Oct 31, 2022: Fran brings up putting Students behind the Benches (Beth wants students around the court). Future Renovation of Carver-Hawkeye Arena?

[Franisdaman]

It isn’t that much revenue boss. How much do honestly think those seats generate? And what percentage is that of the total athletic budget?

I was at the game last night and was actually shocked by how many people over the age of 60 occupy seats close to the action. It’s embarrassing. Sure, if you have the money it’s yours to spend but I’d block even allowing the gray hairs to buy their way in. No reason that they can’t enjoy the game just as much from row 15 and up.

And to his point, I wonder how many folks that actually donated to the renovation still go or are still alive. I bet it isn’t that many

the problem is that the people with the seats behind the benches donated a lot for the most recent renovations. And they apparently are still alive, because Fran brings them up in the interview in the orig post, stating that there would need to be discussions on where they could be moved to. And would they be willing to be moved?

 

[Franisdaman]

You would think with the design of Carver, older people would want to be higher up to avoid all those stairs. Is there another arena in the country that has more continuous stairs than Carver? It’s a hike from row 1 to the top exit. You’d think older people would want to be closer to restrooms too.

unfortunately they made the arena on the cheap, imo. it definitely would have helped to have tunnel access half way up. and, unfortunately, the arena was built without thinking about/including luxury suites

 

[libertyhawkeye]

unfortunately they made the arena on the cheap, imo. it definitely would have helped to have tunnel access half way up. and, unfortunately, the arena was built without thinking about/including luxury suites

I don't think Carver was built cheap, UNLV's arena was opened the same year and cost nearly 50% more. It's just when visioning a modern basketball arena in 1978-79 when Carver was planned, they did not value the luxury seating areas and amenities like they do today. It was largely about total seats.

 

[Franisdaman]

I don't think Carver was built cheap, UNLV's arena was opened the same year and cost nearly 50% more. It's just when visioning a modern basketball arena in 1978-79 when Carver was planned, they did not value the luxury seating areas and amenities like they do today. It was largely about total seats.

My point was that having a midlevel concourse and upper level concourse would have cost more. IMO, it was unfortunately they did not do this.

IIRC, Lute Olson wanted CHA's design similar to The Pit (New Mexico's arena), which
reportedly has a playing floor 37 feet below street level.

 

[libertyhawkeye]

If the student section encroaches into existing high-value donor seating, there will have to be some plan to keep the donors happy while they presumably move to other areas of Carver. Iowa wants to ensure they keep getting those checks.

My good idea fairy for years is Iowa should add luxury box type seating along the sidelines. Not like in Champaign where the private boxes eat up the middle of the bowl seating. These should be built atop of the concourse. Benefits: Easy access from street level, no stairs for older folks or those with disabilities. Constructability too. This can be done with only removing a handful rows of seating. Relatively simple to build because you would not need to alter the structural components of CHA; the roof is supported by the massive columns along the concourse. While this idea would encroach on and narrow the existing concourse, you can still expand the concourse similar to what Hilton recently did. This means build out the concourse on the west side, and the east side to Elliot Drive and remove that East entrance. This can all be done without touching the roof. Would add hundreds of private, potentially enclosed, additional seating for your big donors. Downside: Proximity. You're far away from the court. But if the privacy, amenities, and exclusiveness is there, and Iowa basketball is good, people will pay.

Please see my 30 second chicken scratch.

 

[libertyhawkeye]

My point was that having a midlevel concourse and upper level concourse would have cost more. IMO, it was unfortunately they did not do this.

IIRC, Lute Olson wanted CHA's design similar to The Pit (New Mexico's arena), which
reportedly has a playing floor 37 feet below street level.

If you wanted a mid-level concourse Iowa would have selected a different site for basketball. Carver is built into a little valley and the arena was built within the general limitations of existing site conditions. To build a mid-level concourse that would require extensive additional excavation and structural support to keep the arena and the earth from collapsing onto it.

 

[ICWestfan]

LOL this thread. This war has been fought since CHA opened. Bottom line is the students will NEVER line the court, either opposite benches or behind benches. The reason is it creates an "unfair" disadvantage for the opponents that visit the arena. That came straight from a former ticket manager's mouth.

 

[Franisdaman]

LOL this thread. This war has been fought since CHA opened. Bottom line is the students will NEVER line the court, either opposite benches or behind benches. The reason is it creates an "unfair" disadvantage for the opponents that visit the arena. That came straight from a former ticket manager's mouth.

Never? Then why did Fran say they are having discussions about putting 800-1,000 students behind both benches?

