Honest expectations

[Inthecircle]

This is what is doubly frustrating right now. Not only is Cael landing more top recruits than us, he is developing his top recruits FSR more effectively.

Having Spencer in more of a coaching role after Nationals is going to help development. I expect to see DeSanto rise internationally in the 61kg. field.
We don’t have the horses NLWC has, however, HWC is getting incrementally better at the lower weights. This is why I believe we have to focus on dominating the lower weights.
Carl was very smart for focusing on 74 kg. and up as that encompasses 4 of the 6 Olympic weights.
From a World Championships perspective we can focus on 57, 61, 65 and 70.
Retherford hasn’t had what I’d call spectacular international success.
To make this work, Spencer has to jump Gilman and put a fork in him.

 

[MSU158]

If Cunningham ever leaves, you're going to be really disappointed when Cael keeps succeeding. Pretending he can't actually coach and he's just gotten lucky all these years is one of the most pathetic behaviors I see on this board.

Of course PSU will still do well. I don't think a poster on here truly thinks otherwise. But, you are not bright if you don't think losing someone like Cunningham would really hurt. He is probably the best mat coach at the DI level. Which immediately negates any false narrative that PSU doesn't develop their wrestlers.

Hell, I don't think anyone on here believes they don't develop. They just simply think PSU starts with more polished talent to begin with. Both CAN be true and in this case, I am pretty sure they are.

Remind me, what team are you truly a fan of? Multiple? If so, what team would you put at the top?

 

[MSU158]

PSU’s abundance of top 10 P4P recruits gives them better odds of some developing into D1 studs. How many top 10 P4P guys go to PSU and don’t develop into D1 studs?

Depends on what you define as a stud.... Still, Kemerer, A. Alton, Manville and Berge did not. D. Alton and Gulibon managed to squeeze one AA out each. Oh, and it looks like #10 recruit Seth Nevills may also not AA, but I won't hold that against him since it isn't his fault he was recruited over to get Kerkvliet.

 

[js8793]

Of course PSU will still do well. I don't think a poster on here truly thinks otherwise. But, you are not bright if you don't think losing someone like Cunningham would really hurt. He is probably the best mat coach at the DI level. Which immediately negates any false narrative that PSU doesn't develop their wrestlers.

Hell, I don't think anyone on here believes they don't develop. They just simply think PSU starts with more polished talent to begin with. Both CAN be true and in this case, I am pretty sure they are.

Remind me, what team are you truly a fan of? Multiple? If so, what team would you put at the top?

I am a diehard Iowa fan. I hate this narrative that showing any critical eye towards your team means you're not a true fan. I want Iowa to win every year. The two year run they had was wonderful, but I want more as a fan. I am jealous of PSU fans. I'm not going to pretend they haven't been dominating the sport for the last 10+ years.

Losing Cunningham would hurt, but not to the extent that guy thinks. As long as Cael is running the show and recruiting at this level, they're going to win more years than not until somebody else raises their level to match him.

 

[js8793]

Depends on what you define as a stud.... Still, Kemerer, A. Alton, Manville and Berge did not. D. Alton and Gulibon managed to squeeze one AA out each. Oh, and it looks like #10 recruit Seth Nevills may also not AA, but I won't hold that against him since it isn't his fault he was recruited over to get Kerkvliet.

Kemerer sure. He transferred out pretty quickly. Was he even a Cael recruit? Or was he inherited? I honestly can't remember. The Altons and Berge were derailed by injuries. Both wrestled at a high level at various times in their careers. Gulibon was at the wrong weight for the team his final two years. Was excellent as a sophomore. Manville focused on greco and Nevills joined the football team after Kerk showed up.

 

[MSU158]

I am a diehard Iowa fan. I hate this narrative that showing any critical eye towards your team means you're not a true fan. I want Iowa to win every year. The two year run they had was wonderful, but I want more as a fan. I am jealous of PSU fans. I'm not going to pretend they haven't been dominating the sport for the last 10+ years.

Losing Cunningham would hurt, but not to the extent that guy thinks. As long as Cael is running the show and recruiting at this level, they're going to win more years than not until somebody else raises their level to match him.

Ok, criticial eye is absolutely fine. Many of my posts are critical. It's just you often come off salivating over PSU and post about them alot. You come off as more a PSU fan than a critiquing Iowa fan.

