My truth about Gonzaga.............

[Hawkman34]

Look, I know the Zags are a strong team. But, I am just not sold on them making it undefeated all the way through. My goodness.......they have not even seen a real test since prior to league play. Look at it this way....is there ANYONE who honestly thinks they would have gone undefeated in either the BIG or the Big 12? NOT A CHANCE!!! I think they stumble along the way when someone pushes them and they choke. But, if they do make it, I believe a team like Illinois is simply better top to bottom (I just threw up in my mouth!). The Zags would have NO ONE to match up with Cockburn and the Illini guards and bench are playing at an elite level.

Lets just hope the Hawks have something to say about this whole thing!!!!!!

 

[Hawksfor3]

My goodness.......they have not even seen a real test since prior to league play.

Not true. BYU brought Matt Haarms in to dethrone them. Couldn't get it done. 😁

 

[SSG T]

I don't think they would have gone undefeated in the B1G. I do think they'd have finished 1st or 2nd. They are really, really good, at least as good as Michigan and Illinois.

 

[Rifler]

I don't see the Zags going all the way...

 

[RocknRollface]

They're a great team, much more talented than the normal Gonzaga teams even.

That said, they're on par with UM Baylor Illinois ect.

Theres no reason they should be viewed as a heavy favorite over those teams.

They're getting a little too much credit for playing in a cupcake league.

Its a toss up between all of the 1s Imo.

Gonzaga may have the best guards, although Baylor is great too, but they don't have a matchup for a Cockburn, Garza or Dickinson. And they don't have the athleticism of Baylor's bigs.

 

[Hawkdome]

I say someone bags the zags. You wonder where your teeth all went. When you brush your teeth with pepsident.

 

[Hawkdome]

Winston tastes bad like the one i just had. No filter no flavor just cotton pickin paper.

 

[Hawkdome]

 

[Ihawkhoops]

It's a joke to give Gonzaga a # 1 ranking until they join a legit conference. Yes they are a solid team but why should Iowa or any other P5 team schedule any tough non-conference opponents given they will face multiple top 20 teams in conference play? Meanwhile Gonzaga schedules 4-5 early games against p5 competition and then puts it on auto-pilot crushing West Coast Cupcake teams. So they face BYU twice ok. I would put BYU at the level of Northwestern or Nebraska.

Fine if you want to give them a top 15 ranking but they should be penalized for playing in a complete joke of a conference by playing higher seeded teams in the tournament. Add to this their starters are sitting on the bench for 50% or more of most games in conference play which is a huge advantage come tournament time.

Using this logic, Drake and Loyola-Chicago should be top 10 teams.

 

[RocknRollface]

It's a joke to give Gonzaga a # 1 ranking until they join a legit conference. Yes they are a solid team but why should Iowa or any other P5 team schedule any tough non-conference opponents given they will face multiple top 20 teams in conference play? Meanwhile Gonzaga schedules 4-5 early games against p5 competition and then puts it on auto-pilot crushing West Coast Cupcake teams. So they face BYU twice ok. I would put BYU at the level of Northwestern or Nebraska.

Fine if you want to give them a top 15 ranking but they should be penalized for playing in a complete joke of a conference by playing higher seeded teams in the tournament. Add to this their starters are sitting on the bench for 50% or more of most games in conference play which is a huge advantage come tournament time.

Using this logic, Drake and Loyola-Chicago should be top 10 teams.

Some good points here.

Just about every big ten team is dealing with some kind of injuries to key players because the games are so tough.

Gonzaga cruises against cupcakes all year.

I do think they are as talented as anyone but they really haven't put in anywhere near the work the rest have.

 

[CEIABall]

They're a great team and the best team in the country right now. I don't think they'd be undefeated in the B10 or any major conference but i do think they would have won any conference this year. The best team going into the tournament (#1 overall seed) rarely seems to win it all but we will see.

 

[denmar81]

It's a joke to give Gonzaga a # 1 ranking until they join a legit conference. Yes they are a solid team but why should Iowa or any other P5 team schedule any tough non-conference opponents given they will face multiple top 20 teams in conference play? Meanwhile Gonzaga schedules 4-5 early games against p5 competition and then puts it on auto-pilot crushing West Coast Cupcake teams. So they face BYU twice ok. I would put BYU at the level of Northwestern or Nebraska.

Fine if you want to give them a top 15 ranking but they should be penalized for playing in a complete joke of a conference by playing higher seeded teams in the tournament. Add to this their starters are sitting on the bench for 50% or more of most games in conference play which is a huge advantage come tournament time.

Using this logic, Drake and Loyola-Chicago should be top 10 teams.

Gonzaga has proved they belong year in and year out. They would have been in the top 2 in the B1G. If Michigan is a 1 seed without Livers, Gonzaga definitely should be.

