A simple THANK YOU

[THE_DEVIL]

For all those who have served and are currently serving our country. You have chosen a path that not many can or do and we are the great country we are because of your choices. Although words can not come close to relaying the gratitude, respect and honor you deserve...

THANK YOU

 

[Vroom_C14]

Thank you to all who served before, with and after me.

 

[Nat Algren]

Happy Armistice day! This day has become a huuuuge propaganda day for the state in its march towards nationalism. The fedgov uses our tax dollars to shower the NFL with ads.

 

[shank hawk]

I refuse to thank the slackers: after all, there are three countries out there that we haven't invaded yet. Let's get back to work boys (and girls). No time to rest on our laurels.

According to Christopher Kelly and Stuart Laycock, the United States “has invaded or fought in eighty-four out of 194 countries” and “has had some form of military involvement with a spectacular 191 out of 194.” Their findings are published in the appropriately titled America Invades: How We’ve Invaded or Been Militarily Involved with Almost Every Country on Earth.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/11/laurence-m-vance/america-invader/

 

[Vroom_C14]

I refuse to thank the slackers: after all, there are three countries out there that we haven't invaded yet. Let's get back to work boys (and girls). No time to rest on our laurels.

According to Christopher Kelly and Stuart Laycock, the United States “has invaded or fought in eighty-four out of 194 countries” and “has had some form of military involvement with a spectacular 191 out of 194.” Their findings are published in the appropriately titled America Invades: How We’ve Invaded or Been Militarily Involved with Almost Every Country on Earth.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/11/laurence-m-vance/america-invader/

So stopping the nazi's was a bad thing? And the civil war and the revolutionary war...



I will pray for you.

 

[Nat Algren]

So stopping the nazi's was a bad thing? I will pray for you.

Maybe Wall Street shouldn't have built up Hitler.

http://www.vho.org/aaargh/fran/livres5/suttonhitler.pdf

 

[Vroom_C14]

Maybe Wall Street shouldn't have built up Hitler.

http://www.vho.org/aaargh/fran/livres5/suttonhitler.pdf

So now you are claiming hitler was made up... okay, tell that to all the jews.

I understand your angst, not everyone feels a need to thank someone for defending what they cannot. What's great is that those that have and are serving are the ones that have afforded you the right to think and voice freely - try that in some other countries and you are executed.

 

[The Tradition]

Geez, we can't even have a "thank you, vets" thread on Veterans Day without a bunch of snarky crapola?

 

[Vroom_C14]

In case you were wondering about what other countries have done (and the freedom you enjoy):

Human rights organizations have documented government-approved executions, acts of torture and rape for decades since Saddam Hussein came to power in 1979 until his fall in 2003.


Mass grave.

• In 2002, a resolution sponsored by the European Union was adopted by the Commission for Human Rights, which stated that there had been no improvement in the human rights crisis in Iraq. The statement condemned President Saddam Hussein's government for its "systematic, widespread and extremely grave violations of human rights and international humanitarian law". The resolution demanded that Iraq immediately put an end to its "summary and arbitrary executions... and the use of rape as a political tool and all enforced and involuntary disappearances".[1]

• Full political participation at the national level was restricted only to members of the Ba'ath Party, which constituted only 8% of the population.

• Iraqi citizens were not allowed to assemble legally unless it was to express support for the government. The Iraqi government controlled the establishment of political parties, regulated their internal affairs and monitored their activities.

• Police checkpoints on Iraq's roads and highways prevented ordinary citizens from traveling across country without government permission and expensive exitvisas prevented Iraqi citizens from traveling abroad. Before traveling, an Iraqi citizen had to post collateral. Iraqi females could not travel outside of the country without the escort of a male relative.[2]

• The activities of citizens living inside Iraq who received money from relatives abroad were closely monitored[citation needed].