As far as Cunningham goes, I don't think you realize how influential he is. Much like football a ton of the head coach's success comes from his coordinators. Make no mistake, a ton of the gameplanning and mat wrestling positions come from Casey. You don't lose someone that special and not have it hurt.

Now, PSU is so far ahead of the game now that it would take some time for the full loss of Casey to be felt, but they would quickly need to land a major impact hire to replace him and hope he has the right mentality to mesh with the guys both on the mat and off. Trust me, Casey is THAT good...

 

[wrestlecrazy]

$$$$$ is the difference between Iowa/HWC and PSU/NLWC.

 

[PAHURDLER]

$$$$$ is the difference between Iowa/HWC and PSU/NLWC.

This level of thinking will allow PSU to continue to widen the gap.

 

[PAHURDLER]

PSU’s abundance of top 10 P4P recruits gives them better odds of some developing into D1 studs. How many top 10 P4P guys go to PSU and don’t develop into D1 studs?

Someone already ran the numbers (I thought it was here but maybe it was on the PSU board) and as expected, PSU gets more top recruits but also churns out a higher percentage of national champions from that pool than all other schools.

 

[bourbon n blues]

Someone already ran the numbers (I thought it was here but maybe it was on the PSU board) and as expected, PSU gets more top recruits but also churns out a higher percentage of national champions from that pool than all other schools.

Cael has them winning at app 70% in the finals since starting at PSU and like 90% the last 6 years.

 

[IRONBIRD]

If Cunningham ever leaves, you're going to be really disappointed when Cael keeps succeeding. Pretending he can't actually coach and he's just gotten lucky all these years is one of the most pathetic behaviors I see on this board.

Come on, REALLY!?!?!? I could get a trained monkey to coach that team with the talent they bought in!!!

I would say Cael has shown himself to be equal to Gable, so there is more than one. Maybe Spencer Lee will be another…

REALLY!??!!? Gable got many great recruits, but no where like the advantage that Karl has. Also much greater competition do to the amount of teams, and D2, D3 etc... being able to win D1. NOT the same!!!!

This is what is doubly frustrating right now. Not only is Cael landing more top recruits than us, he is developing his top recruits FSR more effectively.

NOT!!! Just look at the numbers. As many failures as successful wrestlers. Just a numbers game.

Simple answer is money. I work with a former Nebraska AA who also was an assistant coach in the Big 10 for awhile. He told me elite guys like Taylor, Dake, Snyder, etc…will most likely never go into coaching because the money they make from their wrestling club is substantially more than they can make coaching. Only a few head coaching jobs pay more than they currently make. Until the HWC can raise enough money to compete with the NLWC you will continue to see this happen. And this isn’t a knock against Penn St. They have the donors backing this up and the proof is in the pudding based on their success.

YEP!

I agree with this. Penn State wrestlers just always look much more "jacked/stronger" and faster than our guys do. Most of this is better recruiting and athletes but It seems like Iowa, more and more in recent years has had troubles with guys gassing out by the 3rd period. I don't know if it is nutrition deficiencies or cutting weight or what. It just seems like Iowa always has a loss or two by guys giving up late take downs in the 3rd period.. We used to be the guys getting those late takedowns..

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were our only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!

PSU’s abundance of top 10 P4P recruits gives them better odds of some developing into D1 studs. How many top 10 P4P guys go to PSU and don’t develop into D1 studs?

YES!!!!

$$$$$ is the difference between Iowa/HWC and PSU/NLWC.

YES!!!!

If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day.

STOP with the other nonsense for the love of GOD!!!!! "ewww crail is just soOOOO wonderful!!!" Just look at how he develops ALL these #1 ranked kids!!!!" WOW!!!!

Just at 125 alone, he has brought in I believe EIGHT TOP 10 kids in the last 7 years! JACK SH*T to show for it!!!!

WHAT happened!?!?!? Most have even left F*** land. One left and became a 2X national champion!

TWO top 10 guys at 197 and Heavy brought in. Go right ahead and show me just ONE team in history that EVER had this????? You can't, you know why??? Because it never happened, and you want to know why? $$$$$, two of the hardest weights to fill. Getting just 1 top guy is hard enough.

 

[PAHURDLER]

Come on, REALLY!?!?!? I could get a trained monkey to coach that team with the talent they bought in!!!

REALLY!??!!? Gable got many great recruits, but no where like the advantage that Karl has. Also much greater competition do to the amount of teams, and D2, D3 etc... being able to win D1. NOT the same!!!!

