No Scholllies avail for 2017 Class; 1 available for 2018; when was last time we had just 1 Senior?

[Franisdaman]

As a reminder, you can have 13 on scholarship in the men's game (for the women, there is talk of reducing scholarships from 15 to 13 to spread talent across the country and to increase parity; perhaps it is time).

We currently have no scholarships available for the 2017 class; we have just one scholarship available for the 2018 class. What are your thoughts on that? Are our classes too unbalanced right now (see below where 10 of the 13 on scholarship are either freshmen or sophomore)?

When was last time we had just one scholarship senior on an Iowa roster??? Jok, of course, is this year's lone scholarship senior.

Also, as you will see below, in the last three seasons, we have had at least FIVE players leaving the program each season, either by graduation or by transfer; last season, of course, that number was SIX.

Here is the break down of the Iowa roster by graduating class:

Graduating Class : Players

Future Graduating Classes:

2023: 1--6'6" SF Patrick McCaffery (not rated)
2022: 1--6'5" SG Joe Wieskamp (****)
2021: 1--6'5" SG Connor McCaffery (****)

Current Roster (13 currently on scholarship; 0 scholarships available):

2020: 6--6'8" PF Tyler Cook (****): 6'8" SF Cordell Pemsl (***); 6'9" PF Ryan Kriener (***); 6'0" PG Jordan Bohannon (***); 6'5" SF Isaiah Moss (***; ; was reshirted in 2015-16); 6'6" G Maishe Dailey (***)

2019: 4--6'7" SF Ahmad Wagner (***); 6'4" SG Brady Ellingson (***; was redshirted in 2014-15 season); 6'6" combo guard Christian Williams (***); 6'7" SF Nick Baer (was a preferred walk on his 2014-15 red shirt year and for the 2015-16 season; put on scholarship in March 2016)

2018: 2--6'8" SF Dominique Uhl (***); 6'8" PF Dale Jones

2017: 1--6'6" SG Peter Jok

Notable Walk on players:

None

Previous graduating classes and early departures:

2016: 6--PG Anthony Clemmons, PG Mike Gesell, C Adam Woodbury, SF Jarrod Uthoff; Two players granted release in March 2016: 6'6" SG Andrew Fleming (***, was set to graduate in 2019),6'6" SF Brandon Hutton (***; was redshirted in 2015-16; was set to graduate in 2020);

2015: 5--SG Josh Ogelsby, PF Aaron White, C Gabe Olaseni, SG Kyle Denning; PG Trey Dickerson quit/left the team on Feb 23, 2015

2014 (Fran's first recruiting class): 5--PF Melsahn Basabe, SG Devyn Marble, PF Zach McCabe, SF Darius Stokes (graduated & transferred), C Kyle Meyer (granted release & transferred; he redshirted his 2012 freshman season and therefore would have been se to graduate in 2017)

2013: 1--PG Patrick Ingram (would have been part of the 2016 graduation class; transferred in March 2013, after just one season at Iowa)

 

[DanL53]

It's a little bit of a pimple on the arse compared to a carcinoma imo.

I appreciate you put a lot of work into dissecting the Iowa program under McCaffery. But in regards to the current state of D1 basketball Iowa has been doing very well under Fran. First, there isn't a darn thing we can do about graduation, so we're talking transfers. Even if one throws Cully Payne into the mix, Fran's had just six players leave in six years. Last year alone there were over 700 transfers from D1 schools, or more than two per team.

As to having only one senior this season? The entire Big Ten has just 26:

5 Illinois, 12
1 Indiana, 13
1 Iowa, 13
2 Maryland, 13
2 Michigan, 12 - 1
4 Mich St., 12
2 Minn, 13
1 Neb, 12 - 1
2 Northwestern, 12
1 Ohio State, 11
0 Penn State, 13 - 1
1 Purdue, 10
0 Rutgers, 10
4 Wisconsin, 13

The number following the team is how many scholarships given out so far. Three teams have one guy transferring in who is expected to redshirt.

One can see that Illinois, Michigan State and Wisconsin are way over everyone else in terms of experienced seniors. Wisconsin especially has key guys coming back in Koenig and Hayes. Illinois? They only won five Big Ten games last season...but had injury problems. I don't know what to make of them but fortunately Groce probably won't know either.

So, there we are with several Big Ten teams counting on youth. I've posted before, in terms of actual playing time you bet Iowa has far less experience than many other teams. But that's as much a result of having had four seniors starting as anything else.