• Halabja poison gas attack:The Halabja poison gas attack occurred in the period 15–19 March 1988 during the Iran–Iraq War when chemical weapons were used by the Iraqi government forces and thousands of civilians in the Iraqi Kurdish town of Halabja were killed.[3]

• Al-Anfal Campaign: In 1988, the Hussein regime began a campaign of extermination against the Kurdish people living in Northern Iraq. This is known as theAnfal campaign. The attacks resulted in the death of at least 182,000 people, many of them women and children. A team of Human Rights Watch investigators determined, after analyzing eighteen tons of captured Iraqi documents, testing soil samples and carrying out interviews with more than 350 witnesses, that the attacks on the Kurdish people were characterized by gross violations of human rights, including mass executions and disappearances of many tens of thousands of noncombatants, widespread use of chemical weapons including Sarin, mustard gas and nerve agents that killed thousands, the arbitrary imprisoning of tens of thousands of women, children, and elderly people for months in conditions of extreme deprivation, forced displacement of hundreds of thousands of villagers after the demolition of their homes, and the wholesale destruction of nearly two thousand villages along with their schools, mosques, farms and power stations.[3][4]

• In April 1991, after Saddam lost control of Kuwait in the Persian Gulf War, he cracked down ruthlessly against several uprisings in the Kurdish north and the Shiasouth. His forces committed full-scale massacres and other gross human rights violations against both groups similar to the violations mentioned before. Estimates of deaths during that time range from 20,000 to 100,000 for Kurds, and 60,000 to 130,000 for Shi'ites.[5]

• In June 1994, the Hussein regime in Iraq established severe penalties, including amputation, branding and the death penalty for criminal offenses such as theft, corruption, currency speculation and military desertion, while government members and Saddam's family members were immune from punishments ranging around these crimes.[6]

• In 2001, the Iraqi government amended the Constitution to make homosexuality (defined as sodomy) a capital offense.

• On March 23, 2003, during the 2003 invasion of Iraq, Iraqi television presented and interviewed prisoners of war on TV, violating the Geneva Convention.

• Also in April 2003, CNN revealed that it had withheld information about Iraq torturing journalists and Iraqi citizens in the 1990s. According to CNN's chief news executive, the channel had been concerned for the safety not only of its own staff, but also of Iraqi sources and informants, who could expect punishment for speaking freely to reporters. Also according to the executive, "other news organizations were in the same bind."[7]

• After the 2003 invasion of Iraq, several mass graves were found in Iraq containing several thousand bodies total and more are being uncovered to this day.[8]While most of the dead in the graves were believed to have died in the 1991 uprising against Saddam Hussein, some of them appeared to have died due to executions or died at times other than the 1991 rebellion.

• Also after the invasion, numerous torture centers were found in security offices and police stations throughout Iraq. The equipment found at these centers typically included hooks for hanging people by the hands for beatings, devices for electric shock and other equipment often found in nations with harsh security services and other authoritarian nations.

 

[Nat Algren]

So now you are claiming hitler was made up... okay, tell that to all the jews.

I understand your angst, not everyone feels a need to thank someone for defending what they cannot. What's great is that those that have and are serving are the ones that have afforded you the right to think and voice freely - try that in some other countries and you are executed.

Ummm, I said that? Hitler was built up with the help of Wall Street and its financing. Goerring's Luftwaffe could not get off the ground w/o the patented fuel from Rockefeller's Standard Oil. The ball bearings on his planes were made in Camden, NJ. Read the book, not bumper stickers.

This day has become bastardized. It was originally termed Armistice Day—a day to commemorate the signing of the armistice on the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month that ended fighting on the Western Front in World War I.

 

[Nat Algren]

90% of All Deaths In War Are CIVILIANS
Posted on May 16, 2014 by WashingtonsBlog
And the U.S. Launched 201 Out of the 248 Armed Conflicts Since the End of WWII
The June 2014 issue of the American Journal of Public Health notes (free PDF here; hat tip David Swanson):

• Around 90% of all deaths in war are civilians:

“The proportion of civilian deaths and the methods for classifying deaths as civilian are debated, but civilian war deaths constitute 85% to 90% of casualties caused by war, with about 10 civilians dying for every combatant killed in battle.”

• Swanson notes: “A top defense of war is that it must be used to prevent something worse, called genocide. Not only does militarism generate genocide rather than preventing it, but the distinction between war and genocide is a very fine one at best.”