NOT!!! Just look at the numbers. As many failures as successful wrestlers. Just a numbers game.

YEP!

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were are only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!


YES!!!!

YES!!!!

If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day.

STOP with the other nonsense for the love of GOD!!!!! "ewww crail is just soOOOO wonderful!!!" Just look at how he develops ALL these #1 ranked kids!!!!" WOW!!!!

Just at 125 alone, he has brought in I believe EIGHT TOP 10 kids in the last 7 years! JACK SH*T to show for it!!!!

WHAT happened!?!?!? Most have even left F*** land. One left and became a 2X national champion!

TWO top 10 guys at 197 and Heavy brought in. Go right ahead and show me just ONE team in history that EVER had this????? You can't, you know why??? Because it never happened, and you want to know why? $$$$$, two of the hardest weights to fill. Getting just 1 top guy is hard enough.

Never change please.

“Always wrong, never in doubt”

 

[IRONBIRD]

Never change please.

“Always wrong, never in doubt”

OH, really!?!?! Lets see PA hurling in a garbage can behind a Taco bell!

Here ya go.

Top ten P4P recruits the great Krale has had?

#1 at weight recruits he has had?

Include all transfers. Such as Dean, KerKin, Long etc.....

Number of Champions he has develop outside of anyone who fits in the above list?

Number of those in the above list who did not become a champion?

Number in the above list who did not AA?

Number in the above list who Never started, left the team?

Once you, such a smart guy-er girl, have these numbers. Lets go over them. Lets see who is right?

I will bet you TWOOOO things right here, right now. 1) You will not produce these numbers and 2) if you do, you will look like a complete FOOL as will all the other bandwagon fans!!!

Let me add, I gave you the ammo if you wanna look bright. the great Krailure, found a way to create a field tilted in his favor. Well honestly he didn't, some fat rich slob did, BUT hey, he ran with it.

 

[bluroptimo]

…

Missed my point. How many of these p4p recruits going to PSU don’t materialize? And no I don’t want you to answer that I’ll do the leg work.

 

[IRONBIRD]

Here is yet another clear example of what I am talking about. In many years that the great Crailure at F*** st won. Just ONE single Hammer on the 2nd place team would have most likely made the difference. Think about that. Since 2008, IOWA has won 4(really 5) with about 1/10 the recruits!!!

Mean while, many races were close enough that a single added SL type wrestler. Would have change the outcome. Certainly having 2 more studs would have most likely changed all of them. Yet with an advantage over I am guessing the next 3 top teams combined, and he has not produced much!

IOWA has the #1 class coming in! Lets just keep the faith that the momentum keeps going and a few more pieces are added in this years class and moving forward. You will not see or hear from a bandwagon wanna be again!!!

YEAR	CHAMPION	COACH	POINTS	RUNNER-UP	POINTS	HOST OR SITE
2022	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	131.5	Michigan	95	Detroit
2021	Iowa	Tom Brands	129	Penn State	113.5	St. Louis
2020	Canceled due to Covid-19	--	--	--	--	--
2019	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	137.5	Ohio State	96.5	Pittsburgh
2018	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	141.5	Ohio State	133.5	Cleveland
2017	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	146.5	Ohio State	110	St. Louis
2016	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	123	Oklahoma St.	97.5	New York
2015	Ohio State	Tom Ryan	102	Iowa	84	St. Louis
2014	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	109.5	Minnesota	104	Oklahoma City
2013	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	123.5	Oklahoma St.	119.5	Des Moines, Iowa
2012	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	143.0	Minnesota	117.5	St. Louis
2011	Penn State	Cael Sanderson	103.5	Cornell	89.5	Philadelphia
2010	Iowa	Tom Brands	134.5	Cornell	90	Omaha, Neb.
2009	Iowa	Tom Brands	96.5	Ohio State	92	St. Louis
2008	Iowa	Tom Brands	117.5	Ohio State	79	St. Louis

 

[slushhead]

Come on, REALLY!?!?!? I could get a trained monkey to coach that team with the talent they bought in!!!

REALLY!??!!? Gable got many great recruits, but no where like the advantage that Karl has. Also much greater competition do to the amount of teams, and D2, D3 etc... being able to win D1. NOT the same!!!!

NOT!!! Just look at the numbers. As many failures as successful wrestlers. Just a numbers game.

