The (heartbreaking) final play . . .

[AuroraHawk]

After subjecting myself to a number of replays this morning, I'm left with the impression that there had to be a mix-up by PSU's receivers. I can't think of a reason why you'd have two receivers in the same area of the field. All that does is draw defenders together . . . .

And, if my thoughts are correct, it makes the final play even more heartbreaking. McSorley threaded the needle and stabbed the Hawks (and their fans) right in the heart.

 

[hawkbleeder]

After subjecting myself to a number of replays this morning, I'm left with the impression that there had to be a mix-up by PSU's receivers. I can't think of a reason why you'd have two receivers in the same area of the field. All that does is draw defenders together . . . .

And, if my thoughts are correct, it makes the final play even more heartbreaking. McSorley threaded the needle and stabbed the Hawks (and their fans) right in the heart.

If Hooker just gets another inch on that vertical....or if PSU completes the previous pass and time runs out...ugh. Once PSU made it inside the red zone though I think we all knew...

 

[AuroraHawk]

If Hooker just gets another inch on that vertical....or if PSU completes the previous pass and time runs out...ugh. Once PSU made it inside the red zone though I think we all knew...

Didn't PSU have a time out left? If PSU completes the pass, they just call a time out.

 

[hawkbleeder]

Didn't PSU have a time out left? If PSU completes the pass, they just call a time out.

Not at that point, they were out...

 

[Hawkfan_08]

Not at that point, they were out...

Not trying to be argumentative but they did have one more TO. Remember they called a to with the clock stopped on 4th down.

 

[hawkbleeder]

Not trying to be argumentative but they did have one more TO. Remember they called a to with the clock stopped on 4th down.

I don't think that's correct but am open to being wrong...Herbie is the one who mentioned it/that PSU caught a break by not completing that pass on the second to last play...my bro was texting this to me while I was at the game and I thought I glanced up to see PSU with no TO's at that point.

 

[Kurt Warner]

Not trying to be argumentative but they did have one more TO. Remember they called a to with the clock stopped on 4th down.

Nope there were out, unless they get 4 because they're penn state

 

[hawkcub]

I don't think that's correct but am open to being wrong...Herbie is the one who mentioned it/that PSU caught a break by not completing that pass on the second to last play...my bro was texting this to me while I was at the game and I thought I glanced up to see PSU with no TO's at that point.

They had a timeout left they used on the final play. The question is would 4 seconds have ran off if the past was completed.

 

[Hawkfan_08]

http://www.espn.com/college-football/playbyplay?gameId=400935360

I don't think that's correct but am open to being wrong...Herbie is the one who mentioned it/that PSU caught a break by not completing that pass on the second to last play...my bro was texting this to me while I was at the game and I thought I glanced up to see PSU with no TO's at that point.

All good. I did look it up and on the play by play from ESPN it shows the timeout taken with 4 seconds left. Franklin also said on the post game they called it to get exactly what they wanted.

 

[hawkbleeder]

They had a timeout left they used on the final play. The question is would 4 seconds have ran off if the past was completed.

Herbie said he would be tackled immediately...which wouldn't jive with his theory of them catching a break (if they had another TO).

 

[AuroraHawk]

I don't think that's correct but am open to being wrong...Herbie is the one who mentioned it/that PSU caught a break by not completing that pass on the second to last play...my bro was texting this to me while I was at the game and I thought I glanced up to see PSU with no TO's at that point.

Then Herbstreit lost track of how many TOs PSU had left.

I thought that PSU would put the ball in Barkley's hands on a running play on 3rd down because they had a TO to play with at that point.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Glad they ran that story about the final play because it exposes what Taylor needs to work on, as they knew he was biting on plays and they took advantage of it. Hopefully, that gets addressed and Taylor does in fact learn from it.

A few things from that drive:

- For all the praise Jewell is getting, he'll probably be the first to admit that he had several plays out there he would like to have back. I think one of which would be Barkley's run (after the catch?) that got Penn State to or near the 10.

Josie was one on one and Barkley put the moves on him and tight roped the sideline for extra yardage. In hindsight, Josie would've wanted to not bite on the juke step and force Barkley back inside, both to keep the clock running, and allow the middle pursuit to make the play. But there were several instances of the defense biting inside and giving Barkley the outside, especially in the 2nd half, so plenty of teaching points to go around.