 

[fezzador]

I think Gonzaga might struggle against a more deliberate team that plays terrific defense. That's not going to be Illinois, Iowa, Alabama, etc. All of them are run-and-gun offenses that play right into the Zags' strengths. Virginia seems to fit that description and could cause the Zags some major problems in the S16, assuming both make it that far.

That being said, I'm not sure if UVA would be the lesser of two evils should Iowa make it to the E8.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Look, I know the Zags are a strong team. But, I am just not sold on them making it undefeated all the way through. My goodness.......they have not even seen a real test since prior to league play. Look at it this way....is there ANYONE who honestly thinks they would have gone undefeated in either the BIG or the Big 12? NOT A CHANCE!!! I think they stumble along the way when someone pushes them and they choke. But, if they do make it, I believe a team like Illinois is simply better top to bottom (I just threw up in my mouth!). The Zags would have NO ONE to match up with Cockburn and the Illini guards and bench are playing at an elite level.

Lets just hope the Hawks have something to say about this whole thing!!!!!!

My truth is f*** Gonzaga.

 

[HawkLogic]

Look, I know the Zags are a strong team. But, I am just not sold on them making it undefeated all the way through. My goodness.......they have not even seen a real test since prior to league play. Look at it this way....is there ANYONE who honestly thinks they would have gone undefeated in either the BIG or the Big 12? NOT A CHANCE!!! I think they stumble along the way when someone pushes them and they choke. But, if they do make it, I believe a team like Illinois is simply better top to bottom (I just threw up in my mouth!). The Zags would have NO ONE to match up with Cockburn and the Illini guards and bench are playing at an elite level.

Lets just hope the Hawks have something to say about this whole thing!!!!!!

No Timme wouldn't stop Cockburn, but Timme might score 18 and Cockburn 25. Then it comes down to guards/forwards. Gonzaga has 6'5 Ayayi and 6'4 Suggs. That length is different than what Illni usually face.. Kispert is an elite shooter, so if he's on, I don't think Illini have anybody that will shut him down.

Michigan without Livers is not the same team. I think Michigan with Livers is better than the Illini.

Iowa is the team I'm concerned about and I think Fran will roll out same starting lineups, play the same minutes on bench no matter what the opposition looks like. So I would guess sweet16 and out.

 

[CO_hawk]

Gonzaga has proved they belong year in and year out. They would have been in the top 2 in the B1G. If Michigan is a 1 seed without Livers, Gonzaga definitely should be.

Dont think that is the point of his argument though. When tou seed all the other schools by comparing quad 1 wins and SOS, it would only be far to do the same with Gonzaga and order accordingly.

 

[fezzador]

My truth is f*** Gonzaga.

F Wisconsin, F Alabama, F Illinois, F Baylor, and did I say F WISCONSIN?!?!?!

 

[MepoDawg#]

Average margin of victory over Kansas, West Virginia, Auburn, Iowa and Virginia was 14.8 points. Was supposed to play Baylor as well, until Covid pause. They deserve it whether some think they do or not.

 

[MepoDawg#]

I think Gonzaga might struggle against a more deliberate team that plays terrific defense. That's not going to be Illinois, Iowa, Alabama, etc. All of them are run-and-gun offenses that play right into the Zags' strengths. Virginia seems to fit that description and could cause the Zags some major problems in the S16, assuming both make it that far.

That being said, I'm not sure if UVA would be the lesser of two evils should Iowa make it to the E8.

The same Virginia team they scored 98 points on and beat by 23?

 

[fivecardstud14]

The same Virginia team they scored 98 points on and beat by 23?

Stop it, we aren't looking at results. We're just here to whine about their conference schedule & ignore their non-conference schedule.

 

[Hawkdome]

No need to whine. They will be beaten.

 

[joelbc1]

They're a great team, much more talented than the normal Gonzaga teams even.

That said, they're on par with UM Baylor Illinois ect.

Theres no reason they should be viewed as a heavy favorite over those teams.

They're getting a little too much credit for playing in a cupcake league.

Its a toss up between all of the 1s Imo.

Gonzaga may have the best guards, although Baylor is great too, but they don't have a matchup for a Cockburn, Garza or Dickinson. And they don't have the athleticism of Baylor's bigs.

Gee....I wonder how Gonzaga beat Iowa....did Garza sit out? You have a short memory....the Zags kicked Iowa's butt all afternoon. The game was over 15 mins into it....A team like Mich or Illinois will test them a lot...or even a Baylor...But Gonzaga solved the "Luka problem" with little effort....

 

[Greenway4Prez]

I think Gonzaga might struggle against a more deliberate team that plays terrific defense. That's not going to be Illinois, Iowa, Alabama, etc. All of them are run-and-gun offenses that play right into the Zags' strengths. Virginia seems to fit that description and could cause the Zags some major problems in the S16, assuming both make it that far.

