Guessing NCAA seeds for the Hawks

[stangs_sb]

I thought I would take a shot at a few weights. I haven't seen all the results from the other conference tournaments so I'm sure others will have a better idea. Just wondering what everyone else is thinking. Also does anyone know when the brackets get released? I thought I read Wednesday, but not sure. I looked ahead on my TV schedule on ESPNU and didn't see anything. I thought they did a show on it last year.

125- Gilman- 4 seed. Behind Tomasello, Dance, and Nico
133- Clark- 2 seed. Behind Garrett
149- Sorensen- 2 seed. Behind Retherford
157- Cooper- around 12-14
174- Meyer- tough tourney but still has a good record. I'm guessing around 10-12
184- Brooks- great weekend, I'd say 5 or 6. I like his chances at making a run, Mullet and all. (BEST POST MATCH INTERVIEW EVER)
197- Burak- 3 seed. Behind McIntosh and Cox
HWT- Stoll- Tough to call, I have no idea. 8-10???

Just something to talk about until the brackets come out.

 

[hawknut]

I am not knowledgeable at all about the seeding process or the allotment this year, but it really seems low to give basically the only full wrestling conference (5 of the top 10 and 8 of the top 16 teams) only 6 spots at 165. The Mid American conference got 4 and the ACC got 5. I know there is a process to it, but I do think that the Big Ten is always underrepresented comparatively. It really hurts when there is a guy who hasn't wrestled a whole lot suddenly gets healthy for the conference tournament.

 

[LaxHawk174]

I agree with most of what you think OP.
Gilman 4
Clark 2
Sorensen 2
Cooper 12
Meyer 9 or 10.
Brooks 6
Burak 3
Stoll 10

Will be very interesting to see how they seed Brewer and Richards at 133. Also 157 with IMAR/Nolf/Miller/Gantt/Smith/Brascetta. 174 and 184 are full of studs. No 'easy' part of the bracket for either guy IMO. I'm suspecting McIntosh 1 and Cox 2 at NCAAs, so Burak will get a rematch with Cox from last year, in this years Semis. I'm gonna say 3 in the finals and 5 semi finalists.

 

[Omahahawk86]

57 just crazy today. Ian Miller lost(injury default but he started the match). That means Gannt 1 imar 2 nolf 3 and miller 4.

 

[hawknut]

No way Imar not 1 and nolf not 2.

 

[Omahahawk86]

No way Imar not 1 and nolf not 2.

Sig bet?

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

57 just crazy today. Ian Miller lost(injury default but he started the match). That means Gannt 1 imar 2 nolf 3 and miller 4.

They wouldn't let Miller continue he gave one of the people checking him out an F U and that was that

 

[Spoons]

Gilman gets the 3 due to beating Dance last year. I don't care what he gets as he is wrestling Saturday night. He one pissed off hombre right now.
Clark probably gets the 3 due to Brewer being defending National Champ. Probably not right but same could be said about Gilman.
Sorensen gets the 2
Cooper probably 9-12
Meyer probably 9-12
Brooks 5-9 will be interesting here. Hoping for 5 or 6.
Burak 3
Stoll hard to say with using a wild card to get in he might be a 12.

Predictions:
Gilman: Champ
Clark: Champ
Sorensen: 2nd
Cooper: rd of 12
Meyer: rd of 12
Brooks: 6th
Burak: 2nd
Stoll: rd of 16 damn injury!
Team: 2nd with a outside shoot at winning it.

 

[bammhawk1]

Gman should be the 3 seed. Lets throw Dance in the B10 and see how he does! B10 is by far and away the best league and should get the benefit in this case

 

[MSU158]

Brooks actually has a GREAT argument for TOP 3. He is actually 24-3, as the loss to Taylor doesn't count. He avenged his loss to Dudley and placed above McCutcheon. He is also 1-1 vs Zillmer. Having had a chance to even out all of his losses helps a ton. He will also have a very solid RPI and won his conference championship. Winning the B1G was a VERY BIG boost for his seeding chances. The only guy with a better record, having wrestled more than 20 matches is Stauffer, and he will be penalized(just like last year) for wrestling a weak Pac12 schedule. Avery is 13-1, but is ineligible for RPI and has a loss to Zavatsky that will keep him below Zavatsky due to his small match count.

This is a very different seeding procedure than B1G's. I made the mistake of weighing the B1G seeding for Brooks based off NCAA seeding criteria. Having one more loss, but a decisive head to head win, most often results in a higher seed. However, the conference coaches voting was the key factor, where it will not be here.

 

[dicemen99]

Gilman gets the 3 due to beating Dance last year. I don't care what he gets as he is wrestling Saturday night. He one pissed off hombre right now.
Clark probably gets the 3 due to Brewer being defending National Champ. Probably not right but same could be said about Gilman.
Sorensen gets the 2
Cooper probably 9-12
Meyer probably 9-12
Brooks 5-9 will be interesting here. Hoping for 5 or 6.
Burak 3
Stoll hard to say with using a wild card to get in he might be a 12.

