And took a bad loss to Indiana on the road.
To an outsider it doesn’t seem like a melt down streak that can’t be remedied?
To an outsider it doesn’t seem like a melt down streak that can’t be remedied?
You’ve lost to #4, #6 beat MSU
- Thread starter zappaa
- Start date
Leave us alone,.. we have wrists to slit...
Nobody wants your logic here ok! But seriously there’s serious PTSD from this being a historical problem.. If Iowa had made a S16 and not had a meltdown in previous Feb/March I don’t think the reaction would be this bad.
You don’t have last years B1G or NCAA tournament to use as reference.
Every basketball analyst in the country says The B1G gauntlet and strength lends itself to a 3 to 5 game skid, how you come out on the other side is what’s most important.
We’ve seen this slide before. Fran is reading the same choose your own adventure book and continuing to pick the same bad ending.
All he has to do is pick the other one. But never does.
All he has to do is pick the other one. But never does.
If getting swept by a mediocre Indiana doesnt get a rotation shakeup going this is going to be a real head scratcher. With CJ out starting both Bohannon and CMac against B1G guards has been a huge problem. It seems as though Fran is ruining Toussaint this year. Guy is constantly playing on thin ice and it appears to be affecting his confidence. Perkins and Ulis as true frosh have to be going wtf right now. No consistency in their roles or playing time. Have to wonder if this is getting frustrating for them? Hard to get into a rythm when your roles and playing time is hit and miss. Mid season scouting report is out against the Iowa starters and once again Fran and Co. don't have an answer.
You mean it can't be remedied, right?
There's no fixing what's broken with this team. It just doesn't happen, especially at Iowa, and certainly has never happened since Fran came here.
When they break, even if they can throw 12 boxes of bandaids on it, they never ultimately repair whatever fundamental flaws they have.
I think they can still turn it around. I don't have faith in Fran to make the hard decisions buy he could. One or more of the Freshman could play well and force his hand to give more PT. Fredrick could get healthy.
Winning B1G regular season title is dead. They could get hot in time to do well in B1G tournament...winning
BTT and being hot going into NCAA would take away a lot of the sting.
Season is on the brink and it is 50/50 whether it gets worse or gets a lot better.
Fran is not capable of change. Any team with decent guards, which is every team in the big ten, is going to feast on Iowa. Give Garza his 25 after using 15 fouls to make his life tough down low. Get up on the guards and deny open looks and it's a W. Hard to find a worse shooting team than Indiana but they swept Iowa. Harper and Baker shot poorly for Rutgers in the first game and I don't see it happening again. MSU is clearing out a spot in the wood shed as I type this. Hope I am wrong, but this smacks of a Titanic type end to the season.
And it's going to be bad because it's become pretty apparent that Fran is second-guessing things now and that's never good, because that only results in indecision, not positive change......
Problem is we have Fran as a coach. He would need to recruit the equivalent of the Fab 5 to overcome his coaching and we know that isn't happening. Shelf life on Fran at Iowa has expired in my opinion.
You are correct, plus the fact the back up guards (Joe T., Perkins, Ulis) are not scorers. Yes, Joe T. can get to the rim at times but also note when it is often done. At the end of games when the 3 point shot is being guarded. Their time will come but they are not the answer right now. Like it or not, the true "scorer" off the bench is Patrick and to a lesser degree, Nunge. This team will be just fine once C.J. is healthy (big if?) and the rotation can go back to the way it was.
NO CJ, and the Fran skid has all of us fans pissed off. It happens to every single good team we have at Iowa under Fran. Feburary, late January hits and we start to flounder and lose games and look like we are hung over from a month long party. That is what Iowa fans are getting upset about.
*2 losses to Indiana Home & Away, lost 4 of 5, slipped from potential 1 seed to 4 seed currently, a coach and team that melts down 2nd half year after year. 5 of 7 remaining games against ranked opponents so potential to get much worse.
Funny you should say that. A couple of years ago I said that if you gave Fran the all conference BIG10
players, he still wouldn't win the championship. I believed that then and belief it now. He has several fatal flaws, that after 35 years, won't change.
It's quite the opposite if you think about it. According to 247 recruiting, our starting lineup has one 4 star, and four 3 star players currently. Everyone off the bench is a 3 star, except PM. So really, what you are doing, is not giving Fran enough credit for taking average recruits and turning them into a top 25 team, because of Pre-season expectations.
Comparison sake, Illinois starts 5 four star players.
