Has anyone been to any Iowa practices?

[Eternal Return]

I don't think that's true. Fran and Kirk are pretty similar when it comes to being great on one side of the ball and inept on the other....to the detriment if the program. Maybe Kirk is a little less bad at O than fran is on D but they are in the bottom half of offenses pretty much every year and well into bottom half quite often if memory serves (I try to ignore the offensive rankings). I think 02 was only season they broke top 50 but I could be wrong. I'd welcome a correction if someone knows....don't care to look it up

I agree to an extent. I recall reading several assessments of Iowa's offense and part of the reason for the weak stats was related to pace of play and play calling. Iowa sucks up clock under Ferentz, fewer plays per game for both teams. It also makes Iowa's defense look better than it might actually be because they rarely get worn out by the end of the game. I'm sometimes frustrated by the pace of play, but it's a legitimate coaching strategy. Is it the most fun to watch? Not unless the other team is ovrrmatched, but it does lead to competitive teams who can sometimes punch above their weight.

But I understand, it can drive me crazy when the O rarely changes pace because there are some games, or at least stretches in some games, where it seems like it would be better if Iowa put it's foot on the gas and keep it there.

 

[jonesy5960]

I have observed several practices of late and there is some serious weed smoking and Wii playing going on. Not much else that I could gather. It was Wii Sports if that makes any difference.

 

[RomanHawk]

Well I have been very critical of the way Fran does things. I used to go on and on about how much I admire Villanova's program, how I've watched them practice a few times. Fran and staff teach this stuff well, but defense is so much harder than people realize. The way the floor is spaced, the stuff guys can do off the dribble, ball-screens, the game is harder to defend now than it was 20 or 30 years ago. Pretty much everybody is a floor-spacer. Rotations are much more extended and stretched and stressed.

I wish Iowa would have a staff that built its program from a defense/rebounding mindset. Every program I played in was built on D and rebounding. I believe it de-stresses offense, meaning that if your program is supremely confident on D, it frees itself to relax on O. Being relaxed is better for skill execution. Think of shooting pool or darts or whatever. Relaxed is how you want to be to execute. I always feel like Iowa is stressed on offense not just because of who is on the floor, but because they seem to know that if they don't score, they're ğcked. Whereas a team like Michigan State or Purdue that puts 90% of their eggs into the D/rebounding basket knows that as long as they keep getting stops and limiting second chance, they'll be in the game.

That said, it's not like Iowa doesn't work on this stuff. We want Fran to be perfect. A lot of fans act like Fran can suddenly summon some inner Izzo or inner Jay Wright. I don't know. I can get negative like any other fan, but then I remember what I get to root for. I'll defend Fran and his staff and players all day everyday. Good people. Good kids.

 

[RomanHawk]

Well I have been very critical of the way Fran does things. I used to go on and on about how much I admire Villanova's program, how I've watched them practice a few times. Fran and staff teach this stuff well, but defense is so much harder than people realize. The way the floor is spaced, the stuff guys can do off the dribble, ball-screens, the game is harder to defend now than it was 20 or 30 years ago. Pretty much everybody is a floor-spacer. Rotations are much more extended and stretched and stressed.

I wish Iowa would have a staff that built its program from a defense/rebounding mindset. Every program I played in was built on D and rebounding. I believe it de-stresses offense, meaning that if your program is supremely confident on D, it frees itself to relax on O. Being relaxed is better for skill execution. Think of shooting pool or darts or whatever. Relaxed is how you want to be to execute. I always feel like Iowa is stressed on offense not just because of who is on the floor, but because they seem to know that if they don't score, they're ğcked. Whereas a team like Michigan State or Purdue that puts 90% of their eggs into the D/rebounding basket knows that as long as they keep getting stops and limiting second chance, they'll be in the game.

That said, it's not like Iowa doesn't work on this stuff. We want Fran to be perfect. A lot of fans act like Fran can suddenly summon some inner Izzo or inner Jay Wright. I don't know. I can get negative like any other fan, but then I remember what I get to root for. I'll defend Fran and his staff and players all day everyday. Good people. Good kids.