YEP!

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were our only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!


YES!!!!

YES!!!!

If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day.

STOP with the other nonsense for the love of GOD!!!!! "ewww crail is just soOOOO wonderful!!!" Just look at how he develops ALL these #1 ranked kids!!!!" WOW!!!!

Just at 125 alone, he has brought in I believe EIGHT TOP 10 kids in the last 7 years! JACK SH*T to show for it!!!!

WHAT happened!?!?!? Most have even left F*** land. One left and became a 2X national champion!

TWO top 10 guys at 197 and Heavy brought in. Go right ahead and show me just ONE team in history that EVER had this????? You can't, you know why??? Because it never happened, and you want to know why? $$$$$, two of the hardest weights to fill. Getting just 1 top guy is hard enough.

OH, really!?!?! Lets see PA hurling in a garbage can behind a Taco bell!

Here ya go.

Top ten P4P recruits the great Krale has had?

#1 at weight recruits he has had?

Include all transfers. Such as Dean, KerKin, Long etc.....

Number of Champions he has develop outside of anyone who fits in the above list?

Number of those in the above list who did not become a champion?

Number in the above list who did not AA?

Number in the above list who Never started, left the team?

Once you, such a smart guy-er girl, have these numbers. Lets go over them. Lets see who is right?

I will bet you TWOOOO things right here, right now. 1) You will not produce these numbers and 2) if you do, you will look like a complete FOOL as will all the other bandwagon fans!!!

Let me add, I gave you the ammo if you wanna look bright. the great Krailure, found a way to create a field tilted in his favor. Well honestly he didn't, some fat rich slob did, BUT hey, he ran with it.

Don’t forget — you’re supposed to drink the caffeine and snort the coke, not vice versa.

And have a heart, lay off the raccoons.
🦝🦝🦝

 

[Lambertt]

Come on, REALLY!?!?!? I could get a trained monkey to coach that team with the talent they bought in!!!

REALLY!??!!? Gable got many great recruits, but no where like the advantage that Karl has. Also much greater competition do to the amount of teams, and D2, D3 etc... being able to win D1. NOT the same!!!!

NOT!!! Just look at the numbers. As many failures as successful wrestlers. Just a numbers game.

YEP!

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were our only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!


YES!!!!

YES!!!!

If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day.

STOP with the other nonsense for the love of GOD!!!!! "ewww crail is just soOOOO wonderful!!!" Just look at how he develops ALL these #1 ranked kids!!!!" WOW!!!!

Just at 125 alone, he has brought in I believe EIGHT TOP 10 kids in the last 7 years! JACK SH*T to show for it!!!!

WHAT happened!?!?!? Most have even left F*** land. One left and became a 2X national champion!

TWO top 10 guys at 197 and Heavy brought in. Go right ahead and show me just ONE team in history that EVER had this????? You can't, you know why??? Because it never happened, and you want to know why? $$$$$, two of the hardest weights to fill. Getting just 1 top guy is hard enough.

Trained monkey? I’d pay to see that.

 

[BIG10MANIAC]

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were our only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!

I do not disagree with you, but how often do we "beat them" with 1/10 of the firepower? We have 1 Natty in the past 13 years right? Kem was a #1 recruit in his weight class coming out of High School. So was Marinelli and so was Lee so for the 2021 season we had a lineup with credentials damn close to that of Penn State.. To compete regularly year in and year out that needs to occur more than once every 13 years.... To compete we need to recruit and/or develop better than we have. The class coming in is ranked #1 so we are on a good roll, just gotta keep it going now...

 

[GlenHawk]

This level of thinking will allow PSU to continue to widen the gap.

LOL continue to widen the gap, huh? You do remember that Iowa was the best team for 2020 and 2021, right?

Also, why do you hang out here so much? And how have you had this account since 2001 but your first message on this board was just a couple of years ago? Weren't in to the sport until recently?

 

[MSU158]

I do not disagree with you, but how often do we "beat them" with 1/10 of the firepower? We have 1 Natty in the past 13 years right? Kem was a #1 recruit in his weight class coming out of High School. So was Marinelli and so was Lee so for the 2021 season we had a lineup with credentials damn close to that of Penn State.. To compete regularly year in and year out that needs to occur more than once every 13 years.... To compete we need to recruit and/or develop better than we have. The class coming in is ranked #1 so we are on a good roll, just gotta keep it going now...

