Argue with the experts. Those aren't my descriptions. But, of course, you know more than people who study this stuff for a living. SMFH.
AR-15 - designed for Vietnam; expanding bullets are a war crime
- Thread starter DavidGraeberBullSheetJobs
- Start date
Which one Riley?
What does that mean for My coyote gun?
You are a buying bullshit Riley.
Ar15 ammunition is not designed to be more deadly than other rifle ammunition. In fact, if you are going to be shot with a center-fire rifle round, the ar15 ammo will do some of the least damage. Yes, if you get shot with a high powered rifle of any kind, it is going to be bad. To be honest, if you get a hole punched in you with any round, you very well might die. Including 22lr. YouTube probably has videos of shots into ballistic gel from many different rifle rounds. It's hard to have productive conversations with folks that are non educated on the subject. The advantage of an ar15 is that the rounds are so small, that you can fit a lot in a magazine and you can carry a lot of magazines with you. The Ar15 is, comparitively, not a particularly powerful round.
All of them because it can be used to cause such destruction. Just like the weapon itself. We regulate many things that can be dangerous to society.
Which one Riley?
What does that mean for My coyote gun?
You are a buying bullshit Riley.
I know. He's starting to approach your territory again. Don't worry though, he doesn't lie like you do and he's definitely smarter. Your place at the bottom is secure.
How do you respond to the report that was linked and the video showing how much more damage the AR ammo did?
I don't think it matters if it was designed to do more damage.
So rifle rounds, in general, are much much more powerful than pistol rounds. The "AR bullet" aka .223 is not any more or less dangerous because it is a 60(ish) grain piece of lead traveling at 3000(ish) fps because of the object that ignited it. Barrel length in rifle vs pistol is a major factor as well. Pistols have like a 5 inch barrel, rifles by definition, have a minimum 16. The longer the bullet stays in the barrel the more of the gunpowder can fully explode and speed up the bullet. (That's why you think of sniper rifles as being huge and having long barrels)
In general the faster a bullet goes the more accurate it will be in going exactly where it was aimed when you fired it.
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The only pediatrician serving Uvalde, Texas, is revealing what it was like to treat the wounded of the Robb Elementary School shooting, and sharing their horrific survivor stories.
Dr. Roy Guerrero, who was born and raised in Uvalde and attended Robb Elementary School as a child, was at lunch with his staff on Tuesday when he started getting frantic texts.
“I called the hospital, Uvalde Memorial, to ask if they needed me and they said, ‘Yes, get over here right now,'” said Guerrero, a board-certified pediatric specialist who practices in Uvalde and San Antonio.
Guerrero raced to the hospital.
"It was a complete madhouse — what you see in disaster movies," he added. "Doctors and nurses in every single room; people running around like maniacs; kids in the hallway bleeding and screaming; surgeons working on kids.
"The most horrible part, I guess, was just seeing parents I knew outside screaming, asking me to look for their kids. You never really get that out of your head."
Guerrero treated eight children personally that day — four of them are his regular patients.
He lost five of his patients in the shooting.
As Guerrero made his rounds in the hospital the day of the shooting, treating the wounded and identifying the victims, he heard a familiar voice cry out to him.
“I heard, ‘Hey, Dr. G!” he said. Guerrero turned to find an 11-year-old girl he has treated since she was a newborn. He asked that TODAY not publish her name for privacy reasons.
The young girl was in the fourth grade classroom where 19 of her classmates and two of her teachers were shot and killed. She had bullet fragments in her shoulder.
She told her mom and the doctor what happened inside the classroom that day.
“She said she saw people being shot and falling dead. Her best friend was next to her, so she grabbed some of her blood that was coming out of her, smeared it on herself and played dead on the floor,” he said. “As she’s doing this, her teacher ... who got shot and was throwing up blood, told her, ‘I don’t want to die, call 911’ and threw the phone to her. I guess the guy saw the phone and shot the phone, but didn’t see her move. So she continued to play dead.”
Guerrero saw the 11-year-old the next day for a follow-up appointment.
“She was literally shaking,” he explained. “She already has PTSD, and we just got out of this.”
The child was not the only survivor Guerrero treated to show signs of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) after the shooting, he says.
“In clinic the next day, all I heard was, ‘I’m afraid he’s coming for me. I’m afraid he’s going to come get me at my house.’ The kids were telling me that. I was hearing that the whole day,” he explained. “I’m telling you this is going to be a mental health crisis for our community.”