Many good points. Thanks for your post.

Teaching and attention to detail have been mentioned in this thread. They both relate to what I see so many times in most games. I'm referring to individual incidents of not moving into an obvious rebounding position, an action leading to a TO, a shot thrown up or taken off balance, .......

They may not all show up on the stat sheet, but they amount to maybe 10 or more "lost
opportunities a game.

My reaction when that happen is "that was ridiculous, they must be allowed to do that in practice or they wouldn't be doing it in a game".

If there is teaching, a link appears to be missing between the teaching and the insistence, the demanding, that the teaching be followed. Without being a Bobby Knight, a coach has to find his own way of establishing that failure to follow his teaching will not be tolerated. I don't think our players are lazy or unengaged. But I also know that all of us, if pushed sufficiently by ourselves or others, are capable of more than even we, ourselves, thought possible. But asking is not enough, it has to be demanded. I don't think Fran is getting that part done. The disciplined play is just not there.

I think Wisconsin is a very good example. They are never super talented, but they win close to 80% of their close games. And they do it by being disciplined----especially late, they don't take bad shots, they don't make unforced TOs, they rebound well, they don't commit stupid fouls, .....

Either Fran is not teaching or he is trying too hard to be liked.

 

[LarryMullenJr.]

I have to lean toward the coaching side of the discussion for our deficiencies. These are smart kids, who are good players, without question. They also, like every one of us, have shortcomings that we're all pretty much aware of.
Great ball movement and spacing will eventually beat down any defense with even the greatest players, but if you rewind some of the plays were we get smoked for open shots (and 'wide' open at that), many many times you will end up seeing two or three guys in very close proximity to each other out of position. It very much appears that not everyone is on the same page with rotations/rotating. Yes, Jordan and Connor have a tendency to get beat off dribbles, and closeouts can be ugly, but it's not always the same guys to point at. If we had a stat that kept track of the facial expression of "oh, shit, there's a guy wide open over there", it would be pretty even across the team. That, IMO, is solely on the coaches.

 

[NoSwampDonkeys]

Just remember… part of what makes you think "boring vanilla offense" is that you (presumably) have watched nearly every game since Fran was hired. If you watched every Villanova game since Jay Wright was hired—guess what—it would start to look boring and vanilla. You might appreciate how precisely they execute, the shot-making, but it's extremely vanilla—more vanilla than Iowa.

I would equate what you are saying is "boring" in basketball as being simplified and somewhat basic. But just like the Iowa football offense, if the execution is drilled in to the point that it is muscle memory and you don't have to think about it, boring doesn't matter.

Flawless execution makes up for the other team knowing what is coming. Then it becomes a matter of stopping it. I think that might be part of the issue with Fran. He maybe has TOO MANY things installed that they have to think about. Nothing is really natural.

I tend to subscribe to the KISS method in life. Keep It Simple Stupid. Don't over complicate things for the sake of variety, but keep things straight forward and to the point. If the O and D were drilled down further and everything was about execution (As was said of Lute, starting drills over if everything was not perfect etc.), I think that we may not have these lapses, collapses and extended periods without scoring etc. But, all that BS said, I'm just a highly frustrated armchair QB.

 

[NoSwampDonkeys]

I believe most of them WERE head coaches before. I know that Sperew was.....

I think that may be part of the issue. We have a ton of experience on the bench, but not necessarily any influx of new ideas or methods. Good for stability, but are things in a "rut" as a team? That is the main question for me.

 

[NoSwampDonkeys]

well when the great shooters are on we win- when a quick pg shuts down JBo and either CJ or weizzy are having a bad game—- we lose

This is a sign that adjustments are not being made. Whether in the plays called offensively, or in substitution patterns to get people in who find different ways to create points on offense without relying solely on Luka and one other person to be "hot" from the outside.

We seem to have two options on offense. Get the ball to the wing and in to Garza, or take a 3, either on Garza kicking out, or pick and pop. That's IT. When is the last time we opened up a whole side of the floor and just cleared out for Weezy to take someone 1-1? Or for Keegan, or JoeT, Perkins or any number of guys that have that potential ability, given the night/matchup.

