Cannabis Use Disorder is a thing now.

[Aardvark86]

Seems like a name invented by people who spent lots of time swearing “marijuana isn’t addictive”. And yet, the definition of this sounds an awful lot like addiction. Whatever. Smoke up, ya hippies!

https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/29/health/medical-marijuana-cannabis-use-disorder/index.html

CNN —
Developing cannabis use disorderis relatively common in Washington state, one of the first states to fully legalize cannabis, and can even occur in people who only use medical marijuana, according to a new study.


Many Americans wrongly believe exposure to marijuana smoke is safer than tobacco, study finds
“There’s a perception that people who are using marijuana for medical reasons have a lower risk of a cannabis use disorder,” said lead author Gwen Lapham, assistant professor at Kaiser Permanente Bernard J. Tyson School of Medicine in Seattle.

To have cannabis use disorder, or CUD, a person must have two or more of such symptoms as craving weed, becoming tolerant, using more than intended, using marijuana even though it causes problems in life, using it in high-risk situations, experiencing withdrawal and being unable to quit, according to the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

“The main take home message of our study is that cannabis use disorder is common among primary care patients in a state with legal cannabis use,” said Lapham, who is also an assistant investigator at the Kaiser Permanente Washington Health Research Institute.

In addition, using both medical and recreational weed led to a more severe addiction than using medical marijuana alone, the study revealed.


“This study reports some unique, badly needed data on cannabis use in the post-legalization period, specifically, what is the extent and nature of problematic, concerning cannabis use in the general population,” said Nicholas Vozoris, assistant professor and clinician investigator in the division of respirology at the department of medicine at the University of Toronto. He was not involved in the study.

“Not all people will want or remember to report their cannabis use … therefore, this study likely underestimates the prevalence of cannabis use disorder,” he added.

Cannabis use disorder where access is legal​

The study, published Tuesday in JAMA Network Open, quizzed nearly 110,000 patients of a Kaiser Permanente integrated health system in Washington State about their attitudes towards marijuana, then asked 5,000 of those more confidential questions about their use of weed in the past year. Only those who reported cannabis use in the past 30 days, or 1,500 people, were included in the study.


Using marijuana may affect your ability to think and plan, study says
One of the key findings was how frequently people used marijuana, said Dr. Alexandre Dumais, associate clinical professor of psychiatry at the University of Montreal, who was not involved in the research.

“The authors show that 38.8% of medical cannabis users, 25.2% of non-medical cannabis users and 56.1% of mixed medical/non-medical cannabis users consume the substance daily or almost daily,” Dumais said in an email.“Moreover, 39.7% of mixed users consume more than 3 times per day.”

Because frequent use is an important risk factor for the development of cannabis use disorder, “it is not surprising” to find an elevated prevalence of such symptoms, Dumais said.

“Notably, those who reported any non-medical use were at greatest risk of moderate to severe CUD … this is an interesting aspect of the study as not many authors have evaluated the prevalence according to CUD severity,” he said.

There are no current FDA-approved medications to treat cannabis use disorder, Lapham said, so behavior-based treatments or specialty addiction centers are the rule. Yet not getting treatment can have consequences.

1. I love how all of the "symptoms" are only marginally "medical" in nature.
2. I also love how many of the CUD symptoms vaguely resemble the nonspecific indicators for Unspecified Symptom Syndrom (i.e., long covid).
3. I earnestly believe that the substance is not physically addictive, but I have little doubt that it is psychosocially addictive.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

This is my measure of whether something is ok. Would you tell your 15 yo child you use daily? I have no issue with telling my 15 yo I like beer and I like one daily with dinner. But if I used weed there is zero chance I’d think that was ok to tell him. And the reason is…?

I don’t feel any stigma about weed. My kids knew I used gummies when they were in high school. That’s because weed when eaten is safer and better for you than alcohol. Whatever stigma you associate with weed is a by-product of Nancy Reagan and not based on fact.

