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Grades for BTT

R

relishingwinning18

HR Heisman
Feb 21, 2009
5,543
1,664
113
Since nobody else did it, I'm bored.

Ayala - B-, I thought he'd get 2nd, got 3rd. Tough loss to DeAugustino, but fought back with good wins over Barnett and Ramos. Probably a 3/4 seed at NCAA's.

Teske - B, Nice opening win, and loss to eventual champion in Semis. VanDee match would have made this an A. Good tournament, hopefully sets him up for decent seed in NCAA's.

Real - B-, again Mendez wrestled great tourney, fought back to get 3rd. Something doesn't look right, still see him as top 4 seed, and still has ability to win it all

Caleb - B-, thought he'd be 4th, got 5th. Wasn't sure with injury how he'd do. Good win over Demilio likely keeps him in top 10 for seeds to NCAA's.

Franek - B, thought he'd get 3rd with crappy draw, and if his eye didn't cause him to MFF, I think he would have.

Cal - B -, thought he'd get 3rd, but man, just got destroyed by MM. Maybe MM is a finalist, but that was rough.

PK - C. With Star out, this was his chance, and he lost. Although thought he wrestled ok against Griffith, loss to Welsh drops this to a C.

184 - Who cares

197 - Glazier, A-, good semi win and loss against a beast. Gave the minus for how bad he lost to Brooks, but oh well. Can't fault this guy, and should up his seed at NCAA's now.

285 - Hill, B- lost two matches against guys he's probably not better than. Throwing him a bone here.
 
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MilleGinja said:
I suppose with Cass, Nelson and Assad we almost definitely (unless all hell broke loose) finish with a trophy. Likely even finishing in a distant 2nd place.
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Placement points Hill 5 points, Cass likely 12 - 7 more points.
AA - Maybe 4th or higher, but let's say 4th, 7 more points.
Brands - 3rd, likely 4 more points.

18 more placement points, not counting any advancement would have put us in 2nd.
 
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Im fairly certian the problem with Woods has been that right hand injury. He was so dominant on top, it seems that injury has gotten worse and taped more heavily. If you go back an watch his matches closely in slowmo ( I do this all the time) you can see he does not have the GRIP strength in his dominant right hand that allows him to lock the right arm of his opponent as he used to. He also tends to attack more to the left Now, I believe that injury is significant to his right hand.
 
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Grip220 said:
Im fairly certian the problem with Woods has been that right hand injury. He was so dominant on top, it seems that injury has gotten worse and taped more heavily. If you go back an watch his matches closely in slowmo ( I do this all the time) you can see he does not have the GRIP strength in his dominant right hand that allows him to lock the right arm of his opponent as he used to. He also tends to attack more to the left Now, I believe that injury is significant to his right hand.
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Interesting, still think he could win the whole thing, hope for the best I guess.
 
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Grip220 said:
Im fairly certian the problem with Woods has been that right hand injury. He was so dominant on top, it seems that injury has gotten worse and taped more heavily. If you go back an watch his matches closely in slowmo ( I do this all the time) you can see he does not have the GRIP strength in his dominant right hand that allows him to lock the right arm of his opponent as he used to. He also tends to attack more to the left Now, I believe that injury is significant to his right hand.
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It ain't his hand.
 
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Ayala beats #1 & 5 ranked guys and loses to a multi time AA. Woods beats #5 and loses to the new #1 by a takedown. Yet they both get worse grades then Teske, because his best win was against #10 (who also didn't even place at the tournament) and he placed lower at a weaker weight... smooth.

B minus for Drake is especially dumb.
 
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Grip220 said:
Im fairly certian the problem with Woods has been that right hand injury. He was so dominant on top, it seems that injury has gotten worse and taped more heavily. If you go back an watch his matches closely in slowmo ( I do this all the time) you can see he does not have the GRIP strength in his dominant right hand that allows him to lock the right arm of his opponent as he used to. He also tends to attack more to the left Now, I believe that injury is significant to his right hand.
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I've thought shoulder all year, but vhs could be right, a leg wouldn't be a stretch. The leg wouldn't explain getting reversed to back and overpowered from neutral a few times though. Neither would hand really.
 
TNTwrestle said:
I've thought shoulder all year, but vhs could be right, a leg wouldn't be a stretch. The leg wouldn't explain getting reversed to back and overpowered from neutral a few times though. Neither would hand really.
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He is right handed, imagine you have no strength in your right hand and go through a day of manual labor. Its his hand and im not 100% but im 90% sure of it.
 
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BGon4ND said:
Ayala beats #1 & 5 ranked guys and loses to a multi time AA. Woods beats #5 and loses to the new #1 by a takedown. Yet they both get worse grades then Teske, because his best win was against #10 (who also didn't even place at the tournament) and he placed lower at a weaker weight... smooth.

B minus for Drake is especially dumb.
Click to expand...

