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Derrick Willies is tearing it up at Texas juco

You have answered a lot of hypothetical questions in this thread for a guy that don't have time to hash out hypotheticals. Maybe it was just mine. Now I feel bad. :)

Go Hawks.

I agree that was a bit hypocritical. Also agree on the Go Hawks. At least that's something we can hopefully all agree on.
 
Those are judgment calls made by the HC. Even if you (as a player) disagree with the depth chart, you continue to practice, improve, and get ready for your opportunity.

That's exactly what CJ Beathard did; his opportunity arrived.

Its not what Derrick Willies did - he chose to forego his opportunities and walk away from his commitment. He forfeited his opportunity. If a player is not motivated to compete for playing time that is his personal problem.

I don't know why some want to continue to portray Willies as a victim.

It's hard, and not really even smart to trust someone who is clearly making the wrong decision, and it was very clear Beathard was a better option early last year.
 
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KF knew Beathard wasn't sticking around to sit behind Rudock for another year though.

What does that have to do with Willies?

If you're saying he quit because he thought Beathard was leaving also then he exercised very bad judgment in two respects: (1) he was wrong, CJ did not leave; and (2) he quit mid-season while he was still getting playing time thereby foreclosing any opportunity for an expanded role.
 
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What a dumb post. Of course none of us know the full story so obviously all we can do is assume. You assume people that don't agree with you also hate Ferentz. If we are to believe that Willies really wanted to come back (like he said he did), then how else would he not have come back if Kirk did everything he could? Yes, It's an assumption that Kirk didn't do everything he could, but it's a very strong one. Agree with it or not, Kirk could have lessened the requirements he initially set forth if he really wanted him back. I think what Willies did was wrong, but I also would have made sure he made it back. Although I also would have been playing him over Hillyer so this situation likely would have never occurred.
You are missing the point, you continue to say that none of us know the full story. But yet you continue to fill in the unknowns with your personal perspective and continue to make assumptions. I am just thankful somebody like you is not running the Iowa program and somebody with values and the understanding that NO PLAYER no matter their talent level is above the expectations of the program......
 
It's hard, and not really even smart to trust someone who is clearly making the wrong decision, and it was very clear Beathard was a better option early last year.
Yes it was very clear last year when CJB got his opportunity to start against Purdue and struggled. Clearly we are seeing a different CJB from last year, because you all act like he came in and set the world on fire last year. The truth is he did not, even when given the opportunity to start. The fact that CJB had to earn his spot is probably the reason we are seeing a focused and determined QB out there.......am I glad CJB is our QB this year, absolutely! However, to claim that Rudock was the reason for our lack of success last year is just naive and to say the only reason we have are successful this season is bc of CJB is also naive. If we had the defense and more importantly the special teams production last year that we are seeing this year we win the ISU game and the Nebraska game last year easily.....maybe even a few more. That would have put us at 9 wins minimum. The truth is our defense and special teams were about as bad as I have seen in the KF era since 2000..........It would be remiss to say that CJB should not get a ton of credit this year b/c he has looked great, but so has our defense and special teams....hence 3-0.
 
You are missing the point, you continue to say that none of us know the full story. But yet you continue to fill in the unknowns with your personal perspective and continue to make assumptions. I am just thankful somebody like you is not running the Iowa program and somebody with values and the understanding that NO PLAYER no matter their talent level is above the expectations of the program......

No, you are missing the point. I don't know why you keep getting so wrapped up in these assumptions that I'm making. They are irrelevant. No matter what happened between Ferentz and Willies, I am saying I would have let him come back outside of Willies demanding he start right away or something crazy like that. That's not an assumption, it's an opinion. If you don't like my opinion, then we disagree. Man I knew football coaches weren't the sharpest tools in the shed but I though they could at least follow an argument.
 
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Jake Rudock had a very respectable QB rating of 133.5 compared to CJB's QB rating of 129 last year and CJB's QB rating this year is 141.2 and that is without playing a single big ten game......so the likelyhood of that QB rating staying that high is probably not realistic, although it could happen.
So we are arguing that CJB was clearly the best choice last year and when given the opportunity last year clearly struggled, even in comparison to his counterpart.
Some are also freaking out about a WR with a total of 4 college receptions who was playing significant amount of snaps as a RSFR, who decided to quit mid season and somehow are trying to make this look like it was KF who forced him out. The same KF who went on record several times saying he would welcome him back if he decided he wanted to rejoin the program. Somehow these same people are trying to make Willies look like the victim here, agenda much??????
As I have said a numerous occasions, we are 3-0 with a super close knitted group, who very much look they enjoy going to battle with each other every Saturday. If you allow a player with talent do what every he wants, this would not be the case.
We are very fortunate to have KF as our HC and some of you will realize that someday, and that day might be very soon if we continue to play like we have.
 