I was also ok with them occasionally drinking and trying gummies in a safe environment. They were going to find it anyway and I preferred they understood its effects so they could make good choices when out of the house. It was funny to hear their stories of the kids in college from hyper conservative families who lost their shit because they overindulged for the first time outside their sheltered upbringing.

 

[DeangeloVickers]

Strange that you think telling them about drinking alcohol is ok. Society has created a stigma around one and made the other one acceptable. That's the reason.

My dad died from drinking alcohol. When you tell your 15 yo about the beer, make sure to include everything. Show her a raging alcoholic, laying in their own puke in a gutter, and point out you are consuming the same stuff.

I have a tolerance for coffee, I crave it, I feel bad without it, I do it in risky situations (like driving with no lid on the cup), and I will likely never quit.

No, this is just the ridiculous justification pot users have used for decades to normalize getting high.
When I drink a beer while I'm grilling some streaks, getting buzzed isn't remotely the reason. Good beer tastes good and is enjoyable for that reason... especially in moderate amounts that don't get you intoxicated.
Smoking weed or taking gummies serves one purpose - to get you high.
To reach their own, I don't really gaf if you want to use, but casual moderate alcohol consumption isn't remotely the same as using marijuana.

 

[Gus is dead]

Strange that you think telling them about drinking alcohol is ok. Society has created a stigma around one and made the other one acceptable. That's the reason.

My dad died from drinking alcohol. When you tell your 15 yo about the beer, make sure to include everything. Show her a raging alcoholic, laying in their own puke in a gutter, and point out you are consuming the same stuff.

I have a tolerance for coffee, I crave it, I feel bad without it, I do it in risky situations (like driving with no lid on the cup), and I will likely never quit.

Ok except I have a beer with dinner because I like the taste and the taste only comes from beer. If NA beer tasted as good Id probably have that. It doesn't. Last I checked anyway.

It may be a bit of the stigma thing. But I guess it seems to me no one smokes weed because they like the taste of it. Its because they want to relax or feel stoned or whatever. Therein lies the difference in my opinion.

Now if someone wants to make the case they like the taste of THC containing drinks and they consume the 2.5mg type only, ok I could be convinced of that. No idea though. Never had one.

I do think that THC is safer as a drug of abuse/recreational drug than alcohol. On that, the data is clear. So if one is wanting to admit freely that they want to get high, feel stoned, or 'relax' THC is better than alcohol in many ways.

But I also think, rightly, that adults are reluctant to admit to their drug use to their 10-17 year old kids. Wonder why?

That is why I dont do it. Id be embarrassed as hell to have my kids catch me smoking it or knowing I do. So I dont.

 

[Gus is dead]

No, this is just the ridiculous justification pot users have used for decades to normalize getting high.
When I drink a beer while I'm grilling some streaks, getting buzzed isn't remotely the reason. Good beer tastes good and is enjoyable for that reason... especially in moderate amounts that don't get you intoxicated.
Smoking weed or taking gummies serves one purpose - to get you high.
To reach their own, I don't really gaf if you want to use, but casual moderate alcohol consumption isn't remotely the same as using marijuana.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[Moral]

No, this is just the ridiculous justification pot users have used for decades to normalize getting high.
When I drink a beer while I'm grilling some streaks, getting buzzed isn't remotely the reason. Good beer tastes good and is enjoyable for that reason... especially in moderate amounts that don't get you intoxicated.
Smoking weed or taking gummies serves one purpose - to get you high.
To reach their own, I don't really gaf if you want to use, but casual moderate alcohol consumption isn't remotely the same as using marijuana.

I guess you aren't aware that you can use cannabis and not actually use enough to get high. Sometimes that is enough to help with anxiety, nausea, and whatnot.

 

[Flie]

No, this is just the ridiculous justification pot users have used for decades to normalize getting high.
When I drink a beer while I'm grilling some streaks, getting buzzed isn't remotely the reason. Good beer tastes good and is enjoyable for that reason... especially in moderate amounts that don't get you intoxicated.
Smoking weed or taking gummies serves one purpose - to get you high.
To reach their own, I don't really gaf if you want to use, but casual moderate alcohol consumption isn't remotely the same as using marijuana.