Hill was the 7 and placed 5th. Has come from no where to the NCAAs in one season. “Meh…charity B-.” 😂
 
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BGon4ND said:
Ayala beats #1 & 5 ranked guys and loses to a multi time AA. Woods beats #5 and loses to the new #1 by a takedown. Yet they both get worse grades then Teske, because his best win was against #10 (who also didn't even place at the tournament) and he placed lower at a weaker weight... smooth.

B minus for Drake is especially dumb.
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First, you're taking my grades waaaaaaaay too serious on a bored Monday morning. I guess my thinking would be "A" - champion, "B" wrestling to seed. Maybe my seriously low expectations of Teske took over, but if I'm grading them, it's just how they wrestled in this tournament. He wrestled better than he has all year IMO. As far as Drake, he did have two good wins, but losing to Deagustino was disappointing and takes some of that away. I mean it's a tournament and he didn't make the final as a 2 seed, how do you want to grade him higher? Also, if at the beginning of the year, you said Real would get third in the BTT, nobody would place him higher than D.
 
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SPOONER said:
Hill was the 7 and placed 5th. Has come from no where to the NCAAs in one season. “Meh…charity B-.” 😂
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Hill was the 7th seed, who beat the 10 seed twice, the 9 seed, and the 6 seed who is ranked in all polls below him. He beat not a single ranked wrestler on Intermat, but sure, let's give him a better grade. Damn we've fallen in expectations.
 
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Grip220 said:
He is right handed, imagine you have no strength in your right hand and go through a day of manual labor. Its his hand and im not 100% but im 90% sure of it.
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It could very well be his hand, or both, or all three. I'm usually pretty good at spotting signs of shoulder problems. I wrestled half of my senior year of HS with a torn labrum, and I know how hard it is. You can't pull anything toward you, you lose grip strength, you can't lift. I spotted that was the problem right away with McD and had to listen to people on here say it was the weight cut and 50 other things. I'm not arguing, you could be right about the hand, but the shoulder looks suspicious.
 
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TNTwrestle said:
It could very well be his hand, or both, or all three. I'm usually pretty good at spotting signs of shoulder problems. I wrestled half of my senior year of HS with a torn labrum, and I know how hard it it. You can't pull anything toward you, you lose grip strength, you can't lift. I spotted that was the problem right away with McD and had to listen to people on here say it was the weight cut and 50 other things. I'm not arguing, you could be right about the hand, but the shoulder looks suspicious.
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I had shoulder surgery also in HS, full dislocation making a tackle and got hit from behind. I will further look at that but all tge signs of him not getting in to his right and finishing along with his lost ability to ride and tilt to his dominant right side leans towards that hand not being able to hold on as it was.
 
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Woods it’s a strength issue whatever it is. Seems like he’s gotten better over the last month. Will another two weeks be enough to get him over the top against a Mendez or Bartlett.
 
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relishingwinning18 said:
Hill was the 7th seed, who beat the 10 seed twice, the 9 seed, and the 6 seed who is ranked in all polls below him. He beat not a single ranked wrestler on Intermat, but sure, let's give him a better grade. Damn we've fallen in expectations.
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Well, he's a backup who got beat by guys like Gage Marty, Gannon Rosenfeld, and Ryan Catka last year. Hell, the 5th place finisher at 197 (and NCAA qualifier) Garrett Joles handed him his ass in the dual last year.

In case you missed it the first time, he's a backup.

We haven't fallen in expectations, we're just not very smart. And be we, I mean you. And it isn't really a new thing.
 
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SPOONER said:
Well, he's a backup who got beat by guys like Gage Marty, Gannon Rosenfeld, and Ryan Catka last year. Hell, the 5th place finisher at 197 (and NCAA qualifier) Garrett Joles handed him his ass in the dual last year.

In case you missed it the first time, he's a backup.

We haven't fallen in expectations, we're just not very smart. And be we, I mean you. And it isn't really a new thing.
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I imagine it was hard to type all that with one hand down Hills pants. What does last year's results have to do with the grade I just gave out for the tournament last weekend? He's a backup who beat a bunch of other guys who would be backups. "we're just not very smart. And be we, I mean you". Damn, nothing like trying to prove a point about not being smart and killing the grammar. Hill now gets a D.
 
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relishingwinning18 said:
I imagine it was hard to type all that with one hand down Hills pants. What does last year's results have to do with the grade I just gave out for the tournament last weekend? He's a backup who beat a bunch of other guys who would be backups. "we're just not very smart. And be we, I mean you". Damn, nothing like trying to prove a point about not being smart and killing the grammar. Hill now gets a D.
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Why would anyone give a 3nd stringer who wrestled 2 spots above his seed and qualified for the NCAAs such a low grade? Silly.
 
