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Roster assessment with advanced metric

CP84

HB Heisman
Sep 10, 2013
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Here's a look at the roster using win shares per 40.

Jok .203; He has an outstanding 7.5 offensive box +/- but a poor -1.0 defensive sum. The inability to play defense at a high level will probably relegate him to being a JR Smith type shooter off the bench in the NBA as a ceiling.

Baer .166; Not surprising that he is ranked #2 on the team. He is a jack of all trades type player. He also has the highest defensive box score on the team at 5.7.

Kreiner .147; Hopefully the positive takeaway for Fran this weekend is Kreiner factoring into the regular rotation more frequently going forward. His ability to spread the floor should create some mismatches for opposing 5's.

Pemsl .137; He's a solid all around post that can play the 5 in stretches but better suited at the 4.

Ellingson .128; A little hard to believe but he has the highest true shooting % on the team at .713. He also leads the team in 3pt% at a very good .485. He doesn't take a lot of bad shots. He's an ideal 7-8 guy.

Daily .105; with only 73 minutes played it's a small sample size to make an accurate assessment. I think his play should warrant some additional opportunity at the wing.

Cook .104; he's a fine offensive post player but he has limitations in other areas of his game that negatively impact his total. For one thing, his rebound percentage is actual lower than Jok's. His block percentage is lower than Moss'. His assist percentage is almost non-existent. For the things he does well offensively in the post, there are things he needs to work on in the other areas of his game.

Wagner .104; essentially the opposite of Cook. He does well defensively, has a solid assist block and steal percentage. His rebounding percentage leaves plenty of room for improvement and he's very limited offensively.

Bohannon .073; I expected him to be higher. His PER is only 11.4 which is 10th on the team. His steal percentage is 11th on the team which is disappointing for a pg. His rebound percentage is 13th, only higher than Ellingson. His defensive box score +/- is last on the team if you don't count Charlie Rose and his 8 minutes. He certainly has a lot of potential if he can learn to play adequate defense.

Moss .067; 11.6 PER which is disappointing for a starting 2. His rebounding percentage is on par with Bohannon and his steal percentage is on par with Ellingson. You would expect a better athlete to be improved in those areas. The good news is that Devyn Marble was a terrible .052 WS/40 his freshman year and improved to .122 by his second season. Hopefully Moss can follow that same trajectory.

Uhl .051; There's just not much to like here. His defensive box +/- is a serviceable 1.2 but his offensive score is -1.9. He's basically fallen back to his freshman year advanced stats after a solid sophomore season (WS/40 .122). His PER (10.4) is the worst of anyone getting decent minutes not named Christian Williams. His turnover % is 2nd worst on the team.

Williams .032; There's no real positive way to spin this. He leads the team in turnovers %. His PER is an atrocious 8.0. If we had something else on this team resembling a backup pg, I would give serious consideration to moving him to the 2 and see if he can improve when he's not the primary ball handler. The problem there is that he's still a bad shooter with the worst true shooting % on the team. The one positive thing is that his defensive box +/- actual shows a respectable defensive sum. He's just such a trainwreck offensively that it doesn't matter. Maybe the long-term solution would be a move to the wing as a defensive specialist, essentially what we thought Brandon Hutton would be.


My thoughts on the rotation.

I don't think playing Cook/Pemsl together for extended minutes is the best option. Against smaller lineups it might be ok but not generally.

I'd like to see a starting 5 of

Bohannon
Jok
Baer
Pemsl
Kreiner

Cook and Moss would be the first off the bench.

Some may think it's crazy to play Cook in the 2nd unit but I disagree for now. I think Pemsl creates much bigger mismatches against 4s than he does 5s while Kreiner gives more length inside and also creates mismatches against opposing 5s with his ability to space the floor with his shot. Cook is an offensive spark that right now is limited in other areas of the game. I'd like to see his offensive ability get leveraged in the second unit.

I also like the idea of Jok and Baer starting on the wings with Moss off the bench. Baer is arguably the best all around player (not to be mistaken as best overall). A starting unit of JaBo, Jok and Baer would be a tough back court to defend. Moss could be used in a flex role off the bench.
 
The sports reference cbb site. It's the equivalent of the NBA basketball reference site.
 
I thought we had Baer at the 3 and Jok at the 2 vs Seton Hall and the Seton Hall guards just took it to the rack or shot open 3ball shots at will.

You can get away with Baer at 3 part of the time depending on lineups the opponent puts on the floor.
 
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I thought we had Baer at the 3 and Jok at the 2 vs Seton Hall and the Seton Hall guards just took it to the rack or shot open 3ball shots at will.

You can get away with Baer at 3 part of the time depending on lineups the opponent puts on the floor.

