You can’t just take away two years to make your statistics look better they all count. Most coaches come into a job because the program needs to be rejuvenated.
VOTE: Is Kirk Ferentz a Hall of Famer? Assume he gets to a 60.00 Win% & stays there (currently at 60.00%). IF he wins the bowl game he's at 60.11%
- Thread starter Franisdaman
- Start date
Most Career Wins at a Big Ten school:
The Top 4:
1. Woody Hayes.................205...(1951-1978)
2. Kirk Ferentz...................200...(1999-2024)
3. Amos Alonzo Stagg.....199
4. Bo Schembechler.........194...(1969-1989)
Big Ten Winning % (knock off roughly 10 spots, as some coaches like Cignetti have/had less than a full season)
Woody Hayes....................761....23rd
Bo Schembechler............796....17th
Amos Alonzo Stagg........695....43rd
Kirk Ferentz .....................621.....69th
Most career losses at a Big Ten school
Kirk Ferentz.................122
Pat Fitzgerald.............100
Amos Alonzo Stagg...95
John Pont.......................94
Hayden Fry....................89
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A lot of CFP "experts" say KF belongs in the Hall of Fame. Are they wrong?
80% of this board says he belongs in the Hall of Fame. Are they wrong, too?
he likely has a Hall of Fame resume as long as he gets to and stays at 60.00%
I wasn’t taking those years off to look better, I took them off to show just how much of an effect those 2 rebuilding years had on his overall %. And even with them, he’s damn near at the threshold of 60%.
Look, I get it, you hate KF for whatever reason. I’m ready for him to be gone now too, but I can at least make an objective observation about the man’s accomplishments.
I agree with you. KF had a huge mess to clean up, that's for sure....and then he had to dig out of a 4-19 hole after 2 seasons at Iowa
I don't think i voted on this back in September. But voted "Iowa fan, yes" today.
Full disclosure: I am a UNI grad, my dad is a UNI grad that did some graduate hours at Iowa but he does not have any degree from there. My maternal grandfather went to U of I sometime around WWII (not sure if before he was in the army, or after) but I don't think he got a degree.
So, i am very Tavernhawk. I have friends from high school who went there, i visited them some.
I am a supporter of KF. I did not revel in BF's dismissal, but understood it needed to happen.
My dad and I have gone to all but 3 or 4 home Iowa football games back to 2001 or 2002. Went to a game or two per year for about 3 or 4 years before that (maybe back to 1997 or 1998). Dad and I got to take a tour of Kinnick in summer 2023, thanks to donating a bit of money to PBS Iowa. It was a great event, do it if you can.
I have been to the Orange Bowl at end of 2002, the Outback Bowl where we beat Florida by 20 (2004), two Insight Bowls, an Alamo Bowl (KF's first bowl/win), and the win over Kentucky in the Music City Bowl.
I have been to an Iowa win over NIU at Soldier Field, a couple Iowa games vs Gophers in the Metrodome (including 2002, the goalpost game), a couple games at Illinois, and the Iowa vs Iowa St game in 2001 that got postponed to November due to the September 11th Attacks.
KF has been good and pretty consistent. Gotta love the 2002, 2009, and 2015 teams. I love many other squads and players during KF's time, as well.
He is certainly not perfect. Rhabdo, Everson/Satterfield, Cityboyz Inc, DJK, the racial issues, and plenty of dumb choices by white players, too, are all part of KF's legacy.
But, my dad and I have enjoyed a lot of KF's tenure together. It has bonded us in my adulthood, maybe more than most other things (I am not married, have no kids for him to be a grandfather to. Thankfully, one of my sisters gave my parents a grandkid).
We used to go to the games with my dad's cousin and her husband, they are pretty much an aunt and uncle to me (he has passed, she now has dementia). We used to bring a retired Catholic priest with us, he passed away about 3 years ago.
I don't share joy in crapping on KF with online comments. My comments in support of him have pissed off plenty of people over at BHGP, but that place has skewed way too negative in my opinion.
But I think he is an excellent coach (if not quite as legendary or program-saving as Fry). I think Iowa will struggle a bit after he retires. I would not fire him or ask him to retire until he has two BAD seasons in a row. I am not sure he'll wait for that. I think he is sticking around to get above Woody Hayes, then might retire after that season.
I think he truly loves working with the players and assistant coaches. I don't think his ego is as big as many want to portray. I have never met him (have been in a room to hear a speech from Gable, one from Ben Jacobson).
So, i hope KF tops Woody Hayes, gets in the college HOF at some point. Mostly, I hope players know they are fortunate to play at Iowa, regularly go to bowl games, and for a very good coach. There are plenty of players from the last couple decades, from Nebraska, Illinois, Minnesota, Purdue, Rutgers, Maryland, Indiana, Northwestern, and Iowa St, who don't quite have that feeling.
