To the surprise of no one.....Caitlin Clark leads the league in double teams faced on offense

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Just a brief summary of what I shared in the mega thread, so that this doesn't get buried, but it's been confirmed that Caitlin Clark leads the entire WNBA in the amount of double teams faced so far this year.

She has also drawn double teams on 107 Pick and Roll possessions/plays, which is 30 more times........than the next closest player in the entire league.

So my question would be to all those saying this is normal, or that she's not the only one or that all the rookies are going through this, would be........

 

[ottumwan in tx]

and having by far the most controversies and facing hands down the most scrutiny in the press and taking the most questions in pressers and so on..impressive

 

[Franisdaman]

Just a brief summary of what I shared in the mega thread, so that this doesn't get buried, but it's been confirmed that Caitlin Clark leagues the entire WNBA in the amount of double teams faced so far this year.

She has also drawn double teams on 107 Pick and Roll possessions/plays, which is 30 more times........than the next closest player in the entire league.

So my question would be to all those saying this is normal, or that she's not the only one or that all the rookies are going through this, would be........

It's amazing that she's putting up the numbers that she is. And it's true, that besides all of the negativity, she's having a helluva year.

And I will say it again; there needs to be a changing of the OLD, bitchy guard.

Diana turned 42 on June 11.

Caitlin turned 22 on Jan 22.

What follows are the stats thru last night's games. Look at the assist difference. Imagine if her teammates caught all of her passes?

And, as you can see, Caitlin is on pace to be the youngest player in WNBA history to average 15+ points/game & 5+ assists/game.


.............................Pts...Rebs...Asts...Stl...Blk...FG%..3Pt%...FT%
Caitlin Clark......15.6...4.9......6.0...1.4...0.9...36.7...32.2....89.7
Diana Taurasi....17.0...4.5......1.8...0.6...0.2...38.6...34.6...86.4

 

[TheGuy9]

Just a brief summary of what I shared in the mega thread, so that this doesn't get buried, but it's been confirmed that Caitlin Clark leagues the entire WNBA in the amount of double teams faced so far this year.

She has also drawn double teams on 107 Pick and Roll possessions/plays, which is 30 more times........than the next closest player in the entire league.

So my question would be to all those saying this is normal, or that she's not the only one or that all the rookies are going through this, would be........

It's simple. Look at her turnovers. Double team her and she is going to cough up the ball. In fact, she is on pace to turn the ball over more than 200 times at her current pace. The record is 137. Until she proves she can handle it, they are going to continue to doubler her. It's really not complicated.

 

[ZachJump]

It's amazing that she's putting up the numbers that she is. And it's true, that besides all of the negativity, she's having a helluva year.

And I will say it again; there needs to be a changing of the OLD, bitchy guard.

Diana turned 42 on June 11.

Caitlin turned 22 on Jan 22.

What follows are the stats thru last night's games. Look at the assist difference. Imagine if her teammates caught all of her passes?

And, as you can see, Caitlin is on pace to be the youngest player in WNBA history to average 15+ points/game & 5+ assists/game.


.............................Pts...Rebs...Asts...Stl...Blk...FG%..3Pt%...FT%
Caitlin Clark......15.6...4.9......6.0...1.4...0.9...36.7...32.2....89.7
Diana Taurasi....17.0...4.5......1.8...0.6...0.2...38.6...34.6...86.4

View embedded media

Let me know when she gets within 10,000 points of Taurasi.

 

[SL Hawk Fan]

It's simple. Look at her turnovers. Double team her and she is going to cough up the ball. In fact, she is on pace to turn the ball over more than 200 times at her current pace. The record is 137. Until she proves she can handle it, they are going to continue to doubler her. It's really not complicated.

This is the thing that gets me (and pisses me off) though. Bear with me; it’s kind of nuanced.

Critics love to point to the turnovers as a counter to her other, more impressive stats. But they don’t give any consideration to the fact that the level of defensive pressure being applied to Clark is unprecedented.

When a Clark fan (and can someone tell me what the whole “Stan” thing is meant to imply?) simply points this out, they get accused of whining because teams have the audacity to defend Clark and that these other teams shouldn’t guard her “so she can shine.” THAT IS NOT WHAT I’M SAYING!!!!