• The U.S. launched 201 out of the 248 armed conflicts since the end of WWII:

“Since the end of World War II, there have been 248 armed conflicts in 153 locations around the world. The United States launched 201 overseas military operations between the end of World War II and 2001, and since then, others, including Afghanistan and Iraq ….”

• U.S. military spending dwarfs all other countries:

“The United States is responsible for 41% of the world’s total military spending. The next largest in spending are China, accounting for 8.2%; Russia, 4.1%; and the United Kingdom and France, both 3.6%. . . . If all military . . . costs are included, annual [US] spending amounts to $1 trillion . . . . According to the DOD fiscal year 2012 base structure report, ‘The DOD manages global property of more than 555,000 facilities at more than 5,000 sites, covering more than 28 million acres.’ The United States maintains 700 to 1000 military bases or sites in more than 100 countries. . . .”

Here it is in visual form:

This may not be an accident ….

The Project On Military Procurement notes:

To support its world-wide empire at the turn of the 19th century, Great Britain adopted the “two power standard,” which called for the Royal Navy to be equal to the combined strength of the next two largest navies in the world. The United States has more than doubled that standard as regards budgets, and yet our politicians and senior defense officials complain such outspending is inadequate.

In other words, America has apparently adopted an “total power standard” … spending more on military than most of the rest of the world combined:

The United States spent more on its military than the next 13 nations combined in 2011.

Not only is war bad for civilians, it is also bad for the economy and makes us poor. The oligarchs are the only ones who benefit.

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/90-deaths-war-civilians.html

 

[Vroom_C14]

Ummm, I said that? Hitler was built up with the help of Wall Street and its financing. Goerring's Luftwaffe could not get off the ground w/o the patented fuel from Rockefeller's Standard Oil. The ball bearings on his planes were made in Camden, NJ. Read the book, not bumper stickers.

This day has become bastardized. It was originally termed Armistice Day—a day to commemorate the signing of the armistice on the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month that ended fighting on the Western Front in World War I.

Armistice Day (which coincides with Remembrance Day and Veterans Day, public holidays) is commemorated every year on 11 November to mark the armistice signed between the Allies of World War I and Germany at Compiègne,France, for the cessation of hostilities on the Western Front of World War I, which took effect at eleven o'clock in the morning—the "eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month" of 1918. While this official date to mark the end of the war reflects the ceasefire on the Western Front, hostilities continued in other regions, especially across the former Russian Empire and in parts of the old Ottoman Empire.

The date was declared a national holiday in many allied nations, to commemorate those members of the armed forces who were killed during war. An exception is Italy, where the end of the war is commemorated on 4 November, the day of the Armistice of Villa Giusti. In the Netherlands, Denmark and Norway World War I is not commemorated as the three countries all remained neutral.

The first Armistice Day was held at Buckingham Palace, commencing with King George V hosting a "Banquet in Honour of The President of the French Republic"[1] during the evening hours of 10 November 1919. The first official Armistice Day events were subsequently held in the grounds of Buckingham Palace on the morning of 11 November 1919. This would set the trend for a day of Remembrance for decades to come.

 

[Vroom_C14]

90% of All Deaths In War Are CIVILIANS
Posted on May 16, 2014 by WashingtonsBlog
And the U.S. Launched 201 Out of the 248 Armed Conflicts Since the End of WWII
The June 2014 issue of the American Journal of Public Health notes (free PDF here; hat tip David Swanson):

• Around 90% of all deaths in war are civilians:

“The proportion of civilian deaths and the methods for classifying deaths as civilian are debated, but civilian war deaths constitute 85% to 90% of casualties caused by war, with about 10 civilians dying for every combatant killed in battle.”

• Swanson notes: “A top defense of war is that it must be used to prevent something worse, called genocide. Not only does militarism generate genocide rather than preventing it, but the distinction between war and genocide is a very fine one at best.”

• The U.S. launched 201 out of the 248 armed conflicts since the end of WWII:

“Since the end of World War II, there have been 248 armed conflicts in 153 locations around the world. The United States launched 201 overseas military operations between the end of World War II and 2001, and since then, others, including Afghanistan and Iraq ….”

