WH: Child transitioning is between the parents and their child.
- Thread starter FAUlty Gator
- Start date
Yes. I posted it. You obviously didn't if you're saying I chopped it. And as usual, you incorrectly read something into it that isn't happening.
You chopped of the headline and posted a blatant lie. Haha. Stop it. You are embarrassing yourself. Am I lying?
Again ... you stated this:
FDA: The monovalent Moderna and Pfizer vax no longer authorized for use in the United States.
Again...the first paragraph stated this.
The monovalent Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccines are no longer authorized for use in the United States.
Now eat shit, you goddamned moron.
Today, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration amended the emergency use authorizations (EUAs) of the Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 bivalent mRNA vaccines to simplify the vaccination schedule for most individuals.
Also:
With the changes, the only mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines authorized and in use in the country will be the bivalent formulations from Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech, which initially rolled out last fall. These vaccines target the ancestral COVID-19 strain and the omicron BA.4/5 subvariants.
This is 100% false. No school is transitioning child. What they are doing is not informing parents their child wants to transition. Is the teacher buying them a new wardrobe. Is the school bus dropping them off at the pediatric endocrinologist? It's statement like that, that are creating a false crisis.
Social transition is included as part of gender transition. If a teacher is using different pronouns than what the parents know about, this is helping the child transition without the parents knowledge.
"Transition: The process of shifting toward a gender role different from that assigned at birth, which can include social transition, such as new names, pronouns and clothing, and medical transition, such as hormone therapy or surgery."
Defining transgender terms
A glossary of language used to describe transgender and gender non-conforming experiences.
www.apa.org
Meh, by definition of medical experts on next phases of care, social transition is required 24 hours a day. THe OP said they were "transitioning" them. Using different pronouns is not enough to transition a patient. Patient who are in the opposite gender at home but not at work aren't considered socially transitioned when looking at surgical and hormonal criteria. Thanks for playing.Social transition is included as part of gender transition. If a teacher is using different pronouns than what the parents know about, this is helping the child transition without the parents knowledge.
"Transition: The process of shifting toward a gender role different from that assigned at birth, which can include social transition, such as new names, pronouns and clothing, and medical transition, such as hormone therapy or surgery."
Defining transgender terms
A glossary of language used to describe transgender and gender non-conforming experiences.
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I get your point, but transitioning is not all or nothing. It is a continuum.
Coming out as gender divergent is a massive step in the transition process. If a teacher is openly using alternate pronouns, then they are participating in the transition process.
Most people I talked to have said that 'Coming out' was one of the hardest parts of the transition process. If a teacher is helping the student come out, then they are enabling the student.
A teacher should not have access to the mental health records of a student, so how does the teacher know if the student is mentally capable of making this decision? After all, isnt that one of the diagnostic criteria? The patient must be capable of making the decision?
Well...They're buying them boob flatteners, as in the article. Now go ahead and pretend there's some monumental world of difference between those things.
These transgender discussions remind me of an old nursery rhyme. It's almost as if stuff like this has happened before.
Does anyone "The Emperors New Clothes"? It's a quick 5 min read if you don't remember.
https://www.nurseryrhymes.com/the-emperors-new-clothes-nursery-rhymes/
Does anyone "The Emperors New Clothes"? It's a quick 5 min read if you don't remember.
https://www.nurseryrhymes.com/the-emperors-new-clothes-nursery-rhymes/
@Urohawk
Do you think a child should be able to socially transition without any input from parents, counselors, teachers, doctors? (child makes the decision to change pronouns independently)
Should certain criteria have to be met before the teacher starts using different pronouns (at the child's request)? Or should the child be able to tell the teacher what they want to go by without oversight?
I'm curious if any teachers here can give insight on the exact process the child goes through to change their pronouns.
Do you think a child should be able to socially transition without any input from parents, counselors, teachers, doctors? (child makes the decision to change pronouns independently)
Should certain criteria have to be met before the teacher starts using different pronouns (at the child's request)? Or should the child be able to tell the teacher what they want to go by without oversight?
I'm curious if any teachers here can give insight on the exact process the child goes through to change their pronouns.
I can't think of anything I hid from my parents as a kid that I wouldn't have also hidden from my teachers. Wonder why there are so many parents worried about their kids trusting their teachers more than them? Are they just dumb and easily fooled by reactionary propaganda or are they mainly just shitty parents?
One person. One person was shot here in KC for knocking on the wrong door. Are you at banning all guns now?