Predictions:
Gilman: Champ
Clark: Champ
Sorensen: 2nd
Cooper: rd of 12
Meyer: rd of 12
Brooks: 6th
Burak: 2nd
Stoll: rd of 16 damn injury!
Team: 2nd with a outside shoot at winning it.

Gilman is getting the 4. Dance will be 2 with the win over Megaludis this year.

Clark is getting the 2.

Cooper will be seeded, but I would guess in the 11-15 range.

Brooks should be 5 or 6.

 

[MSU158]

Spoons,

Last year's results mean nothing and more than 1/2 of the seeding committee won't even have a clue what happened last season!

125 is pretty cut and dry. Tomasello will get the #1 for being undefeated. Dance will get the 2 because his only loss is to Tomasello and he beat Megaludis. #3 Megaludis only has losses to Tomasello and Dance and has beat Gilman. #4 Gilman lost to Megaludis and didn't wrestle the other 2.#5 Millhof is 2-1 with Klimara and has a win over McGhee and Peters. #6 Klimara has a win over McGhee and has only lost to those seeded above him. #7 McGhee beat Peters to win MAC. #8 Peters has a win over Rios and is 1-1 with McGhee. #9 Schram has 2 wins over Rios. #10 Rios has wrestled an insane schedule, his RPI is ridiculous for someone with 7 losses.

 

[DonHawkeye]

Think Brooks is going end up higher than most think.

Seeding Criteria
25% Head to Head - This is a wash. He has 3 losses but wins over those same guys. He is going to be very high in this regard
20% Quality Wins - Not 100% sure how they count these but he has a lot of good wins. WAY more than guys like Avery, Stauffer who I think many would feel would be higher than Brooks.
10% RPI - He was 6th going into this weekend. He had 3 matches with top 20 guys this weekend. Would be surprised to not see his RPI be right at the top.
10% Conference Placement - Can't do any better than winning the B1G - This will kill Brown
15% Coaches Poll - I think this will be his worst knock. I think he will probably be 4-6 in this. Could be worse depending on how bad he gets jobbed.
10 % Win Percentage - I think he has the 4th or 5th best win % if you remove the loss to Taylor

Guys who have arguments to be ahead of him
Dean - Duh
Avery - has 1 quality and bad RPI
Stauffer - Not many more quality wins than Avery and bad RPI
ZZ - Just not sure where he ends up. I think the early season losses and the late loss to Ab comes back to bite him in the Head to Head
Brown - His Conference tourney is gonna hurt him bad. Add the head to head with Dudley and can't see him ahead of Brooks.
Zilmer - Conference tourney should hurt him and not as many quality wins as Brooks.
Ab - Have to think the conference tourney trumps the better win % and should jump him in the Coaches poll.
Dudley - better conference placement, Should jump him in coaches poll, Better win %. Head to head = wash.
Boyd - This is a hard one. He could be anywhere from 2-10.

It would not surprise me to see him jump all these guys. Obviously a 2 or 3 would be huge.

I don't think it really matters. There are gonna be tough guys at every seed so basically getting the 2, 3 or 6 or 7 would be nice to get on the other side of Dean but can see him beating Dean anyways if he wrestles like he did this weekend.

 

[Spoons]

If I'm wrong than that's fine with me Gilman does not care nor do I(not that that means all that much) because he's gonna win it!!!

 

[MNkids2IA]

I thought I would take a shot at a few weights. I haven't seen all the results from the other conference tournaments so I'm sure others will have a better idea. Just wondering what everyone else is thinking. Also does anyone know when the brackets get released? I thought I read Wednesday, but not sure. I looked ahead on my TV schedule on ESPNU and didn't see anything. I thought they did a show on it last year.

125- Gilman- 4 seed. Behind Tomasello, Dance, and Nico
133- Clark- 2 seed. Behind Garrett
149- Sorensen- 2 seed. Behind Retherford
157- Cooper- around 12-14
174- Meyer- tough tourney but still has a good record. I'm guessing around 10-12
184- Brooks- great weekend, I'd say 5 or 6. I like his chances at making a run, Mullet and all. (BEST POST MATCH INTERVIEW EVER)
197- Burak- 3 seed. Behind McIntosh and Cox
HWT- Stoll- Tough to call, I have no idea. 8-10???

Just something to talk about until the brackets come out.

How much conditioning is Stoll able to do ? What is the extent of the injury ?

 

[Omahahawk86]

Think Brooks is going end up higher than most think.

Seeding Criteria
25% Head to Head - This is a wash. He has 3 losses but wins over those same guys. He is going to be very high in this regard
20% Quality Wins - Not 100% sure how they count these but he has a lot of good wins. WAY more than guys like Avery, Stauffer who I think many would feel would be higher than Brooks.
10% RPI - He was 6th going into this weekend. He had 3 matches with top 20 guys this weekend. Would be surprised to not see his RPI be right at the top.
10% Conference Placement - Can't do any better than winning the B1G - This will kill Brown
15% Coaches Poll - I think this will be his worst knock. I think he will probably be 4-6 in this. Could be worse depending on how bad he gets jobbed.
10 % Win Percentage - I think he has the 4th or 5th best win % if you remove the loss to Taylor

Guys who have arguments to be ahead of him
Dean - Duh
Avery - has 1 quality and bad RPI
Stauffer - Not many more quality wins than Avery and bad RPI
ZZ - Just not sure where he ends up. I think the early season losses and the late loss to Ab comes back to bite him in the Head to Head
Brown - His Conference tourney is gonna hurt him bad. Add the head to head with Dudley and can't see him ahead of Brooks.
Zilmer - Conference tourney should hurt him and not as many quality wins as Brooks.
Ab - Have to think the conference tourney trumps the better win % and should jump him in the Coaches poll.
Dudley - better conference placement, Should jump him in coaches poll, Better win %. Head to head = wash.
Boyd - This is a hard one. He could be anywhere from 2-10.

