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Why is Black face wrong?

fredjr82 said:
Who the F are you to tell people what should or shouldn't offend them? I don't find it reasonable that people are offended by abortion (I know, I know) so it's not reasonable for you to be offended by those getting them. Feel free to share what else we're not allowed to be offended by since you seem to be both judge and jury in that environment.
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So we should do everything in our lives based around the possibility that someone might be offended somewhere? Because you certainly don't do that.

I'm trying to figure out the message here because this isn't making any sense to me.

Was it wrong for this guy to dress up as Kanye West because it turns out that some people where offended by it?
 
5446myno said:
I specifically told you it didn't matter if you understood or agreed. So I'm most certainly not telling you that you need to feel offended by anything, so you're missing the mark.

And no one's seeking to deny you any rights. I have yet to see anyone suggest blackface be illegal, so I'm not sure what you're on about, really. You're the one telling people how they should feel, not giving a damn if they feel differently than you think they should.

In short, you're being a jackass. Please stop.
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Look, it's not my goal to piss people off by this or to fight the world. My thought is, most people call for jobs for stuff like this while it's perfectly OK for people to do white face. Maybe the guy is a jerk in his daily life, but I just dislike this knee jerk reaction from people making him out to be horrible and possibly putting his job at risk.

I see your point, but it just doesn't usually work that way as it plays out in the media.
 
fredjr82 said:
Who the F are you to tell people what should or shouldn't offend them? I don't find it reasonable that people are offended by abortion (I know, I know) so it's not reasonable for you to be offended by those getting them. Feel free to share what else we're not allowed to be offended by since you seem to be both judge and jury in that environment.
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I can't answer for him, but I'll share one topic that is repeated from my OP. I don't feel people should be offended by stuff that shows up hypocritically in other areas where no offense is shown. It doesn't necessarily mean they are an idiot, but they are a hypocrite which is almost worse. Being a hypocrite is part of the problem that drives racism.
 
shopping


Racist?
 
Oh good, myno (the biggest racist here) is back! I shall have fun making it aware of all of the double-standards in our society.
 
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Frankly, I don't think this guy should be crucified for the black face. He should be crucified for the idea of a Kanye/Kardasian couples costume. They should both be beaten, tied up in a sack, and thrown in the river.
 
Hoosierhawkeye said:
So we should do everything in our lives based around the possibility that someone might be offended somewhere? Because you certainly don't do that.

I'm trying to figure out the message here because this isn't making any sense to me.

Was it wrong for this guy to dress up as Kanye West because it turns out that some people where offended by it?
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Why did he apologize for it? If he or his superiors didn't feel what he did was wrong, why issue the apology? I'm not saying we should stop doing that things that offend people. You're always going to offend someone even with best intentions. What I'm saying is that YOU don't get to call people unreasonable if they are offended by it just like we don't get to call you unreasonable for being offended by stances on certain subjects.

If the guy wants to dress up as Bruce Willis from Die Hard with Vengeance with a "I HATE N*****" sign around his neck then he can knock himself out and go for it. Don't be a pussy and apologize when people get offended by it.

People who have been affected by domestic abuse may be offended by this

ray-rice-photo-u1.jpg


People against abortion may find this offensive

an-aborted-baby-photo-u1.jpg


Bottom line, YOU don't get to be judge and jury for telling people they're being unreasonable in what they find offensive and don't.
 
Hoosierhawkeye said:
No I'm suggesting that we don't run down the name of people for a few unreasonable people being offended.
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I'll ask again since you're struggling with this. Why do you think you get to determine what's it's reasonable for other people to find offensive?

If you want to dress in blackface, go for it. Just know that others find it hurtful and offensive, and it's their right to say so if you make that choice.

The thing I'm wondering is why it would mean so much to someone to dress in blackface that they would do so even though they know how so many other people feel about it? It seems to lack basic human decency, to be honest. Hence my asking people to simply try not to be a jackass. That's all it really takes, and we could move on to other things as a society. Just a thought.
 
fredjr82 said:
Why did he apologize for it? If he or his superiors didn't feel what he did was wrong, why issue the apology? I'm not saying we should stop doing that things that offend people. You're always going to offend someone even with best intentions. What I'm saying is that YOU don't get to call people unreasonable if they are offended by it just like we don't get to call you unreasonable for being offended by stances on certain subjects.
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Re the bolded: Isn't that what you already do?

Re the rest: Fair enough. . . but the guy likely apologized because his job was under threat for something he did in his personal life. I'm not saying that if something is egregious enough that a job shouldn't be under threat. But I think part of what the school board has to decide eventually is the reasonableness of those who are offended by it in determining if they are going to fire him or not. So at some point with many of these things, people have to sit down and hash out the reasonableness of the offense.

People against abortion may find this offensive

an-aborted-baby-photo-u1.jpg
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Not me. . . She's basically playing a zombie pregnant woman with a zombie baby as far as I can tell.

