As a class Iowa is about in the middle of the Big 10, though I can't find the Rivals team rankings for 2020
Payton Sandfort announcing October 1st
- Thread starter Blair Sanderson
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As a class Iowa is about in the middle of the Big 10, though I can't find the Rivals team rankings for 2020
9th is “about the middle”? Ok dude.
9th (55th nationally) with FIVE commits is not good. Only Nebraska and Penn State have lower average recruit rankings.
Is Fran a good coach? Yes.
Is he good enough to get these kind of teams to the tourney competing in the B1G Ten? I doubt it.
Time will tell.
To be brutally honest about it, seems like he’s mailed it in on these last few classes. Feels like he’s trying to get his kids through before he hangs it up.
Maybe not. Just seems like it.
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The conference has 14 teams. This one says 8th. https://bustingbrackets.com/2020/07/03/big-ten-basketball-analysing-each-programs-2020-classes/7/
Either the 5 signees point went over your head or you just want to avoid it because you have no response which is understandable.
p.s. from the article you linked: “Iowa Hawkeyes: No. 9 Big Ten, No. 55 Nation“
lol
Aww. Don’t take your ball and go away mad. You seem to think the last few years have been middle of the pack recruiting results. I think they have been worse than that.
The good thing about it is that we will know who’s right over the next few seasons.
You enjoy arguing by yourself too much. You are picking a fight with me and I have no idea why.
Our 2017 class was Luka, Connor, and Nunge.
Our 2018 class was Joe and CJ
Our 2019 class was JT and Pat.
According to Rivals, that's 4 four stars and 3 three stars, and most of what is making up of a top five team? Thinking that is "worse" than middle of the pack is just plain stupid. Take a break peep.
And the Murray twins went from not rated to 3-stars during the past season. WTF are you even talking about? You must not read much. If they weren't committed to us, others would have offered. Same goes for Perkins. Go back to kicking your dog or whatever else makes you happy.
lol
2017 9th in B1G 57th nationally
2018 12th in B1G 67th nationally
2019 11th in B1G 72d nationally
2020 9th in B1G 55th nationally
2021 We're currently a lock for a 3 star 150+ recruit -- that's it.
Math doesn't seem to be your strong suit so let me break it down for you -- that's an average of a little worse than 10th in the B1G and 63d nationally (it will go down when this class is done).
That is the very definition of worse than middle of the pack. You seem to think that because you believe e.g., JT and Pat are better than middle of the pack recruits, that it makes it so. The only reason you think these players are above average is because you don't who who anyone else is recruiting.
Now.... there's no question that Iowa has a pretty damn good team right now but let's be real -- if Garza doesn't way, way, WAY outperform his 120 ranking last year, what are you looking at? You're looking at an average team (at best) in the league and likely below average. Hell....we finished 5th with a national player of the year candidate on the roster. Even with Garza taking on the role of super hero, we won one more league game than we did the year before.
Players like Garza -- a guy who by sheer force of will makes himself into a phenom -- happen about once a generation.
That's all I'm saying. The '19, '20, '21 classes don't bode well for the future unless you're depending on extreme outlier development to happen every other class or so.
I don't think that's realistic.
...and that's why I'm planning on enjoying every minute of this season. I think it drops off after this. Hope I'm wrong.
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I think we need to remember that the virus has changed everything, including the number of opportunities there are for evaluating players.
IIRC, Perkins really had a great senior year and was in the running for the Indiana's POY award. The Murrays' didn't even get ranked by most services until recently. Ulis also had a great senior year that some pundits thought was well above his current ranking. Everyone knows who the top ten or twenty recruits are, but there are always surprises every season where kids out perform their rankings. Hopefully this class has a few of those.
IIRC, Perkins really had a great senior year and was in the running for the Indiana's POY award. The Murrays' didn't even get ranked by most services until recently. Ulis also had a great senior year that some pundits thought was well above his current ranking. Everyone knows who the top ten or twenty recruits are, but there are always surprises every season where kids out perform their rankings. Hopefully this class has a few of those.
Some players out perform their rankings. Some players under perform their rankings. No question about that.