Guerrero worries that the child survivors will live in fear for the rest of their lives. It’s a fear, he imagines, that could even be passed down to their own children if something does not change.
“I don’t want them having that doubt in their mind, all the time, that the world is the same or worse, and that there’s nothing here to protect their children,” he explained. “That’s my biggest fear.”
Texas ranks last in the country for access to mental health services. In April, Texas Governor Gregg Abbott cut $211 million in mental health program funding.
Guerrero said the severity of the survivors' wounds varied. There were minor cuts and bruises on children who climbed out of busted-out windows to safety. Others had shrapnel injuries, including one little girl who had fragments of a bullet lodged in her shoulder.
"The children were in hysterics at first," he said. "But when they saw a familiar face — because I've known them for so long — I was able to calm them down. I told them I would be here until it was over and that I was going to call their mom."
Guerrero says those moments were as much a relief to him as it was a relief to the injured children.
"It was a blessing to see a familiar face that wasn't OK, but was alive," he explained. "And was going to stay alive. Because in the back of your mind, you knew there were many who weren't."
The doctor treats roughly 3,000 patients in the Uvalde area, and he says he feels protective about every single one of them.
"The second I start taking care of a kid, they're my kid," he added. "What people don't realize is that I have 3,000 babies — and that day, I lost some of them."
As the hours went on, it became apparent that some of the parents outside were not going to find their children alive.
Guerrero was instructed to be in the front of the receiving area to immediately help the other patients the hospital was expecting.
"We were supposed to have 14 more kids show up and they wanted me to triage them."
The 14 children never arrived.
"When you know, you know — I just knew," he said. "I tried to be positive and optimistic. But we knew what that meant."
Guerrero still had parents yelling at him, asking if their children were inside the hospital.
"So I asked the hospital to show me the bodies," he added. "I needed to make sure it wasn't who they were talking about."
The deceased children Guerrero viewed were not the kids of the parents in the waiting room of the hospital, but what he saw will never leave his mind.
"It was awful," he explained. "It was a high-power rifle injury. Almost decapitation, to that level. Open chest wounds. These are war wounds. It's as if things exploded once the bullets hit the bodies."
It wasn't until two days later that the trauma from the day caught up with him.
"I lost it for a little while," he said. "And that's OK, but I told myself to get it together. I have to take care of the rest of these kids. I can't lose myself."
As difficult as the day of the shooting and the hours that followed were, Guerrero says there is even more heartbreak ahead.
"The worst part is going to be next week when we have more vigils and funerals," he said. "It still feels surreal, and it will until we have the funerals next week and the week after that."
The first of many funerals will begin on Tuesday.
www.today.com
Dr. Roy Guerrero, who was born and raised in Uvalde and attended Robb Elementary School as a child, was at lunch with his staff on Tuesday when he started getting frantic texts.
“I called the hospital, Uvalde Memorial, to ask if they needed me and they said, ‘Yes, get over here right now,'” said Guerrero, a board-certified pediatric specialist who practices in Uvalde and San Antonio.
Guerrero raced to the hospital.
"It was a complete madhouse — what you see in disaster movies," he added. "Doctors and nurses in every single room; people running around like maniacs; kids in the hallway bleeding and screaming; surgeons working on kids.
"The most horrible part, I guess, was just seeing parents I knew outside screaming, asking me to look for their kids. You never really get that out of your head."
Guerrero treated eight children personally that day — four of them are his regular patients.
He lost five of his patients in the shooting.
'I'm afraid he's coming for me'
As Guerrero made his rounds in the hospital the day of the shooting, treating the wounded and identifying the victims, he heard a familiar voice cry out to him.
“I heard, ‘Hey, Dr. G!” he said. Guerrero turned to find an 11-year-old girl he has treated since she was a newborn. He asked that TODAY not publish her name for privacy reasons.
The young girl was in the fourth grade classroom where 19 of her classmates and two of her teachers were shot and killed. She had bullet fragments in her shoulder.
She told her mom and the doctor what happened inside the classroom that day.
“She said she saw people being shot and falling dead. Her best friend was next to her, so she grabbed some of her blood that was coming out of her, smeared it on herself and played dead on the floor,” he said. “As she’s doing this, her teacher ... who got shot and was throwing up blood, told her, ‘I don’t want to die, call 911’ and threw the phone to her. I guess the guy saw the phone and shot the phone, but didn’t see her move. So she continued to play dead.”
Guerrero saw the 11-year-old the next day for a follow-up appointment.