Hell last year, they parked Connor at the high post and he was hitting a decent number of those shots. That has disappeared, because apparently he is the only one capable of making a decent entry pass to Garza.

 

[Rudolph]

I would equate what you are saying is "boring" in basketball as being simplified and somewhat basic. But just like the Iowa football offense, if the execution is drilled in to the point that it is muscle memory and you don't have to think about it, boring doesn't matter.

Flawless execution makes up for the other team knowing what is coming. Then it becomes a matter of stopping it. I think that might be part of the issue with Fran. He maybe has TOO MANY things installed that they have to think about. Nothing is really natural.

I tend to subscribe to the KISS method in life. Keep It Simple Stupid. Don't over complicate things for the sake of variety, but keep things straight forward and to the point. If the O and D were drilled down further and everything was about execution (As was said of Lute, starting drills over if everything was not perfect etc.), I think that we may not have these lapses, collapses and extended periods without scoring etc. But, all that BS said, I'm just a highly frustrated armchair QB.

I never called anything boring. I'm never bored watching sports of any kind. I was contextualizing for another poster.

 

[NoSwampDonkeys]

I never called anything boring. I'm never bored watching sports of any kind. I was contextualizing for another poster.

As was I.

 

[DodgerHawki]

Actually on the radio pre game, Fran addressed his practice philosophy: he said this time of year he wants to keep his guys fresh so they primarily watch film and do walk through occasionally will do a full speed run through. Says 2.5 hour practices can drag on a player physically and mentally or something like that.

That's not a bad philosophy and likely most teams are run like this. The issue is what happens in the off-season and in the weeks leading up to when games start, and with longer breaks in the season. A team's identity and culture of how it will play and it's defensive and offensive philosophies is all established pre-season. It is nigh on impossible to "fix" Iowa's defensive issues mid-season, as putting the team through 2-3 hour practices at this point in the season wouldn't do much.

During the season, you can change up things like specifics on how you deal with ball screens, how you will double the post against a specific opponent, etc. But if a team has not instilled a culture of toughness and making defending a priority in the off-season, it's not getting done in the midst of the season. At least not consistently. We will see a game here and there where Iowa defends with good effort and attention. But they don't keep it up. Why? Because it's not been drilled into who they are as a team. Teams always revert to what they are. Iowa is a team that is very skilled and plays very motivated and unselfishly on offense. They do almost zero of that consistently on defense. How do players know that defense, hustle and toughness matters? When the coach spends time on it in practice, and when playing time is given out or taken away when a player doesn't do those things.

I will not ever stop cheering for the Hawks and wishing for them the best. But their ceiling has been limited from the start, some of us have said, because they just don't make 1 end of the floor a priority at all. I do hope they find something here down the stretch. I wouldn't count it out from happening. They are good enough offensively they could make a Sweet 16 if they get hot and a good matchup. But they could more likely get bounced in the first round due to just not being able to stop anyone.

 

[kceasthawk]

That's not a bad philosophy and likely most teams are run like this. The issue is what happens in the off-season and in the weeks leading up to when games start, and with longer breaks in the season. A team's identity and culture of how it will play and it's defensive and offensive philosophies is all established pre-season. It is nigh on impossible to "fix" Iowa's defensive issues mid-season, as putting the team through 2-3 hour practices at this point in the season wouldn't do much.

During the season, you can change up things like specifics on how you deal with ball screens, how you will double the post against a specific opponent, etc. But if a team has not instilled a culture of toughness and making defending a priority in the off-season, it's not getting done in the midst of the season. At least not consistently. We will see a game here and there where Iowa defends with good effort and attention. But they don't keep it up. Why? Because it's not been drilled into who they are as a team. Teams always revert to what they are. Iowa is a team that is very skilled and plays very motivated and unselfishly on offense. They do almost zero of that consistently on defense. How do players know that defense, hustle and toughness matters? When the coach spends time on it in practice, and when playing time is given out or taken away when a player doesn't do those things.