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No, you are missing the point. I don't know why you keep getting so wrapped up in these assumptions that I'm making. They are irrelevant. No matter what happened between Ferentz and Willies, I am saying I would have let him come back outside of Willies demanding he start right away or something crazy like that. That's not an assumption, it's an opinion. If you don't like my opinion, then we disagree. Man I knew football coaches weren't the sharpest tools in the shed but I though they could at least follow an argument.
IT IS AN ASSUMPTION BECAUSE YOU DO NOT KNOW IF FERENTZ DID GIVE HIM THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME BACK OUTSIDE OF WILLIES DEMANDING HE START RIGHT AWAY.....YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE DISCUSSION WAS BETWEEN THE TWO SO WHEN YOU MAKE A STATEMENT LIKE THAT WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED BEHIND CLOSED DOORS THAT THE DEFINITION OF MAKING AN ASSUMPTION
An opinion would be like saying "I did not agree with that play call" or "I did not agree with who was our starting QB" those are opinions.
 
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It's hard, and not really even smart to trust someone who is clearly making the wrong decision, and it was very clear Beathard was a better option early last year.
Except it wasn't very clear. The fact that this board is split pretty much says as much.

Now if you want to say it's not really smart to take the word of an overly biased person that seems to be infatuated with hating the coach I'd be right there with you.
 
It's hard, and not really even smart to trust someone who is clearly making the wrong decision, and it was very clear Beathard was a better option early last year.

Nice to have this rear-view mirror view of the situation. It was anything but "very clear" in early 2014, now more than one year ago, which QB was better.
 
IT IS AN ASSUMPTION BECAUSE YOU DO NOT KNOW IF FERENTZ DID GIVE HIM THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME BACK OUTSIDE OF WILLIES DEMANDING HE START RIGHT AWAY.....YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE DISCUSSION WAS BETWEEN THE TWO SO WHEN YOU MAKE A STATEMENT LIKE THAT WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED BEHIND CLOSED DOORS THAT THE DEFINITION OF MAKING AN ASSUMPTION
An opinion would be like saying "I did not agree with that play call" or "I did not agree with who was our starting QB" those are opinions.

Jesus christ it's an opinion. Argue the opinion! Yes I had to use an assumption to clarify my opinion, but that's only to show the terms under which I would let Willies back on the team and those in which I wouldn't.
 
Not thick skinned, just call it like I see it......you do not like KF, we all get it. But because some of feel that KF should not be at fault for having expectations and accountability with his student-athletes does not make us "KF jock sniffers" Am I a KF supporter, you are damn right I am. I like the fact that he runs a clean by the book program, sticks with his beliefs, and is far more successful than any KF haters make him out to be. Being in the coaching profession I probably have a different vantage point on this topic and we may not agree on this topic. However, if you are going to act like a prick on here do not be surprised if somebody calls you out on it. When he decides to step down (sometime after the 2020 season) he will go down as the most successful or at least #2 passing legendary Hayden Fry and that is a fact

He ties Alvarez for wins this weekend. Same amount of time, basically.
 
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Jesus christ it's an opinion. Argue the opinion! Yes I had to use an assumption to clarify my opinion, but that's only to show the terms under which I would let Willies back on the team and those in which I wouldn't.
Hey bud let's leave JC out of this.....also making assumptions to prove your opinion is bad form
 
Hey bud let's leave JC out of this.....also making assumptions to prove your opinion is bad form

It's not proving my opinion, it's clarifying it. God you are frustrating. I'm done going back and forth with you on this, you're helpless. I made sure to throw god in there along with JC for you. It was warranted.
 
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It's not proving my opinion, it's clarifying it. God you are frustrating. I'm done going back and forth with you on this, you're helpless. I made sure to throw god in there along with JC for you. It was warranted.
Clarifying an opinion with an assumption is still bad form....you are just getting so butt hurt bc deep down you know you are wrong......quite hilarious really....I'll make to say hi to the coaching staff, current players, and keep sending kids to the tailgater every year....
 