“She was literally shaking,” he explained. “She already has PTSD, and we just got out of this.”
The child was not the only survivor Guerrero treated to show signs of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) after the shooting, he says.
“In clinic the next day, all I heard was, ‘I’m afraid he’s coming for me. I’m afraid he’s going to come get me at my house.’ The kids were telling me that. I was hearing that the whole day,” he explained. “I’m telling you this is going to be a mental health crisis for our community.”
Guerrero worries that the child survivors will live in fear for the rest of their lives. It’s a fear, he imagines, that could even be passed down to their own children if something does not change.
“I don’t want them having that doubt in their mind, all the time, that the world is the same or worse, and that there’s nothing here to protect their children,” he explained. “That’s my biggest fear.”
Texas ranks last in the country for access to mental health services. In April, Texas Governor Gregg Abbott cut $211 million in mental health program funding.
'I told them I would be here until it was over'
Guerrero said the severity of the survivors' wounds varied. There were minor cuts and bruises on children who climbed out of busted-out windows to safety. Others had shrapnel injuries, including one little girl who had fragments of a bullet lodged in her shoulder.
"The children were in hysterics at first," he said. "But when they saw a familiar face — because I've known them for so long — I was able to calm them down. I told them I would be here until it was over and that I was going to call their mom."
Guerrero says those moments were as much a relief to him as it was a relief to the injured children.
"It was a blessing to see a familiar face that wasn't OK, but was alive," he explained. "And was going to stay alive. Because in the back of your mind, you knew there were many who weren't."
The doctor treats roughly 3,000 patients in the Uvalde area, and he says he feels protective about every single one of them.
"The second I start taking care of a kid, they're my kid," he added. "What people don't realize is that I have 3,000 babies — and that day, I lost some of them."
Waiting for the children who would never arrive
As the hours went on, it became apparent that some of the parents outside were not going to find their children alive.
Guerrero was instructed to be in the front of the receiving area to immediately help the other patients the hospital was expecting.
"We were supposed to have 14 more kids show up and they wanted me to triage them."
The 14 children never arrived.
"When you know, you know — I just knew," he said. "I tried to be positive and optimistic. But we knew what that meant."
Guerrero still had parents yelling at him, asking if their children were inside the hospital.
"So I asked the hospital to show me the bodies," he added. "I needed to make sure it wasn't who they were talking about."
The deceased children Guerrero viewed were not the kids of the parents in the waiting room of the hospital, but what he saw will never leave his mind.
"It was awful," he explained. "It was a high-power rifle injury. Almost decapitation, to that level. Open chest wounds. These are war wounds. It's as if things exploded once the bullets hit the bodies."
It wasn't until two days later that the trauma from the day caught up with him.
"I lost it for a little while," he said. "And that's OK, but I told myself to get it together. I have to take care of the rest of these kids. I can't lose myself."
As difficult as the day of the shooting and the hours that followed were, Guerrero says there is even more heartbreak ahead.
"The worst part is going to be next week when we have more vigils and funerals," he said. "It still feels surreal, and it will until we have the funerals next week and the week after that."
The first of many funerals will begin on Tuesday.
Uvalde’s only pediatrician shares the horror of treating school shooting victims
As the only pediatrician in Uvalde, Texas, Dr. Roy Guerrero was called to the hospital to help shooting victims. There, he found patients he's known since infancy.
www.today.com
Huh?
I'm almost 50 years old.
Huh?
Huh?
Lol. Again, so? Regulate ammunition. At least the ammo that can be used in high powered rifles.
Are you standing firm on regulating this type of ammo is "dumb"? If so, you've not presented anything compelling.
You are some kind of a gun salesman. You like the death toll?
you always pretend that society is to blame.
Salesman. Do you earn money from gun and ammo sales?
Blood money.
I don't think most people even consider a 223 a "high power rifle".
Yes, because it isn't the ammo thats the problem. Hollowpoints do what they do. There are rounds designed to do many things.
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Bro, I get it that it's a holiday but me thinks you might be a bit overserved. You have completely unmasked yourself on your other handle and proceeded to just spew nonsense. No, I do not sell firearms.
The rifle that uses it certainly can be high power and do massive damage as the report details.
So you object to regulating hollow point ammo?
You appear to profit from gun sales. Why else are you pushing guns so hard?
My other handle? You are full of it.
You obviously still haven't read Graeber's major work.