MIchigan starts 4 four star players.
Indiana starts 3 four stars, and first guy off bench is a four star.
Wisky has 2 four stars.
OSU has 3 four stars.
A top 25 team? You realize Fran was gifted a top 5 ranking based on projections. That ranking was not earned. When given a chance to back that ranking up, what have we seen? Gonzaga loss fine. MN loss frustrating but ok, it was a fluke and the list goes on. Fran will finish out of the top 20 at the rate he is going. At what point does Fran do something in March? Ultimately I could care less about regular season or BTT titles, but I would like to see Fran get past the second round in the tournament. Is that asking too much in year 10 with a NPOY candidate?
I know you cited 247 which is good, however Rivals says we start 3 four players. CMAC, GARZA and WEISCAMP. CJ and JBO were both 3 stars. . 😎❤️🏀
Also first game where CJ was shut down. I don't know if he is the magic sauce to fix all the problems but he shouldn't be rushed back if he is... Save for BT Tournament and NCAA bracket play. BT title had been lost already
Not at all, just trying to add a little bit of positivity around here. I personally think this team makes a run in March, especially if CJ gets healthy. The big ten is just a b**** right now. We don't have any bad losses, but both Indiana losses are just disappointing, They are currently an NCAA tourney team. Every big ten team has its share of warts on the year, and that's largely just due to the extremely competitive conference. I think we Iowa fans need to just look around at what other things are happening outside of just our games.
Michigan got crushed by Minny, and if they were playing I'd say they'd have at least another loss.
Illinois lost to MD at home, and at Rutgers.
Rutgers lost to MSU and PSU.
OSU lost to Minnesota, NW, and Purdue twice.
Wisconsin lost to Marquette, Maryland, and PSU.
We haven't even had the luxury of getting the one damn layup in this conference, in Nebraska yet.
It was totally understandable for Fran to run with his guys while CJ was healthy because it was working. Fran needs to realize he can't just plug in some guy off the bench to play with the other our in the same way; the bench guys don't have CJ's game.
It seems like it would be obvious that a shakeup in style of play would follow. If using Ulis or Joe T as point for driving, scoring, or dishing to generate offense (part of the time at least, enough to keep other teams off balance), then add JBo and Weiskamp for perimeter shooting, Garza inside/out, and Murray to clean up the boards, lock down opposing 3, 4, or 5, and grab garbage buckets.
Off the bench is either Joe T or Ulis at point to give the other a breather or if not playing well, Perkins in for JBo, PMac for Joe W, Nunge backing up Murray and Garza, Connor for spot minutes at 2, 3, or 4 as needed for passing or a breather. If 2 of Garza, Murray, or Nunge gets in serious foul trouble (not 2 fouls) then go small with PMac at 4 and either Garza, Nunge, or Murray at the 5 depending on which isn't in foul trouble.
There are a lot of possible options, but using Joe T and Ulis for 40 minutes at point has never been tried and I wonder how much more consistent Iowa could be offensively and defensively with true point guards instead of using a shooting guard (Jb) as the point.
I think CJ is a very, very good player and I really enjoy watching his game, BUT, it's odd that a guy averaging 9 ppg (about 9, right?) when healthy is the missing link to our success.
He could in fact be a major factor in Iowa's recent plummet but man, I'm just not on board with it. The mismanagement of minutes is to blame. The failure to recognize what moments during a game call for WHAT type of player.
At the end of the last game, Fran's gotta get his quicker defenders out on the floor to better defend the obvious soon-to-be last second shot taken by IU. He didn't and dude put a good move on a slower Weiskamp. Maybe Fran's thought was to keep more lengthy defenders out there over the shorter quicker guy...
Lastly (Captain Obvious here), you CAN NOT have Luka on the bench that long!!! Good lord, Fran..........
I know.. i'm just a big time fan that 'coaches' from his couch..and actually being the coach during the game is much more difficult and hectic, and calls for quick recognition of a number of things but the two examples I noted above!?? Come on now. Good coaching must have taken a vacation b/c i'm not seeing it. At all.
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Nice emoticons. 😎
I have to say though, that retroactive ranking would have Garza as a 5 star, CJ as a 4 star, Joe W as a 3 or 4, JBo as a 3, and Connor a 2 star. Now that would be Connor as a 2 star guard; Fran starts the 2 star guard as the team's power forward. There is no true point guard and a slow shooting guard (3 star JBo) playing point.
