ADVERTISEMENT

D Line Must be really good -

While deep, I don't think we know yet that the D-line is gonna be really good.

Don't mean to be a Debbie downer, but just don't think it really holds a candle to, for example, a line that had Clayborn, Daniels, Klug, Ballard, and Binns.
This DL will be good and deep. For it to be great, a player or combination of players will have to emerge as star/game changers like a Clayborn or Roth or Epenesa. The proof will be in preventing 3rd down conversions and getting off the field, limiting yards per carry in the running game, creating turnovers & TFL, and ultimately limiting points per game.
 
While deep, I don't think we know yet that the D-line is gonna be really good.

Don't mean to be a Debbie downer, but just don't think it really holds a candle to, for example, a line that had Clayborn, Daniels, Klug, Ballard, and Binns.
We need them to be good, not elite. Not with all the NFL talent behind em
 
We need them to be good, not elite. Not with all the NFL talent behind em
Exactly this. I wouldn’t be surprised to see some of the absolute best games this defense may have this year won’t have eye opening DL stats, and not because they aren’t doing their jobs.
 
I’m starting to wonder if this is going to be the best front 7 under the Kf Era. There’s so many that have come along but our depth at DL plus Campbell, Jacob’s and Benson potentially being the best Lb corp since Hodge/Greenway, I’m excited to see if they can join some of those other epic defenses.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ichawk24 and F5n5
While deep, I don't think we know yet that the D-line is gonna be really good.

Don't mean to be a Debbie downer, but just don't think it really holds a candle to, for example, a line that had Clayborn, Daniels, Klug, Ballard, and Binns.
While I agree those 5 guys were great in quarters 1-3, from what I witnessed, they weren't so great in Q4. They were terrific players, but, no depth...hands on hips and sucking wind in Q4.
 
You make a good point. We have a lot of good players and depth on the DL, but for this to be a great D-line a couple guys will need to take their game to a higher level. I think there are several guys capable of doing so. Go Hawks !
Different lines in 2022 vs the one in 2010. Likely no one on the current line who is as good individually as Clayborn. Hell, perhaps no one as good as Ballar or Klug as well. But the 2022 line is 7-8 deep with average to good players. Very important to be able to put fresh bodies on the field all the time at DL. Van Ness and perhaps the freshman Graves have star potential. Time will tell.
 
Different lines in 2022 vs the one in 2010. Likely no one on the current line who is as good individually as Clayborn. Hell, perhaps no one as good as Ballar or Klug as well. But the 2022 line is 7-8 deep with average to good players. Very important to be able to put fresh bodies on the field all the time at DL. Van Ness and perhaps the freshman Graves have star potential. Time will tell.
Ballard was an athletic freak ... but really didn't have the love for the game necessary to truly hone his craft. He never really rid himself of his bad-habits in terms of technique ... consequently, for as high as his ceiling was in terms of potential ... he never really scratched the surface.

Klug was initially an undersized, twitchy guy who was super-productive for us at DT ... a lot like a taller version of Mitch King.

I think that folks are criminally underselling Logan Lee ... he's a guy whose style is much like that of a Klug.

Noah Shannon, himself, comps himself to Bazata ... and I think that is fabulous and accurate. Nate did nothing but help the D play better together as a unit!

Obviously, Van Ness is a guy who arguably is pretty comparable to Chauncey Golston ... and if I could, I'd clone Chauncey and have a whole army of his clones on our DL. Unselfish player who was productive every place Coach Bell put him ... was a leader too!

Black is a guy who the coaches have been high on from day 1 ... guy seems physically pretty impressive. He played quite a bit last year - just needs to keep on improving his technique and fundamentals. Unlike Ballard, one of the main reasons why Black came to Iowa was because he wanted to develop and be coached - he knew he had a ways to go in order to achieve his potential. I love that about him!

If Evans can channel his inner Nate Meier ... then we're in store to observe some great things! Both guys being really explosive, tough guys ... albeit, undersized.

Obviously, if the buzz is to be believed ... then Graves is a guy who has pretty elite potential. On top of that ... much like Epenesa ... he's a guy who was highly touted as a recruit, but goes about his business like a 2-star recruit. Love these guys who want to go to work ... who play for the love of the game and the love of the Hawks!

If you look at Waggs, he was injured off and on through much of his career. Last year was really his first experience playing extensive snaps. In all honestly, while some folks might dismiss him - the guy did nothing BUT do the gritty work of doing his job last season. Now can he continue to grow his game and refine his craft like Logan Lee? I don't even think we're close yet to seeing the best from Waggs. I hope he enjoys a healthy SR campaign so that he can show us and his brothers (on the D) what he can do!