I don't consider that socially transitioning. I look at dozens of medical records a day and have no idea why Williams H Smith prefers to be called "Carl". If someone wants me to use a name and pronoun for them, I am happy to accommodate.
Many trans people I have encountered are sexually or physically abused, often by family. If the teacher is the one person, they turn to as a trust figure, then kudos to the teacher for connecting with the student and I hope that poor child finds some beacon of hope/trust. Note, I'm not saying the teacher is aware of the abuse which has mandatory reporting.
I think many of you live in a vacuum. My buddy is a 7th grade teacher and kids are sexting/having sex, vaping, smoking weed, etc. He had to have a talk with them about using condoms. I don't think the student came from a home that was providing good lessons on appropriate behavior nor do I think the teacher to parent phone call would have done much good. However, I do think he was "doing the right thing".
So you disagree with the definition of social transition according to the APA?
And you didn't answer my question about if a child alone should be able to change their pronouns without the help of a parent, teacher, counselor, or doctor.
Lastly, as a doctor, you don't see it as a huge red flag that many of your patients are sexually or physically abused by a family member? This is the same thing I have been saying for years now. These kids are traumatized and are going through ptsd from a previous experience. Gender transition has never been presented as a treatment for ptsd (nor should it be). Gender dysphoria is being presented to these people as a solution to their problem, but it won't work long term.
Send me your information that you want me to review from the APA regarding defining social transitioning. I don't know what they call it but changing a name wouldn't qualify as socially transitioned for surgical care under that definition. Changing one's name is a step in socially transitioning but it's not social transitioning itself.
I don't care if a child wants to change their name. I would probably engage the child and ask why and if they spoke to their parents about it as guidance but I'm not going to jump on the phone and tattle to their parents.
Some, not all have been abused. Yes, it's a red flag. That's why we do to psych evals and make them establish a longstanding history of gender dysphoria before doing surgery. It's why I reject people all the time for surgery. They have to have those issues controlled. It's what my peds colleagues do as well.
Gay used to be mentally ill. Seems socially acceptable now.
OK. Back to my question then. Do you support the plaintiff in that case? Also, how do you know this is the only one? If they're doing it without telling anyone, you don't think there's more? Apparently, the crap only hits the fan when the parents find out. And there are more of these types of lawsuits out there.
BTW I forgot to respond to this statement. Writing legislation mandating informing parents about potential transgender students is not a hill I need to die on. In fact it would be a point of contention I could compromise over since the topic is controversial and knowledge is not complete. However, you should ask that same question of the republication legislators across the country. Are they the best to determine competency of the patient?
According to the article:
Administrators at the Maine school add that confidentiality requirements have prevented them from responding to “a grossly inaccurate and one-sided story” that began circulating on social media. The superintendent didn’t immediately return a message seeking comment Thursday.
So I would kind of like to hear the other side before automatically assuming that everything this parent is saying is absolute fact.
I don't think it was appropriate to provide a chest binder. I do think it's fine to support their name and pronoun use. People sue all the time hoping to make money. I would rather have someone sue to change policy if they're going to do so. I'm sure they will want a pay out which they don't deserve.
And that's the exact premise of the thread. If you believe this is something that "should be kept between a parent and their child", then how can you also advocate it being kept from the parent at the same time?
Because I can't fathom how a parent would be so unaware that their child is showing signs of being transgender or would have such a crappy relationship that they wouldn't have some conversations but I'm sure it happens.
I generally assume that most teachers are looking to help out my kids.
I posted the link and definition of transition in post #50. Obviously a name change is not a complete transition but it is the start of it.
Defining transgender terms
A glossary of language used to describe transgender and gender non-conforming experiences.
www.apa.org
It is scary to me that you "don't care" if a child changes their name and identifies as trans without speaking to a single adult.
Should we start letting kids self diagnose other medical conditions as well? Why do we even need doctors if kids are so informed that they can self diagnose as being trans. I think this is a testament as to how big of a sham trans care is.
Because changing their name isn't permanent or a point needing safeguard. Stop clutching your pearls or your fingers may go numb.I posted the link and definition of transition in post #50. Obviously a name change is not a complete transition but it is the start of it.
Defining transgender terms
A glossary of language used to describe transgender and gender non-conforming experiences.
It is scary to me that you "don't care" if a child changes their name and identifies as trans without speaking to a single adult.
Should we start letting kids self diagnose other medical conditions as well? Why do we even need doctors if kids are so informed that they can self diagnose as being trans. I think this is a testament as to how big of a sham trans care is.