 

[ICWestfan]

Never? Then why did Fran say they are having discussions about putting 800-1,000 students behind both benches?

I don't doubt that they are having "discussions". Maybe never was too strong of a word and I'll just say that that there is a certain faction in the TO that subscribes to "competitive balance" and they never want to see students anywhere near the opposing tams bench.

I'd be amazed if anything like that happens and will gladly eat my crow if it does.

 

[hooper56]

the problem is that the people with the seats behind the benches donated a lot for the most recent renovations. And they apparently are still alive, because Fran brings them up in the interview in the orig post, stating that there would need to be discussions on where they could be moved to. And would they be willing to be moved?

1. I donated. I am still alive. Sorry
2. I don't want to be moved. The Club seats come with other amenities which I enjoy.
3. I am all for improving the atmosphere in Carver but don't toss the contributors to the curb!
4. If or when students start occupying their sections then think about moving them. Fact is they don't care.

 

[Franisdaman]

1. I donated. I am still alive. Sorry
2. I don't want to be moved. The Club seats come with other amenities which I enjoy.
3. I am all for improving the atmosphere in Carver but don't toss the contributors to the curb!
4. If or when students start occupying their sections then think about moving them. Fact is they don't care.

what would you like to see happen at Carver?

Would suites at the top be popular, as another poster suggested?

why were schools like Michigan and Michigan State able to get students behind the benches where Iowa can't? Where did Michigan put their top donors?

 

[hooper56]

the problem is that the people with the seats behind the benches donated a lot for the most recent renovations. And they apparently are still alive, because Fran brings them up in the interview in the orig post, stating that there would need to be discussions on where they could be moved to. And would they be willing to be moved?

Apparently. I notice when I am standing, clapping and singing the fight song, the majority of the few students who attend are sitting on their hands.

If they would get an innovative marketing team, Carver would be full for every game. They are too interested in doing the same things year after year with the same people.

 

[Buckwatcher]

I've been saying this for years. Carver needs a total remodel for seating

 

[Hawkdiver]

I think it is always going to be a struggle to get students to games, regardless of where they are seated. My son is a freshman and asked me about season tickets, I advised him not to do it.

He lives in the west side dorms so it is easier for him but just getting to Carver is a barrier. From the west side you are looking at a 20 minute walk in the dead of winter. East side dorms is probably 50% - 100% longer when you factor in catching buses. Off campus students it is easily double that. A considerable amount of travel for a 2 hour game, in cold weather.

Add to that, midweek games are tough from a timing perspective as 6:00 tips would cause many to miss dinner in the dorms and possibly classes.

It is not like football where you can get several hours of tailgating, nice weather, always on a Saturday, and essentially a 7+ hour experience. An hour plus of travel for a 2 hour game that you can watch from the comfort of your room is something I don't see many students committing to regardless of how good their seats are.

 

[BBHawk]

I think it is always going to be a struggle to get students to games, regardless of where they are seated. My son is a freshman and asked me about season tickets, I advised him not to do it.

He lives in the west side dorms so it is easier for him but just getting to Carver is a barrier. From the west side you are looking at a 20 minute walk in the dead of winter. East side dorms is probably 50% - 100% longer when you factor in catching buses. Off campus students it is easily double that. A considerable amount of travel for a 2 hour game, in cold weather.

Add to that, midweek games are tough from a timing perspective as 6:00 tips would cause many to miss dinner in the dorms and possibly classes.

It is not like football where you can get several hours of tailgating, nice weather, always on a Saturday, and essentially a 7+ hour experience. An hour plus of travel for a 2 hour game that you can watch from the comfort of your room is something I don't see many students committing to regardless of how good their seats are.

CHA isn't that far to walk, especially when there are shuttles running regularly from the dorms to the arena. I did it as a student in the 80s and didn't feel put out. And not tailgating is a reason for not going? I guess some people just value things differently than I do.

 

[SI_NYC]

unfortunately they made the arena on the cheap, imo. it definitely would have helped to have tunnel access half way up. and, unfortunately, the arena was built without thinking about/including luxury suites

I was giving the architect too much credit thinking they designed Carver to keep the older people up top.

 

[retrodent]

View embedded media

The band and cheerleaders are the only students there. I doubt that changes

 

[Franisdaman]

I've been saying this for years. Carver needs a total remodel for seating

we have the money

just need to get some smart people together to figure it out

 

[Beattheohiostate]

its interesting Fran brings this up; hopefully this is part of ongoing discussions on making CHA more of a home court advantage

But what took so long? Fran should have demanded this change about 10 years ago. As usual, Iowa's Athletic Department is at least a decade behind top tier programs. And any decent AD would have done it long ago without a prompt from the head coach.