So Fran is playing two guys out of position--one WOEFULLY out of position and overmatched on D--which does a lot to negate how good Garza, Joe W, and CJ could be if paired with a true point (Joe T or Ulis) and a true power forward (Murray).
Of course, CJ is out so Fran is now missing his 4 star guard and trying to replace his production and defense with ... I'm not actually sure what Fran has been doing. He's continued using Bohannon as point except for about 3 minutes per game when he plays JBo with Joe T and continues to run Connor in weird positions with weird combos that don't work offensively or defensively (sometimes neither is working).
Bottom line is that Fran is in love with Connor and JBo handling the point and the ball most of every game and he lets Joe T and Ulis gather moss on the bench.
EDIT: I'll add that Murray would probably be given 4 stars after seeing what he is doing as a freshman. Another reason to get him on the floor as much as possible.
If Murray is benched for Joe T or Ulis and they have 6 turnovers the screams will immediately follow on this board.
Rutgers will be tough because they have a big who’ll defend and they are so much quicker. Luka is getting to respect from the refs and is just getting mugged. Expect that to continue.
Both J Bo and Joe W have to be hot and able to get their shots off if we are to have a chance. It’s time to bet the farm on Rutgers.
Rutgers will be tough because they have a big who’ll defend and they are so much quicker. Luka is getting to respect from the refs and is just getting mugged. Expect that to continue.
Both J Bo and Joe W have to be hot and able to get their shots off if we are to have a chance. It’s time to bet the farm on Rutgers.
It's not so much the points he scores, although that alone would have probably given us wins in the last three losses,... It's what the threat of his offense does to open the floor for everyone else, especially Garza...
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That 9PPG would have probably given us wins against OSU, Illinois, and Indiana.
Well it's not really as simple as having him back would have just added 9 points to what our score was you do realize that right?
No, that's my entire thought process. Just add 9 points on and we win. LOL, come on.
Perkins, Joe, and Ulis played 25 minutes total against Indiana and provided 3 points, 3 rebounds, and 3 turnovers. I feel like if those 25 minutes go to CJ, we win. You?
Against Illinois, Perkins and Joe played 20 minutes, providing 8 points, 4 rebounds, 2 assists, 2 turnovers. Again, I feel if we have CJ we win.
That's just me, doesn't have to be you, I get it. I feel his 3 point presence is just daunting to other teams when he's in. Coaches have even pointed it out. We've lost by a combined 11 points against Ill, OSU, and Indiana. To think CJ's presence wouldn't have helped is silly, but that's this board right now.
If we were struggling to make 3s and spread the floor without CJ i would probably agree with you. But in our last 3 losses without him we are 32-78 41% from 3 which is better in terms of efficiency and volume than our season averages. We have plenty of shooters, we don't have defense and I don't think CJ makes us materially better on that side of the ball.
Could he have helped? Sure, but to lose mulitiple games even when we have above average shooting nights as a team is unacceptable if you are going to be elite.
Why bench Murray? I'd bench Connor. At this point, I think run with Joe T./Ulis, Bohannon, Weiskamp, Murray, and Garza. If Joe T is playing poorly or on foul trouble it's time to try Ulis as his backup for an entire game and leave Bohannon at the 2 with Perkins as his backup. When/if CJ gets back try going back to Bohannon at point since Iowa was 6-1 with that starting lineup. If that's not working, go with J/U at point and bring Bohannon off the bench to spell CJ.
This is video from when I talked one Hawkeye fan off the ledge.
Ok, so I had to force him.....
I highly doubt that MSU can take Iowa "out behind the woodshed". We've played poorly and still been in all these games but one until the last few seconds. MSU is NOT good.......
Hope you are right but the officiating will be way different. Garza on the bench early with 2 fouls does not bode well for Iowa.
God I hope it won't be any worse then that last game. That was a farse from the get go.......
You're trying to hard to ignore the obvious. CJ shoots 50% from three, so saying other guys coming in and shooting below his season average, taking the shots he would have, and then correlating that somehow to not mattering, isn't making sense to me. Murray, who is starting for CJ, is 1-7 in those losses. The triple teams are affecting Luka as well, as in our last 3 losses, he hasn't even hit 20 points. I'm as frustrated as anyone with these losses, but I'm also understanding that our opponents are good, and CJ's loss hurts. If we were losing by 15 points, I'd understand, but these games are really close. Hopefully, we can beat Rutgers and get back on track.