Whatever it takes to get him to retire, let's get it done.
Enough is enuff.
Enough is enuff.
I think he ends up in the HOF, too
I said neither. KFz is right there, but I think he's stayed too long.
If Iowa has full discretion to credit Kirk with a win during a self-imposed suspension, why not let Miss State have full discretion to credit Leach with the bowl win that comes at the end of the season of his death?
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Does his time at Maine count, or is the 10 year minimum inclusive of college coaching at any level?
Yes, I believe this was asked of Dochterman or Morehouse on twitter a while back, and they confirmed that all games are taken into account.
Kirk was watching from home, feeling dead inside everytime he saw the offense run a pass play, so it's all the same.
No offense, but your post reads as though you’re taking those years off to look better (66% “coupled with” his other major achievements and “he’s in”). That’s how it reads, anyway.
Personally, I think his only shot is to tie or surpass Woody this year and then retire. Which unfortunately I don’t think is likely, as I don’t see 6-0/5-1 down the stretch.
If he doesn’t make that, then HOF is lost. I’m sure he’ll chase and eventually catch Woody. But 0.600 is gone after this season if not sooner, IMO.
I’ve gone back and forth myself on this. Personally, I do think he’s a hall of famer, and an exception to the 60% rule should be made (very sparingly) for coaches that have had a lasting impact on the game (like Mike Leach - his offensive schemes have literally changed the game).
I think it also needs to have some experience for coaches that started their career at a challenging school and had to turn those programs around. KF is a great example both with Maine but also with his first two year records at Iowa. How the F do you punish a coach for taking over a dumpster fire and then having to overcome that impact on their record!!?? The rhabdo, gambling, and Doyle scandals put a little dent on the integrity and character angle, but any truly objective view would squarely consider KF a true statesman and impeccable steward of the game.
That said, it’s also easy to argue that KF has brought the razor thin miss to get to 60% on himself with the continued questionable decision at QB, horrible clock management, and overall offensive neglect. He’d easily have plenty more victories and be comfortably above the 60% mark had he simply fixed the mind boggling issues that have plagued him/his teams against often inferior opponents. Just mind boggling.
All that said, in a world now where the game is riddled with scuzz and dishonest/disingenuous players, coaches, administration, etc, it would be a complete shame if he is not a hall of fame because of a one to two game miss.
I think it also needs to have some experience for coaches that started their career at a challenging school and had to turn those programs around. KF is a great example both with Maine but also with his first two year records at Iowa. How the F do you punish a coach for taking over a dumpster fire and then having to overcome that impact on their record!!?? The rhabdo, gambling, and Doyle scandals put a little dent on the integrity and character angle, but any truly objective view would squarely consider KF a true statesman and impeccable steward of the game.
That said, it’s also easy to argue that KF has brought the razor thin miss to get to 60% on himself with the continued questionable decision at QB, horrible clock management, and overall offensive neglect. He’d easily have plenty more victories and be comfortably above the 60% mark had he simply fixed the mind boggling issues that have plagued him/his teams against often inferior opponents. Just mind boggling.
All that said, in a world now where the game is riddled with scuzz and dishonest/disingenuous players, coaches, administration, etc, it would be a complete shame if he is not a hall of fame because of a one to two game miss.
"it would be a complete shame if he is not a hall of fame because of a one to two game miss". I don't think it would be a shame. If he hadn't hired an incompetent son, he wouldn't have a one or two game miss and probably would have passed Woody Hayes by now.
Agreed with all that.
Bottom line for me is that I think it's stupid to have some arbitrary winning % or any other stat as a requirement for HOF eligibility.
59.999% or 60% even, and someone is going to tell me that there's a meaningful difference there?
To me, KF feels like a "hall of very good" type of coach. Consistently solid but rarely reaching "great" level. Kind of the Harold Baines of college football coaches IMO. He's compiled a lot of wins but never has felt like one of the top echelon of coaches to me. He's borderline. Then again, he's won 200 games coaching mostly at Iowa, not Ohio State. That's got to count for something.
Iowa, for better or for worse, has a tradition of being patient and of hanging on to head coaches.
It will be interesting to see if that tradition continues under Beth.
It will also be interesting to see see if these ridiculous buyout amounts continue across the Power 2 and Other 2 conferences.
To get to & stay at 60%:
5-1 (.833): to finish 2024 (puts him at 60.11%)
8-5 (.615): record then needed in 2025
.........................................
13-6 (.684) Total
===============
If KF goes 13-6 through 2025...