I will not ever stop cheering for the Hawks and wishing for them the best. But their ceiling has been limited from the start, some of us have said, because they just don't make 1 end of the floor a priority at all. I do hope they find something here down the stretch. I wouldn't count it out from happening. They are good enough offensively they could make a Sweet 16 if they get hot and a good matchup. But they could more likely get bounced in the first round due to just not being able to stop anyone.

Very good post Dodger. Obviously like many of us your still now ,and will always be a fan, and a realist. We all want big things for OUR boys, but we know its an uphill battle none the less......

 

[Alex Thompson]

Would love to get Dean Oliver back in Iowa City to help coach up our guards and shore up the defense with his experience in Madison.

 

[HawkRugged17]

 

[BlackNGoldBleeder]

Speculation about what Fran and company work on in practice is silly. Iowa is limited athletically. Most of the loose balls and rebounds Indiana got were due to being quicker and more athletic. Practice and coaching, albeit important, won't change that reality.

 

[innercircle287]

Fran’s staff is garbage. A bunch of yes men. 10+ years and has no one on his staff who preaches defense. Spreraw brings nothing a washed up ex HC. Dillard a “recruiting” coach who brings in little who does nothing. Fran is a piss poor in game coach a recipe for crap.

Fran is Kirk Ferentz. The only difference is Ferentz has been carried by Norm and Phil. Credit to Kirk for hiring and keeping them. Otherwise they are 2 average, extremely stubborn coaches. They are also both terrible game day coaches but run good clean programs and know a lot about their respective sports.

 

[2432Hawk]

I can't believe this thread got to page 2 before AI was invoked....

I've lost faith in my Hawkeye Basketball brethren

 

[BlackNGoldBleeder]

Fran is Kirk Ferentz. The only difference is Ferentz has been carried by Norm and Phil. Credit to Kirk for hiring and keeping them. Otherwise they are 2 average, extremely stubborn coaches. They are also both terrible game day coaches but run good clean programs and know a lot about their respective sports.

JFC

 

[Ihawkhoops]

Look at Iowa football. Vaunted running game but it's amazing how much difference guys like Wadley and Goodson make. They have an extra burst of quickness and ability to hit a hole other guys can't. It would be nice for the O-line to blow giant holes but that doesn't always happen, especially when teams load up on the run.

Same applies in hoops. It would be great if Iowa's offense clicked as Fran draws it up on the board, but that doesn't always happen. You need a couple guys who can make plays with their athleticism. Fran just can't figure that out apparently.

 

[NoSwampDonkeys]

Speculation about what Fran and company work on in practice is silly. Iowa is limited athletically. Most of the loose balls and rebounds Indiana got were due to being quicker and more athletic. Practice and coaching, albeit important, won't change that reality.

There are many things that can be done to counteract poor athleticism. Knowing your assignments and clear communication on help needed or being given so others can adjust etc. Also properly boxing out negates a better jumper. It doesn't matter how high they can jump, if you have a space cleared out that they can't get to and your teammates are doing the same thing. Details, discipline, communication and execution matter. A team that doesn't focus on those things, will not be successful. At least a couple of those things have been missing in key stretches over the last few games, which cost us the wins.

 

[Ronman]

Aren't these the same players and coaches that guided the season to a 12-2 record? Only a few "perfectionists" were bitching then. Yes, we've hit a rough stretch, but it's not like we're getting blown out by inferior teams. Hopefully, CJ returns tonight and we get it turned around.

 

[NoSwampDonkeys]

Aren't these the same players and coaches that guided the season to a 12-2 record? Only a few "perfectionists" were bitching then. Yes, we've hit a rough stretch, but it's not like we're getting blown out by inferior teams. Hopefully, CJ returns tonight and we get it turned around.

It is the same players. But if we are relying solely on a 3/4th offensive option as the savior and as our only defensive guru that says more about coaching style than the players. As the year progresses, the coaches have more and more tape of Iowa to watch. They notice the fundamental breakdowns and exploit them. Focusing on fundamentals brings things back to where they should be.