In terms of recruiting we'll just have to see what happens down the road.

 

[Vbeachawk]

I would guess that Ellingson will get only 4 years at Iowa, if he doesn't transfer at the end of this next season. Much like with the football program, I suspect Fran will move the player that plays the least out after 4 years, if not earlier.

 

[Titanhawk2]

How has Ferentz moved seniors that haven't started out of the program?

 

[DanL53]

Eric May, in 2012/13, was the lone senior. Forgot to address that question.

 

[TheHawkeyeDudeAbides]

Franisdaman..... the roster is already in transition. Moss, Williams, and Baer will be around for the next two years (minimum). Wagner, Cook and Pemsl should be frontcourt players to build a program upon for a while. Dailey seems likely to play his first year based on PTL play and so make an impact that will cause some evaluation of roster PT. A couple of guys may transfer ( Kreiner is more likely to redshirt) as minutes for guys not in the top 8 rotation will become dissatisfied as the season progresses.

Fran needs a top 25 class next year and there should be at least two (2) scholarships to go with Wieskamp next year.
Joey Hauser and Cart'Are Gordon should likely be the top bigs Iowa is strongly after with the potential of a high quality PG/CG as a major consideration with a transfer opening. Guys like Tre Woods or Courtney Ramey are known offers.

 

[TheHawkeyeDudeAbides]

I would guess that Ellingson will get only 4 years at Iowa, if he doesn't transfer at the end of this next season. Much like with the football program, I suspect Fran will move the player that plays the least out after 4 years, if not earlier.

If Ellingson is demoted to the being the ninth guy off the bench for Iowa, BE won't be at Iowa next year. Dailey, CMacC and Moss should own the SG spot next year and after that. And Fran wants to play a faster tempo. BE is not that type of guy.

 

[91hawki]

If Ellingson is demoted to the being the ninth guy off the bench for Iowa, BE won't be at Iowa next year. Dailey, CMacC and Moss should own the SG spot next year and after that. And Fran wants to play a faster tempo. BE is not that type of guy.

Bingo.

Also, if Bohanon proves to be a better shooter than Ellingson- this will certainly be his last year.

Even with Jones getting a 6th year, Fran will sign at least 1 Big Man in 2017.

 

[icparkerhawk]

Bingo.

Also, if Bohanon proves to be a better shooter than Ellingson- this will certainly be his last year.

Even with Jones getting a 6th year, Fran will sign at least 1 Big Man in 2017.

My thoughts as well. Bohanon looks to be a quicker, better ball handling version of Ellingson. If that proves true, I would imagine he takes almost all his minutes provided he can play Big Ten defense. If that happens I have to think BE looks for opportunity elsewhere. The beauty is if BE sticks around, it's likely because h me has shown something to earn minutes, which makes the Hawks better. Win-win imo

 

[greenelite]

We are loaded with talent right now. Iowa will become perennial top 25 and will challenge for the B1G title from here on out. It's great to be a Hawkeye, gentlemen.

 

[HoustonREDHawk]

One way or another, a scholarship will be available in 2017. Also, pretty likely that there will be more than one available in 2018. Glad Fran has the some scholarship wild cards to play with his sons on the team, if needed.

 

[Franisdaman]

Franisdaman..... the roster is already in transition. Moss, Williams, and Baer will be around for the next two years (minimum). Wagner, Cook and Pemsl should be frontcourt players to build a program upon for a while. Dailey seems likely to play his first year based on PTL play and so make an impact that will cause some evaluation of roster PT. A couple of guys may transfer ( Kreiner is more likely to redshirt) as minutes for guys not in the top 8 rotation will become dissatisfied as the season progresses.

Fran needs a top 25 class next year and there should be at least two (2) scholarships to go with Wieskamp next year.
Joey Hauser and Cart'Are Gordon should likely be the top bigs Iowa is strongly after with the potential of a high quality PG/CG as a major consideration with a transfer opening. Guys like Tre Woods or Courtney Ramey are known offers.

someone is going to have to leave the program early to get your desired outcome of at least two (2) scholarships to go with Wieskamp. It appears that most on here think it will be BE. However, from the CR Gazette:

Iowa Coach Fran McCaffery remains confident in his shooting guard, who showed he’s capable of performing other tasks when his shot is off.

“I’ve been impressed with Brady,” McCaffery said. “He got hurt his first year and he sat back and figured it out. Last year he was really good for most of the season, and he didn’t get as much playing time. He didn’t sulk. He just kept working. He improved his body. He knows what we need him to do.”