- On the final play, two things......1) some fans talked about blitzing the A gap earlier this week. We rushed 6 on that play but every man was picked up, including whoever was in the middle. Barkley of all players picked him up. Neimann though blitzed from the outside and never got close to McSorely. Hindsight and all, but THAT would've been the time to actually use the double A gap blitz. If Neimann blitzes in the other A gap and one of our DTs slants to one side or the other, I guarantee you that throw would've been rushed and depending on how quick we get to the QB maybe even sacked.

As it was, McSorely had enough time to make the throw he wanted. This leads me to my next point.....

2) "Don't get beat in the middle of the field"...........as it was reported, Penn State exploited Miles Taylor and got him to bite on an outside move giving the receiver the middle of the field.....the shortest distance from the spot of the ball.
Hooker did a nice job of breaking off his man and nearly deflecting the ball get, but all it took was one small gap and misread to give PSU the room they needed to make the play.

Protect the middle of the field first and especially if you're blitzing, hope that any throw to the corners is under duress giving the DBs time to break up the pass. That's why a second man blitzing the middle would've been perfect for that play.....but again, hindsight.

 

[GPRHAWK]

They had a timeout left they used on the final play. The question is would 4 seconds have ran off if the past was completed.

This is 100% correct

 

[BioHawk]

Nope there were out, unless they get 4 because they're penn state

They had one because PSU called timeout right before the final play of the game. Franklin even said in the postgame that "the used the timeout so they could make sure they had the right play and weren't rushing".

Time would have ran out if the Iowa player who tipped it managed to intercept the pass instead.

 

[BHCrusader2010]

That was an incredible drive by PennSt and remarkable pass by McSorely ( and catch). KF usual home game plan vs much better teams, of KF ball almost paid off, but #9 is an amazing football player at his size playing qb in the BIg 10. Great drive and play man, you have to respect that.

 

[pepsicock]

Made me sick on that last play . But you guys got one hell of a defense . Love the black and gold crowd . Still say you guys will win 9 games

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

That was an incredible drive by PennSt and remarkable pass by McSorely ( and catch). KF usual home game plan vs much better teams, of KF ball almost paid off, but #9 is an amazing football player at his size playing qb in the BIg 10. Great drive and play man, you have to respect that.

I will not.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Made me sick on that last play . But you guys got one hell of a defense . Love the black and gold crowd . Still say you guys will win 9 games

10.

 

[Kurt Warner]

They had one because PSU called timeout right before the final play of the game. Franklin even said in the postgame that "the used the timeout so they could make sure they had the right play and weren't rushing".

Time would have ran out if the Iowa player who tipped it managed to intercept the pass instead.

I know they didn't have one left after the one they called with 4 sec left

 

[hawkcub]

After subjecting myself to a number of replays this morning, I'm left with the impression that there had to be a mix-up by PSU's receivers. I can't think of a reason why you'd have two receivers in the same area of the field. All that does is draw defenders together . . . .

And, if my thoughts are correct, it makes the final play even more heartbreaking. McSorley threaded the needle and stabbed the Hawks (and their fans) right in the heart.

You're a better man than me. I DVR'd the game but there is no way I was going to watch any part of it. Especially the last play

 

[pharmdfd]

Glad they ran that story about the final play because it exposes what Taylor needs to work on, as they knew he was biting on plays and they exposed it. Hopefully, that gets addressed and Taylor does in fact learn from it.

A few things from that drive:

- For all the praise Jewell is getting, he'll probably be the first to admit that he had several plays out there he would like to have back. I think one of which would be Barkley's run (after the catch?) that got Penn State to or near the 10.

Josie was one on one and Barkley put the moves on him and tight roped the sideline for extra yardage. In hindsight, Josie would've wanted to not bite on the juke step and force Barkley back inside, both to keep the clock running, and allow the middle pursuit to make the play. But there were several instances of the defense biting inside and giving Barkley the outside, especially in the 2nd half, so plenty of teaching points to go around.

- On the final play, two things......1) some fans talked about blitzing the A gap earlier this week. We rushed 6 on that play but every man was picked up, including whoever was in the middle. Barkley of all players picked him up. Neimann though blitzed from the outside and never got close to McSorely. Hindsight and all, but THAT would've been the time to actually use the double A gap blitz. If Neimann blitzes in the other A gap and one of our DTs slants to one side or the other, I guarantee you that throw would've been rushed and depending on how quick we get to the QB maybe even sacked.

As it was, McSorely had enough time to make the throw he wanted. This leads me to my next point.....