Not unlike Waggs ... I think that it is premature for fans to suppose that we truly know what we have on the DL quite yet - other than a battle-tested unit that played pretty well last year but still has plenty of room for growth AND that the unit does appear to have decent battle-tested DEPTH.

While many fans seem to suffer from Ferentz-fatigue ... however, the truth remains that his encouragement of player development AND the expectation that players are the ones who write their own story ... that's the reason why the Hawks have so many "success stories." Those stories of emerging guys ... guys who go on to be great Hawks ... really productive players ... hell, even consensus AA sometimes ... that's the life-blood of this program.
 
Last edited:
In 2008, Clayborn and Ballard were first-year starters at DE. Binns came in as a top backup at DE and Klug came in as a top backup at DT. That year, Geary emerged as a highly competent walk-on who contributed as a back-up DE. Mike Daniels was still severely undersized back then ... and he saw backup action in something like 8 games. Here was their production:
Clayborn: 50 tackles, 8 TFLs, 2 sack, 3 batted-balls, 2 qbh (starting through 13 games)
Ballard: 40 tackles, 3.5 TFLs, 1.5 sacks, 1 batted-ball, 5 qbh (starting through 13 games)
Binns: 22 tackles, 2.5 TFLs, 2 sacks, 2 batted-balls, 2 qbh (backup through 13 games)
Geary: 15 tackles, 1 qbh (backup through 13 games)
Klug: 17 tackles, 5 TFL, 2 sacks (backup through 12 games)
Daniels: 6 tackles, 1 TFL, 1 sack (backup through 8 games)

With King and Kroul graduating after the '08 season ... and with Geary getting injured ... the depth on the DL significantly contracted in 2009 ... with primarily Clayborn, Binns, Ballard, Klug, and Daniels seeing quality snaps. It's pretty crazy when you think about it ... manning the DL with essentially just 5 guys.

If you look at the production in 2021 for contrast:
Lee: 48 tackles, 5 TFLs, 3 sacks, 1 batted-ball, 1 qbh (starter - 14 games)
Shannon: 47 tackles, 2 TFLs, 2 sacks, 3 qbh (starter - 14 games)
Evans: 34 tackles, 7 TFLs, 7 sacks, 1 batted-ball, 6 qbh (back-up - 14 games)
Waggoner: 25 tackles, 3.5 TFLs, 2 sacks, 3 batted-balls, 7 qbh (starter - 14 games)
Van Ness: 33 tackles, 8.5 TFLs, 7 sacks, 1 batted-ball, 3 qbh (back-up - 14 games)
Black: 18 tackles, 2 qbh (back-up - 14 games)
Craig: 14 tackles, 3 TFLs, 1.5 sacks (back-up - 11 games)
Hurkett: 4 tackles, 0.5 TFL, 1 qbh (back-up - 3 games)

If you're wondering about all of Iowa's picks ... it benefitted A LOT from those batted-balls and QB hurries.

Hopefully it's striking to some folks that in their first year starting for the Hawks ... neither Clayborn, nor Ballard had all that many sacks.

Folks can sift through the numbers and draw their own conclusions. The only thing I'd really highlight is that Iowa's '21 DL was QUITE inexperienced/young.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CookyMonster
The D line must be really good -

Has anybody heard how Llewellyn and Bowie are doing?
I was pretty high on them when they were recruited but have not heard much about them.
Any Updates?

48Max Llewellyn

DL 6-5 243 #Fr. Urbandale, IA Urbandale


86Jeff Bowie

DL 6-5 270 #Fr. West Branch, IA West Branch
To answer your initial question ... folks seem to indicate that there might be some buzz relating to Llewellyn. He was reputed to have looked pretty good during the spring.

At DE, in '22, it's expected that our top guys to see reps are:
Waggoner, Evans/Van Ness, Craig, Hurkett
The next guy after the aforementioned seems like it would probably be Llewellyn.

At DT, in '22, it's expected that our top guys to see reps are:
Lee, Shannon, Van Ness, Black, Pittman/Graves, Stec

We'll have to see how Bowie continues to develop. As others have rightly indicated, the guy is still just a RS FR ... so it's still VERY early in his career yet. The Hawks are likely to lose 3 guys from the DL this year ... so we'll need new guys to emerge.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Herkey Ohio
I’m starting to wonder if this is going to be the best front 7 under the Kf Era. There’s so many that have come along but our depth at DL plus Campbell, Jacob’s and Benson potentially being the best Lb corp since Hodge/Greenway, I’m excited to see if they can join some of those other epic defenses.
If we're talking front 7s ... then there's also potentially the question about not only the starters ... but also the quality of depth that exists too. The '04 front 7 was top-notch. The '09 front 7 was top-notch. The '13 front 7 was MOSTLY impressive ... although the DE play wasn't necessarily inspiring. The '17 front 7 was MOSTLY impressive ... but the depth/firepower at DT was lacking.

