Will Supreme Court allow workers to skip shifts for religious reasons?

[JRHawk2003]

This guy is mad the USPS made him work Sundays because they contracted with Amazon. Boo-hoo.

If he gets his way. It would create a nightmare for employers.

But with this clown car court, I would not rule it out.

Sabbath Showdown

 

[ConvenientParking]

He gets hired at USPS which historically doesn't work a lot of Sundays. They start requiring more Sunday work because they contract with Amazon? Nah, siding with the post man on this one.

 

[Hoosierhawkeye]

If employers can accommodate the disabled they can accommodate religious employees.

Especially when they are going and changing the terms of employment on already existing employees.

When he took the job Sundays were off. It's not like he came into a place that told him he would have to work Sundays and demanded they give him Sundays off.

 

[JRHawk2003]

 

[mnole03]

The requirements changed. Find a new job.

Publix used to be closed on Sundays. Now they’re not.

 

[ConvenientParking]

Maybe they should stop trying to operate USPS similarly to a for-profit business. Ideological dogshit. It's a subsidized service, let's subsidize higher wages so they don't have issues with staffing.

 

[Red Hills Nole]

If employers can accommodate the disabled they can accommodate religious employees.

Especially when they are going and changing the terms of employment on already existing employees.

When he took the job Sundays were off. It's not like he came into a place that told him he would have to work Sundays and demanded they give him Sundays off.

Power To The People! said some guy named Mao. Everyone can find a reason to be looked down on. Get over yourself dude.

 

[The Tradition]

The question before the court is what constitutes an undue hardship.

Under current case law, employers have a duty to accommodate religious conflicts with work requirements unless the requested accommodation causes more than a de minimis hardship on the operation of the business.

In this case, the post office was short-staffed, and therefore it was an undue hardship to guarantee him Sundays off.

It will be interesting to see if the justices maintain the status quo, or change the rules on how this will work going forward.

 

[cfbfan23]

The requirements changed. Find a new job.

Publix used to be closed on Sundays. Now they’re not.

This. Simple and to the point.

If you don't like it, go to work at Hobby Lobby or Chik-fil-A.

 

[ConvenientParking]

There's no reason USPS should be experiencing staffing issues except for the adoption of neoliberal ideology. It was never supposed to be a for-profit enterprise or operate akin to one. They *should* enjoy advantages in hiring (like subsidized higher than market wages) that most firms don't. They never should have had to contract with Amazon in the first place.

 

[ConvenientParking]

This. Simple and to the point.

If you don't like it, go to work at Hobby Lobby or Chik-fil-A.

Amazon could own or destroy both of those companies by 2050. What then?

 

[DooBi]

He was willing to work nights and every holiday. I would work for somebody on Sundays to not have to work any holidays and nights.

 

[DooBi]

The question before the court is what constitutes an undue hardship.

Under current case law, employers have a duty to accommodate religious conflicts with work requirements unless the requested accommodation causes more than a de minimis hardship on the operation of the business.

In this case, the post office was short-staffed, and therefore it was an undue hardship to guarantee him Sundays off.

It will be interesting to see if the justices maintain the status quo, or change the rules on how this will work going forward.

It shouldn't be his fault or responsibility that they are short staffed imo.

 

[ConvenientParking]

He was willing to work nights and every holiday. I would work for somebody on Sundays to not have to work any holidays and nights.

He's willing to work 6 days per week rain, sleet, or snow and there's apparently no place for him. The article is insinuating his situation is part of the problem with staffing issues at USPS. That is next level bullshit.

 

[OILCHECKER]

I think one of the staffing issues with USPS is that you don't get weekends off and you rarely get two days off back to back. You will pretty much always have to work Saturdays and then get Sunday off. Your other day off is typically some random day in the middle of the week. And if you don't have seniority, you are going to be forced to work Sunday delivering Amazon packages. If you have no life, it's a good/easy gig where you will get a ton of overtime and make decent money with limited skills or training.

 

[JRHawk2003]

People are hung up on USPS. Its not about the USPS.

Its the fact that employer can change their the days they are open. I cant believe you are on the fence on this Trad.

 

[tarheelbybirth]

They never should have had to contract with Amazon in the first place.

They should turn down what is likely a large source of revenue? Why?

 

[NoleATL]

If employers can accommodate the disabled they can accommodate religious employees.

Especially when they are going and changing the terms of employment on already existing employees.

When he took the job Sundays were off. It's not like he came into a place that told him he would have to work Sundays and demanded they give him Sundays off.

While I agree with you that religious people may be considered disabled, are you saying employers are never allowed to change any terms of employment after employment commences or are you saying this should only be for religious reasons?

 

[ConvenientParking]

They should turn down what is likely a large source of revenue? Why?

They had their hand forced in needing the revenue, they were never supposed to be chasing revenue. It was originally supposed to be a subsidized service. Apparently the extra work they took on for the revenue they needed is causing staffing issues now.

 

[NoleATL]

People are hung up on USPS. Its not about the USPS.

Its the fact that employer can change their the days they are open. I cant believe you are on the fence on this Trad.

He's only on the fence because it regards religion... kind of ironic in that his behavior on HROT is anything but christian... I wonder what religion?

 

[Hoosierhawkeye]

While I agree with you that religious people may be considered disabled, are you saying employers are never allowed to change any terms of employment after employment commences or are you saying this should only be for religious reasons?

My thought is that if you are changing those terms and in changing those terms you are creating additional difficulties when it comes to conflicts between their job duties and either their religion or their disability than you should have a much higher bar when it comes to accomodations.

That would be like Wal-Mart employing disabled greeters in wheelchairs with the understanding that their job is to just greet customers, then telling them they have to start stocking the top shelf without assistance on top of their duties as a greeter.

 

[JRHawk2003]

He's only on the fence because it regards religion... kind of ironic in that his behavior on HROT is anything but christian... I wonder what religion?

Usually he is 100% company man lol

 

[The Tradition]

He's only on the fence because it regards religion... kind of ironic in that his behavior on HROT is anything but christian... I wonder what religion?

I'm Agnostic. I'd have the same opinion no matter what the employee's sincerely held religious beliefs are.

And really, I'm not rooting for either side in this dispute. My hope is that a new Supreme Court ruling will create more clarity regarding the employer's duty to accommodate.

 

[JRHawk2003]

If this ruling passes, I predict a conversion to whatever religion offers the most holidays

 

[pablow]

The question before the court is what constitutes an undue hardship.

Under current case law, employers have a duty to accommodate religious conflicts with work requirements unless the requested accommodation causes more than a de minimis hardship on the operation of the business.

In this case, the post office was short-staffed, and therefore it was an undue hardship to guarantee him Sundays off.

It will be interesting to see if the justices maintain the status quo, or change the rules on how this will work going forward.

I think the "reasonable accommodation" test that equates "reasonable" with "de minimis" (i.e. trivial, small, etc.) will be tossed and case will be remanded.

 

[Hoosierhawkeye]

He's only on the fence because it regards religion... kind of ironic in that his behavior on HROT is anything but christian... I wonder what religion?

Couldn't the opposite accusation be made of some here. That they usually support workers rights but suddenly when it's a religious accommodation that is being requested they just want to tell him to get another job??

 

[Finance85]

I think the "reasonable accommodation" test that equates "reasonable" with "de minimis" (i.e. trivial, small, etc.) will be tossed and case will be remanded.

This is the crux of the issue that many seem to be missing.

 

[JRHawk2003]

This is the crux of the issue that many seem to be missing.

Seems rational, but we are talking about a clown car of a court. The fact that they even agreed to hear it is pathetic.

 

[The Tradition]

If this ruling passes, I predict a conversion to whatever religion offers the most holidays

In my professional life, the religious group that requests the Sabbath off are overwhelmingly Seventh Day Adventists (they can't work from sundown on Friday until sundown on Saturday).

I haven't seen mass conversions to that faith in order to get Saturdays off.

 

[gohawks50]

That would be like Wal-Mart employing disabled greeters in wheelchairs with the understanding that their job is to just greet customers, then telling them they have to start stocking the top shelf without assistance on top of their duties as a greeter.

I think this is a bad analogy. A person confined to a wheelchair would be unable to stock the top shelf no matter what the company asks. The USPS worker is physically able to work on Sundays, but because of his religious beliefs does not think he should.

I think this is a contract issue. If the USPS worker signed a contract that guaranteed Sundays off he should win the lawsuit. If the terms of his employment he agreed to did not designate which days he would be required to work then he has no case in my opinion.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

find new job. People like this suck. I'm all for a union helping dictate working conditions but this is shit.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

If this ruling passes, I predict a conversion to whatever religion offers the most holidays

Festivus will allow me to air my grievances with my employer and assign new holidays and work conditions... who needs a union.

 

[Aardvark86]

Personally, on Tuesday, I'll be much more focused on SuperValue.

 

[Rifler]

Things can change in the world of business, and employers will always need the right to schedule their work,. Workers, on the other hand, will always retain the right to seek employment elsewhere...

 

[Hoosierhawkeye]

I think this is a bad analogy. A person confined to a wheelchair would be unable to stock the top shelf no matter what the company asks. The USPS worker is physically able to work on Sundays, but because of his religious beliefs does not think he should.

I think this is a contract issue. If the USPS worker signed a contract that guaranteed Sundays off he should win the lawsuit. If the terms of his employment he agreed to did not designate which days he would be required to work then he has no case in my opinion.

Because of his principles he is unable to work on Sunday.

Most jobs don't have a signed contract.

 

[hydro2.0]

Just signed up at the local mosque. I am now ibin Al-hydro and all days ending in “y” I shall rest

 

[SSG T]

I'm torn.

For one, there should absolutely be other options for work scheduling, especially for a religious reason (applied equally for all religions).

On the other hand, was there extra compensation for it being a Sunday (OT or comp time)?

This goes to CPs comment about USPS is a service provided by the government. It's not supposed to be a business. Yeah, don't waste taxpayer dollars. But, don't try to squeeze every dime out of the serve either.

 

[Aardvark86]

Just signed up at the local mosque. I am now ibin Al-hydro and all days ending in “y” I shall rest

just, whatever you do, don't sign up for jehovah's witnesses

 

[hydro2.0]

just, whatever you do, don't sign up for jehovah's witnesses

If it gets me the day off I’ll witness that ass all day

 

[THE_DEVIL]

(IMHO) Religion wins on this. It seems to me that the Roberts court always defers to the hands of religion. I could be wrong though.