• U.S. military spending dwarfs all other countries:

“The United States is responsible for 41% of the world’s total military spending. The next largest in spending are China, accounting for 8.2%; Russia, 4.1%; and the United Kingdom and France, both 3.6%. . . . If all military . . . costs are included, annual [US] spending amounts to $1 trillion . . . . According to the DOD fiscal year 2012 base structure report, ‘The DOD manages global property of more than 555,000 facilities at more than 5,000 sites, covering more than 28 million acres.’ The United States maintains 700 to 1000 military bases or sites in more than 100 countries. . . .”

Here it is in visual form:

This may not be an accident ….

The Project On Military Procurement notes:

To support its world-wide empire at the turn of the 19th century, Great Britain adopted the “two power standard,” which called for the Royal Navy to be equal to the combined strength of the next two largest navies in the world. The United States has more than doubled that standard as regards budgets, and yet our politicians and senior defense officials complain such outspending is inadequate.

In other words, America has apparently adopted an “total power standard” … spending more on military than most of the rest of the world combined:

The United States spent more on its military than the next 13 nations combined in 2011.

Not only is war bad for civilians, it is also bad for the economy and makes us poor. The oligarchs are the only ones who benefit.

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/90-deaths-war-civilians.html

You are welcome for having the right to post that and express your opinion without harm.

 

[fredjr82]

You are welcome for having the right to post that and express your opinion without harm.

I get it Nat is a bitch, who can't allow others to enjoy a holiday they choose to celebrate without being an ass. That said, I can name multiple countries that don't start war nearly as often as America does and I could get away with saying the things Nat is saying. It didn't take countless wars for them to earn that freedom of speech either. So while I thank you and those like you for the service you provided for this country, the narrative that we should be thankful for voices we get to have because of the wars that have been fought is a little naive.

 

[Nat Algren]

You are welcome for having the right to post that and express your opinion without harm.

You're militarism is putting Americans in harm's way. You just refuse to see it. How many people do you think America has killed since WW2? More or less than Hitler, the son of a civil servant, who rose up with the help of wealthy people? It takes money to expand militarily. Where did he get it?

 

[Nat Algren]

Armistice Day (which coincides with Remembrance Day and Veterans Day, public holidays) is commemorated every year on 11 November to mark the armistice signed between the Allies of World War I and Germany at Compiègne,France, for the cessation of hostilities on the Western Front of World War I, which took effect at eleven o'clock in the morning—the "eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month" of 1918. While this official date to mark the end of the war reflects the ceasefire on the Western Front, hostilities continued in other regions, especially across the former Russian Empire and in parts of the old Ottoman Empire.

The date was declared a national holiday in many allied nations, to commemorate those members of the armed forces who were killed during war. An exception is Italy, where the end of the war is commemorated on 4 November, the day of the Armistice of Villa Giusti. In the Netherlands, Denmark and Norway World War I is not commemorated as the three countries all remained neutral.

The first Armistice Day was held at Buckingham Palace, commencing with King George V hosting a "Banquet in Honour of The President of the French Republic"[1] during the evening hours of 10 November 1919. The first official Armistice Day events were subsequently held in the grounds of Buckingham Palace on the morning of 11 November 1919. This would set the trend for a day of Remembrance for decades to come.

Armistice day is good. It celebrated peace. Today, it is Stalin like propaganda to drum up support for perpetual war. That's why I despise it. And not all these guys are heroes either. Many sign up because they have crappy job prospects. Many are psychopaths who love killing and can get a medal for it in the military like a dog in a dog show. In public, they go to jail. Stop being so manipulated.

 

[The Tradition]

Does this board have an "ignore poster" feature?

 

[Nat Algren]

Veterans, Americans: Honor us all by ending unlawful, lie-began US wars
Posted on November 11, 2014 by Carl Herman
Veterans Day honors those among us who took a military Oath to “defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic.” All US military are trained to refuse obvious unlawful orders, with officers trained to arrest those who issue them (here, here).

Given the following objective and independently verifiable facts, the honor all Americans can exercise for veterans, country, and Earth is to end lie-started, unlawful US Wars of Aggression.

Honor is experienced and expressed through our thoughts, words, and actions.