What does that have to do with Willies?

If you're saying he quit because he thought Beathard was leaving also then he exercised very bad judgment in two respects: (1) he was wrong, CJ did not leave; and (2) he quit mid-season while he was still getting playing time thereby foreclosing any opportunity for an expanded role.

If I remember correctly CJB tried to talk Willies into not quitting and once CJB realized that Willies was leaving he basically wished him all the best.

http://hawkeyenation.com/football/miller-cracks-foundation

"Then an hour or so later, when players met with the media, CJ Beathard made some comments:

"Best Willies take came from CJB. He tried to talk him into staying. Didn't agree with midseason move. Still friends, close." per Marc Morehouse

http://www.scout.com/college/iowa/story/1474128-beathard-sheds-more-light-on-willies-exit
 
Wow you guys will really go through some revisionist mental gymnastics to defend KF.

I don't have time to pick apart all the straw man arguments that got thrown out there...but to summarize.

Yes Beatherd is better now than then, yes he wasn't great in his one start last year, and yes Rudock had a good QB rating and wasn't the only reason Iowa underachieved last year.

It was still painfully obvious who was more talented and who the QB should have been.

Better passer, better pocket presence better runner. Those things were quite apparent last year.

I mean seriously who are you trying to kid? We all watched it.

It's ok, It's a new KF this year. You guys can relax.
 
What does that have to do with Willies?

If you're saying he quit because he thought Beathard was leaving also then he exercised very bad judgment in two respects: (1) he was wrong, CJ did not leave; and (2) he quit mid-season while he was still getting playing time thereby foreclosing any opportunity for an expanded role.

Nothing to do with DW, just addressing the point of CJ earning it.

Sure he earned it but KF also had to look at the situation differently than a normal competition.
 
Maybe we ought to be looking at the two Trinity Valley QB"s -- 456 yards passing per game, 62% completion percentage, 27 TD's and only 1 INT. 399 yards rushing on 71 carries. If Willis wanted to be a Hawkeye, he would have stayed and worked his way back up the depth chart. When a player walks out on the team, they need to earn back the trust of their teammates and coaches. You can't expect a coach or team leaders to "do whatever it takes to get him back."
JUCO football is very similar to JUCO basketball......NO DEFENSE EVER!! Once he quit the story is over.
 
Id be surprised if you are right.

Based on what? Tech has a lot of talented receivers. Go look at the talent they get at receiver. Plus he is going to be behind guys coming in and has shown he isn't willing to put in the effort to beat guys out.
 
And because the competition has not been much.
And because Kirk is getting carried by the two players he didn't want starting. CJ and Cane. Willies was good friends with CJ. You guys don't realize that both were disgusted with how Ferentz was running the offense. They sat through the Ball State and Clown fiasco. Both were jumping ship.
One did it earlier than the other while the assistant coaches knocked some sense into Ferentz to keep CJ at the end of the season. They finally slapped him with the Nebraska results and he caved in. Ferentz fought tooth and nail for Jake all season. Jake would still be our starter if Ferentz were the only coach. That is a fact.
 
And because Kirk is getting carried by the two players he didn't want starting. CJ and Cane. Willies was good friends with CJ. You guys don't realize that both were disgusted with how Ferentz was running the offense. They sat through the Ball State and Clown fiasco. Both were jumping ship.
One did it earlier than the other while the assistant coaches knocked some sense into Ferentz to keep CJ at the end of the season. They finally slapped him with the Nebraska results and he caved in. Ferentz fought tooth and nail for Jake all season. Jake would still be our starter if Ferentz were the only coach. That is a fact.

No
 
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Wow you guys will really go through some revisionist mental gymnastics to defend KF.

I don't have time to pick apart all the straw man arguments that got thrown out there...but to summarize.

Yes Beatherd is better now than then, yes he wasn't great in his one start last year, and yes Rudock had a good QB rating and wasn't the only reason Iowa underachieved last year.

It was still painfully obvious who was more talented and who the QB should have been.

Better passer, better pocket presence better runner. Those things were quite apparent last year.

I mean seriously who are you trying to kid? We all watched it.

It's ok, It's a new KF this year. You guys can relax.