2) "Don't get beat in the middle of the field"...........as it was reported, Penn State exploited Miles Taylor and got him to bite on an outside move giving the receiver the middle of the field.....the shortest distance from the spot of the ball.
Hooker did a nice job of breaking off his man and nearly deflecting the ball get, but all it took was one small gap and misread to give PSU the room they needed to make the play.

Protect the middle of the field first and especially if you're blitzing, hope that any throw to the corners is under duress giving the DBs time to break up the pass. That's why a second man blitzing the middle would've been perfect for that play.....but again, hindsight.

I was more mystified by Josey standing 10 yards from Barkley on that pass play, and many others, allowing him to catch a pass in space then proceed to burn him for big gains. Why not run up and prevent the pass in the 1st place? All game long you'd think no one knew who #26 was when he was in the flat on passing plays.

 

[LGEND24]

Glad they ran that story about the final play because it exposes what Taylor needs to work on, as they knew he was biting on plays and they exposed it. Hopefully, that gets addressed and Taylor does in fact learn from it.

A few things from that drive:

- For all the praise Jewell is getting, he'll probably be the first to admit that he had several plays out there he would like to have back. I think one of which would be Barkley's run (after the catch?) that got Penn State to or near the 10.

Josie was one on one and Barkley put the moves on him and tight roped the sideline for extra yardage. In hindsight, Josie would've wanted to not bite on the juke step and force Barkley back inside, both to keep the clock running, and allow the middle pursuit to make the play. But there were several instances of the defense biting inside and giving Barkley the outside, especially in the 2nd half, so plenty of teaching points to go around.

- On the final play, two things......1) some fans talked about blitzing the A gap earlier this week. We rushed 6 on that play but every man was picked up, including whoever was in the middle. Barkley of all players picked him up. Neimann though blitzed from the outside and never got close to McSorely. Hindsight and all, but THAT would've been the time to actually use the double A gap blitz. If Neimann blitzes in the other A gap and one of our DTs slants to one side or the other, I guarantee you that throw would've been rushed and depending on how quick we get to the QB maybe even sacked.

As it was, McSorely had enough time to make the throw he wanted. This leads me to my next point.....

2) "Don't get beat in the middle of the field"...........as it was reported, Penn State exploited Miles Taylor and got him to bite on an outside move giving the receiver the middle of the field.....the shortest distance from the spot of the ball.
Hooker did a nice job of breaking off his man and nearly deflecting the ball get, but all it took was one small gap and misread to give PSU the room they needed to make the play.

Protect the middle of the field first and especially if you're blitzing, hope that any throw to the corners is under duress giving the DBs time to break up the pass. That's why a second man blitzing the middle would've been perfect for that play.....but again, hindsight.

Taylor should have benched a long time ago, the problem is that his backup has been benched and the other safety is a true freshman.

 

[kcgolfer]

Not trying to be argumentative but they did have one more TO. Remember they called a to with the clock stopped on 4th down.

No they didn't.

 

[HawkNole09]

Maybe it's time to
Play Miles on questionable downs and distances and play Geno on coverage downs.

 

[HIWB]

No they didn't.

PSU had an incomplete pass on 3rd down, then called a timeout before their 4th down play. It's in the game play by play notes on ESPN if you need to see for yourself.

http://www.espn.com/college-football/game?gameId=400935360

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

I was more mystified by Josey standing 10 yards from Barkley on that pass play, and many others, allowing him to catch a pass in space then proceed to burn him for big gains. Why not run up and prevent the pass in the 1st place? All game long you'd think no one knew who #26 was when he was in the flat on passing plays.

Wheel route......but yes, I agree, and mentioned this a few times in the game thread. They needed to take some chances there.

 

[kjb32812]

As an FYI, Gesicki was the second option...a jump ball if JJ wasn't open but JJ was the primary. No idea why the other WR was there.

https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...0/penn-state-iowa-game-results-2017-touchdown

 

[kjb32812]

I was more mystified by Josey standing 10 yards from Barkley on that pass play, and many others, allowing him to catch a pass in space then proceed to burn him for big gains. Why not run up and prevent the pass in the 1st place? All game long you'd think no one knew who #26 was when he was in the flat on passing plays.

I commented on this earlier in the week. If he does that, then Moorhead would have gone elsewhere...that's how his offense operates. I obviously don't know what the Ferentz gameplan was but it appeared they were going to limit everyone else and take their chances with Barkley as a WR. Remember, PSU is not a TOP team and thrives on making the big plays. Maybe they sold out to stop that.

Interesting enough, it seemed to me from the jump that Moorhead was determined to do the complete opposite of what his offense is...control the clock. Don't remember a game where we began by simply feeding Barkley so much.