They also had Christian Williams and Dom Uhl starting and playing a combined 49 minutes while Pemsl and Moss combined for 8 minutes. That was probably the more significant problem in that game. Pemsl had 5 rebounds in only 6 minutes.

Jok scored 30 points at the two and Baer had 3 steals and 2 blocks against only 1 TO at the 3.

Seton Hall's 1st unit literally did nothing from beyond the arc. Carrington was 1/5 for 3.

In the second half, Myles Powell came off the bench and hit a bunch of threes.
 
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I knew Pemsl and Cook weren't going to be very effective together at this point in their development.

They dont compliment eachother offensively and they dont help eachothers defensive weaknesses.

Kreiner needs to be getting primary minutes as the 5.
 
Teams would still guard Pemsl with their biggest player using your lineup.

Pemsl and Cook have both shown an awareness for each other on the court. They connected several times in the Purdue game and in other B1G games. I think teams respect Jok/Bohannon/Moss and give both space. I don't think they made the most of their chances yesterday. I think any two of Cook/Pemsl/Kriener could work together.

Baer's weakness as a defender is more highlighted playing the 3. Seton hall did little from three because they blew by everyone, including Nicholas.

Is there anyway for you to separate these statistics into conference play only?
 
Is there anyway for you to separate these statistics into conference play only?

This information is provided but with only a half dozen games the sample size is too small to be taken with value. Here it is though:

Kreiner: .144
Jok: .106
Baer: .100
Cook: .086
Dailey: .077
JaBo: .073
Ellingson: .048
Uhl: .043
Wagner: .011
Pemsl: .008
Moss: -.032
Williams: -.061

Whether or not Cook or Pemsl start doesn't matter too much for me. I just believe Kreiner should be given the opportunity to be the primary 5. Cook and Pemsl will likely eventually be put exclusively at the 4 anyway with the development of Kreiner and addition of Garza. Personally I would rather see Cook come off the bench and add scoring to the second unit.

I disagree with you about Cook/Pemsl being the starters. Pemsl has been taken advantage of playing the 5.
 
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Teams would still guard Pemsl with their biggest player using your lineup.

Pemsl and Cook have both shown an awareness for each other on the court. They connected several times in the Purdue game and in other B1G games. I think teams respect Jok/Bohannon/Moss and give both space. I don't think they made the most of their chances yesterday. I think any two of Cook/Pemsl/Kriener could work together.

Baer's weakness as a defender is more highlighted playing the 3. Seton hall did little from three because they blew by everyone, including Nicholas.

Is there anyway for you to separate these statistics into conference play only?

We dont know how teams will choose to defend Iowa with Kreiner at the 5. They likely dont know.

We dont how good RK is on the block.
 
If I were in Fran's shoes, I would start Kriener the rest of the season to give us a pick and pop shooter on the floor. I like Cook and Pemsl, but neither of them are pick and pop guys and teams sag in the paint daring them to shoot it. Teams will have to guard Kriener or give him wide open looks and I like his % if they do. Cook or Pemsl need to be on the floor at all times.

Next I draw up some sets to get Bohannon or Moss some open looks early. Use Jok to draw attention and slip these guys off some ball screens to get them engaged. Iowa is a different team when more than Jok is involved offensively. Jok will get his shots and won't have to shoulder so much of the load.

Second unit is Baer, Pemsl, Williams, Dailey and Wagner or Uhl. Slap the full or half court pressure on and use the length of Williams, Dailey and Baer to ball hawk with Pemsl and whoever else down low. Try get some tips / deflections against likely the other team's second unit. Baer and Pemsl are crafty guys with ball who can find each other. Williams,, Dailey and Uhl or Wagner can crash the glass. Not exactly 40 minutes of hell, but maybe 5 minutes of disruptive chaos.

IMO, there is no reason Dailey is wasting on the bench. He cannot be worse defensively than all the other guards and his length alone has the potential to get a couple blocks and rebounds. Ellingson is back to being a non-factor offensively and is a major liability defensively. Time to see if Dailey can contribute more if given some PT.
 
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We dont know how teams will choose to defend Iowa with Kreiner at the 5. They likely dont know.

We dont how good RK is on the block.
We're starting to know what RK can do away from the hoop. We know what TC and CP can do underneath it. Sounds like a good fit.

Who knows the minutes. But it's obvious to me that RK and Garza were recruited for one position underneath and TC and CP for the other. Nunge is another kind of talent, in the White/Uthoff mold, who appears to have the shoulders to be physical like White with some shooting like JU and driving ability like both. Looking forward to the ride.
 