It would not surprise me to see him jump all these guys. Obviously a 2 or 3 would be huge.

I don't think it really matters. There are gonna be tough guys at every seed so basically getting the 2, 3 or 6 or 7 would be nice to get on the other side of Dean but can see him beating Dean anyways if he wrestles like he did this weekend.

Good post. The real wildcard here is Boyd. He's on fire and has beaten Miklus, Dean, and Zillmer lately. I'm hoping Brooks can get the 3 or 6 seed. Let's let someone else beat Dean before we see him How bad has Miklus fallen? He will pry be 12-15.

 

[Omahahawk86]

They wouldn't let Miller continue he gave one of the people checking him out an F U and that was that

That sounds about like Miller. He is super fun to watch though. Wasn't he losing when it happened though?

 

[Atdawn123]

Gilman 4
Clark 2 (chance of 3rd)
Sorenson 2
Cooper 10
Meyer 12
Brooks 5
Burak 3
Stoll 9

Three finalists (Gilman, Clark and Sorenson)
Burak and Brooks top 5
Stoll 7/8 if healthy
Cooper/Meyer Rd 12

 

[DonHawkeye]

If you go and listen to how the actually seeding are done here. http://www.flowrestling.org/article/30388-frl-ep-18-jason-borelli-explains-ncaa-seeds someone that had some serious free time could maybe get it close. https://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/DIWRENWCAAnnualReport2015V1.pdf

They match everyone up against each other. Then use the seeding criteria against everyone to see if you beat them head to head on a 10 point scoring system. For instance if you have more head to head wins you get 2.5 points. More quality wins (Tiered) 2 points ...

They do this for every possible matchup in the weight and then you get a point for every win. So an undefeated #1 will probably get 32 points.

Brooks having no head to head marks, great PRI, Confrence placement, and a ton of quality wins is going to put him really high.

Also this line in the rules makes me think if you get a wildcard you can't get seeded.

"For 2016, the committee recommends that the qualifying tournament placement selection and seeding criteria only be awarded to wrestlers who earn a pre-allocated spot in their respective conference tournament. This puts more emphasis on the conference tournaments, rewarding conference champions and wrestlers that place within the earned allocated spots."

I could be reading that wrong.



'

 

[AFHawk86]

Spoons,

Last year's results mean nothing and more than 1/2 of the seeding committee won't even have a clue what happened last season!

125 is pretty cut and dry. Tomasello will get the #1 for being undefeated. Dance will get the 2 because his only loss is to Tomasello and he beat Megaludis. #3 Megaludis only has losses to Tomasello and Dance and has beat Gilman. #4 Gilman lost to Megaludis and didn't wrestle the other 2.#5 Millhof is 2-1 with Klimara and has a win over McGhee and Peters. #6 Klimara has a win over McGhee and has only lost to those seeded above him. #7 McGhee beat Peters to win MAC. #8 Peters has a win over Rios and is 1-1 with McGhee. #9 Schram has 2 wins over Rios. #10 Rios has wrestled an insane schedule, his RPI is ridiculous for someone with 7 losses.

I would love to see Gilman as the #4 and meet up with Tomasello in the Semi's.

Would also like to see Clark and Richards as the #2 and #3 with Brewer as the #4.

 

[AFHawk86]

"For 2016, the committee recommends that the qualifying tournament placement selection and seeding criteria only be awarded to wrestlers who earn a pre-allocated spot in their respective conference tournament. This puts more emphasis on the conference tournaments, rewarding conference champions and wrestlers that place within the earned allocated spots."
'

I like putting more emphasis on the qualifying tournaments; however, the application could really screw up the brackets.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

That sounds about like Miller. He is super fun to watch though. Wasn't he losing when it happened though?

I don't think they gave 2 to barnes at the stop he was winning but if they did give 2 he would've been down by 1 I believe

 

[stangs-sb]

I see that the selection committee are making their at large selections tonight. Do they get released before the brackets?

 

[21Guns]

Regardless of where you are, if you are Miller and you get the 4, you have a legit shot at Imar before he eats half of New York city and fattens up to 175 on Saturday night. Like I said, that gas tank issue was no "rope a dope" it was real. He's going to gas after weigh ins.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

I see that the selection committee are making their at large selections tonight. Do they get released before the brackets?

They'll be released with the brackets Wednesday

 

[MSU158]

In the past they released each weight in 30 minute intervals running up to the bracket show starting somewhere around 3:00 pm with bracket show around 6:30.