These are the justifications beer drinkers have used for decades, me included. I like the taste! I'm not getting a buzz! I enjoy it while grilling!

My dad used to say the same things.

 

[pink shizzle]

I take edibles to get high AF and for that reason alone. Oh noooos!

 

[Gus is dead]

I guess you aren't aware that you can use cannabis and not actually use enough to get high. Sometimes that is enough to help with anxiety, nausea, and whatnot.

No I am aware of the anti nausea and anti anxiety effects and have no issue recommending its use in those situations. I simply dont think that the massive uptick in THC use can be justified by the symptoms you describe above. If they can be, that the world is just a pit of anxiety we have a whole new problem that one could probably write a book on. The rise in anxiety in general and what that suggests.

So no, if I had cancer or severe anxiety not responding to cognitive therapy etc I wouldnt have the same objections,.

 

[jneffer]

who gives a shit if marijuana isn't 100% perfectly harmless? is that the line we need for something to not have our government prohibit it's use by adults?

yes...the people you don't like that said weed is completely harmless were wrong. there, are you happy now?

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

No I am aware of the anti nausea and anti anxiety effects and have no issue recommending its use in those situations. I simply dont think that the massive uptick in THC use can be justified by the symptoms you describe above. If they can be, that the world is just a pit of anxiety we have a whole new problem that one could probably write a book on. The rise in anxiety in general and what that suggests.

So no, if I had cancer or severe anxiety not responding to cognitive therapy etc I wouldnt have the same objections,.

I use it as a sleep aid. I travel my ass off and have for decades. I used Melatonin for years to try to regulate my sleep patterns with crazy time zone adjustment…to the point where my doctor said it is likely my body doesn’t produce enough Melatonin and recommended I drop the melatonin habit. Indica THC is the only natural substance I have found that can induce a good nights sleep. I am quite sure they are better than taking Niquil, melatonin or whatever other witches brew people are dreaming up as a sleep aid.

 

[dgordo]

My teenage kids know I have a gummie or 2 every day. I don’t see the problem, cannabis is legal here.

 

[DeangeloVickers]

I guess you aren't aware that you can use cannabis and not actually use enough to get high. Sometimes that is enough to help with anxiety, nausea, and whatnot.

Legit medicinal purposes aren't really what's being discussed. When prescribed and monitored by a medical professional it clearly has benefits. But I'd also guess significantly more people are self medicating with weed than are being prescribed by docs.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Drugsarebad mmmkay.

 

[jneffer]

our government should only allow us to have or use things that are completely safe and harmless

what do you want...people to be able to make those kinds of decisions for themselves?

 

[Nole-4-Life]

Anything you use you develope tolerance....not sure how that can by listed as a symptom. I am shooting league pool right now...will end up with 10 IPAs on my tab...obviously not going to be ok to drive...but I will be more or less as functional as those that drink 2.

God damn I'd be comatose.

 

[DeangeloVickers]

These are the justifications beer drinkers have used for decades, me included. I like the taste! I'm not getting a buzz! I enjoy it while grilling!

My dad used to say the same things.

Well your dad clearly had a problem. And now you're projecting his problem on others, and using it to justify your drug use.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

No, this is just the ridiculous justification pot users have used for decades to normalize getting high.
When I drink a beer while I'm grilling some streaks, getting buzzed isn't remotely the reason. Good beer tastes good and is enjoyable for that reason... especially in moderate amounts that don't get you intoxicated.
Smoking weed or taking gummies serves one purpose - to get you high.
To reach their own, I don't really gaf if you want to use, but casual moderate alcohol consumption isn't remotely the same as using marijuana.

you constantly post stupid stuff. Normalizing Alcohol, like you are doing, is more dangerous than weed.
You drinking a beer for "taste" (stupid at face value) is the same as someone using some thc to sleep well.
This post just indicates a general lack of knowledge around alcohols use/misuse and your personal anecdotal evidence.
Sweet WOB by the way.