Next you'll be bitching about how Gandhi led terrorist attacks on the Brits. That would make just as much sense.
As for ammo, that has always struck me a a soft way to cut the gun carnage.
There are a variety of less lethal configurations that would be perfectly suitable in most circumstances.
I mean do you really need ammo that will pass through multiple walls for home defense?
Simply ban all but less lethal ammo, with suitable exceptions for hunting and . . . well, I can't think of anything else. Maybe some sorts of regulated competition.
There are a variety of less lethal configurations that would be perfectly suitable in most circumstances.
I mean do you really need ammo that will pass through multiple walls for home defense?
Simply ban all but less lethal ammo, with suitable exceptions for hunting and . . . well, I can't think of anything else. Maybe some sorts of regulated competition.
If assault rifles are banned once again, what will the procedure be? I'm not aware of what happened during the ban in the 1990s. Will the government buy rifles from owners?
I would understand that of people were using super crazy shit but as the other guy said by rifle standards the 223 is pretty mild. Yes, it is going really fast, it's a 22 caliber bullet.
Who is the sociologist? What is the conspiracy?
who is manipulating the truth?
The truth - the AR-15 was designed for and tested in the VIETNAM WAR. and expanding bullet use is a war crime, according to the Geneva conventions.
and you choose not to recognize that truth, and rather, resort to attacking me personally. Same tyrannical strategy trump used all the time. Maybe one day you’ll get to have a picture with your fat orange god?
for the rest of you non-trolls: read the articles in the OP.
Way to switch handles, that will throw them off..
You are right about thr m-16 and Vietnam, but it was due to weight. The older larger ammo was much heavier and the pistol cartridge, 30 carbine, wasn't effective penetrating the vegetation. The us soldiers thought the original m16s were plastic toys and the round was useless in the vegetation as well.
All this will be ignored by the trumpist gun and death cult members.The only pediatrician serving Uvalde, Texas, is revealing what it was like to treat the wounded of the Robb Elementary School shooting, and sharing their horrific survivor stories.
Dr. Roy Guerrero, who was born and raised in Uvalde and attended Robb Elementary School as a child, was at lunch with his staff on Tuesday when he started getting frantic texts.
“I called the hospital, Uvalde Memorial, to ask if they needed me and they said, ‘Yes, get over here right now,'” said Guerrero, a board-certified pediatric specialist who practices in Uvalde and San Antonio.
Guerrero raced to the hospital.
"It was a complete madhouse — what you see in disaster movies," he added. "Doctors and nurses in every single room; people running around like maniacs; kids in the hallway bleeding and screaming; surgeons working on kids.
"The most horrible part, I guess, was just seeing parents I knew outside screaming, asking me to look for their kids. You never really get that out of your head."
Guerrero treated eight children personally that day — four of them are his regular patients.
He lost five of his patients in the shooting.
'I'm afraid he's coming for me'
As Guerrero made his rounds in the hospital the day of the shooting, treating the wounded and identifying the victims, he heard a familiar voice cry out to him.
“I heard, ‘Hey, Dr. G!” he said. Guerrero turned to find an 11-year-old girl he has treated since she was a newborn. He asked that TODAY not publish her name for privacy reasons.
The young girl was in the fourth grade classroom where 19 of her classmates and two of her teachers were shot and killed. She had bullet fragments in her shoulder.
She told her mom and the doctor what happened inside the classroom that day.
“She said she saw people being shot and falling dead. Her best friend was next to her, so she grabbed some of her blood that was coming out of her, smeared it on herself and played dead on the floor,” he said. “As she’s doing this, her teacher ... who got shot and was throwing up blood, told her, ‘I don’t want to die, call 911’ and threw the phone to her. I guess the guy saw the phone and shot the phone, but didn’t see her move. So she continued to play dead.”
Guerrero saw the 11-year-old the next day for a follow-up appointment.
“She was literally shaking,” he explained. “She already has PTSD, and we just got out of this.”
The child was not the only survivor Guerrero treated to show signs of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) after the shooting, he says.
“In clinic the next day, all I heard was, ‘I’m afraid he’s coming for me. I’m afraid he’s going to come get me at my house.’ The kids were telling me that. I was hearing that the whole day,” he explained. “I’m telling you this is going to be a mental health crisis for our community.”
Guerrero worries that the child survivors will live in fear for the rest of their lives. It’s a fear, he imagines, that could even be passed down to their own children if something does not change.