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Props to the OP. Interesting thread. Only disclaimer: can a short burst really always translate into 40 minutes? So far this year, the following players have had amazing ten-minute spurts in which they dominated the stats: Jok (of course), Pemsl, Cook, Kriener, Bohannon, Uhl, Moss, and Baer (and Ellingson, sort of). Hmmm. That's eight or nine guys that did what Ryan K did against Northwestern in a short period of time. That's great because many of these spurts are what won some games. I'll leave it up to Fran to decide who plays the minutes. But, since Ryan K has joined that "elite" group, he will get more minutes. (I think the reason he shot well was because he shaved his chin, actually. That caused his head and eyes to move .0000008 mm. upward, improving the accuracy of his shot.)
 
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Ellingson has a role as closer with his FT shooting. I think he is pretty skilled shooting wise, his passing is solid, but his handles are poor. With his lack of athleticism, he can't get his shot off and can't defend. He's not getting a lot of minutes, but I don't see how Maishe Dailey doesn't offer more upside and deserve some of those minutes.

NW had 6'5 Scott Lindsey and 6'7 Vic Law and they smothered Jok and our guards on defense and killed us with 3pt shooting. Maishe Dailey is more in that mold of player than Ellingson.
 
Ellingson has a role as closer with his FT shooting. I think he is pretty skilled shooting wise, his passing is solid, but his handles are poor. With his lack of athleticism, he can't get his shot off and can't defend. He's not getting a lot of minutes, but I don't see how Maishe Dailey doesn't offer more upside and deserve some of those minutes.

NW had 6'5 Scott Lindsey and 6'7 Vic Law and they smothered Jok and our guards on defense and killed us with 3pt shooting. Maishe Dailey is more in that mold of player than Ellingson.
Smothered is a very appropriate description. ELL needs to hit the floor more when the opponent is weak on closing out and Moss / Dailey need to be there when they are closing out.
As far as the bigs go it appears Uhl is hurt so the three mentioned need to get rotated around alot with each other .They all have game but also weakness that needs improvement.
For some reason when Pete dogs it on D the whole team does. Here's to hoping we had some flu or something going through the team that day because they haven't played that bad a D for quite some time now.
 
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This is going to be an NIT bubble team type of season, so let's see what guys can do. Dailey can play 2-4, so put the dude out there and see if he can contribute more than Ellingson, Williams, Uhl, etc. If nothing else, he is a taller, quicker, more athletic defender and rebounder. I would have put him after McIntosh's 10th blow by easy basket / assist to see if his length could slow him down.

It is puzzling why he didn't play at all in a lopsided loss. It would seem the perfect time to put the kid in and let him get some reps.
 
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Fran needs to find a high quality (real) pg to bring in for next year, juco or high school. Having to rely on an injured JBo shows just how weak Iowa is in the back court this year, imo. The Hawks will have a powerful front court tandem for quite some time into the future, but Moss/Dailey are the only 2g's that can compete and JBo is the only pg (who is really more of a 2g). This squad can be real good, if Fran gets a high quality pg to run the show. Jmo.
 
The one piece we are missing (that Fran tried to address with Hutton) is a lockdown defender at the guard/wing spot. If we can find that in the next year or two, we could be even better than what I think our team can be. We have a lot of nice pieces, but that one would really help a lot.

I love Bohannon, Moss, Ellingson, and Baer. But, I wouldn't decribe any of them as lockdown defenders at this point. Maybe Dailey could evolve into that. Who knows.
 
Here's a look at the roster using win shares per 40.

Jok .203; He has an outstanding 7.5 offensive box +/- but a poor -1.0 defensive sum. The inability to play defense at a high level will probably relegate him to being a JR Smith type shooter off the bench in the NBA as a ceiling.

Baer .166; Not surprising that he is ranked #2 on the team. He is a jack of all trades type player. He also has the highest defensive box score on the team at 5.7.

Kreiner .147; Hopefully the positive takeaway for Fran this weekend is Kreiner factoring into the regular rotation more frequently going forward. His ability to spread the floor should create some mismatches for opposing 5's.

Pemsl .137; He's a solid all around post that can play the 5 in stretches but better suited at the 4.

Ellingson .128; A little hard to believe but he has the highest true shooting % on the team at .713. He also leads the team in 3pt% at a very good .485. He doesn't take a lot of bad shots. He's an ideal 7-8 guy.

Daily .105; with only 73 minutes played it's a small sample size to make an accurate assessment. I think his play should warrant some additional opportunity at the wing.

Cook .104; he's a fine offensive post player but he has limitations in other areas of his game that negatively impact his total. For one thing, his rebound percentage is actual lower than Jok's. His block percentage is lower than Moss'. His assist percentage is almost non-existent. For the things he does well offensively in the post, there are things he needs to work on in the other areas of his game.

Wagner .104; essentially the opposite of Cook. He does well defensively, has a solid assist block and steal percentage. His rebounding percentage leaves plenty of room for improvement and he's very limited offensively.