The whole story: http://www.thegazette.com/subject/sports/uhl-ellingson-look-to-make-strides-with-hawkeyes-20160714

 

[Franisdaman]

One way or another, a scholarship will be available in 2017. Also, pretty likely that there will be more than one available in 2018. Glad Fran has the some scholarship wild cards to play with his sons on the team, if needed.

what makes you think that Connor will not be on scholarship? he is a 4 star recruit and deserves it.

the only way more than one schollie is available for 2018 is wishful thinking that someone transfers out......I hope everyone stays put! then what? i guess this board will melt down because BE or someone else is not doing the honorable thing

 

[TheHawkeyeDudeAbides]

someone is going to have to leave the program early to get your desired outcome of at least two (2) scholarships to go with Wieskamp

Attempting to take my Captain Obvious spot?

 

[Franisdaman]

Attempting to take my Captain Obvious spot?

View embedded media

I just think you are wishful thinking that someone is going to transfer.

BE does not sound like a quitter, even though some of you make him out to be one.

 

[terrehawk]

If I were Fran or Connor I would have zero problem giving the scholarship to another player that can help.

"Deserves" has zero to do with it. Zip. Nada.

Money is not an issue (obviously) for the family. There is no difference within the program for a scholarship or non scholarship player. Especially the coaches son.

The desire to be better as a team is higher than a drop in the bucket financially to them.

 

[terrehawk]

I just think you are wishful thinking that someone is going to transfer.

BE does not sound like a quitter, even though some of you make him out to be one.

I think you've got it completely backwards

.transferring so you can actually play doesnt mean you are a quitter. It is kind of the opposite actually if you know you just aren't good enough to see the floor and want to just play basketball.

 

[DanL53]

what makes you think that Connor will not be on scholarship? he is a 4 star recruit and deserves it.

the only way more than one schollie is available for 2018 is wishful thinking that someone transfers out......I hope everyone stays put! then what? i guess this board will melt down because BE or someone else is not doing the honorable thing

I'm a little confused about the meltdown thing. Your initial post had words capitalized like, "FIVE guys leaving", and "SIX guys leaving!" And It was all about unbalanced classes. You brought up transfers, and for some reason included graduation as well (which I'm still trying to figure out the point to that). So, what's wrong with posters anticipating the obvious which is in today's college basketball world players often transfer to find an opportunity to play?

It sounds like you are trying to say we're stuck, no more players, ONE more guy in the next two years, woe is us! As you can see, unbalanced classes are becoming common as a result of players transferring. Ohio State? Four of their five freshmen, a highly ranked recruiting class, are already gone from last year!

It happens. We lost Fleming and Hutton and dang but I wish they'd have stuck around. But they didn't. So we found a scholarship for Baer and he deserved it. And we found Maishe Dailey. You know what, I'm not unhappy about that at all.

It's the waaaaay of the world. So we learn not to count on guys sticking around. We learn that it's better to not be certain about anything. Nobody is throwing a tizzy fit and the Conner thing? All having him means is if a guy we can't refuse commits and nobody leaves Conner could walkon for a year. And that's unlikely to happen, and it is totally up to McCaffery, we shouldn't expect it by dang why shouldn't Fran use that insurance to recruit a stud this year and gamble a little that like it or not players do transfer these days?

 

[Franisdaman]

I think you've got it completely backwards

.transferring so you can actually play doesnt mean you are a quitter. It is kind of the opposite actually if you know you just aren't good enough to see the floor and want to just play basketball.

if you quit the team, you are a quitter, are you not?

 

[StormHawk42]

if you quit the team, you are a quitter, are you not?

Not necessarily. At least not in my book.

 

[Franisdaman]

I'm a little confused about the meltdown thing. Your initial post had words capitalized like, "FIVE guys leaving", and "SIX guys leaving!" And It was all about unbalanced classes. You brought up transfers, and for some reason included graduation as well (which I'm still trying to figure out the point to that). So, what's wrong with posters anticipating the obvious which is in today's college basketball world players often transfer to find an opportunity to play?

It sounds like you are trying to say we're stuck, no more players, ONE more guy in the next two years, woe is us! As you can see, unbalanced classes are becoming common as a result of players transferring. Ohio State? Four of their five freshmen, a highly ranked recruiting class, are already gone from last year!

It happens. We lost Fleming and Hutton and dang but I wish they'd have stuck around. But they didn't. So we found a scholarship for Baer and he deserved it. And we found Maishe Dailey. You know what, I'm not unhappy about that at all.