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Chips28 said:
Woods it’s a strength issue whatever it is. Seems like he’s gotten better over the last month. Will another two weeks be enough to get him over the top against a Mendez or Bartlett.
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Could be a viral illness with lingering problems with fatigue. That will make you look weak. Especially in 3rd period, which is when Mendez ran him over. Spencer had this issue most of one year, was barely hanging on with guy who made it through the 3rd period . Slowly got stronger, regaining enough strength to win nationals again, but think he lost to the northwestern guy twice that year??
 
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Grip220 said:
How does feel knowing you go through life being a putz?
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I feel fine. Just tired of all the excuses we make. But you go ahead and analyze Woods’s body frame-by-frame to figure something out for yourself, don’t let my jokes ruin it for you.

In the end, it really doesn’t matter why he got bulled by Mendez and beat to the punch by Bartlett. He’s got another shot to step up and be the man, our excuses be damned.
 
SPOONER said:
Why would anyone give a 3nd stringer who wrestled 2 spots above his seed and qualified for the NCAAs such a low grade? Silly.
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A B- isn't that bad for starters. I actually thought the hawks wrestled a decent tournament with what we had to throw out there. But.......I did look at who he beat and it does matter. Two guys who he should have beat, and twice a Nebraska football player. While he won the matches he should have, it was in incredibly weak weight bracket and he upset nobody.
 
relishingwinning18 said:
Placement points Hill 5 points, Cass likely 12 - 7 more points.
AA - Maybe 4th or higher, but let's say 4th, 7 more points.
Brands - 3rd, likely 4 more points.

18 more placement points, not counting any advancement would have put us in 2nd.
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Are you subtracting what we lose at 157/165. Probably lose a few points there.
 
Libertylover said:
Could be a viral illness with lingering problems with fatigue. That will make you look weak. Especially in 3rd period, which is when Mendez ran him over. Spencer had this issue most of one year, was barely hanging on with guy who made it through the 3rd period . Slowly got stronger, regaining enough strength to win nationals again, but think he lost to the northwestern guy twice that year??
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Are we really blaming viral illnesses on our guys lack of strength/gassing in the 3rd?
 
drunkengoat said:
Are we really blaming viral illnesses on our guys lack of strength/gassing in the 3rd?
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Make more sense that a limb injury. They only affect you after you get ahold of someone, or affect the quickness of you feet if it’s a leg. Viral illness can give you total body fatigue. I just noticed this problem seemed to start after he missed that road trip because he was sick.
 
acuhawk said:
How about if at the beginning of the year someone said our 3rd or 4th string heavyweight would get 5th at the BTT?
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Well, Keuter was never the plan this year, so Hill was our backup for starters. IMO, and maybe this isn't everyone's, but every Iowa backup should be able to step in and be close to top 30 at their respective weights, and should be able to beat any unranked wrestler. If this is no longer the case, then we have really fallen. Most, if not every recruit is top 15 at their weight coming out of high school. Hill was the #112 recruit in the country and again, he beat a Nebraska football player twice, a converted average 197 pounder in Wilham, and a very average MSU Redshirt Freshman that went 0-2 BBQ at the Big Tens by two other very average wrestlers.
 
relishingwinning18 said:
Well, Keuter was never the plan this year, so Hill was our backup for starters. IMO, and maybe this isn't everyone's, but every Iowa backup should be able to step in and be close to top 30 at their respective weights, and should be able to beat any unranked wrestler. If this is no longer the case, then we have really fallen. Most, if not every recruit is top 15 at their weight coming out of high school. Hill was the #112 recruit in the country and again, he beat a Nebraska football player twice, a converted average 197 pounder in Wilham, and a very average MSU Redshirt Freshman that went 0-2 BBQ at the Big Tens by two other very average wrestlers.
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Wow the 112 recruit in the country. Why is he not a superstar, pinning his way to Big 10 titles?

Never before has someone worked so hard to discredit a guy for wrestling 2 spots above his seed. Well done, I guess.
 
acuhawk said:
How about if at the beginning of the year someone said our 3rd or 4th string heavyweight would get 5th at the BTT?
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I'd say, "Uh-oh, what happened to Cass?"

I think everyone agrees that Hill did a nice job in placing 5th. He has improved throughout the season--certainly from last season.

But I think everyone also agrees that placing 5th in the BTT isn't a goal anyone on the Iowa team should be striving for.

So we have a feel-good personal story ("an A for Hill!") and we have the bigger picture of his performance relative to the level of his competition ("a B- for Hill!"). He was not our 3rd string heavyweight for this tourney, he was our starter, and there's no reason to grade him on a curve out of pity. Don't treat him like he's "Rudy." I suspect he would agree.
 
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SPOONER said:
Wow the 112 recruit in the country. Why is he not a superstar, pinning his way to Big 10 titles?

Never before has someone worked so hard to discredit a guy for wrestling 2 spots above his seed. Well done, I guess.
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Amazingly, 112th was a higher ranking than those he beat last weekend. Thanks for proving my point.
 
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