Absolutely, other teams should guard Caitlin to the extent they think is necessary in order to win the game. All we’re pointing out, is that when looking at all of Caitlin’s stats, including the turnovers, just acknowledge that she’s been doing this while facing a level of defensive attention unlike any of the other players.

And finally, given all that, if you simply adjusted the turnover stats for the bobbled catches and assist for even half of the missed bunnies, her assists would be higher still and the turnovers would be considerably lower.

It’s like having a 400 meter race, making Caitlin wear a 40lbs pack, and then denigrating her when she only comes in third or fourth place.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

It's simple. Look at her turnovers. Double team her and she is going to cough up the ball. In fact, she is on pace to turn the ball over more than 200 times at her current pace. The record is 137. Until she proves she can handle it, they are going to continue to doubler her. It's really not complicated.

Lol ok.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

I'd like to know why teams aren't doubling A'ja Wilson or Breanna Stewart or some of these other top scorers that are setting records or are allegedly more of a scoring threat than Caitlin Clark........

And yes I know some of this falls on her Fever teammates and Sides as a coach to find ways to better exploit all the double teams Clark faces.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Let me know when she gets within 10,000 points of Taurasi.

Well if Taurasi would retire, that won't take very long at all............

 

[AWS1022]

It's simple. Look at her turnovers. Double team her and she is going to cough up the ball. In fact, she is on pace to turn the ball over more than 200 times at her current pace. The record is 137. Until she proves she can handle it, they are going to continue to doubler her. It's really not complicated.

Every player in the league would have that many turnovers as well if teams did that to them. If you look at her “real” turnovers, taking out offensive fouls and drops by her teammates, she has about 3-4 a game, which is about the same as many other players. So if coaches don’t think she’s one of the best players in the league and they focus all their defense on stopping her, then every coach should be fired. I’ve coached a lot of basketball and never have I focused all of my defensive attention on an average player. And if I did, then I would think that would make it easy for their other players to be stars, but that’s not happening for the Fever players.

 

[spiderland]

I'd like to know why teams aren't doubling A'ja Wilson or Breanna Stewart or some of these other top scorers that are setting records or are allegedly more of a scoring threat than Caitlin Clark........

And yes I know some of this falls on her Fever teammates and Sides as a coach to find ways to better exploit all the double teams Clark faces.

I would also be interested in seeing how many of CC’s turnovers happen late in the third or in the fourth quarter with the Fever down 20+, since they’ve been in that situation more than a few times this year already. Seems to me that when you are double team blitzing up 25 in the fourth quarter, you might have an agenda that goes just a little beyond simply competing and winning the game.

 

[Franisdaman]

Let me know when she gets within 10,000 points of Taurasi.

Let me know when anyone gives a fook about Diana Taurasi and any of her stats

 

[Franisdaman]

I'd like to know why teams aren't doubling A'ja Wilson or Breanna Stewart or some of these other top scorers that are setting records or are allegedly more of a scoring threat than Caitlin Clark........

And yes I know some of this falls on her Fever teammates and Sides as a coach to find ways to better exploit all the double teams Clark faces.

yeah, i think its shitty coaching; you need to see the double team coming, throw out of it and make the opponent pay

 

[ZumaHawk]

I also think that when CC went to the Fever is the same as the best QB going to Cleveland Browns. No matter how good you are you are going to a really bad team.

 

[BioHawk]

It's simple. Look at her turnovers. Double team her and she is going to cough up the ball. In fact, she is on pace to turn the ball over more than 200 times at her current pace. The record is 137. Until she proves she can handle it, they are going to continue to doubler her. It's really not complicated.

You would think her coach would look for ways to try and get her some help beyond just taking the ball out of her hands. Clark has a few flubs for sure, but I would be willing to bet as many as half of her turnovers are the result of her teammates making the wrong decision or setting a bad screen that leaves her isolated and double teamed on the sideline with nowhere to go forcing a bad pass as a result. Or, they simply don't catch the pass they are given.

 

[BurgHawk87]

I'd like to know why teams aren't doubling A'ja Wilson or Breanna Stewart or some of these other top scorers that are setting records or are allegedly more of a scoring threat than Caitlin Clark........