You look at a lot of those units ... depth was often, seemingly an issue.

Looking at the '22 personnel among the front 7 ... there's a lot to be optimistic about. Without the benefit of hindsight, I'm willing to suggest that the unit SHOULD BE top notch.

In the second level (LB-level), we have Campbell, Benson, Jacobs, and Higgins as the "true" LBs ... and we have DeJean and Nwankpa at CASH. The CASH spot is clearly "young" ... but there definitely appears to be talent there.

On the DL (in '22), the depth is most certainly there. Furthermore, it's experienced depth. As some folks have argued ... the primary unknown relates to how much "true firepower" exists on this DL. Are we going to see the emergence of somebody like a Howard Hodges, a Nate Meier, a Matt Roth, a Jonathan Babineaux, etc? Who will provide the story-lines for the '22 season? Evans and Van Ness have demonstrated some aptitude for getting to the QB ... will those guys continue to make strides? Will we continue to see the pattern of our SRs putting together their best season? I still remember the initial start of Drew Ott's SR campaign ... being on pace to set the world on fire. But then, regrettably, his season was cut short due to injury ... poor guy never caught the break to have that break-out season truly "show up."
 
Ballard was an athletic freak ... but really didn't have the love for the game necessary to truly hone his craft. He never really rid himself of his bad-habits in terms of technique ... consequently, for as high as his ceiling was in terms of potential ... he never really scratched the surface.

Klug was initially an undersized, twitchy guy who was super-productive for us at DT ... a lot like a taller version of Mitch King.

I think that folks are criminally underselling Logan Lee ... he's a guy whose style is much like that of a Klug.

Noah Shannon, himself, comps himself to Bazata ... and I think that is fabulous and accurate. Nate did nothing but help the D play better together as a unit!

Obviously, Van Ness is a guy who arguably is pretty comparable to Chauncey Golston ... and if I could, I'd clone Chauncey and have a whole army of his clones on our DL. Unselfish player who was productive every place Coach Bell put him ... was a leader too!

Black is a guy who the coaches have been high on from day 1 ... guy seems physically pretty impressive. He played quite a bit last year - just needs to keep on improving his technique and fundamentals. Unlike Ballard, one of the main reasons why Black came to Iowa was because he wanted to develop and be coached - he knew he had a ways to go in order to achieve his potential. I love that about him!

If Evans can channel his inner Nate Meier ... then we're in store to observe some great things! Both guys being really explosive, tough guys ... albeit, undersized.

Obviously, if the buzz is to be believed ... then Graves is a guy who has pretty elite potential. On top of that ... much like Epenesa ... he's a guy who was highly touted as a recruit, but goes about his business like a 2-star recruit. Love these guys who want to go to work ... who play for the love of the game and the love of the Hawks!

If you look at Waggs, he was injured off and on through much of his career. Last year was really his first experience playing extensive snaps. In all honestly, while some folks might dismiss him - the guy did nothing BUT do the gritty work of doing his job last season. Now can he continue to grow his game and refine his craft like Logan Lee? I don't even things we're close yet to seeing the best from Waggs. I hope he enjoys a healthy SR campaign so that he can show us and his brothers (on the D) what he can do!

Not unlike Waggs ... I think that it is premature for fans to suppose that we truly know what we have on the DL quite yet - other than a battle-tested unit that played pretty well last year but still has plenty of room for growth AND that the unit does appear to have decent battle-tested DEPTH.

While many fans seem to suffer from Ferentz-fatigue ... however, the truth remains that his encouragement of player development AND the expectation that players are the ones who write their own story ... that's the reason why the Hawks have so many "success stories." Those stories of emerging guys ... guys who go on to be great Hawks ... really productive players ... hell, even consensus AA sometimes ... that's the life-blood of this program.
Absolutely. To your point. The captain will never be fully appreciated by many Iowa fans until he's been gone a decade.....
 
  • Like
Reactions: cmhawks99
He treated White players just as shitty,,,,,that was the way he conducted his business.
1. That's worse. That just means he treated even more people like shit.

2. He wasn't using their race as a basis of treating them like shit. That's the difference.
 
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT