more 3's. If he's open, take it. If he can drive, do that. Definitely a good start.
I've been a proponent of Toussaint taking more 3-pointers. Yes, his % will likely come down a bit. However, the plus is that a defender will have to come out on him and with his quickness that can open things up for getting into the lane easier.
It would be a huge plus for Joe's game if he could become a significant 3 point threat,.. I see nothing but upside here..
I think that part of the reason that Joe has been an effective shooter from three is that his shot selection has been really smart......he isn't "hunting" that shot, he only takes it when he both feels confident in the shot and he is open, along with being at the right time in the game.
He appears to have a really good shooting form and I would guess that he has worked hard and put in a lot of time shooting to get where he is at.
He appears to have a really good shooting form and I would guess that he has worked hard and put in a lot of time shooting to get where he is at.
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I like Joe T. A lot. He is playing more under control and needs more minutes. He can shoot when it’s there. Not sure why Fran sits him so much.
Joe continues to play with more and more confidence, which is a very good thing. He has a lot of natural ability and the team needs his skill set.
I think among other things, Fran plays Joe depending on the tempo he wants. Want to play fast? Joe is your guy. Want to play a more moderate tempo and take the time to get a good shot (usually from Keegan)? Maybe Ulis or JBo on the point.
I think among other things, Fran plays Joe depending on the tempo he wants. Want to play fast? Joe is your guy. Want to play a more moderate tempo and take the time to get a good shot (usually from Keegan)? Maybe Ulis or JBo on the point.
I don't know exactly what Fran's thinking on the minutes is either...but I am guessing that he plays guys that have earned it in practice and in the game....Ulis is playing really well. JBO brings experience and has Fran's confidence (in spite of what some fans would argue-he has great value). Tony generally plays well and when he does, he brings a lot to the team.....So, we have four guards (occasionally Connor & PS play the two) that he is trying to find time for...AND I think Fran plays the guards who are playing well more minutes which varies by the day/game. Then I think Fran has to play guards based on what the team most needs in that game...sometimes it's scoring, sometimes it's defense, sometimes it's both.
Last but not least.....coaches now have to worry about discontent and transferring more than ever...to a crazy extent. So, we know JBO is done after this year, but the other 3 guys (Joe-Tony-AU) will all be experienced and improved next year. There will be a significant investment in their development.....how do you keep them all happy? Everyone wants to start right? I would hate to go into next year and not have Ulis there to split time with Joe. Ulis could easily and legitimately feel like he is capable of starting for a high level D1 school...because he is. I would hate for Joe to think he isn't getting enough time and decide to transfer....though I think it's tougher to logically justify transferring when you're the starter (although Moss did that and went to Kansas where he didn't start). If Tony continues to improve and sticks with it......he would make a dynamite starting 2G next year for the Hawks....wow, our backcourt would be so athletic!
I haven't seen ANY evidence that a short leash for Joe is related to his shooting.....turnovers. period. Fran is an elite level offensive coach. Perfect system coach for guys like Keegan, JBO, and others. Fran gives the green light for pretty much everyone....and everyone of our players is generally pretty smart about the shots that they take. Fran has specifically stated that he gives the green light and rarely if EVER questions them about shots BECAUSE he is all about developing confidence and you can't develop confidence when you're harping on players about what shots they take (that's a summary, but generally his words). It has NOTHING to do with being a MC.
I think one reason why Joe doesn't shoot a lot of 3's is because he's not a one trick pony. He's very effective as a slasher driving to the hoop for a layup or a drive and dish or spot up turnaround. His ability to hit 3's this year has made his all around offensive game much more effective.
He still seems to slip-n-slide a lot, almost like the tread on his shoes are worn.