And yes I know some of this falls on her Fever teammates and Sides as a coach to find ways to better exploit all the double teams Clark faces.

Those teams have players who can hit the broadside of a barn on a layup. I've never seen more shot clock violations on layups than a Fever game, how do you miss the rim?

 

[JayTheOkay]

I guess the experts were right when the told us silly old Iowa fans that the WNBA is a whole different ball game. I just didn't realize they meant that the WNBA was LITERALLY going to play a whole different type of ball game against CC and only CC.

 

[chuck285]

Let me know when anyone gives a fook about Diana Taurasi and any of her stats

I'm surprised she has been playing that long, having kids and a husband .

 

[ZachJump]

Let me know when anyone gives a fook about Diana Taurasi and any of her stats

Well I am going to go out on a limb and say plenty of people care.

Megan Gustafson for one.

You all are the ones creating problems for Caitlin, acting like it’s her vs the world. Hell she called you all out in a recent interview to basically stop the attacks on other players.

But I guess you do not have enough respect for her to listen.

 

[Bro D]

Well I am going to go out on a limb and say plenty of people care.

Megan Gustafson for one.

You all are the ones creating problems for Caitlin, acting like it’s her vs the world. Hell she called you all out in a recent interview to basically stop the attacks on other players.

But I guess you do not have enough respect for her to listen.

So deep

 

[kceasthawk]

It's simple. Look at her turnovers. Double team her and she is going to cough up the ball. In fact, she is on pace to turn the ball over more than 200 times at her current pace. The record is 137. Until she proves she can handle it, they are going to continue to doubler her. It's really not complicated.

Your right it is simple. Try watching anyone of the videos put out about the effortless horrible job her team mates are doing on screening and pick and rolls (the basis for pro offense). They are not really screening anyone and are instead BRINGING their defender directly in Clarks face and then not giving her an angle to pass the ball, often turning their backs away from Clark during the action. This is all basic high school stuff that both Boston and Smith are horrible at, and is the major issue for this problem. One video showed the difference between how Iowa did pick and roll correctly and how it led to Clarks success feeding MC and Stuelke, and the absolutely horrible job that the Fever are doing on this basic concept. And once again WHERE are the Fever's coaches, in fixing this TEAM issue?

 

[BioHawk]

Well I am going to go out on a limb and say plenty of people care.

Megan Gustafson for one.

You all are the ones creating problems for Caitlin, acting like it’s her vs the world. Hell she called you all out in a recent interview to basically stop the attacks on other players.

But I guess you do not have enough respect for her to listen.

Racist or homophobic attacks, for sure. I haven't seen many of those (I actually see them more on this website than I do on social media) but I don't doubt that they exist. But I wish people would be specific about what they are talking about. Because calling out Aliyah Boston for not being able to make a 5 foot shot, something that is one of the basic pillars of her job, is not attacking her. Calling her out, and others, for evidently not knowing the first thing about how to set a proper screen is not attacking her. Calling out players for being a black hole with the ball once it comes to them and never getting rid of it until they take a shitty shot or miss a layup is not attacking. That's piss poor basketball and deserves to be called out. If that is what they are upset about, suck it up and play better.

So, no, racist and homophobic attacks are ridiculous and shouldn't be happening. Being called out for shitty play is legitimate and they need to be addressing these things. It seems everyone can see these things except her coach.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Let me know when anyone gives a fook about Diana Taurasi and any of her stats

I think that it’s impressive that after 20 years people have finally figured out that they can watch her games, go to games and buy the merchandise. She is a 20 year overnight sensation……..

 

[DanHawkPella]

I don't see why people need to take the "sides" that the media has created for us. It is in their best interest to create drama, as drama creates clicks and engagement on their platform. We are the fools in this case.