 

[tWarnerHawk]

I think it is always going to be a struggle to get students to games, regardless of where they are seated. My son is a freshman and asked me about season tickets, I advised him not to do it.

He lives in the west side dorms so it is easier for him but just getting to Carver is a barrier. From the west side you are looking at a 20 minute walk in the dead of winter. East side dorms is probably 50% - 100% longer when you factor in catching buses. Off campus students it is easily double that. A considerable amount of travel for a 2 hour game, in cold weather.

Add to that, midweek games are tough from a timing perspective as 6:00 tips would cause many to miss dinner in the dorms and possibly classes.

It is not like football where you can get several hours of tailgating, nice weather, always on a Saturday, and essentially a 7+ hour experience. An hour plus of travel for a 2 hour game that you can watch from the comfort of your room is something I don't see many students committing to regardless of how good their seats are.

Do you even like Iowa basketball?!?😜

 

[blhawk]

I think it is always going to be a struggle to get students to games, regardless of where they are seated. My son is a freshman and asked me about season tickets, I advised him not to do it.

He lives in the west side dorms so it is easier for him but just getting to Carver is a barrier. From the west side you are looking at a 20 minute walk in the dead of winter. East side dorms is probably 50% - 100% longer when you factor in catching buses. Off campus students it is easily double that. A considerable amount of travel for a 2 hour game, in cold weather.

Add to that, midweek games are tough from a timing perspective as 6:00 tips would cause many to miss dinner in the dorms and possibly classes.

It is not like football where you can get several hours of tailgating, nice weather, always on a Saturday, and essentially a 7+ hour experience. An hour plus of travel for a 2 hour game that you can watch from the comfort of your room is something I don't see many students committing to regardless of how good their seats are.

WTF? Well you're part of the problem then. Saying it's always going to be a struggle is just a clueless statement if you paid any attention to the 80's and 90's. The distance is just a pathetic excuse with how tiny IC is. I lived on the east side and had student tix with my friends every year. Granted, they made a sweet 16 while I was there and there weren't coach's kids who played over nba caliber players. Hopefully your kid doesn't listen to his lame old man.... You robbed him of some good memories and part of his college experience if he does.

Why are you even on this board?

 

[WestCoastHawkI]

CHA isn't that far to walk, especially when there are shuttles running regularly from the dorms to the arena. I did it as a student in the 80s and didn't feel put out. And not tailgating is a reason for not going? I guess some people just value things differently than I do.

I was curious if we had shuttles. How do they work? Do they make stops at all of the main dorms or is there a central pickup location?

 

[Kabby]

Most donors I know spend their time cheering at the games and giving their money to the U.

And learn how to spell.

this dude has no idea what he is talking about. Just going off of some old BS.

 

[Hawkdiver]

WTF? Well you're part of the problem then. Saying it's always going to be a struggle is just a clueless statement if you paid any attention to the 80's and 90's. The distance is just a pathetic excuse with how tiny IC is. I lived on the east side and had student tix with my friends every year. Granted, they made a sweet 16 while I was there and there weren't coach's kids who played over nba caliber players. Hopefully your kid doesn't listen to his lame old man.... You robbed him of some good memories and part of his college experience if he does.

Why are you even on this board?

I'm not part of the problem as we are talking about students, I am too many years removed to get student tickets. I'm not making excuses, I'm sharing the reality of today's college students. The fact that every game is on TV makes the inconvenience in getting to the arena that much larger, we didn't have every game in high def like they do today.

I earned my 4 letters at Iowa in the late 80's and early 90's so you might say I paid attention, hard not to when you are friends with over half of the starting 5.

Trust me, I have not robbed him of any of his college experience. He can get a ticket to any game he wants to/is able to go to, without feeling committed to make it to every game just because "I have season tickets".

 

[bobchawk]

I mean come on. I've been critical of aspects of Fran's coaching but this is silly. Fran was hired at the worst part of program history over the past 60 years. The job his current boss hired him to do was get the program to respectable and do so while not cheating.

Watch the podcast/show linked to in the first post here. Fran provides a reasoned response when asked about the student section. There are considerations about what donors were promised in the renovations for Carver. Want those people to not give again? Screw them over on seating.

