There is a lot of talk about Iowa not being athletic enough to win. The most athletic team probably wins, but not always. Was Loyola more athletic than Illinois? I would say definitely not and they still won. Why? It had to do with game plan, preparation, effort and some breaks. It also had to do with maybe the lack of those things on the part of Illinois. I think anyone who says Iowa had no chance in this game is wrong. Oregon probably played their best game of the season and Iowa certainly didn't play their best and didn't seem to be as prepared for what Oregon did. The best team won on this day, but on another things could have been different - even with the same athletes.
Does the most athletic team always win?
- Thread starter mepohawk
- Start date
No. A skilled unathletic team will beat an unskilled athletic team.
However, I would argue that two teams of equal skill, the more athletic one will win.
In general, though, it's more about the fit with the style.
However, I would argue that two teams of equal skill, the more athletic one will win.
In general, though, it's more about the fit with the style.
The 'Oregon was more athletic' talk is so ridiculous. You know who else was more athletic than us? Rutgers, Maryland, North Carolina, Minnesota, Michigan St, hell even Iowa State was more athletic.
Being more athletic is only a problem if you try to 'out-athlete' the other team. I.e. Speed things up, turn it into a track meet. If they're a good team (such as Oregon, Michigan, Illinois, Gonzaga), the more athletic team will win win pretty much every time. I think each of those 4 teams scored close to 100 on us.
Should've slowed the game down, not give them so many easy baskets and open looks in transition. Mess up their flow. As it was, they dictated the pace, we tried to keep up w them instead of slowing things down, and that didn't exactly work out for us.
Oh well, it's over now. Gonzaga Oregon will be a heck of a game if they both advance.
Being more athletic is only a problem if you try to 'out-athlete' the other team. I.e. Speed things up, turn it into a track meet. If they're a good team (such as Oregon, Michigan, Illinois, Gonzaga), the more athletic team will win win pretty much every time. I think each of those 4 teams scored close to 100 on us.
Should've slowed the game down, not give them so many easy baskets and open looks in transition. Mess up their flow. As it was, they dictated the pace, we tried to keep up w them instead of slowing things down, and that didn't exactly work out for us.
Oh well, it's over now. Gonzaga Oregon will be a heck of a game if they both advance.
The more athletic team definitely does not always win, but it is an advantage that must be overcome. With Nunge out, CJ at maybe 75%, and Connor also hurt, Iowa was at a huge disadvantage athletically against Oregon. The Ducks played an outstanding game, and deserved to win. They were rolling for 40 minutes. They also have a really good coach, who never seems to get credit for it. Hawks got an unfortunate draw, and they were not really a favorite going into this game (if we had known Connor and CJ's status). Oregon probably should have been at least a 4 or 5 seed, and the Hawks were going to have a hard time going deep into the dance without their full roster, or at least without a healthy CJ and Connor.
Iowas starters weren't just unathletic they were uniquely unathletic by college basketball standards.
Luka was fantastic but he made defending 4 and 5 out teams basically impossible.
Then throw in JBO who did not have the physical tools to be at that level and its amazing they won as many games as they did.
You'll probably never see a major conference basketball team as unathletic as that ever again.
Its why I actually think that next year's squad will eventually have a higher ceiling in a year or two.
Luka was fantastic but he made defending 4 and 5 out teams basically impossible.
Then throw in JBO who did not have the physical tools to be at that level and its amazing they won as many games as they did.
You'll probably never see a major conference basketball team as unathletic as that ever again.
Its why I actually think that next year's squad will eventually have a higher ceiling in a year or two.
You're a moron if you think JBO didn't have the tools to play at the D1 level.
Oregon had 10 dunks, 9 uncontested. Plus numerous other lightly contested layups. You just don't win period giving up that many easy baskets.
Oh come on- this statement is ridiculous. I agree that iowa was less “athletic” than many this year- but saying “you’ll never see a major conference basketball team as unathletic as that ever again” is a ridiculously untrue statement.
just like how cockburn had so many of those. next years team clearly wont be as good offensively but at least we shouldnt be destroyed in the pick and roll like we were this year
Iowa gave up 56 pts in 1st half vs Oregon. Let that sink in when Loyola just scored 16 in half vs OSU. If you are less athletic and have a team of clydesdales, you don''t get in a race with a team that has Arabian Stallions. Iowa starting lineup of CMac, Fredrick, Weezy, Jbo, Garza was both a really slow/unathletic and SMALL at the guard positions. The fact that Iowa doesn't play defense is why they got blown out.
Its an accurate description of the starters.