“I don’t want them having that doubt in their mind, all the time, that the world is the same or worse, and that there’s nothing here to protect their children,” he explained. “That’s my biggest fear.”
Texas ranks last in the country for access to mental health services. In April, Texas Governor Gregg Abbott cut $211 million in mental health program funding.
'I told them I would be here until it was over'
Guerrero said the severity of the survivors' wounds varied. There were minor cuts and bruises on children who climbed out of busted-out windows to safety. Others had shrapnel injuries, including one little girl who had fragments of a bullet lodged in her shoulder.
"The children were in hysterics at first," he said. "But when they saw a familiar face — because I've known them for so long — I was able to calm them down. I told them I would be here until it was over and that I was going to call their mom."
Guerrero says those moments were as much a relief to him as it was a relief to the injured children.
"It was a blessing to see a familiar face that wasn't OK, but was alive," he explained. "And was going to stay alive. Because in the back of your mind, you knew there were many who weren't."
The doctor treats roughly 3,000 patients in the Uvalde area, and he says he feels protective about every single one of them.
"The second I start taking care of a kid, they're my kid," he added. "What people don't realize is that I have 3,000 babies — and that day, I lost some of them."
Waiting for the children who would never arrive
As the hours went on, it became apparent that some of the parents outside were not going to find their children alive.
Guerrero was instructed to be in the front of the receiving area to immediately help the other patients the hospital was expecting.
"We were supposed to have 14 more kids show up and they wanted me to triage them."
The 14 children never arrived.
"When you know, you know — I just knew," he said. "I tried to be positive and optimistic. But we knew what that meant."
Guerrero still had parents yelling at him, asking if their children were inside the hospital.
"So I asked the hospital to show me the bodies," he added. "I needed to make sure it wasn't who they were talking about."
The deceased children Guerrero viewed were not the kids of the parents in the waiting room of the hospital, but what he saw will never leave his mind.
"It was awful," he explained. "It was a high-power rifle injury. Almost decapitation, to that level. Open chest wounds. These are war wounds. It's as if things exploded once the bullets hit the bodies."
It wasn't until two days later that the trauma from the day caught up with him.
"I lost it for a little while," he said. "And that's OK, but I told myself to get it together. I have to take care of the rest of these kids. I can't lose myself."
As difficult as the day of the shooting and the hours that followed were, Guerrero says there is even more heartbreak ahead.
"The worst part is going to be next week when we have more vigils and funerals," he said. "It still feels surreal, and it will until we have the funerals next week and the week after that."
The first of many funerals will begin on Tuesday.
Uvalde’s only pediatrician shares the horror of treating school shooting victims
As the only pediatrician in Uvalde, Texas, Dr. Roy Guerrero was called to the hospital to help shooting victims. There, he found patients he's known since infancy.
Children with exploded faces are just the necessary price we all must pay for their freedom to be fascists.
I know many of them think it's time to move on. I started a thread about the article, you can see for yourself that there are posters that don't want to hear about it anymore.
Uvalde's Only Pediatrician
The only pediatrician serving Uvalde, Texas, is revealing what it was like to treat the wounded of the Robb Elementary School shooting, and sharing their horrific survivor stories. Dr. Roy Guerrero, who was born and raised in Uvalde and attended Robb Elementary School as a child, was at lunch...
iowa.forums.rivals.com
Why would they? Some people refuse to be responsible, refuse to admit the truth or admit they are wrong, even partially, refuse to see how pwned they’ve been by a tyrannical violence obsessed military-industrial-congressional and libertarian corporate-fascist complex that benefits from the dismantling of the USA and the destruction of democracy itself. Fascists and fundamentalists hate complexity, hate diversity, love the “purity” of violence, yearn for an apocalyptic war led by their god.I know many of them think it's time to move on. I started a thread about the article, you can see for yourself that there are posters that don't want to hear about it anymore.
Uvalde's Only Pediatrician
The only pediatrician serving Uvalde, Texas, is revealing what it was like to treat the wounded of the Robb Elementary School shooting, and sharing their horrific survivor stories. Dr. Roy Guerrero, who was born and raised in Uvalde and attended Robb Elementary School as a child, was at lunch...
the banality of evil means the people who do the most evil deeply believe in their own goodness and the ends-justify-means goodness of their god-given mission.
It's difficult to discuss things rationally with folks that have their head planted firmly up their ass. At this point, I'll bow out and let the angry and clueless continue to spout their nonsense.
Is it the car's fault it got driven by a drunk? This is the lamest excuse you've made to date.