That being said, I'm not sure if UVA would be the lesser of two evils should Iowa make it to the E8.

If Illinois and Alabama don’t have the defense to stop/slow down Gonzaga, then nobody does.

KenPom AdjD Ratings:
Alabama- #2
Illinois- #5

Illinois, Michigan and Baylor can play any pace. But without Livers, Michigan just isn’t the same team and I highly doubt they’ll make it out of their region.

On the right night, there are a decent number of teams that could take Gonzaga out. But they consistently play at or near their best, which is why they’re #1.

 

[joelbc1]

If Illinois and Alabama don’t have the defense to stop/slow down Gonzaga, then nobody does.

KenPom AdjD Ratings:
Alabama- #2
Illinois- #5

Illinois, Michigan and Baylor can play any pace. But without Livers, Michigan just isn’t the same team and I highly doubt they’ll make it out of their region.

On the right night, there are a decent number of teams that could take Gonzaga out. But they consistently play at or near their best, which is why they’re #1.

Liver's ability to play is key to UMichigan...

 

[hawkfan0319]

I think Gonzaga might struggle against a more deliberate team that plays terrific defense. That's not going to be Illinois, Iowa, Alabama, etc. All of them are run-and-gun offenses that play right into the Zags' strengths. Virginia seems to fit that description and could cause the Zags some major problems in the S16, assuming both make it that far.

That being said, I'm not sure if UVA would be the lesser of two evils should Iowa make it to the E8.

Gonzaga beat Virginia Dec 26 by 21 on a nuetral court in Tx. Virginia would need a perfect game to keep it close with Zags.

 

[littlez]

Gonzaga beat Virginia Dec 26 by 21 on a nuetral court in Tx. Virginia would need a perfect game to keep it close with Zags.

And at one point in the game they were up over 30. Final score was misleading. Not that close.

 

[TheTruthTheWholeTruth]

It’s kind of weird that Gonzaga gets to play their non conference schedule again in the tourney. Well done, selection committee!

 

[denmar81]

It’s kind of weird that Gonzaga gets to play their non conference schedule again in the tourney. Well done, selection committee!

True, never thought about that

 

[Rambler Hawk]

I think Gonzaga might struggle against a more deliberate team that plays terrific defense. That's not going to be Illinois, Iowa, Alabama, etc. All of them are run-and-gun offenses that play right into the Zags' strengths. Virginia seems to fit that description and could cause the Zags some major problems in the S16, assuming both make it that far.

That being said, I'm not sure if UVA would be the lesser of two evils should Iowa make it to the E8.

Sounds like a vintage Wisconsin Team could take them down, just not this year though...

 

[LeroyHawk]

My truth is that if we're on from the 3-point line, we can beat anybody, including Gonzaga. If we're not, we can lose to anybody!

 

[RocknRollface]

They're a great team and the best team in the country right now. I don't think they'd be undefeated in the B10 or any major conference but i do think they would have won any conference this year. The best team going into the tournament (#1 overall seed) rarely seems to win it all but we will see.

I think they could go undefeated in pac12, acc or sec.

Big10 or b12 no way.

 

[littlez]

Don’t disagree with that.

 

[RocknRollface]

Gee....I wonder how Gonzaga beat Iowa....did Garza sit out? You have a short memory....the Zags kicked Iowa's butt all afternoon. The game was over 15 mins into it....A team like Mich or Illinois will test them a lot...or even a Baylor...But Gonzaga solved the "Luka problem" with little effort....

What the fvck game were you watching?

Luka scored 30 and dominated his matchup.

The final margin of victory was less than the amount of freethrows Iowa missed. Thats a mathematical reality.

So they did absolutely no solving of Luka.

They are better at all other positions and thats why they won.

 

[IllQChawk]

Gee....I wonder how Gonzaga beat Iowa....did Garza sit out? You have a short memory....the Zags kicked Iowa's butt all afternoon. The game was over 15 mins into it....A team like Mich or Illinois will test them a lot...or even a Baylor...But Gonzaga solved the "Luka problem" with little effort....

Evidently you must not have seen that game...Garza scored 30 & 10 against Timme and their front court and fouled out both Timme and Kispert. If that's solving the Luka problem I hope to see that again if we meet a 2nd time.

Yes they beat Iowa and for most of the game it was an uphill struggle but if Suggs hadn't gone off from 3, (7 of 10) and most of them just over half court the game would have been much closer. Bohannan and Keegan Murray totaled 3 points between them, that won't happen again.

Granted Nunge and Toussaint were in double figures and Nunge's production on the boards and offensively will be missed if another meeting occurs, but we shall see if we meet again if the outcome will be different.