It's scary my kids may get shot due to easy access to guns. It's even scarier that their school has bullet holes in the bricks outside and I live in a highly segregated, rich neighborhood, with overpriced houses because some wacko got a gun. Gun deaths are the number one killer of kids and the leading cause of death.
Stopping points sit with the professionals- psych, peds endocrine, various surgeons. Teachers have enough on their minds rather than wading into trans issues.
Yes, it is important for legislators to step in and stop kids from receiving 'trans' care. Children are not mentally or emotionally mature enough to make these decisions.BTW I forgot to respond to this statement. Writing legislation mandating informing parents about potential transgender students is not a hill I need to die on. In fact it would be a point of contention I could compromise over since the topic is controversial and knowledge is not complete. However, you should ask that same question of the republication legislators across the country. Are they the best to determine competency of the patient?
Kids are too easily influenced by parents, doctors, teachers and do not understand the impact of the decision. Kids will go along with things because they don't know any better or because they don't want to disagree with an authority figure.
There are way too many variables at play, and the consequences when you're wrong are too high with kids. It goes against the hippocratic oath to treat children under 18 for trans care.
The teacher is an adult.I posted the link and definition of transition in post #50. Obviously a name change is not a complete transition but it is the start of it.
Defining transgender terms
A glossary of language used to describe transgender and gender non-conforming experiences.
It is scary to me that you "don't care" if a child changes their name and identifies as trans without speaking to a single adult.
Should we start letting kids self diagnose other medical conditions as well? Why do we even need doctors if kids are so informed that they can self diagnose as being trans. I think this is a testament as to how big of a sham trans care is.
You can't stop how people see themselves thru legislation.
So you think all of those people don't have some professionalism or vested interest in making the "right call" for kids and doing what they think is best. You honestly don't think I don't understand the impact of severing a penis off a human body?
So I have you down as a vote to ban guns because that's a more major threat to children than transgender care? A total ban is the only way to go because there are way too many variables at play, and the consequences when you're wrong are too high with kids.
There are a lot of providers who are just going through the motions and doing what the "standards of care" say. Most providers don't really believe it, but they also don't want to speak out against it.So you think all of those people don't have some professionalism or vested interest in making the "right call" for kids and doing what they think is best. You honestly don't think I don't understand the impact of severing a penis off a human body?
So I have you down as a vote to ban guns because that's a more major threat to children than transgender care? A total ban is the only way to go because there are way too many variables at play, and the consequences when you're wrong are too high with kids.
The care is also compartmentalized so no single individual is completely wrong. for example, the therapist sees they have a history of sexual trauma, but they refer the patient to the gender clinic anyway because the patient is confused and mentions they dont like their breasts. the gender doctor thinks, well the therapist wouldn't have referred if it wasn't legit, so I'll write a letter recommending therapy. the endocrinologist writes for hormones because that isn't causing permanent damage yet, the surgeon then gets the patient and thinks, well, to me they are suffering from ptsd, but 4 other providers signed off and the patient seems mentally competent with supportive parents, so let's do it. as a bonus the surgeries pay well since it's always covered and generate high rvus.
I have seen this play out just like this. I have seen how easily it is to get a letter of support.
No one wants to be the one to step in, especially because the patient will threaten to sue the second they don't get what they want.
There are also gender doctors who think everyone they see is trans. I don't know of a single disease where close to 100% of the patients who walk in are diagnosed as trans. This is why I criticize the diagnostic criteria, since there is none.
As far as guns, guns are not the reason people kill others. it is the underlying issues. just like with trans patients, we ignore the underlying problems and put the blame elsewhere.
I have not read about anyone deciding to shoot up a school because they had an assault rifle laying around. Instead, they got the assault rifle because they wanted to kill as many people as they could. These people are very angry and feel wronged. If we take away the assault rifle, they will use a shotgun or pipe bomb, or something else.
I am open to gun reform, but this is not the solution to gun violence.
Looks like another "between parents and their child" situation bites the dust. Not to mention the whole "Re-uniting separated families" jargon we always hear about at the border.
Imagine the state locating your missing child and not notifying you that they have them.
Bill in Washington state passes SB 5599. If a kid runs away from home, the state doesn't have to contact the parent if the kid is seeking to get an abortion or transition genders.
Imagine the state locating your missing child and not notifying you that they have them.
Bill in Washington state passes SB 5599. If a kid runs away from home, the state doesn't have to contact the parent if the kid is seeking to get an abortion or transition genders.