My much too detailed assessment of the Fever:

• Fever started the year using high screen and roll in order to get Clark or Boston open, and other teams countered by blitzing (double teaming) Clark off the screen. Clark tried to hit Boston on the roll but other teams countered by rotating a weak side defender into the near block area to take that away (and Boston is a slow roller, ugh).
• Fever then started using the 'short roll' by having Boston stop around the FT line area so that she didn't move into the area where the help defense was (this is very common in the NBA). However, Boston lacks a good 16 foot jumper and wasn't good at driving and kicking in that situation like the NBA bigs can do. So the Fever continued to not make teams pay for doubling Clark, and Clark keeps getting double teamed.
• Clark did have issues with the double team and turnovers, as her passing windows were limited by the length and physicality of the defenders and she'd have deflections or passes too far in front of the roller. This was exacerbated by having some bad rollers like Boston.
• Fever then started to give up on the high pick and roll, which was the beginning of reducing Clark's role in the offense to a degree. They did have a few good plays where they bring Clark off of double screens without the ball where she can catch and shoot, and that's been the best play type for her all season. But they don't run it enough and at times have Clark just standing in the Corner, which is dumb imo because she can only stretch the defense out to 24 feet there, whereas if you have her stand in an area above the FT line she can extend a defender to 28 feet ... and we've seen defenders guard her there all season and not help.
• Clark's offensive issues include needing to tighten her dribble against certain defenders, being a bit smarter with passes (she will with experience) and developing a mid range game. I think being a taller PG all her life she never really needed a floater the way a Molly Davis did, and was able to finish around the rim even with defenders rotating to her late on her drive as she has a nice 4 foot bank shot. However in the WNBA that "close" shot is a 6 ft bank shot over a very good post player, and she doesn't shoot it and so always needs to dump it off or keep her dribble and dribble back out. The 7-15 foot floater/jumper is there for her but she doesn't shoot it and when she does it's flat - exactly like a player who has never shot one much.
• Clark's transition game is still her best and I think she's the best in the NBA in this situation because her up court vision, anticipation and passing is ridiculous. She finds the rim runner early and drops a perfectly shaped ball almost every time. This is why Fagbenle and Mitchell make sense with Clark because they are elite in transition as well.
• Defensively Clark has many issues, the most glaring two being EFFORT and DEFENSIVE IQ. She often does not rotate to the right person, and in transition will reach for a steal and turn a 3 on 3 break into a 3 on 2 break. She also doesn't identify the highest risk player in transition to match up with and is often stopping at the top of the 3 point line to find someone behind her to match up with. That's not how transition defense works. Her defensive IQ is much worse than I'd have thought, and at times her effort is costing her the respect of her teammates - she got her dribble ripped the other night and never ran back to stop the layup. Her teammates and coach had to absolute HATE that (I did).
• Boston doesn't fit the team the Fever need with Clark. They need a defensive team that can get defensive boards and get out on the break, with enough shooters to work in the half court. Boston is very slow in transition defense and on offense is only good in the low block, and even then is not that good imo. Her moves are very slow developing and she has to always use a counter move and sometimes a pump fake on a pass where she should just go up with it. Not impressed with her, and she's also a bad screener AND a bad roller.
• Mitchell just wants to be put in isolation and so in the half court isn't a great fit with Clark, but she is in transition.
• Wheeler is awful on offense and can only score efficiently on layups, but not when contested hard. Not great vision either. I'd trade Boston and Wheeler imo.
• I do like some of the other role players, but got to go

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

My much too detailed assessment of the Fever:

• Fever started the year using high screen and roll in order to get Clark or Boston open, and other teams countered by blitzing (double teaming) Clark off the screen. Clark tried to hit Boston on the roll but other teams countered by rotating a weak side defender into the near block area to take that away (and Boston is a slow roller, ugh).

Speaking of.........

In other news today that continues to illustrate how Caitlin is being treated like every other rookie, coming into their game against the Sky, Caitlin Clark has been blitzed by the defense on screens 57 times so far this year.

That's not just more than any other player..........no other TEAM has been blitzed this much to this point in the season.

In their most recent game against Seattle, she was blitzed 18 times, which is more than twice as many times as any other player has faced in a game this year..................

But yes, all the rookies are being treated this way.



To clarify, blitzing in basketball is essentially sending extra pressure toward a player coming off a screen with the hopes of either denying them the ball or forcing them to give it up/create a turnover.

 

[DanHawkPella]

Speaking of.........

In other news today that continues to illustrate how Caitlin is being treated like every other rookie, coming into their game against the Sky, Caitlin Clark has been blitzed by the defense on screens 57 times so far this year.