I hate this cherry picked time frame. It specifically starts immediately after the won 3 in a row and makes sure to ignore they were the clear #1 team in the country the year Covid hit 1 week too soon.

Simply put, Iowa has absolutely been the best team 2 of the last 3 seasons. Cherry picking 13 years to make an argument like the sky has fallen, falls on its face when the very recent success shouldn’t be ignored.

Yes, they still have a ton to do to even begin to keep up with PSU on a regular basis. But, again, only 3 teams have won the last 14 contested NCAA’s. PSU has 9, Iowa 4 and tOSU 1. Add in 2020 and that is 5 for Iowa….

 

[IRONBIRD]

I do not disagree with you, but how often do we "beat them" with 1/10 of the firepower? We have 1 Natty in the past 13 years right? Kem was a #1 recruit in his weight class coming out of High School. So was Marinelli and so was Lee so for the 2021 season we had a lineup with credentials damn close to that of Penn State.. To compete regularly year in and year out that needs to occur more than once every 13 years.... To compete we need to recruit and/or develop better than we have. The class coming in is ranked #1 so we are on a good roll, just gotta keep it going now...

Yes, With those three guys, IOWA was the best team for 2 years. They may have been for three without all the injuries. Now just times that 3 by 6!!!! The HAWKS would be unbeatable. So exactly what you said. We have to keep the recruits rolling in; anyway we can to keep pace.

A top class like we just brought in, every few years, and 1 or 2 studs filling in every year. Pretty simple to say, much harder to produce without having the ability to match F*** st $$$$.

 

[Kale_yeah]

I don't consider him equal, but close. Cael will never achieve the number of nattys in the same amount of years Gable did. That ship has sailed. And it remains to be seen whether he will achieve as many. And he certainly won't win 21 Big Ten's in 21 years, not even close. What his regime is even more amazing at than Gable is preparing his wrestlers for the finals on Saturday night.

Semi finals are where the points are earned, the finals is just for the recruiting video.

 

[slushhead]

. . . Simply put, Iowa has absolutely been the best team 2 of the last 3 seasons. Cherry picking 13 years to make an argument like the sky has fallen, falls on its face when the very recent success shouldn’t be ignored . . .

But this is wrestling. For most high-end recruits, potential for individual accomplishment is going to trump potential for team accomplishment. This is even more true for recruits with post-collegiate aspirations.

So citing “best team” stats is not that pertinent in a discussion about how to improve recruiting (or how to blame shortcomings in it). Individual NCAA champs and RTC representation on the world stage are more relevant variables. Iowa may have had the best team 2 of the past 3 years, but PSU had 9 individual champs to Iowa’s 1. And we all know NLWC had far more representation on the world stage than the HWC the past several years. Iowa needs to start producing more individual champs and attracting more olympic-caliber wrestlers to HWC if the tide in recruiting for the college team is to change in a sustained way.

 

[Kale_yeah]

Come on, REALLY!?!?!? I could get a trained monkey to coach that team with the talent they bought in!!!

REALLY!??!!? Gable got many great recruits, but no where like the advantage that Karl has. Also much greater competition do to the amount of teams, and D2, D3 etc... being able to win D1. NOT the same!!!!

NOT!!! Just look at the numbers. As many failures as successful wrestlers. Just a numbers game.

YEP!

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were our only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!


YES!!!!

YES!!!!

If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day.

STOP with the other nonsense for the love of GOD!!!!! "ewww crail is just soOOOO wonderful!!!" Just look at how he develops ALL these #1 ranked kids!!!!" WOW!!!!

Just at 125 alone, he has brought in I believe EIGHT TOP 10 kids in the last 7 years! JACK SH*T to show for it!!!!

WHAT happened!?!?!? Most have even left F*** land. One left and became a 2X national champion!

TWO top 10 guys at 197 and Heavy brought in. Go right ahead and show me just ONE team in history that EVER had this????? You can't, you know why??? Because it never happened, and you want to know why? $$$$$, two of the hardest weights to fill. Getting just 1 top guy is hard enough.

105-2 in last 107 duals ouchie!!

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

you often come off salivating over PSU and post about them alot

@js8793, I fear you're about to be accused of being TBar.

@MSU158, more than 131.5 points for PSU is looking much better these days, even if WrestleStat projects them an impossible 131.7. How you feeling these days about the 131.5 O/U?