It's the waaaaay of the world. So we learn not to count on guys sticking around. We learn that it's better to not be certain about anything. Nobody is throwing a tizzy fit and the Conner thing? All having him means is if a guy we can't refuse commits and nobody leaves Conner could walkon for a year. And that's unlikely to happen, and it is totally up to McCaffery, we shouldn't expect it by dang why shouldn't Fran use that insurance to recruit a stud this year and gamble a little that like it or not players do transfer these days?

Yeah, you are right; I should have never brought up the possibility that this board might melt down if something does not go Iowa's way, because we have never seen that before, have we? Actually we have and not too long ago you said that you were leaving the free board, yet you are back.

I guess I don't understand why you don't understand how I listed every player (starting with Fran's first recruiting class) and the year they graduated/left the program or are scheduled to graduate. As you can see in my original post, it covers 2013-2023. I think it's pretty easy to look at and understand.

Any way, regarding unbalanced classes, when you have 13 on scholarship, that means that on average you would have 3.25 players leaving the program each year. So, on average, that would be 9.75 players leaving Iowa over the last 3 years. Iowa, however, has had 16 ( 5, 5 and 6) leaving over the last 3 years. I just think its a concern when you have one kid set to graduate in 2017 and SIX (almost half your scholarship players) set to graduate in 2020. We are not Kentucky, which brings in multiple 5 star recruits each year. And we don't benefit, like Kentucky does, by playing in the weak SEC. At Iowa, with balanced classes you are more likely to have more stability when it comes to wins and losses year in and year out. I am afraid with the 10 players who are freshman and sophomore, we could be in for a roller coaster of a ride this season.

Don't put words into my mouth, Dan. No where did I say "woe is us." I just pointed out the facts, which is that we currently have one sholarship to offer over the next two classes.

Yes, transfers are a reality; however, immediately anticipating BE's departure is not fair to him nor is there any evidence that he would leave the program. Fran likes how hard Brady is working and Brady has given no evidence that he is leaving the program.

 

[SDHawkDoc]

I'm with you, terrehawk. I have no problem with a player leaving for another opportunity if it's clear he isn't going to see the floor/field.
If Ellingson becomes a solid game contributor great. If not, and he opts to transfer elsewhere rather than sit on the bench, then great.

 

[Franisdaman]

If I were Fran or Connor I would have zero problem giving the scholarship to another player that can help.

"Deserves" has zero to do with it. Zip. Nada.

Money is not an issue (obviously) for the family. There is no difference within the program for a scholarship or non scholarship player. Especially the coaches son.

The desire to be better as a team is higher than a drop in the bucket financially to them.

Has Connor been quoted anywhere saying he would be happy to give up his scholarship?

We know of at least one fact in your post: you are NOT Connor and you are NOT Fran.

 

[goodbyebobby]

if you quit the team, you are a quitter, are you not?

Rehab is for quitters.

 

[unoHawkeye]

if you quit the team, you are a quitter, are you not?

You are not.

 

[nu2u]

I'm guessing Ellingson finds his shot and earns 10 or so minutes per game as a 3PT specialist. He has a decent mid-range shot as well. Fran will certainly give him every opportunity to earn that spot off the bench. I'm pulling for him.

Good 3PT shooters are vital now, you can't consistently win without them. He has a good looking shot but judging from his interviews it appears that he had lost confidence last year. That happens to every shooter at some point. I remember Gatens talking about it and, going back further, Jeff Horner as well. Both of those former players were more athletic than Brady so he has to work even harder to get his shot.

I think the non-con games will be critical for Brady this season, History shows us that it can be a big mistake to give up on a player who did not perform to expectations as a freshman.

 

[terrehawk]

if you quit the team, you are a quitter, are you not?

Weak. You're painting a pretty broad brush there buddy boy. There's a huge difference between a competitive kid that just wants to get to play so he transferred and a kid that quits on his teammates and his team because he is selfish and a cancer.

 

[Ronman]

Yes, transfers are a reality; however, immediately anticipating BE's departure is not fair to him nor is there any evidence that he would leave the program. Fran likes how hard Brady is working and Brady has given no evidence that he is leaving the program.

Not sure what alternative you think McCaffery might have stated regarding Brady. Bottom line, at this point in the programs development, you need to produce to play. Last season Brady was given every opportunity early and as his production diminished, so did his playing time. I suspect that this season, he will be given plenty of "heat check" options, but if cannot hit his outside shots, he will move further and further down the bench. Then it will be up to him to decide whether he is in the right situation for himself or not.