I 100% agree, and it sounds like Fran does too, that they need to improve the experience at CHA. I am not convinced that giving the students the prime seats behind the opponent bench would bring them out in droves. It might for conference season, but I'm not totally convinced it would short of paying students to show up to the games. AD needs to look at all options like giving away student tickets, etc., to get students in the arena and loud.

It is not Fran's job to improve the game day experience or get students moved behind the bench. The AD needs to do whatever it takes to turn CHA into a decent place to watch a game.

I think it is Fran.s job to generate excitement for his teams and he has not done anything that I know of. Love him or hate him but Alford got the student groups involved and got the place rocking--remember Wigman?
Alford would have meetings with the students quite often at carver and buy them pizza--etc....
Fran is wanting the team to speak for itself and if they were perennial top 10 we might not have this student issue

 

[libertyhawkeye]

WTF? Well you're part of the problem then. Saying it's always going to be a struggle is just a clueless statement if you paid any attention to the 80's and 90's. The distance is just a pathetic excuse with how tiny IC is. I lived on the east side and had student tix with my friends every year. Granted, they made a sweet 16 while I was there and there weren't coach's kids who played over nba caliber players. Hopefully your kid doesn't listen to his lame old man.... You robbed him of some good memories and part of his college experience if he does.

Why are you even on this board?

What's with the hostility? I was a student when Fran took over and rebuilt the program to respectability and I was very interested in Iowa basketball. My floormates and friends across campus did not care so I did not go to many games. The rabid passion just isn't there.

There are factors that make going to Carver less than desirable. If that wasn't the case in the 80s, sorry, but these are some of the reasons...

Scheduling. Lots of late weekday evening games when students have classes. Typically boring home non-con schedule. Walking to Carver isn't ideal from the West side dorms because you have to walk out of the way around the hospital CW or CCW to get there, and a 15-20 minute walk in the cold to see Bethune Cookman doesn't excite the youth. There are more things to do in Iowa City today too. More students are content with being introverted and connected socially with their phones. HQ audio/picture TV quality so many students like myself just watched from the dorm or apartment. Results matter too. Iowa has done well under Fran relatively speaking but has not gone far in the tournament. A lot of low student support is underclassmen not buying season tickets as freshman. Students at Michigan State go out of their way to buy season tickets because they know whatever happens their program will be relevant and games will be a wild party atmosphere. So it's like a Catch-22. Students don't go to games largely because they don't think they're going to be fun, but they're not fun because students aren't going to games.

These are excuses to some but it's also just reality. Other schools have logistical challenges to attending games but their students turn out in droves. Some of them just have a stronger basketball culture, including some that have gone far consistently in March. I think that's the only thing that will make a significant change for Iowa student support. Then everyone else will stop complaining.

 

[BBHawk]

I was curious if we had shuttles. How do they work? Do they make stops at all of the main dorms or is there a central pickup location?

All kinds of routes and ways to get from point A to point B: https://transportation.uiowa.edu/cambus/routes
The buses run often and there are extras for special events link games. No reason for any kid (or adult!) not to go to a game. They are FREE.

 

[doughuddl2]

All kinds of routes and ways to get from point A to point B: https://transportation.uiowa.edu/cambus/routes
The buses run often and there are extras for special events link games. No reason for any kid (or adult!) not to go to a game. They are FREE.

Half the time they are late. 15-20 minutes. That gets old and the lines half way down the street.

 

[BBHawk]

Half the time they are late. 15-20 minutes. That gets old and the lines half way down the street.

They run every 15 minutes and they are late by 15-20 minutes? 😂 I have taken them many times without issues.

Leave a little earlier maybe...

 

[BDinIC]

It isn’t that much revenue boss. How much do honestly think those seats generate? And what percentage is that of the total athletic budget?

I was at the game last night and was actually shocked by how many people over the age of 60 occupy seats close to the action. It’s embarrassing. Sure, if you have the money it’s yours to spend but I’d block even allowing the gray hairs to buy their way in. No reason that they can’t enjoy the game just as much from row 15 and up.

And to his point, I wonder how many folks that actually donated to the renovation still go or are still alive. I bet it isn’t that many

So blue hairs can enjoy the game from rows 15 and up, but students can't? That's rich.

 

[BDinIC]

unfortunately they made the arena on the cheap, imo. it definitely would have helped to have tunnel access half way up. and, unfortunately, the arena was built without thinking about/including luxury suites

One of the major reasons it was built that way was for energy conservation. Damn environmentalists. 🙃

 

[Fighter of the Nightman]

So blue hairs can enjoy the game from rows 15 and up, but students can't? That's rich.