 

[MSU158]

@js8793, I fear you're about to be accused of being TBar.

@MSU158, more than 131.5 points for PSU is looking much better these days, even if WrestleStat projects them an impossible 131.7. How you feeling these days about the 131.5 O/U?

Every bit as confident as I was when I made that bet. I see PSU in the 120’s and have seen nothing to change that…

 

[nitlion6]

Come on, REALLY!?!?!? I could get a trained monkey to coach that team with the talent they bought in!!!

REALLY!??!!? Gable got many great recruits, but no where like the advantage that Karl has. Also much greater competition do to the amount of teams, and D2, D3 etc... being able to win D1. NOT the same!!!!

NOT!!! Just look at the numbers. As many failures as successful wrestlers. Just a numbers game.

YEP!

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were our only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!


YES!!!!

YES!!!!

If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day.

STOP with the other nonsense for the love of GOD!!!!! "ewww crail is just soOOOO wonderful!!!" Just look at how he develops ALL these #1 ranked kids!!!!" WOW!!!!

Just at 125 alone, he has brought in I believe EIGHT TOP 10 kids in the last 7 years! JACK SH*T to show for it!!!!

WHAT happened!?!?!? Most have even left F*** land. One left and became a 2X national champion!

TWO top 10 guys at 197 and Heavy brought in. Go right ahead and show me just ONE team in history that EVER had this????? You can't, you know why??? Because it never happened, and you want to know why? $$$$$, two of the hardest weights to fill. Getting just 1 top guy is hard enough.

First of all there dim dum, recruiting successfully is part of the job of the coaching staff. Yes, PSU recruits much better than Iowa or anybody else except for maybe OSU. So bytching about PSU's superior recruiting efforts is the equivalent to bytching because the PSU staff does their job better than your guys.

As far as developing guys, limiting the comparison to top10 p4p guys. The statement that is important is Cael develops more of those top recruit guys into national champs than the next 4 or 5 coaches combined.

It is quite apparent through your very own admissions that what bothers you about Cael Sanderson and his staff is they do their jobs better than any other wrestling staff in the country, far superior to the twins.

Plus good Lord, you are a very bitter little guy. This part of your post simply reeks of bitter, bitter, bitter "If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day."

Come on dude, little, bitter and dumb is no way to go through life. Strive to be better!

 

[js8793]

I hate this cherry picked time frame. It specifically starts immediately after the won 3 in a row and makes sure to ignore they were the clear #1 team in the country the year Covid hit 1 week too soon.

Simply put, Iowa has absolutely been the best team 2 of the last 3 seasons. Cherry picking 13 years to make an argument like the sky has fallen, falls on its face when the very recent success shouldn’t be ignored.

Yes, they still have a ton to do to even begin to keep up with PSU on a regular basis. But, again, only 3 teams have won the last 14 contested NCAA’s. PSU has 9, Iowa 4 and tOSU 1. Add in 2020 and that is 5 for Iowa….

I feel like I’m going insane. YOU are the one cherry picking the brief 2 year period where Iowa had the better team. YOU are picking the random number 14 so you can include 3 iowa titles that happened over a decade ago when the landscape was completely different.

Since Cael arrived in happy valley, he’s dominated. Acting like the landscape didn’t change is ludicrous. The pre-2011 landscape is not comparable to now. You want to keep going and bring up the Gable years as reason why Iowa is still keeping pace?

This was reasonable in 2014. Many, including myself, thought he had a perfect storm. But then he repeated it with a second generation. And then a third. It will take a monumental shift to prevent him from a third 3-peat. It’s hard to project this far out, but based on recruiting and who he has now, he’s the favorite to have a 3rd 4-peat 3 years from now.

Waiting for PSU to come back to earth is delusional. This is one of college sports greatest dynasties of all time. 9 titles in 13 years is insane. You’re damn right I’m jealous. I want that. I’m not going to apologize for wanting my team to be the best. It’s Tom’s job to catch up. Nobody will be more fired up than me if he does it.

 

[LagunaBeachHawk]

I feel like I’m going insane. YOU are the one cherry picking the brief 2 year period where Iowa had the better team. YOU are picking the random number 14 so you can include 3 iowa titles that happened over a decade ago when the landscape was completely different.