Not saying they were bad but you'd be hard pressed to find any combination of 3 less athletic players than Luka, JBO and Connor.
Normally you want guys like CJ and Weiskamp to be the low end athletes in a group not the two best.
It actually felt like more.....
didn't the game begin by a Oregon player going to the rack and our 'defense' consisted of a swipe against his arm? We had a great year, but it seemed our players were just running on fumes and you could see the proverbial dam was about to give way not long into it. All teams have to deal with injuries, but with a program like Iowa's it just means even more trouble. We just don't have a roster full of 4 & 5 star players like the Blue Bloods.
Oregon was more athletic than Iowa's starters AND they had offensive skills at every position.
Long story short we need more blacks. I wish the university could demand a certain number of scholarships go to them.
I, personally, would like the NCAA to let Iowa back in the tournament to play Oregon State for their Elite 8 spot.
Watching that team, if we lost to them at any point in a 10-game series it'd be a f***ing crime against humanity.........
I have absolutely no idea how this team has pulled so many consecutive wins out of their ass. It is truly a miracle run they are on.
I mean they beat Oregon in the Pac 12 tournament and it wasn't close.
agree here. come out in man D and it only took a couple of minutes to see we could not do this, went to zone and some subs , slowed the dribble penetration which also slowed their 3 pt shooting, and we got back in the game.
Then turn around the last 3:50 and put back in the original group and they go on a 10-0 run to end the half leading by 10.
we come out in second half with the same starters and play man D again and they get the lead from 10 to 16-18.
Might not have won the game still but with some solid coaching we could maybe had a chance, it was over after this stretch.....
many attributes make a team better. That is one attribute. Any other obvious things you struggle with?
There is a threshold of athleticism that even the best preparation and execution can't overcome. Iowa's overall athletic deficit in the starting five was glaringly obvious. When Weiskamp and CJF are your best athletes in that group, by far, it is surprising they did as well as what they were able to.
Iowa didn't have great execution against oregon. They didn't have great shooting. They got drilled. That was the case most of the season. They depended on a 25+ point game from Garza, very few turnovers and high numbers and percentage made from three. They needed all of that. They didn't play good D with the exception of a few games to end the regular season. Against oregon Iowa's starters, who were already outclassed athletically, had virtually no chance when two of the 3 most limited were more hobbled with injuries.
Iowa needs better athletes who can stay in front of their men on D to make it farther in March.
Iowa didn't have great execution against oregon. They didn't have great shooting. They got drilled. That was the case most of the season. They depended on a 25+ point game from Garza, very few turnovers and high numbers and percentage made from three. They needed all of that. They didn't play good D with the exception of a few games to end the regular season. Against oregon Iowa's starters, who were already outclassed athletically, had virtually no chance when two of the 3 most limited were more hobbled with injuries.
Iowa needs better athletes who can stay in front of their men on D to make it farther in March.
So many of the teams we see in the tournament are playing with grown men, while Iowa was playing with college kids.
The real dissapointment is Fran had all the defense he needed to go around Garza sitting on the bench all year.
If Fran could have been honest with himself about the limited potential of such an athletically lacking team he could have changed it.
He needed to develop those more athletic defenders early on in favor of playing the more experienced "assist to turnover" guys. That would have resulted in an eventual higher ceiling for this team.
Not to mention all the second chance points we gave up because we don't block out and/or rebound well enough.
Talk of defense and teaching, in 4 years we do not cover the high post pick and roll with LG any better, Never got better at defending this simple bball concept used by everyone.
Just baffles me that we could not have improved this in 4 yrs. Not a good look in my book.
Its amazing on the number of "best games" other teams have against the hawks
Yeah, skill can overcome athleticism, as can effort and intelligence.
Great defense especially doesn't take great athleticism but there's a baseline you can't be below and a couple of Iowas starters were below that athletic baseline to be able to play good d.
Iowa had enogh skill advantages to beat allot of average skilled yet more athletic teams but against the skilled athletic teams it wasn't that competitive.
Luka, JW, then who ever plays the best defense.
Im worrying way less about offense and way more about defense.
Im playing Keegan, Ulis, Perkins and Patrick early and often in the season over JBO and Connor. Kris after Nunge is injured.
My starting 5 by big ten time is probably Luka, JW, Keegan, Perkins and Ulis or JT.
CJ would have stayed the starter had he not gotten injured.
Pat and JT first off the bench, Kris 8th man after Nunge out.
Yep, seems like that has been going on for decades.
And, if UCLA makes both FTs (instead of 1-2) with 3 seconds to go in their 1st round PAC 12 tourney matchup, Oregon State is not even in the NCAA Tourney. Crazy ...
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