Every arena with a good atmosphere has the students ringing the court, and Carver will never compete in that aspect until they do the same. It’s fine if that’s not important to you, but it’s just how it is.

 

[Gus is dead]

So blue hairs can enjoy the game from rows 15 and up, but students can't? That's rich.

The students stand up, make noise, bring excitement. All the blue hairs bring is a change of underwear.

 

[Hawkfan_08]

I think it would ... and those students turn in to some of your most loyal season ticket holders and donors down the road.

That's me...

 

[Franisdaman]

WTF? Well you're part of the problem then. Saying it's always going to be a struggle is just a clueless statement if you paid any attention to the 80's and 90's. The distance is just a pathetic excuse with how tiny IC is. I lived on the east side and had student tix with my friends every year. Granted, they made a sweet 16 while I was there and there weren't coach's kids who played over nba caliber players. Hopefully your kid doesn't listen to his lame old man.... You robbed him of some good memories and part of his college experience if he does.

Why are you even on this board?

I still think if you feed the students a slice of pizza and give them a bottle of water you can get them to games. But that would require the Iowa marketing dept to line up a couple sponsors.

I hope they can figure out a seating arrangement in CHA that will get the students even further energized to come to games. If they got to sit behind the benches, they might line up outside the doors. The problem is that it seems like it takes forever for the Iowa administration to figure anything out.

 

[cidhawkeye]

If you wanted a mid-level concourse Iowa would have selected a different site for basketball. Carver is built into a little valley and the arena was built within the general limitations of existing site conditions. To build a mid-level concourse that would require extensive additional excavation and structural support to keep the arena and the earth from collapsing onto it.

The original plan for Hawkeye Arena was for that location and with a mid level concourse. The initial plan didn’t call for a donors name on it either. Fundraising didn’t go as well as hoped and the mid level concourse went and the Carver name was added.

 

[hawktech]

If you wanted a mid-level concourse Iowa would have selected a different site for basketball. Carver is built into a little valley and the arena was built within the general limitations of existing site conditions. To build a mid-level concourse that would require extensive additional excavation and structural support to keep the arena and the earth from collapsing onto it.

They could have a mezzanine/middle level concourse build into 1/2 to 2/3 of the stadium. Existing offices are on same level of where it would be located for almost half the arena, on the north side.

The opposite side would be more difficult, but possible. At least for a restroom and at least one concessions(beer) stand. Some horizontal digging may be necessary (need to see the arena design plans).

Having a walkway completely around the arena, for a middle concourse would wipe out a few rows, but so what. We rarely sell out, and making the game experience vastly improved would bring in people to fill some seats! Anything to get to some concessions, restrooms, adding an escalator for the old (and the lazy), would be HUGE.

The architect plans are available to the public information. They would be interesting to see... Who knows what is behind/underneath the seating of the stadium...?

 

[Franisdaman]

would students have shown up last night if they had seats behind the benches?

maybe it's time to let them in free

and i still think you should feed them pizza, for starters.....

free tickets, free food. why not?

 

[Rifler]

Yeah, I don't get how/why they ended up with the seats pushed SO far away from the court

Wrestling,.. The Carver athletic floor is sized to accommodate multiple mats and the accompanying accessory equipment for a conference meet.

 

[libertyhawkeye]

They could have a mezzanine/middle level concourse build into 1/2 to 2/3 of the stadium. Existing offices are on same level of where it would be located for almost half the arena, on the north side.

The opposite side would be more difficult, but possible. At least for a restroom and at least one concessions(beer) stand. Some horizontal digging may be necessary (need to see the arena design plans).

Having a walkway completely around the arena, for a middle concourse would wipe out a few rows, but so what. We rarely sell out, and making the game experience vastly improved would bring in people to fill some seats! Anything to get to some concessions, restrooms, adding an escalator for the old (and the lazy), would be HUGE.

The architect plans are available to the public information. They would be interesting to see... Who knows what is behind/underneath the seating of the stadium...?

Underneath the stadium seating is probably nothing. Compacted earth with stone, then a concrete slab.

would students have shown up last night if they had seats behind the benches?

maybe it's time to let them in free

and i still think you should feed them pizza, for starters.....

free tickets, free food. why not?

Offering more freebies may marginally help, but it's really a student interest issue. Students don't really care. Nearly every freshman buys football season tix, but they hold out on basketball and that apathy is sustained all 4 years old school. The reasons are plenty and have been discussed ad nauseum and there's always the chicken/egg argument, but enthusiasm for Iowa basketball culture is simply poor. The only certain thing to improve this is winning deeper in March.