Bottom line, YOU don't get to be judge and jury for telling people they're being unreasonable in what they find offensive and don't.
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True but my point is that when we get down to hashing out if this guy can continue his job the people who are deciding that have to decide how reasonable it was for people to be offended by his actions. As they can't just start firing every time someone is offended nor could they allow someone to continue to teach if that person did do the Die Hard thing. So in the end public officials are in a sense left to decide if he gets to keep his job and how much to punish him based on how reasonable the offense was. Because there is literally no other basis on which they could decide such things.
 
Hoosierhawkeye said:
Re the bolded: Isn't that what you already do?
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Why do you get the feeling this is something that I do? Are you insinuating that I call people unreasonable for what they get offended about?

Hoosierhawkeye said:
Not me. . . She's basically playing a zombie pregnant woman with a zombie baby as far as I can tell.
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I wasn't referring to you. Would you call people unreasonable if they were offended by the pic of the abortion costume?

Hoosierhawkeye said:
True but my point is that when we get down to hashing out if this guy can continue his job the people who are deciding that have to decide how reasonable it was for people to be offended by his actions. As they can't just start firing every time someone is offended nor could they allow someone to continue to teach if that person did do the Die Hard thing. So in the end public officials are in a sense left to decide if he gets to keep his job and how much to punish him based on how reasonable the offense was. Because there is literally no other basis on which they could decide such things.
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That is not what you were implying by the below statment

It's not reasonable to be offended by someone dressed up as Kanye West unless you happen to be Kanye West.

Your response basically indicates that anyone offended by "Black Face Kanye" is being unreasonable which an absurd statement.
 
5446myno said:
I'll ask again since you're struggling with this. Why do you think you get to determine what's it's reasonable for other people to find offensive?

If you want to dress in blackface, go for it. Just know that others find it hurtful and offensive, and it's their right to say so if you make that choice.

The thing I'm wondering is why it would mean so much to someone to dress in blackface that they would do so even though they know how so many other people feel about it? It seems to lack basic human decency, to be honest. Hence my asking people to simply try not to be a jackass. That's all it really takes, and we could move on to other things as a society. Just a thought.
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As I described to Fred the decision on if this guy keeps his job will come down to the school board deciding how reasonable it was to be offended by what he did. There is simply no other standard by which they could based their decision on.

I would agree somewhat but my personal issue is that if you give way to that too much then it's very easy for people to control other people through the use of "being offended". Should we have a society where we are able control one another by claiming offense?

So eventually again I think people have to decide if other people's offense to something is reasonable or not. Hence this is why we have debates on this topic and others like the confederate flag.
 
fredjr82 said:
Why do you get the feeling this is something that I do? Are you insinuating that I call people unreasonable for what they get offended about?
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You insinuate that my views on abortion are unreasonable all of the time.

I wasn't referring to you. Would you call people unreasonable if they were offended by the pic of the abortion costume?
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Yes. . . now if they where there in front of me then I would at least hear them out as to the reason they are offended just like I would listen to the people that this this offensive if they where here.

But only given what I know now, I find both to be unreasonable. For example what I know now about the offensiveness of the Kanye West costume is that it is because black face used to be used in the past in for very terrible and negative racial caricatures. My response is that I acknowledge that but I do not believe it is reasonable to generalize the two.

That is not what you were implying by the below statment

It's not reasonable to be offended by someone dressed up as Kanye West unless you happen to be Kanye West.

Your response basically indicates that anyone offended by "Black Face Kanye" is being unreasonable which an absurd statement.
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I'm implying that at least in my own view such offense is not reasonable. Eventually the reasonableness of it will have to be determined by the school board.

But eventually when it comes to these things every group and individual has to come to their own conclusions as to if something would reasonably be offensive. I think that takes education, insight, discussion and empathy and perhaps we arn't going to agree on all of the same things but we can't just allow people being offended to control what we do.
 
A lot of pussies in this thread. Halloween is a time to offend people. If you're complaining about people getting offended and getting offended at their complaining, you are missing the point. Go get freaky and ignore or revel in the complaints.
 
naturalmwa said:
A lot of pussies in this thread. Halloween is a time to offend people. If you're complaining about people getting offended and getting offended at their complaining, you are missing the point. Go get freaky and ignore or revel in the complaints.
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This guy gets it. On a side note, this thread has me really thinking about what to be for my Halloween party? Hmmm....only a few more days to decide.
 
naturalmwa said:
A lot of pussies in this thread. Halloween is a time to offend people. If you're complaining about people getting offended and getting offended at their complaining, you are missing the point. Go get freaky and ignore or revel in the complaints.
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You are correct.I like you,but I don't want you getting frisky with Lil Jerry.That's not how The Sailor and lil jerry roll.
 
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MichiganManLifer said:
This is another stupid double standard out there. Why on earth is it not OK to dress up like a celebrity for Halloween? This isn't racist or even malicious. Can somebody tell me a good reason why these people are under attack?