That's not just more than any other player..........no other TEAM has been blitzed this much to this point in the season.

In their most recent game against Seattle, she was blitzed 18 times, which is more than twice as many times as any other player has faced in a game this year..................

But yes, all the rookies are being treated this way.



To clarify, blitzing in basketball is essentially sending extra pressure toward a player coming off a screen with the hopes of either denying them the ball or forcing them to give it up/create a turnover.

Yeah - my point to the Olympic Committee would have been: "If I'm not that good, why are they defending me this way?" .... especially since none of the other Olympic team members are defended that way either.

It does explain some of her higher turnovers, as well as lower stats in the scoring department. Anyone watching the games know her assists should be 20% higher except for teammates inability to take advantage of the defense in rotation.

Teams can't do that against the Aces stars because the roster is better and the coach is WAY better.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Yeah - my point to the Olympic Committee would have been: "If I'm not that good, why are they defending me this way?" .... especially since none of the other Olympic team members are defended that way either.

It does explain some of her higher turnovers, as well as lower stats in the scoring department. Anyone watching the games know her assists should be 20% higher except for teammates inability to take advantage of the defense in rotation.

Teams can't do that against the Aces stars because the roster is better and the coach is WAY better.

They can't but it's also worth noting that the Fever have one fewer win on the season than the Aces.

 

[littlez]

I don't see why people need to take the "sides" that the media has created for us. It is in their best interest to create drama, as drama creates clicks and engagement on their platform. We are the fools in this case.

My much too detailed assessment of the Fever:

• Fever started the year using high screen and roll in order to get Clark or Boston open, and other teams countered by blitzing (double teaming) Clark off the screen. Clark tried to hit Boston on the roll but other teams countered by rotating a weak side defender into the near block area to take that away (and Boston is a slow roller, ugh).
• Fever then started using the 'short roll' by having Boston stop around the FT line area so that she didn't move into the area where the help defense was (this is very common in the NBA). However, Boston lacks a good 16 foot jumper and wasn't good at driving and kicking in that situation like the NBA bigs can do. So the Fever continued to not make teams pay for doubling Clark, and Clark keeps getting double teamed.
• Clark did have issues with the double team and turnovers, as her passing windows were limited by the length and physicality of the defenders and she'd have deflections or passes too far in front of the roller. This was exacerbated by having some bad rollers like Boston.
• Fever then started to give up on the high pick and roll, which was the beginning of reducing Clark's role in the offense to a degree. They did have a few good plays where they bring Clark off of double screens without the ball where she can catch and shoot, and that's been the best play type for her all season. But they don't run it enough and at times have Clark just standing in the Corner, which is dumb imo because she can only stretch the defense out to 24 feet there, whereas if you have her stand in an area above the FT line she can extend a defender to 28 feet ... and we've seen defenders guard her there all season and not help.
• Clark's offensive issues include needing to tighten her dribble against certain defenders, being a bit smarter with passes (she will with experience) and developing a mid range game. I think being a taller PG all her life she never really needed a floater the way a Molly Davis did, and was able to finish around the rim even with defenders rotating to her late on her drive as she has a nice 4 foot bank shot. However in the WNBA that "close" shot is a 6 ft bank shot over a very good post player, and she doesn't shoot it and so always needs to dump it off or keep her dribble and dribble back out. The 7-15 foot floater/jumper is there for her but she doesn't shoot it and when she does it's flat - exactly like a player who has never shot one much.
• Clark's transition game is still her best and I think she's the best in the NBA in this situation because her up court vision, anticipation and passing is ridiculous. She finds the rim runner early and drops a perfectly shaped ball almost every time. This is why Fagbenle and Mitchell make sense with Clark because they are elite in transition as well.
• Defensively Clark has many issues, the most glaring two being EFFORT and DEFENSIVE IQ. She often does not rotate to the right person, and in transition will reach for a steal and turn a 3 on 3 break into a 3 on 2 break. She also doesn't identify the highest risk player in transition to match up with and is often stopping at the top of the 3 point line to find someone behind her to match up with. That's not how transition defense works. Her defensive IQ is much worse than I'd have thought, and at times her effort is costing her the respect of her teammates - she got her dribble ripped the other night and never ran back to stop the layup. Her teammates and coach had to absolute HATE that (I did).
• Boston doesn't fit the team the Fever need with Clark. They need a defensive team that can get defensive boards and get out on the break, with enough shooters to work in the half court. Boston is very slow in transition defense and on offense is only good in the low block, and even then is not that good imo. Her moves are very slow developing and she has to always use a counter move and sometimes a pump fake on a pass where she should just go up with it. Not impressed with her, and she's also a bad screener AND a bad roller.
• Mitchell just wants to be put in isolation and so in the half court isn't a great fit with Clark, but she is in transition.
• Wheeler is awful on offense and can only score efficiently on layups, but not when contested hard. Not great vision either. I'd trade Boston and Wheeler imo.
• I do like some of the other role players, but got to go