I like Joe but he is more of a one trick pony. He needs to shoot more 3's, period. Ulis and Perkins also. All three combined they're averaging making a single 3-pointer per game. That's a crazy number. They average taking 1 attempt each (per game) and out of those three attempts, they make 1. I wish we had a better option than JBo but at this point we don't have another guard that's actively looking to shoot the ball. Ulis and Perkins are productive (because of defense) when Keegan or Kris is scoring 25+ points in a game. In order for Perkins to get more minutes he has to start shooting and making 3's. People can complain about JBo getting to many minutes but it's not his fault or Fran's fault, it's the fact the other guards aren't able to shoot from the outside. Kris not getting more minutes, well, that's on Fran.
Amen.
Joe is really coming in to his own and I hope he shoots more.
Wasn't he all time scorer in Long Island history or something like that? Dude can score, let him Fran.
One trick pony? He can shoot the 3, drive to the hoop effectively, create his own shot with a beautiful turnaround, and dole out assists at a higher volume. I don't want to bash JBo, but he is the epitome of a one trick pony and shoots a lot of 3's because he doesn't have anything else in his game. He can't drive to the hoop and he can't create his own shot. What's this love of 3's about?
Joe is scoring at roughly the same rate on a per 40 basis (11.5 vs 12.5 for Jbo). That's basically a wash. When it comes to efficiency they are in a different stratosphere right now. Joe is scoring WAY more efficiently than JBo (52.5% vs 36.1%). In fact, Joe is tied with Kris for the 2nd highest effective FG% on the team in conference play.
Scoring is important but a PG needs to be a facilitator for everyone else as well. Joe does a good job of breaking down the defense and doling out assists in addition to scoring more efficiently than pretty much everyone else on the team not named Murray.
But Joe needs to take more 3s? For what reason exactly? You want people shooting a high efg%. That incorporates the point differential from 3 pointers.
With respect to minutes, Fran decides who plays and who doesn't. Saying it's not Fran's fault that Jbo gets too many minutes is just dumb. You know who has the 5th highest EFG% in the team? Tony. Tony has an EFG% of 50% (14 Points higher than JBo) and his PPG on a per 40 basis is 6 points higher than JBo. Just put him in the damn game.
I would like to see us shoot more threes in general. Teams are really packing the lane on us. Keagan needs to shoot more threes and I wouldn't mind if Joe and Kris and Ulis launched a few more as well. We seem to be rebounding better these last few games so we can maybe snag 50% of our misses. In this vein I think we need to get Sandfort more minutes as he is the best shooter on the team. He makes mistakes but his effort is always there. Just my 2 cents.
The team needs more outside shooting. There are many times that Joe, Ulis, and Perkins (and even JBo) pass up shots that they need to be taking. I'm not going to defend JBo's numbers because they're not what we need either. Right now we have 4 guards that aren't producing enough scoring for this team to be successful. It's easy to having a high % when you're selective on the shots you take. The rest of the team doesn't have that luxury. JBo is taking some bad shots because there's no other guard to take them. Until we get better shooting from the guards the team is in trouble.
It also doesn't make things better to have the small forward minutes being consumed by both Mc's. We don't have good outside shooting from the 1, 2, and 3 positions.
So this is a different discussion. You said Jbo is playing because the other guards don't score. Tony has a per 40 ppg number of 18.7 which is 6 points higher than Jbo. He's scoring much more efficiently than Jbo and at a much higher rate. Add in that he's a superior defender and rebounder. You saying that Jbo is playing because Tony doesn't shoot or score enough is objectively false. Jbo is playing over Perkins because Fran isn't using numbers to guide his decisions and is deciding to play Jbo in spite of the metrics favoring Tony. That's just a fact.
You could say the exact same thing about Cmac, Pmac and Kris. The allocation of minutes does NOT reflect the relative performance of these players.
And stating that Iowa isn't scoring enough is just flat out wrong. Aside from the game against Rutgers, offense and scoring has been elite for most of the year. Defense and rebounding not so much.
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I'd like to see them drive more. They do a much better job getting to the basket than pmac lol.
Would like to see them more confident from deep though!
You probably didn't even factor in the free FTs jbo gets which would change the numbers even more
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