Kirk's record would be:
......12-21 (36.4%):.............3 years at Maine....(1990-92)
213-128 (62.5%):..........27 years at Iowa........(1999-2025)
..................................................................
225-149 (60.16%) Overall Record
========================
5-1 (.833): to finish 2024 (puts him at 60.11%)
8-5 (.615): record then needed in 2025
.........................................
13-6 (.684) Total
===============
If KF goes 13-6 through 2025...
Kirk's record would be:
......12-21 (36.4%):.............3 years at Maine....(1990-92)
213-128 (62.5%):..........27 years at Iowa........(1999-2025)
..................................................................
225-149 (60.16%) Overall Record
========================
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I think it's way past being patient...Kirk is in his 26th year.
Looking at the list of coaches, it is a Hall of Very Good more than a Hall of Fame.
Mark Dantonio
Paul Johnson
Mark Richt
Gary Pinkel
Mike Bellotti
Frank Solich
Those are all relatively recent inductees that are very good, but I'm not sure are great. Ferentz's career is better than Solich, Pinkel, and Bellotti. Johnson has a couple of D2 titles, but other than that has a worse resume at the D1 level. Richt's career was good and on par with Ferentz over a shorter time period, but he had the benefit of doing it at powerhouse schools that were easier to recruit to. Dantonio was really good for most of a decade, a longer success streak than anything Ferentz put together, but other than that was average and only was a head coach for 16 years.
If all of those coaches are HoF material, then Ferentz is too.
Mark Dantonio
Paul Johnson
Mark Richt
Gary Pinkel
Mike Bellotti
Frank Solich
Those are all relatively recent inductees that are very good, but I'm not sure are great. Ferentz's career is better than Solich, Pinkel, and Bellotti. Johnson has a couple of D2 titles, but other than that has a worse resume at the D1 level. Richt's career was good and on par with Ferentz over a shorter time period, but he had the benefit of doing it at powerhouse schools that were easier to recruit to. Dantonio was really good for most of a decade, a longer success streak than anything Ferentz put together, but other than that was average and only was a head coach for 16 years.
If all of those coaches are HoF material, then Ferentz is too.
FIFY ...and that's incredible longevity for a guy not winning conference championships every 4-5 years and making the playoffs at least a couple of times.
Update after Iowa's 40-14 win on Oct 26, 2024 vs Northwestern:
You can change your vote, if needed.
As we have been discussing in this thread since September 2023, one of the stipulations for the College Football Hall of Fame is you have to have won 60% of your games.
Assuming Kirk gets to 60% (which he currently is just below) and stays there, what say you?
Kirk has been the head coach in 356 games. He's won 59.83% of those games.
By season's end Kirk will be up to 361 games (4 reg season games + 1 bowl game are left).
To get to 60.00% by the end of the 2024 season, Kirk will have to finish at 4-1 to get to 217-144 (60.11%). Going 5-0 would be even better, of course.
Kirk's current record:
.......12-21 (36.4%):.............3 years at Maine.........(1990-92)
201-122 (62.2%):.........26th season at Iowa (1999-present)
..................................................................
213-143 (59.83%) Overall Record
========================
When Kirk hit win #200 he became the 24th Division I coach to reach that milestone.
You can change your vote, if needed.
As we have been discussing in this thread since September 2023, one of the stipulations for the College Football Hall of Fame is you have to have won 60% of your games.
Assuming Kirk gets to 60% (which he currently is just below) and stays there, what say you?
Kirk has been the head coach in 356 games. He's won 59.83% of those games.
By season's end Kirk will be up to 361 games (4 reg season games + 1 bowl game are left).
To get to 60.00% by the end of the 2024 season, Kirk will have to finish at 4-1 to get to 217-144 (60.11%). Going 5-0 would be even better, of course.
Kirk's current record:
.......12-21 (36.4%):.............3 years at Maine.........(1990-92)
201-122 (62.2%):.........26th season at Iowa (1999-present)
..................................................................
213-143 (59.83%) Overall Record
========================
When Kirk hit win #200 he became the 24th Division I coach to reach that milestone.
Hall of fame coach? No. What’s the biggest win of his career? The Orange Bowl against GT? lol, Kirk has been a mostly good steward of Iowa, but the nepotism bullshit has tarnished his legacy. I honestly don’t understand why so many gloss over that whole debacle with his dipshit son. It was disgusting, and it would still be ongoing if Beth hadn’t stepped in. Move on old man.
not sure how many years left he has but he seems to really love showing up at the facility every day
I mean, for $17k per day, I would, as well.
If he's not eligible for the HOF, all he has to do is look at family photos and see Brian!
Even more to like.Maybe I am missing something.
$7,000,000/365 days a year = $19,178.08
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