 

[Gus is dead]

I use it as a sleep aid. I travel my ass off and have for decades. I used Melatonin for years to try to regulate my sleep patterns with crazy time zone adjustment…to the point where my doctor said it is likely my body doesn’t produce enough Melatonin and recommended I drop the melatonin habit. Indica THC is the only natural substance I have found that can induce a good nights sleep. I am quite sure they are better than taking Niquil, melatonin or whatever other witches brew people are dreaming up as a sleep aid.

I know a lot of people take it for that and honestly, given the context I was discussing prior, I wouldnt be super opposed to admitting any use for that purpose to my kids. Especially if taken right at bedtime.

Lots of things are natural substances by the way. That alone doesn't mean much. Belladonna, Ricin to name a very select few.

 

[DeangeloVickers]

you constantly post stupid stuff. Normalizing Alcohol, like you are doing, is more dangerous than weed.
You drinking a beer for "taste" (stupid at face value) is the same as someone using some thc to sleep well.
This post just indicates a general lack of knowledge around alcohols use/misuse and your personal anecdotal evidence.
Sweet WOB by the way.

I'm not normalizing alcohol. I'm saying it serves more purposes than just to get you intoxicated. Most people who drink casually do so bc they enjoy the taste, not for a buzz. It's not that hard to understand.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

How are NA sales by the way? If it was drank for the "taste" na sales would equal alcohol sales.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

I'm not normalizing alcohol. I'm saying it serves more purposes than just to get you intoxicated. Most people who drink casually do so bc they enjoy the taste, not for a buzz. It's not that hard to understand.

you realize you can change this whole post to thc/cbd...

 

[Flie]

Well your dad clearly had a problem. And now you're projecting his problem on others, and using it to justify your drug use.

You are making some assumptions. You are also justifying your drug use.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

I'm not normalizing alcohol. I'm saying it serves more purposes than just to get you intoxicated. Most people who drink casually do so bc they enjoy the taste, not for a buzz. It's not that hard to understand.

most people:
I'd bet 1% of beer drinkers drink it for the taste before +50%. I'd be willing to believe a very small amount of people drink it for the taste but it would be a very small number.

 

[DeangeloVickers]

you constantly post stupid stuff. Normalizing Alcohol, like you are doing, is more dangerous than weed.
You drinking a beer for "taste" (stupid at face value) is the same as someone using some thc to sleep well.
This post just indicates a general lack of knowledge around alcohols use/misuse and your personal anecdotal evidence.
Sweet WOB by the way.

I will ad... you thinking a clear typo entered in on a mobile is a WOB shows you're not really someone whose opinions should be taken seriously. Desperation is telling.

 

[jonesy5960]

Strange that you think telling them about drinking alcohol is ok. Society has created a stigma around one and made the other one acceptable. That's the reason.

My dad died from drinking alcohol. When you tell your 15 yo about the beer, make sure to include everything. Show her a raging alcoholic, laying in their own puke in a gutter, and point out you are consuming the same stuff.

I have a tolerance for coffee, I crave it, I feel bad without it, I do it in risky situations (like driving with no lid on the cup), and I will likely never quit.

Yeah. Alcohol has taken and destroyed more lives than weed ever will. There is little doubt of that. With that said, weed becomes a problem for a whole lot of people who partake too often and for whom it becomes all too important in the scheme of things.

 

[DeangeloVickers]

You are making some assumptions. You are also justifying your drug use.

No, you told us everything.

most people:
I'd bet 1% of beer drinkers drink it for the taste before +50%. I'd be willing to believe a very small amount of people drink it for the taste but it would be a very small number.

1% lol, you're not a serious person if that's your take. Get out and meet some normal people.

 

[Flie]

No, you told us everything.

1% lol, you're not a serious person if that's your take. Get out and meet some normal people.