The US has started 201 foreign armed attacks since WW2, causing the world’s peoples to conclude in polling that the US is indeed #1 as the most threatening nation to world peace. These US-started armed attacks have killed ~30 million and counting; 90% of these deaths are innocent children, the elderly and ordinary working civilian women and men. These US armed attacks have war-murdered more than Hitler’s Nazis.

Importantly, US official reports now confirm all “reasons” for war the US .01% claimed were known to be false as they were told.

More importantly, these lie-started US wars are not even close to lawful (here, here, here, here), and continue a long history of lie-began US Wars of Aggression. The most decorated US Marine general in his day warned all Americans of this fact of lie-started wars for 1% plunder, and W. Bush’s Senior Advisor and Deputy Chief of Staff, Karl Rove, chided Pulitzer-winning journalist, Ron Suskind, that government will continue with such actions to “create our own reality” no matter what anyone else might say.

As we all observe, the US/UK/Israel .01% continuously scream for even more war in Syria, Iraq, Iran, Gaza, Ukraine, Russia, wherever ISIS or Khorasans might be, and wherever else.

All of these armed attacks are OBVIOUSLY Emperor’s New Clothes-unlawful from the two treaties won by all our families’ sacrifices from two world wars. Our veterans sacrificed to win these treaties that already ended war as a lawful option in crystal-clear letter and intent. These war-murders are supported by other former imperial-power-crazed governments and the agency they created after their last world war: the UN.

US rhetoric of “needing war” because they’re “heartbroken” for 276 African girls, or caring for 426 dead Syrian children are psychopathic pretense because the US reneges on every promise to end poverty that would save one million children from gruesomely slow and painful deaths every month (20,000 – 30,000 daily). I witnessed both parties’ “leaderships” only and always lie and dishonor their promises to end poverty as a lobbyist with RESULTS over two World Summits with heads of state.

Consensus among leading organizations is that ending poverty would require an investment from developed nations of just 0.7% of their GNI (gross national income), with a total 10-year cost of between $1 trillion and $3 trillion. Current US wars since 9/11 have a long-term cost now between $4 trillion and $6 trillion. This means that the US alone could have ended global poverty just since 9/11 for half the cost for their wars (also for perspective, 11 days of ongoing war cost would pay all tuition for US public college students).

In addition, the .01% hide $21 trillion to $32 trillion in offshore tax havens, with the top seven US banks hiding over $10 trillion.

The leverage point to remove the .01% for ongoing insult and crimes to our veterans, country, and all humanity is for those of us among the 99.99% with arrest authority to exercise it for ongoing War Crimes and murders of US soldiers who were lied-into criminal wars. Those of us with Oaths to “defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic” are honor-bound to expose and end these Orwellian crimes.

We invite all interested to demand arrests as lawful response to restore those explicit limits to government power, stop the War Crimes, and prevent further war-murders.

Click link for balance.
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014...nor-us-ending-unlawful-lie-began-us-wars.html

 

[Nat Algren]

Does this board have an "ignore poster" feature?

So, you didn't risk your life so that others may speak freely? This is the fraud that you represent.

 

[Nat Algren]

I'll sign out and let you have your back slapping day and casting of rose petals. The propaganda in this country is thick.

 

[shank hawk]

This is somewhat rhetorical, but is an 18 year old kid forced into service really serving anyone?

Let's use Vietnam as an example. The 18 year old boy receives his draft notice. At this point he can choose to 'dodge' his status or report for duty. If he does the former he will be hunted down and imprisoned. If the latter, he will be shipped off to a jungle pisshole, risking his life to fight an 'enemy' that poses no threat to his country. Is that service, or is it a form of slavery?

It's somewhat akin to a plantation owner back in the 1800's that sets aside one day a year to thank his slaves for their service. Seems kinda shallow and disingenuous, doesn't it?

Nat is right: this is pure propaganda. All anyone has to do to see how our veterans are truly regarded by the powers-that-be is to look into the VA hospital scandals under the Bush and Obama administrations. It truly is disgusting how little they actually care for veterans, but they sure are good at whipping the masses into a frenzy when it comes time to pimp their endless wars.