Since Cael arrived in happy valley, he’s dominated. Acting like the landscape didn’t change is ludicrous. The pre-2011 landscape is not comparable to now. You want to keep going and bring up the Gable years as reason why Iowa is still keeping pace?

This was reasonable in 2014. Many, including myself, thought he had a perfect storm. But then he repeated it with a second generation. And then a third. It will take a monumental shift to prevent him from a third 3-peat. It’s hard to project this far out, but based on recruiting and who he has now, he’s the favorite to have a 3rd 4-peat 3 years from now.

Waiting for PSU to come back to earth is delusional. This is one of college sports greatest dynasties of all time. 9 titles in 13 years is insane. You’re damn right I’m jealous. I want that. I’m not going to apologize for wanting my team to be the best. It’s Tom’s job to catch up. Nobody will be more fired up than me if he does it.

It is basically a race for second every year.

Between Penn State winning every year based on recruiting and everyone ducking big matchups during the season, I am going to stop going to Nationals for the 1st time since my father took me as an 8 year old in 1979.

Wrestling is it’s own worst enemy.

 

[IRONBIRD]

First of all there dim dum, recruiting successfully is part of the job of the coaching staff. Yes, PSU recruits much better than Iowa or anybody else except for maybe OSU. So bytching about PSU's superior recruiting efforts is the equivalent to bytching because the PSU staff does their job better than your guys.

As far as developing guys, limiting the comparison to top10 p4p guys. The statement that is important is Cael develops more of those top recruit guys into national champs than the next 4 or 5 coaches combined.

It is quite apparent through your very own admissions that what bothers you about Cael Sanderson and his staff is they do their jobs better than any other wrestling staff in the country, far superior to the twins.

Plus good Lord, you are a very bitter little guy. This part of your post simply reeks of bitter, bitter, bitter "If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day."

Come on dude, little, bitter and dumb is no way to go through life. Strive to be better!

Is your whole state filled with clowns, or is it just you wanna be pussy cat bandwagon jerks?

Did you ever see the movie MONEY BALL? It is about how this man developed a system if you will of evaluating talent. He made a program on how you win baseball games. It was/is revolutionary. By doing this, The A's Baseball team with a small % of say the Yankees payroll, could compete!!!

Your great Crailure did NOTHING like this. What they did was exactly what I said they did. He was brought in by some wealthy smuck in my opinion. Landing in a place where they knew they would look the other way. It worked you numb nuts!!!

"they do their job better" Do not be such a horse ass all your life!!! It is very well known that it was the money and is the money! Then to make yourself look even dumber, you bring up the club!?!?!? REALLY??? I mean how do you think they brought in Dake, Snyder, Gilman!?!?!?

YEA it was $$$$$$ TOO! Funny though how they have to bring in all these guys when the great PHRAILURE is "developing all this talent"

Just go back to what I had wrote, READ it, and if you want to take over for the other dork? Go right ahead and answer my questions. Then get back to me once we have all those numbers. Once again, lets see who is right by using MATH and FACTS!!!!

 

[nitlion6]

LOL continue to widen the gap, huh? You do remember that Iowa was the best team for 2020 and 2021, right?

Also, why do you hang out here so much? And how have you had this account since 2001 but your first message on this board was just a couple of years ago? Weren't in to the sport until recently?

Gee Hurdler. He really zinged you there. Wow!

9 championships since Cael started claiming them to Iowa's one. After this year it will 10 to 1, yep that is growing gap. Difficult concept?

 

[nitlion6]

I hate this cherry picked time frame. It specifically starts immediately after the won 3 in a row and makes sure to ignore they were the clear #1 team in the country the year Covid hit 1 week too soon.

Simply put, Iowa has absolutely been the best team 2 of the last 3 seasons. Cherry picking 13 years to make an argument like the sky has fallen, falls on its face when the very recent success shouldn’t be ignored.

Yes, they still have a ton to do to even begin to keep up with PSU on a regular basis. But, again, only 3 teams have won the last 14 contested NCAA’s. PSU has 9, Iowa 4 and tOSU 1. Add in 2020 and that is 5 for Iowa….

Can't add in 2020, it did not happen.
Take your clock back 20 years, PSU has 9, Iowa 4. Hell, going back to include Iowa's 3 prior their single in 2021 and if you look at it as most top 2 finishes Penn State has 9, Ohio State 6 and Iowa 5.
Iowa is lagging so far behind PSU in championships it is a struggle to quantify Iowa as the clear number 2.