Summarize what I told you. Bullet points.

 

[Flie]

Yeah. Alcohol has taken and destroyed more lives than weed ever will. There is little doubt of that. With that said, weed becomes a problem for a whole lot of people who partake too often and for whom it becomes all too important in the scheme of things.

Agreed and I'm not saying there are no risks. I know people who have messed up their lives with both. I just find it odd that people feel comfortable with telling their kids about drinking a drug vs smoking/eating/drinking a different drug that is arguably less dangerous.

Did you guys know that alcohol has the most dangerous withdrawal of any drug?

The order in severity/danger of withdrawal is something like:

1. Alcohol
2. Benzos
3. Opiates
4. Cocaine

 

[jneffer]

I'm not normalizing alcohol. I'm saying it serves more purposes than just to get you intoxicated. Most people who drink casually do so bc they enjoy the taste, not for a buzz. It's not that hard to understand.

i understand that's what those people say

 

[FAUlty Gator]

I remember nothing about starting this thread. Hmmmmm...

 

[jonesy5960]

Agreed and I'm not saying there are no risks. I know people who have messed up their lives with both. I just find it odd that people feel comfortable with telling their kids about drinking a drug vs smoking/eating/drinking a different drug that is arguably less dangerous.

Did you guys know that alcohol has the most dangerous withdrawal of any drug?

The order in severity/danger of withdrawal is something like:

1. Alcohol
2. Benzos
3. Opiates
4. Cocaine

I'm more balanced in my reasoning because alcoholism runs in my family and I've been totalled by 2 drunk drivers in my lifetime. I don't see weed as life threatening as is alcohol. In terms of threats to health and happiness I'd probably place it between alcohol and tobacco/nicotine products. I'm very happy that my 2 Russian 23 year old kids aren't involved with either to any extent because alcoholism is rampant over there.

 

[Mister_Man]

 

[Bulldogs1974]

I will ad... you thinking a clear typo entered in on a mobile is a WOB shows you're not really someone whose opinions should be taken seriously. Desperation is telling.

judging by your posts, one can't assume it was a typo

 

[DeangeloVickers]

Summarize what I told you. Bullet points.

Or you could just reread your own post and the post you responded to. Post #40. Are you high right now?

 

[BelemNole]

I told my college age kids that I'd rather they use weed than alcohol. As an RA my weed residents were great. My drunk residents were a nightmare. Had to call the paramedics more than once.

I enjoy a drink after work but these days it's nearly guaranteed to trigger a migraine. Not an issue with weed.

 

[Bulldogs1974]

No, you told us everything.

1% lol, you're not a serious person if that's your take. Get out and meet some normal people.

"most people drink beer for the taste" is not something i've heard outside a miller lite commercial and it's still comical today.
far more people drink to get drunk than take pot to get high.
Let me know when doctors write a prescription for PBR.

 

[DeangeloVickers]

judging by your posts, one can't assume it was a typo

We've seen over the years some people have trouble grasping the concept of what a want of bee is. No biggie but maybe don't call someone out if you don't really get it?

 

[DeangeloVickers]

"most people drink beer for the taste" is not something i've heard outside a miller lite commercial and it's still comical today.
far more people drink to get drunk than take pot to get high.
Let me know when doctors write a prescription for PBR.

Agree to disagree but we're not talking about medical mj. That's a weak strawman. The bulk of my family and social circles are people who enjoy a couple beers or a glass or two of wine with dinner and don't drink too get drunk. There's certainly exceptions. But it's not 99%, that's ridiculous.

 

[jneffer]

Agree to disagree but we're not talking about medical mj. That's a weak strawman. The bulk of my family and social circles are people who enjoy a couple beers or a glass or two of wine with dinner and don't drink too get drunk. There's certainly exceptions. But it's not 99%, that's ridiculous.

you understand that it's possible to be "just a little high", right?

you don't turn into snoop dogg immediately upon one hit or inhale

people drink socially...and people smoke socially