However, team success typically tracks recruiting class rankings. No way around it. If you find yourself counting on recruits to outperform their rankings every season, you're in trouble, because that ain't happening. The virus was the same for everyone. Using it to argue that this class is somehow under rated compared with the rest is nothing more than a sad coping strategy.
I think people are just trying to be optimistic. I agree that Fran's recruiting has been subpar for the B1G Ten. Iowa has had to rely too heavily on guys like Dom Uhl, Brady Ellingson, Maishe Dailey, etc. to "develop," and it has been that kind of depth where mediocre recruiting has been the most glaring.
I'm trying to be optimistic about this season, but I also know how Iowa teams with lofty expectations in the past have performed. This year is especially problematic because it seems anything short of a conference championship and a Final Four appearance is a failure. I don't see it that way, but I know how many Iowa fans are.
The question you pose is not without merit. How far will the drop be after this season? Time will tell, but I share the same concerns. The hope is Iowa has a remarkable year which carries over to recruiting success. If it does, Iowa can be a legitimate Top 25 program with the occasional mediocre season and rebuilding year. If recruiting stays the same, Iowa falls toward the lower tier of the middle of the pack (8-10 range) in the conference and goes to the NIT most years. I don't think that will be palatable to most fans. Again, time will tell.
Outside of the Woodbury/Gesell class, I feel like Fran’s strategy has almost always been to recruit under the radar/late bloomers. More often than not, it works when he gets his top targets, and fails when he has to settle for fallback recruits. As far as I can tell, at least some in the 2020 class, guys like CJF/Toussaint, as well as Sandfort are among Fran’s top choices for those classes and hasn’t had to settle for all fallback recruits. 2014 was a mess of a recruiting class where Fran missed on seemingly everybody (including Ulis) and he missed on several other big time players in 2015, including OG Anunoby who we all thought we had a great shot at until Indiana swooped in with an offer. All this to say, I remain optimistic despite Iowa’s recruiting rankings
With guys like Ulis, Perkins, Toussaint, Fredrick and Weiskamp, McCaffery, Murray twins. Not sure why this is a bad pickup at all for Iowa. A 6-8 guy that can straight drain the 3 is pretty valuable with other talent like that around them.
I’m trying to think of guys with this size and skill set that Fran has missed on and the only one who comes to mind is Kyle Meyer, and that’s not even close to an apples to apples comparison. Dale Jones maybe? Same deal there though
I like Toussaint's play and Iowa got more out of him than I expected as he showed flashes of developing an outside shot. But I believe if you go back and look at PG offers, he was a great example of a fallback recruit. By that I mean there were several others Fran offered first that chose to go elsewhere before he offered Joe. CJF well out performed his recruiting rankings, and is likely a good example of what a redshirt year can do for development with the team. He is a case where a timely injury actually may have helped his career.
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I don’t remember many others that Iowa had a great shot at landing aside from Carton. I pretty much remember that it was he, and then Fran was willing to take any of Toussaint, Bryan Greenlee (ended up choosing Minnesota), and Yuri Collins (ended up at SLU). Technically a fallback, yes, but also a guy Fran was in on relatively early in the process and really liked, which might be a better way to put it than fallback vs non fallback
I misremember a lot, so I’m sure somebody will correct me if that’s the case
And Toussaint was very unlike any PG recruit he had landed previously. Perhaps a fallback, but I'm not complaining.
Totally derailing the thread now, but this popped up on the timeline a bit ago
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Discussing fallback recruiting should not be misconstrued as fans not valuing Joe T. He earned respect with his play last season. He wasn't a late scrub to fill out the practice roster, but by most definitions he was indeed a fall back recruit. For last year Iowa had at least 6 offers for PG.
Carton was clearly the #1 candidate, but there was lots of talk about Tyrell Terry who went to Standford. Joe wasn't offered until the very end of July and a couple of others were offered around the same time. There was even discussion if Iowa should still take a PG with what was on the roster and most higher rated recruits off the board for Iowa. Not sure where you get "on really early in the process" unless you are saying he saw him play early. He certainly didn't offer early.