This is great work my friend!

 

[Tenacious E]

Well I am going to go out on a limb and say plenty of people care.

Megan Gustafson for one.

You all are the ones creating problems for Caitlin, acting like it’s her vs the world. Hell she called you all out in a recent interview to basically stop the attacks on other players.

But I guess you do not have enough respect for her to listen.

This is a hawkeye basketball message board. Posting opinions here should have no impact on anything. Now, if people are lighting up her twitter feed and such, I agree.

 

[littlez]

I'd like to know why teams aren't doubling A'ja Wilson or Breanna Stewart or some of these other top scorers that are setting records or are allegedly more of a scoring threat than Caitlin Clark........

And yes I know some of this falls on her Fever teammates and Sides as a coach to find ways to better exploit all the double teams Clark faces.

This isn't that hard. Neither Wilson or Stewart bring the ball up the court. The Fevers entire offense starts and ends w/Clark. And while the Aces are currently struggling there is no comparison between coaches in Sides and Hammons. Sides is learning on the job w/a very very young team and currently the only team w/a rookie at pt guard w/the usage rate of Clark. Also it's ok at times to say CC makes a poor play or decision at times. It's not the end of the world when she does. We've watched her play all these years w/Marshall and Kate Martin beside her who knew her every move. At times she needs to make the easy play and when the blitz comes get rid of the ball quickly and let it happen. Yesterday was I thought by far her most in control game in all facets, including emotionally. Very little complaining, take the hard foul like she did from Reese and move on and hit your free throws. She was masterful on the pick and roll.

 

[littlez]

This is a hawkeye basketball message board. Posting opinions here should have no impact on anything. Now, if people are lighting up her twitter feed and such, I agree.

They are. Constantly.

 

[Tenacious E]

They are. Constantly.

I know, but we here are the "you all" in his post, not random twitter flamers.

 

[ft254]

This isn't that hard. Neither Wilson or Stewart bring the ball up the court. The Fevers entire offense starts and ends w/Clark. And while the Aces are currently struggling there is no comparison between coaches in Sides and Hammons. Sides is learning on the job w/a very very young team and currently the only team w/a rookie at pt guard w/the usage rate of Clark. Also it's ok at times to say CC makes a poor play or decision at times. It's not the end of the world when she does. We've watched her play all these years w/Marshall and Kate Martin beside her who knew her every move. At times she needs to make the easy play and when the blitz comes get rid of the ball quickly and let it happen. Yesterday was I thought by far her most in control game in all facets, including emotionally. Very little complaining, take the hard foul like she did from Reese and move on and hit your free throws. She was masterful on the pick and roll.

Excellent post.

To start the season the Fever had few practices for the youngest team in the league against the most games scheduled in that stretch, mainly the top teams.

Caitlin is naturally TO prone due to her passing skills, which her new teammates are not accustomed to. The other Fever guards are not team players and CC has to engineer offense when she can. It's like 2-dimensional chess watching the Fever. Sides can't reign in Mitchell because she scores, but if she played within the system, ala Kate Martin the system would be more efficient.

It's the pro mentality. Shoot 1st and shoot only. This is why Caitlin is so highly regarded (and detested). She is a true basketball player. Fans appreciate the game she brings to the WNBA, and they're the ones filling the arenas, filling hotel rooms. Players don't understand this and resent her success and attention.

At some point, maybe not in Side's tenure Caitlin will have control of the Fever offense and we'll see her as we know she's capable.