Sure he had better physical skills, but if he wasn't there mentally, all that is wasted. The problem is that you assume you know more than the coaching staff...if you've attended all the practices, team meetings, discussions on reading D's, etc and know that CJ was absolutely ready and better overall, I apologize. The fact that it didn't show up that way on the field makes me think the coaches knew what they were doing.

I have no such information, but the way things played out I think a pretty reasonable analysis of what transpired looks like this (to avoid the inevitable...what follows is my speculation, I'm not claiming any of it as fact):

Going into last season, Rudock had the play book, reads, etc. down pat. He also had reasonable physical skills. He was a solid QB, but not a playmaker. This also fits what we're seeing from him at Michigan.
At the same time, the coaches felt CJ was the better player physically, but were not comfortable that he had it figured out mentally. I think they suspected he was a "gamer". Hence the decision to get CJ game time experience...see what he could do "under the lights" and get more info on whether or not it was time to switch.

The problem was that CJ didn't light it up and they felt, for the bulk of the season, that Rudock was the QB more likely to put them in a position to win.
By the end of the season, they decided CJ had progressed to a point where they were putting their eggs in that basket. He wasn't going to be worse than Jake, and he had much higher upside. I think they also realized that the QB controversy was not good for the team, so in January they released the 2 deeps announcing CJ as the clear #1. Controversy gone, team can rally around one QB, one QB getting #1 reps in practice, and the QB can play without looking over his shoulder.

You can believe one of two things at this point: that CJ improved and earned his starting spot and the coaches recognized and rewarded that, or that CJ was clearly better overall (not just in physical skills) and that the coaches were too stupid to recognize it or too stubborn to act on it (yeah, maybe they deliberately played a worse QB because....they wanted to win less?). KF has said on more than one occasion that CJ has grown immensely since last year.

I have a pretty good idea which one is more rational, but I'm guessing it's not the one you'd choose.
 
And because Kirk is getting carried by the two players he didn't want starting. CJ and Cane. Willies was good friends with CJ. You guys don't realize that both were disgusted with how Ferentz was running the offense. They sat through the Ball State and Clown fiasco. Both were jumping ship.
One did it earlier than the other while the assistant coaches knocked some sense into Ferentz to keep CJ at the end of the season. They finally slapped him with the Nebraska results and he caved in. Ferentz fought tooth and nail for Jake all season. Jake would still be our starter if Ferentz were the only coach. That is a fact.
Oh great, another poster with no 'real' knowledge in the situation who decides to make claims that are 100% assumptions. You know KF didn't want these players starting? You do realize that both of these players were at Iowa b/c KF recruited them to Iowa right? You know that both were disgusted how the offense was being run, bc it is and was the same offense that we had when the signed a LOI with iowa. You know the assistant coaches were the ones who knocked sense into KF and not the other way around? You know for a fact that it was KF that fought for Jake all season? You know that KF was not the one who didn't decide to start Beathard? You do not, I do not, nobody outside of that room knows.....these are all 100% assumptions....you guys can't keep trying to claim that your assumptions are facts
 
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Oh great, another poster with no 'real' knowledge in the situation who decides to make claims that are 100% assumptions. You know KF didn't want these players starting? You do realize that both of these players were at Iowa b/c KF recruited them to Iowa right? You know that both were disgusted how the offense was being run, bc it is and was the same offense that we had when the signed a LOI with iowa. You know the assistant coaches were the ones who knocked sense into KF and not the other way around? You know for a fact that it was KF that fought for Jake all season? You know that KF was not the one who didn't decide to start Beathard? You do not, I do not, nobody outside of that room knows.....these are all 100% assumptions....you guys can't keep trying to claim that your assumptions are facts

These 'posters' probably have another thing in common - the same password...
 
And because Kirk is getting carried by the two players he didn't want starting. CJ and Cane. Willies was good friends with CJ. You guys don't realize that both were disgusted with how Ferentz was running the offense. They sat through the Ball State and Clown fiasco. Both were jumping ship.
One did it earlier than the other while the assistant coaches knocked some sense into Ferentz to keep CJ at the end of the season. They finally slapped him with the Nebraska results and he caved in. Ferentz fought tooth and nail for Jake all season. Jake would still be our starter if Ferentz were the only coach. That is a fact.

LMFAO - wow...just....wow. Consider reading up on Occam's Razor.
 