 

[terrehawk]

Has Connor been quoted anywhere saying he would be happy to give up his scholarship?

We know of at least one fact in your post: you are NOT Connor and you are NOT Fran.

Let me go back and copy and paste my quote.

terrehawk said: ↑
"If I were Fran or Connor I would have zero problem giving the scholarship to another player that can help."

You should probably just quit now. You are obviously not very good at this

 

[DanL53]

Yeah, you are right; I should have never brought up the possibility that this board might melt down if something does not go Iowa's way, because we have never seen that before, have we? Actually we have and not too long ago you said that you were leaving the free board, yet you are back.

Good point about meltdowns. I'm sorry, I was drawn in with your, "What are your thoughts on that?", sentence in the first post. I should have known...

 

[championhawk]

I gained respect by the way Hubbard handled his departure. He saw that he wasn't ready for this level and opted to respectfully go to another institution. He is far from a "quitter".

 

[HawkAttackDial911]

Based upon reports from the PTL, it sounds like we're set with big guys. Here's hoping Fran and company can recruit a top flight guard.

 

[EZ2BJZ]

if you quit the team, you are a quitter, are you not?

I quit drinking. I guess I'm a quitter too.

 

[HoustonREDHawk]

what makes you think that Connor will not be on scholarship? he is a 4 star recruit and deserves it.

the only way more than one schollie is available for 2018 is wishful thinking that someone transfers out......I hope everyone stays put! then what? i guess this board will melt down because BE or someone else is not doing the honorable thing

Damn you're anxious to create arguments. No one said Fran's kids don't deserve to be on scholarship or even that they will not be on scholarship. He does have that option, which gives him some recruiting flexibility. If Fran didn't think he will have scholarships to offer in the next couple of years, he and the assistants could kick back and save on a lot travel.

 

[mazda1]

Could Fran pay Conner's way? SURE. Or he could go on scholarship and buy himself or Conner a bass boat, a collector car, jet ski's, an ATV, buy an annuity, give to a special charity or..........

Just because Fran makes a lot of money he still is working not only because he loves it, but because it allows him do things for himself and his family that they enjoy. I don't think fans should expect to tell him how to spend his money.

 

[TopHawkeye]

Could Fran pay Conner's way? SURE. Or he could go on scholarship and buy himself or Conner a bass boat, a collector car, jet ski's, an ATV, buy an annuity, give to a special charity or..........

Just because Fran makes a lot of money he still is working not only because he loves it, but because it allows him do things for himself and his family that they enjoy. I don't think fans should expect to tell him how to spend his money.

The only flaw I see in your otherwise well-reasoned point, Mazda, is that Fran & Margaret can do all those things & still pay the in-state tuition for Connors should he not be put on scholarship.

 

[SDHawkDoc]

I disagree with the argument that Fran's kids shouldn't receive a schollie if they otherwise would based on their talent.

However, I don't think that's an argument that's being made.

What I've read in the threads is an OPTION that Fran would have to possibly open up a schollie by paying for his kid's tuition. Big difference.

 

[DanL53]

Could Fran pay Conner's way? SURE. Or he could go on scholarship and buy himself or Conner a bass boat, a collector car, jet ski's, an ATV, buy an annuity, give to a special charity or..........

Just because Fran makes a lot of money he still is working not only because he loves it, but because it allows him do things for himself and his family that they enjoy. I don't think fans should expect to tell him how to spend his money.

I agree Mazda. It's entirely up to McCaffery. No expectations on my part. I also don't think it is "vital" to bring in another player in 2017. I'm very much liking the looks of the team. I'm of the opinion that Fran has things well in hand and recruiting will be well handled.

 

[CanadaHawk]

I agree with the fact that the McCaffery's should decide about Connor's scholarship. However, I think Fran COULD use the situation as his ace in the hole. Like most, I expect at least one departure by the end of this season. Fran can feel fairly confident in offering schollys and having at least one available for 2017. IF someone accepts a scholly and no one departs, he always has his ace in the hole, Connor's scholly.

In any case, Jones' 6th year means there will be a scholly available in 2018 for Wood, Ramey, Gordon, etc (Jones + Uhl = 2 - Wieskamp = 1).

 

[StormHawk42]

Not anyone's decision but Fran and Connor. Both as coach to player and father to son. We should all be able to live with whatever they decide.