Bohannon .073; I expected him to be higher. His PER is only 11.4 which is 10th on the team. His steal percentage is 11th on the team which is disappointing for a pg. His rebound percentage is 13th, only higher than Ellingson. His defensive box score +/- is last on the team if you don't count Charlie Rose and his 8 minutes. He certainly has a lot of potential if he can learn to play adequate defense.

Moss .067; 11.6 PER which is disappointing for a starting 2. His rebounding percentage is on par with Bohannon and his steal percentage is on par with Ellingson. You would expect a better athlete to be improved in those areas. The good news is that Devyn Marble was a terrible .052 WS/40 his freshman year and improved to .122 by his second season. Hopefully Moss can follow that same trajectory.

Uhl .051; There's just not much to like here. His defensive box +/- is a serviceable 1.2 but his offensive score is -1.9. He's basically fallen back to his freshman year advanced stats after a solid sophomore season (WS/40 .122). His PER (10.4) is the worst of anyone getting decent minutes not named Christian Williams. His turnover % is 2nd worst on the team.

Williams .032; There's no real positive way to spin this. He leads the team in turnovers %. His PER is an atrocious 8.0. If we had something else on this team resembling a backup pg, I would give serious consideration to moving him to the 2 and see if he can improve when he's not the primary ball handler. The problem there is that he's still a bad shooter with the worst true shooting % on the team. The one positive thing is that his defensive box +/- actual shows a respectable defensive sum. He's just such a trainwreck offensively that it doesn't matter. Maybe the long-term solution would be a move to the wing as a defensive specialist, essentially what we thought Brandon Hutton would be.


My thoughts on the rotation.

I don't think playing Cook/Pemsl together for extended minutes is the best option. Against smaller lineups it might be ok but not generally.

I'd like to see a starting 5 of

Bohannon
Jok
Baer
Pemsl
Kreiner

Cook and Moss would be the first off the bench.

Some may think it's crazy to play Cook in the 2nd unit but I disagree for now. I think Pemsl creates much bigger mismatches against 4s than he does 5s while Kreiner gives more length inside and also creates mismatches against opposing 5s with his ability to space the floor with his shot. Cook is an offensive spark that right now is limited in other areas of the game. I'd like to see his offensive ability get leveraged in the second unit.

I also like the idea of Jok and Baer starting on the wings with Moss off the bench. Baer is arguably the best all around player (not to be mistaken as best overall). A starting unit of JaBo, Jok and Baer would be a tough back court to defend. Moss could be used in a flex role off the bench.

I agree. I like Baer starting. Always have. Why have that energy and all-around basketball skill & intelligence come off the bench, instead of at the starting gun? Why wait until when we are down 10-2 four minutes into the game?? Get that baller on the floor from the opening tip!

Still too small of a sample size for Kriener. But I am really liking what I see with the extended minutes. Had he played more earlier in the season, he would be, well, more seasoned. Now he is playing catchup. More PT will do that. He should make some significant improvements in the next couple weeks. Stay tuned...

Moss & Cook off the bench sounds great to me. Have those two observe the game for a couple minutes on the bench, get a feel for the game and their assignments, then set them loose! They both play with good energy. They would be good bench players, IMHO.

I would have Ellingson, Wagner & Uhl finish my rotation.... Williams need a shot of confidence. If he can find it, bring it.... Dailey could be a Kriener, if we could only play him. My guess is he explodes on the scene. Unfortunately it will be next year. We will see!

Go Hawks!
 
My disappointment started when Fran did not take advantage of the spots opened up when Hutton and Fleming left. He had to hit on 1 of 2 with an impact PG and didn't. I don't recall the exact sequence of events, but if memory serves, we ended up with Dailey and Bohannon.

Lots to like about Bohannon, but a starting B1G PG he is not. Essentially he is a better shooting and less athletic version of Gesell, so it ends up being a wash IMO. I thought Dailey as a late get signaled Fran's awakening about our guard issues, but that was clearly not the case. Williams' struggles came as a surprise to us, but could not have emerged when the season started. I don't know what Fran saw in the off season to give him confidence that Williams could run the team. That lasted all of what, 6 games?
 
Circling back to my original idea of rotating Kreiner Cook and Pemsyl at 5/4. Bring Pemsyl in for Kreiner at 5, then Cook at 4. The Bear Trap plays all over the floor. Can see Wagner with some match up benefits. Uhl's fallen off the map, the three freshmen are all better.

Bohannon plays til he drops or fouls to the bench. Williams brings the offensive to a stop and appears to have no shot. Happy to see Dailey tried at that position as Bohannon's reserve.

Ellingson does need to start hitting again. He has improved and looks to be continuing to his overall game. He and Williams have gone in different directions. If the younger McC is the player some say he is both Ellingson and Williams will see far fewer minutes so now is the time to make some progress.

The middle gets crowded next year but that is a very good problem to have. There are going to be a lot of shots and points to replace for having only one senior.
 
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