Iowa Basketball Recruiting: Bettendorf’s Five-Star PG DJ Carton Trims List to 3, Eliminates Hawkeyes
The Hawkeyes search for the PG of their future now likely leads outside the state’s borders.
www.blackheartgoldpants.com
I didn’t feel as though he was being devalued by anybody. I thought he had been offered earlier, so I was wrong in that regard, though do know that both Fran and Pat were well aware of Toussaint long prior to the time of offering as Pat had competed against Joe in AAUDiscussing fallback recruiting should not be misconstrued as fans not valuing Joe T. He earned respect with his play last season. He wasn't a late scrub to fill out the practice roster, but by most definitions he was indeed a fall back recruit. For last year Iowa had at least 6 offers for PG.
Carton was clearly the #1 candidate, but there was lots of talk about Tyrell Terry who went to Standford. Joe wasn't offered until the very end of July and a couple of others were offered around the same time. There was even discussion if Iowa should still take a PG with what was on the roster and most higher rated recruits off the board for Iowa. Not sure where you get "on really early in the process" unless you are saying he saw him play early. He certainly didn't offer early.
Iowa Basketball Recruiting: Bettendorf’s Five-Star PG DJ Carton Trims List to 3, Eliminates Hawkeyes
The Hawkeyes search for the PG of their future now likely leads outside the state’s borders.
I’m a fanatic for basketball recruiting and I get what Raptor is saying... I get really disappointed when we miss on the top players. I want classes rated in the top tier of the B10 because that is the foundation for success at the highest levels.
That said, look where our current team ranks. Most pick us between 1st and 3rd in the conference....top 10 in the country. That doesn’t happen without talent.
I am haunted by the last big class where Moss was the top recruit? BUT that doesn’t mean that’s what this class will be.
We really need two starter level recruits per year that can play at a high level....and Fran has shown that he can spot under the radar talent. I would always love to have the highly rated recruits, but I feel like we’re in pretty good shape both now and next year.
That said, look where our current team ranks. Most pick us between 1st and 3rd in the conference....top 10 in the country. That doesn’t happen without talent.
I am haunted by the last big class where Moss was the top recruit? BUT that doesn’t mean that’s what this class will be.
We really need two starter level recruits per year that can play at a high level....and Fran has shown that he can spot under the radar talent. I would always love to have the highly rated recruits, but I feel like we’re in pretty good shape both now and next year.
Iowa is a developmental school. The recruiting footprint is small. Doesn't have a recent tradition of NCAA success. Nor does it have outside help from non-university affiliated individuals. So recruiting rankings isn't going to be high.
Iowa could try to hire another dynamic coach like Alford. Who put together a couple highly rated recruiting classes in his first 3 yrs. But that didn't turn out well.
Iowa could try to hire another dynamic coach like Alford. Who put together a couple highly rated recruiting classes in his first 3 yrs. But that didn't turn out well.
He'll have to "mail it in for awhile" considering Jacks only in 8th grade currently......
did produce 2 BigTen Tournament Championships and 1 Runner-up. However it was a character issue with one of his star recruits that sidetracked his tenure and the program.
lol
Take a deep breath, soy boy. Unclench you’re wittle fists and wipe you’re eyes. Everything is going to be ok.
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lol
While I have no doubt that son 3 deserves a scholarship every bit as much as sons 1 and 2... seems unlikely to me. I’m sure he’ll end up at Duke or Kentucky or in MLB.
You're literally jumping back and forth with no argument. If our recruits didn't turn out so good, they wouldn't be good. No sh**. You're opinion of how our recruiting classes turn out, stop the minute they walk onto a college campus? This seems like great reasoning. How some fat middle aged guy sitting on a website, not having seen 90% of these highschool players ranks a guy, shouldn't outweigh a college coaching staffs evaluation. Recruiting rankings are just for fun, and mean very little outside the top 25-50 players. Most of us realize a recruiting class is judged when they complete their careers, some do not.
You think he is that good or are saying it in jest? That class has 3 talented kids in it for the state of Iowa. Levar Woods son, Weiskamps brother, and the youngest McCaffery.
I don't know, You tell me. They attended a sports academy that played other sports academies, many with highly rated players. They certainly had many opportunities to be seen and I seem to remember seeing a lot of articles praising their play against pretty decent teams.
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