I'll wait for some of our guys to watch the tape and comment but I don't remember Mc missing too many throws (early on he wasn't sharp) so I have to think the Iowa D was shutting down everyone but #26 or Mc would have gone to them.

 

[BruceK-PSU83]

Herbie said he would be tackled immediately...which wouldn't jive with his theory of them catching a break (if they had another TO).

Then Herbstreit lost track of how many TOs PSU had left.

Herbie's point (maybe not a great one) was that had the 3rd down pass been completed, the PSU receiver would have been tackled before reaching the end zone, but not before time expired. In other words, the game would have been over and the remaining PSU time out useless.

Not sure I agree, as I think PSU would have been able to call time out with 1 or 2 seconds remaining. Herbie's "point" was a bit of a reach, IMO, but he does that sometimes.

 

[Hawkfan_08]

No they didn't.

Sorry but they did. I even posted the play by play. Feel free to take a look yourself if you don't believe me.

 

[Lone Clone]

I don't think that's correct but am open to being wrong...Herbie is the one who mentioned it/that PSU caught a break by not completing that pass on the second to last play...my bro was texting this to me while I was at the game and I thought I glanced up to see PSU with no TO's at that point.

I thought they had 1 timeout left, but there wouldn't have been time to call it if the pass had been completed.

 

[BeepBeepInMyJeep]

I tend to agree LC, if he catches it and gets tackled, he may fight forward or get panicked and run laterally instead of going down immediately. Even if there is 1, possibly 2 seconds at max, you're also banking on the refs (watching the play) calling the TO by seeing the signal from another player or coach in that 1-2 second window and blowing it dead...they sure as hell werent going to hear someone yell "timeout" from more than 3 feet away. Plus I don't think that's something that's reviewable

 

[NittanyBlue92]

As an FYI, Gesicki was the second option...a jump ball if JJ wasn't open but JJ was the primary. No idea why the other WR was there.

https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...0/penn-state-iowa-game-results-2017-touchdown

Here's why there were 2 WRs in the same vicinity...

http://pennstate.247sports.com/Arti...Tape-Juwan-Johnsons-game-winning-TD-107889284

 

[MauiHawk]

Here's why there were 2 WRs in the same vicinity...

http://pennstate.247sports.com/Arti...Tape-Juwan-Johnsons-game-winning-TD-107889284

Watching that replay in the article from the behind the play, it seems somewhat likely that if Johnson hadn't come open that McSorley could have escaped up the middle and scored the TD on the ground.

 

[BioHawk]

I was more mystified by Josey standing 10 yards from Barkley on that pass play, and many others, allowing him to catch a pass in space then proceed to burn him for big gains. Why not run up and prevent the pass in the 1st place? All game long you'd think no one knew who #26 was when he was in the flat on passing plays.

My guess is because other teams do that and then PSU burns them for a huge play by running somebody to the space Josey would have vacated.

 

[Nihilist Rodgers]

I was more mystified by Josey standing 10 yards from Barkley on that pass play, and many others, allowing him to catch a pass in space then proceed to burn him for big gains. Why not run up and prevent the pass in the 1st place? All game long you'd think no one knew who #26 was when he was in the flat on passing plays.

if you are 1 v 1 with Barkley in the open field.. the first thing you have to control is your bowels.. the next thing you have to do is sort thu 3 million instantaneous calculations on what he might do to you.. and then your feet are stuck.-sg

 

[KCLion]

Not at that point, they were out...

PSU called their final TO right before the 4th down play. Otherwise, why did both teams go to their respective sidelines before that play took place?

 

[boilerbusdriver]

Man, what a tough way to lose. Was able to watch after Michigan hammered my Boilers, was pulling for you guys to give James Franklin a beat down, but Mr Barclay is a Stud. Iowa played their hearts out, players should hold their heads high.

 

[EPC FAN]

Nope there were out, unless they get 4 because they're penn state

Go look at any youtube on the last play. After 3rd down Franklin called a timeout. This clearly shows PSU sideline before last play, from field level.
http://scout.com/college/penn-state/Article/BrennanCam-Penn-States-Last-Second-Win-At-Iowa-107893483

 

[iowaathletes]

Nice hold by PSU on Hesse on that play.

 

[EPC FAN]

Nice hold by PSU on Hesse on that play.

The Lions were penalized 8 times. Iowa 1 time. Please, don't use that excuse. I just looked at that clip, 5 times. Sorry, no holding there.