9099046_G.jpg


A teacher at Chestnut Grove Elementary School with Decatur City Schools apologized on Monday morning for using blackface as part of his Halloween costume.

The Decatur City Board of Education held a meeting Monday morning to discuss the fifth grade teacher, Heath Morrow, who wore blackface to dress up as Kanye West for Halloween.

The picture gained international attention when the Daily Mail reported Morrow dressed as Kanye West and his wife joined him as Kim Kardashian West in an early Halloween celebration effort.

Decatur City Schools Superintendent Dr. Ed Nichols read a letter from Morrow where he apologized from his error in judgment and said his intentions were not malicious. In the letter, he said he wasn't raised that way and he has not taught his kids that way.

Morrow said he and his wife made a decision based on celebrity and political climates and he doesn't want that to reflect on Chestnut Grove Elementary.

Here's a look at the letter from Morrow:

To whom this may concern:

I would like to first apologize for my error in judgment. My intentions were not malicious or directed toward any certain group of people. I would also like to say that everyone who knows my character and knows my heart, knows that I have never seen color in my life. I wasn’t raised or taught that way and do not raise my children that way. I see people for who they are, and my wife and I go out of our way to help anyone we can in my profession as an educator. When deciding to dress up for a Halloween party, my wife and I made a decision based on celebrities and the political climate today. I do not want this to reflect on my school or school system based on my poor decision that I made. Again I apologize and this will not happen again.

Sincerely,

Heath Morrow


http://www.wistv.com/story/30349647...eacher-who-wore-black-face?clienttype=generic
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Why do adults find it necessary to "dress up" for Halloween? I used to dress for the occassion......back in HS for a church youth group function...I think I was 15.
 
joelbc1 said:
Why do adults find it necessary to "dress up" for Halloween? I used to dress for the occassion......back in HS for a church youth group function...I think I was 15.
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Because some people don't enjoy spending each night sitting on their front porch yelling at the neighborhood kids to stay off of their lawn. You have seriously never been to a costume party as an adult? It's fine if you haven't; but I have found many of them quite fun.
 
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Big_Palooka said:
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Because some people don't enjoy spending each night sitting on their front porch yelling at the neighborhood kids to stay off of their lawn. You have seriously never been to a costume party as an adult? It's fine if you haven't; but I have found many of them quite fun.
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Serious(ly) as a heart attack. Never. Ever. How much fun can you have?
 
5446myno said:
I've never come across anyone who used the term SJW" as a perjorative that wasn't an ahole.

"Whiteface" doesn't have the same racial implications because it hasn't been used as a means of mocking white people for centuries. But it's fine if you don't understand that, as long as you aren't so arrogant you think that you get to decide what others find offensive, or such an ahole that you don't actually care what offends those around you.

In other words, just don't be a jackass and you'll be fine. If you insist on spending your energy fighting for your right to be a jackass, then don't be surprised if people call you one. It's not complicated.
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I will proudly use SJW as a pejorative because I HATE what those people stand for even though I usually agree with them on issues. Absolute scum, most of them. The term does not refer to all people who believe in social justice. Just those who engage in social media campaigns after reading hearsay of something they don't like on Jezebel or Gawker. One must lack all self-awareness if one behaves the way they do while thinking it's good/right/just. I suspect they think they're marching in Selma and deserve that kind of respect for their heroics. I really hope they all go stand in front of a real tank.
 
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naturalmwa said:
Oh lord, don't get me started. How much fun would you like to have? Halloween is the high holy holiday of fun.
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Really? Never thought of it as such. For me, the "high holy day of fun" is the first round of the men's NCAA basketball tournament in March. Never understood the foolishness of Halloween. Seems silly to me. BTW...I keep my lights off and don't answer the door.
 
joelbc1 said:
Really? Never thought of it as such. For me, the "high holy day of fun" is the first round of the men's NCAA basketball tournament in March. Never understood the foolishness of Halloween. Seems silly to me. BTW...I keep my lights off and don't answer the door.
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Well it's a Saturday this year, so you should be at the club, grinding on partially naked people you can't quite tell if they are hot. Being silly is part of the appeal.
 
joelbc1 said:
Really? Never thought of it as such. For me, the "high holy day of fun" is the first round of the men's NCAA basketball tournament in March. Never understood the foolishness of Halloween. Seems silly to me. BTW...I keep my lights off and don't answer the door.
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Dude, three words:

girls... sexy... costumes.

But you can watch basketball if you want...
 
joelbc1 said:
Why do adults find it necessary to "dress up" for Halloween? I used to dress for the occassion......back in HS for a church youth group function...I think I was 15.
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I don't usually dress up for Halloween because I don't usually go to Halloween parties. But if you have the time for that then it can be fun even for adults.

Adults probably have more fun with it because they don't get the pre-packaged costumes but instead often get creative on their own.

As long as they arn't out trick or treating for themselves or something like that then it's just harmless fun usually.
 
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