Have a great day.

 

[Nat Algren]

This is somewhat rhetorical, but is an 18 year old kid forced into service really serving anyone?

Let's use Vietnam as an example. The 18 year old boy receives his draft notice. At this point he can choose to 'dodge' his status or report for duty. If he does the former he will be hunted down and imprisoned. If the latter, he will be shipped off to a jungle pisshole, risking his life to fight an 'enemy' that poses no threat to his country. Is that service, or is it a form of slavery?

It's somewhat akin to a plantation owner back in the 1800's that sets aside one day a year to thank his slaves for their service. Seems kinda shallow and disingenuous, doesn't it?

Nat is right: this is pure propaganda. All anyone has to do to see how our veterans are truly regarded by the powers-that-be is to look into the VA hospital scandals under the Bush and Obama administrations. It truly is disgusting how little they actually care for veterans, but they sure are good at whipping the masses into a frenzy when it comes time to pimp their endless wars.

Have a great day.

They refused to treat them for some 'made-up' disease such as PTSD. A figment of their imagination. But, hey...they got a memorial in the park.

 

[moral_victory]

They refused to treat them for some 'made-up' disease such as PTSD. A figment of their imagination. But, hey...they got a memorial in the park.

Does this inspire freedoms in you?

 

[Vroom_C14]

I get it Nat is a bitch, who can't allow others to enjoy a holiday they choose to celebrate without being an ass. That said, I can name multiple countries that don't start war nearly as often as America does and I could get away with saying the things Nat is saying. It didn't take countless wars for them to earn that freedom of speech either. So while I thank you and those like you for the service you provided for this country, the narrative that we should be thankful for voices we get to have because of the wars that have been fought is a little naive.

If we don't stick our nose into half of those wars - what do you think the world would be like? If we weren't determined to show power, do you think other power countries would sit idle on us (not attack). Have we overstepped our bounds at times, absolutely. I shudder to think what this country would be like with a flaccid approach (which is what we are getting too now with the current POTUS - and countries laugh at us).

To each their own - enjoy your day, the remained of this year and hopefully many to come. Here is to no more war, peace building and beer!

 

[Vroom_C14]

This is somewhat rhetorical, but is an 18 year old kid forced into service really serving anyone?

Let's use Vietnam as an example. The 18 year old boy receives his draft notice. At this point he can choose to 'dodge' his status or report for duty. If he does the former he will be hunted down and imprisoned. If the latter, he will be shipped off to a jungle pisshole, risking his life to fight an 'enemy' that poses no threat to his country. Is that service, or is it a form of slavery?

It's somewhat akin to a plantation owner back in the 1800's that sets aside one day a year to thank his slaves for their service. Seems kinda shallow and disingenuous, doesn't it?

Nat is right: this is pure propaganda. All anyone has to do to see how our veterans are truly regarded by the powers-that-be is to look into the VA hospital scandals under the Bush and Obama administrations. It truly is disgusting how little they actually care for veterans, but they sure are good at whipping the masses into a frenzy when it comes time to pimp their endless wars.

Have a great day.

Funny how the draft hasn't been around for decades and yet we have the largest, most powerful VOLUNTEER force in the world.

As far as having one day of gratitude for those that served - I am fine with it, I didn't serve to have a hero label, I served because of my love for this country and ALL those that reside.

You and Nat are "entitled" to your opinions. Enjoy them.

 

[THE_DEVIL]

Well, I tried.

 

[naturalmwa]

I just knew a simple thank you wouldn't stay a simple thank you.

 

[Nat Algren]

If we don't stick our nose into half of those wars - what do you think the world would be like? If we weren't determined to show power, do you think other power countries would sit idle on us (not attack). Have we overstepped our bounds at times, absolutely. I shudder to think what this country would be like with a flaccid approach (which is what we are getting too now with the current POTUS - and countries laugh at us).

To each their own - enjoy your day, the remained of this year and hopefully many to come. Here is to no more war, peace building and beer!

A flaccid approach??? How many countries does Obama have to bomb before he is accused of showing strength in your eyes?

 

[moral_victory]

Well, I tried.

This is the work of the devil.