Gonzaga has a terrific team and paid their dues with their non conference schedule, but there's a reason the WCC only got a total of 2 bids to this years tournament, it's basically a crap conference and there's no convincing argument that will change that...

 

[Polkhawk]

Stop it, we aren't looking at results. We're just here to whine about their conference schedule & ignore their non-conference schedule.

The argument does have merit. Many on here think Michigan isn't the same team without Livers. Do you think Michigan wins the WCC with Livers hurt? I do. I think the argument is that once conference play begins Gonzaga is afforded the luxury of still winning if they sustain injuries or just play a bad stretch of basketball. The BIG10, BIG12 and usually ACC are a grind and most teams go through cold spells where they lose a couple or sustain an injury. Many years Gonzaga has been valued to high as a result of running through a weak WCC. Since Mark Few arrived Gonzaga has been a top 3 seed seven times, three of which were a 1 seed and only advanced past the Elite 8 once, playing and losing in the National Championship. Gonzaga is a really good program but most of their good teams advanced to the round of 32 or Sweet 16.

 

[RocknRollface]

My truth is that if we're on from the 3-point line, we can beat anybody, including Gonzaga. If we're not, we can lose to anybody!

Iowas guards are usually on from 3.

The problem is that good defensive teams don't let Iowa guards get open looks.

The x factor in my opinion is when Luka passes well out of doubles Iowa is really tough to beat. When he's determined to score against doubles Iowa becomes one dimensional and much easier to guard.

 

[joelbc1]

Evidently you must not have seen that game...Garza scored 30 & 10 against Timme and their front court and fouled out both Timme and Kispert. If that's solving the Luka problem I hope to see that again if we meet a 2nd time.

Yes they beat Iowa and for most of the game it was an uphill struggle but if Suggs hadn't gone off from 3, (7 of 10) and most of them just over half court the game would have been much closer. Bohannan and Keegan Murray totaled 3 points between them, that won't happen again.

Granted Nunge and Toussaint were in double figures and Nunge's production on the boards and offensively will be missed if another meeting occurs, but we shall see if we meet again if the outcome will be different.

Gonzaga has a terrific team and paid their dues with their non conference schedule, but there's a reason the WCC only got a total of 2 bids to this years tournament, it's basically a crap conference and there's no convincing argument that will change that...

If my aunt had nuts, she would be my uncle...the “Luka problem” was that Luka is not necessarily the secret to stopping Iowa and the Zags were the first team this year that showed how to beat them...other future opponents took notes and concentrated of stopping Luka’s support staff. That has been pretty much how you gear Iowa. Luka had a couple of bad games but in a 30 game schedule that is gonna happen. The secret to beating Iowa is to stop his help because stopping him from his points isn’t likely.
The Zags for the most part can flat out shoot... that is their trademark.... great shooters.

 

[RocknRollface]

If my aunt had nuts, she would be my uncle...the “Luka problem” was that Luka is not necessarily the secret to stopping Iowa and the Zags were the first team this year that showed how to beat them...other future opponents took notes and concentrated of stopping Luka’s support staff. That has been pretty much how you gear Iowa. Luka had a couple of bad games but in a 30 game schedule that is gonna happen. The secret to beating Iowa is to stop his help because stopping him from his points isn’t likely.
The Zags for the most part can flat out shoot... that is their trademark.... great shooters.

They have one great shooter.

Have you seen them play at all?

 

[SDHawkDoc]

They are at the top this season, so far.
It's a very, very difficult thing though to run the table. That's why there hasn't been an unbeaten champ since '76.

 

[joelbc1]

They have one great shooter.

Have you seen them play at all?

You know, I have....
You know that back in the day, Ralph Miller figured out a way to beat Purdue and Rick Mount....You let Mount score his points...because you cant stop him and its a waste of energy...What you do is prevent others from beating you. Miller was like 3-3 vs. Purdue in Mount's time at Purdue....and Mount scored a bucket of points vs. Iowa (53 and 61 in '70, Iowa won both games)....but when Iowa beat them, Iowa's defense cut down Mount's support staff. That's what Gonzaga did in effect.....Garza had a great game....and Iowa was never a threat to win the game....that is a pretty effective game plan I would say. But then I am sure I am wrong....
Not saying the Zags will win it all...but to say the "don't deserve" a #1 rating is sour grapes.If anyone "deserves" a #1, it is the Zags......being undefeated has its advantages.
Back in '66 most folks thought Texas Western was way overrated, too. That season, TW beat Iowa by about 20 in a game that #4 Iowa was blitzed coming out of the locker room and trailed by 20 at halftime. Everyone dismissed Texas Western until.they whupped Kentucky in the Championship game.....I believe Western was the first NCAA tournament team to start 5 black players, too.......how many blacks did Rupp and Kentucky have on their roster that year?