".....pretty reasonable analysis......"

I believe you reasonably described the QB situation as it was developing during that time frame. You have to fill in the details with speculation but most of what you wrote can be logically supported by what the coaches were stating publically during that time frame (the competition was close, practice and preparation remarks concerning both QBs, e.g) and afterwards (comments about CJB's maturity and better judgment shown during bowl prep and continuing after the bowl game). Your explanation sounds most reasonable to me.
 
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I believe you reasonably described the QB situation as it was developing during that time frame. You have to fill in the details with speculation but most of what you wrote can be logically supported by what the coaches were stating publically during that time frame (the competition was close, practice and preparation remarks concerning both QBs, e.g) and afterwards (comments about CJB's maturity and better judgment shown during bowl prep and continuing after the bowl game). Your explanation sounds most reasonable to me.

You really think that's a more reasonable explanation than KF was just giving fans the finger? You're an apologists. Have fun in Mediocrityville. :)
 
Yes It is a fact that Ferentz wanted Jake and is the reason CJ was never given a fair shot all season long. Ferentz got the ultimatum from Admin that it was win or be fired. The coaching staff met and Ferentz was forced to listen. 2 Jakes in a row that Ferentz had heated exchanges trying to keep them as the starter.
 
Yes It is a fact that Ferentz wanted Jake and is the reason CJ was never given a fair shot all season long. Ferentz got the ultimatum from Admin that it was win or be fired. The coaching staff met and Ferentz was forced to listen. 2 Jakes in a row that Ferentz had heated exchanges trying to keep them as the starter.

Do you have proof of the ultimatum?
 
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Do you have proof of the ultimatum?
That's the problem with this entire thread... It's a long hypothetical with lots of hearsay and rumors. The facts: Willies was good in a spring game. He looked decent in limited time. He quit. He wanted back. He chose not to follow Ferentz's obligations to rejoin. He left. Iowa had a poor season last year. Rudock was the QB. Ferentz listed Beathard as the top QB in January. Rudock left. Everything else is hearsay unless it's stated directly by Willies, Rudock, Ferentz/coaching staff, and Beathard.
 
Wow, I rarely come over to this board. Now I remember why. The level of thinking that goes into some of the posts in this thread is mind boggling And the OP wishing that he had not started the thread-that's funny. Seriously, what did you think would happen??
 
That's the problem with this entire thread... It's a long hypothetical with lots of hearsay and rumors. The facts: Willies was good in a spring game. He looked decent in limited time. He quit. He wanted back. He chose not to follow Ferentz's obligations to rejoin. He left. Iowa had a poor season last year. Rudock was the QB. Ferentz listed Beathard as the top QB in January. Rudock left. Everything else is hearsay unless it's stated directly by Willies, Rudock, Ferentz/coaching staff, and Beathard.

I would agree with you the thread is full of hypothetical hearsay. What we know to be fact, Willies was unhappy with his playing time, (per CJB comments) his father's illness, (per Coach Ferentz and CJB), CJB tried to talk him into not leaving, (per CJB).

http://www.scout.com/college/iowa/story/1474128-beathard-sheds-more-light-on-willies-exit

Ferentz was asked if Willies had expressed dissatisfaction with a lack of playing time.

"Not to me, no" he said.

Willies did confide in Beathard that he wanted more time on the field.

"I think that was one of the things," Beathard said. "I guess he wasn't getting the reps that he wanted to get and that was maybe one of the reasons (Willies decided to leave). But there was a lot of stuff that went into it."
 
Do you have proof of the ultimatum?
No he doesn't - he
Yes It is a fact that Ferentz wanted Jake and is the reason CJ was never given a fair shot all season long. Ferentz got the ultimatum from Admin that it was win or be fired. The coaching staff met and Ferentz was forced to listen. 2 Jakes in a row that Ferentz had heated exchanges trying to keep them as the starter.
Good to see you keep spewing bs regarding CJ and others. How many wins until you quit posting? Still waiting for one piece of proof from you regarding your "inside" knowledge. Great to see that others know you are full of crap.
 
Feel free to enlighten the conversation with 'the point' you were attempting to make earlier.

It's simple logic my friend.

What other teams have faced is arbitrary, it in no way has an effect on the caliber of opponent Iowa has faced.

I'm not criticizing but a 1aa and isu are not strong competition.

Pitt is decent.
 
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