 

[slushhead]

It is basically a race for second every year.

Between Penn State winning every year based on recruiting and everyone ducking big matchups during the season, I am going to stop going to Nationals for the 1st time since my father took me as an 8 year old in 1979.

Wrestling is it’s own worst enemy.

I don’t get this. No one is going to duck at at Nationals, so why stop going to that event? If ducking is affecting your enjoyment of the sport, then stop going to the events (duals and holiday tourneys) where ducking might actually be in play.

And PSU winning every year “based on recruiting” plays a part in your decision, too? Would it matter if they won every year based on something else? Seems like an odd qualifier.

 

[nitlion6]

Is your whole state filled with clowns, or is it just you wanna be pussy cat bandwagon jerks?

Did you ever see the movie MONEY BALL? It is about how this man developed a system if you will of evaluating talent. He made a program on how you win baseball games. It was/is revolutionary. By doing this, The A's Baseball team with a small % of say the Yankees payroll, could compete!!!

Your great Crailure did NOTHING like this. What they did was exactly what I said they did. He was brought in by some wealthy smuck in my opinion. Landing in a place where they knew they would look the other way. It worked you numb nuts!!!

"they do their job better" Do not be such a horse ass all your life!!! It is very well known that it was the money and is the money! Then to make yourself look even dumber, you bring up the club!?!?!? REALLY??? I mean how do you think they brought in Dake, Snyder, Gilman!?!?!?

YEA it was $$$$$$ TOO! Funny though how they have to bring in all these guys when the great PHRAILURE is "developing all this talent"

Just go back to what I had wrote, READ it, and if you want to take over for the other dork? Go right ahead and answer my questions. Then get back to me once we have all those numbers. Once again, lets see who is right by using MATH and FACTS!!!!

Still stuck on dim dum, bitter and a little guy. Pissed because in your own rants an acknowledgement that PSU's coaching staff is simply, yet vastly superior to yours.

 

[pish69]

I feel like I’m going insane. YOU are the one cherry picking the brief 2 year period where Iowa had the better team. YOU are picking the random number 14 so you can include 3 iowa titles that happened over a decade ago when the landscape was completely different.

Since Cael arrived in happy valley, he’s dominated. Acting like the landscape didn’t change is ludicrous. The pre-2011 landscape is not comparable to now. You want to keep going and bring up the Gable years as reason why Iowa is still keeping pace?

This was reasonable in 2014. Many, including myself, thought he had a perfect storm. But then he repeated it with a second generation. And then a third. It will take a monumental shift to prevent him from a third 3-peat. It’s hard to project this far out, but based on recruiting and who he has now, he’s the favorite to have a 3rd 4-peat 3 years from now.

Waiting for PSU to come back to earth is delusional. This is one of college sports greatest dynasties of all time. 9 titles in 13 years is insane. You’re damn right I’m jealous. I want that. I’m not going to apologize for wanting my team to be the best. It’s Tom’s job to catch up. Nobody will be more fired up than me if he does it.

Great post. MSU is THE biggest cherry picker and will talk in circles to create a narrative where he can claim to be right. He claims you’re not a real Iowa fan. Meanwhile he claims his team is MSU. I stopped with this clown yrs ago when he challenged me to a pickem contest on NCAA results and I buried him. His predictions are always wrong too. I remember him screaming from the rooftops that Marinelli would have a better career than Cenzo. LOL @MSU158

 

[IRONBIRD]

Still stuck on dim dum, bitter and a little guy. Pissed because in your own rants an acknowledgement that PSU's coaching staff is simply, yet vastly superior to yours.

You are really just a schmuck huh?

 

[nitlion6]

You are really just a schmuck huh?

Just having a 3 raccoon day, are you?
I had a busy, but great day. You on the other hand, i don't know. You cheer for a wrestling team that typically finishes 3rd just about every year and you are so petty and bitter about it that instead of enjoying the results the kids on that team put in to being an annual top 3 program, you bytch and whine about how superior Penn State's program is to Iowa's.
Amazingly sad.

 

[WrestlerHawk]

Come on, REALLY!?!?!? I could get a trained monkey to coach that team with the talent they bought in!!!

REALLY!??!!? Gable got many great recruits, but no where like the advantage that Karl has. Also much greater competition do to the amount of teams, and D2, D3 etc... being able to win D1. NOT the same!!!!

NOT!!! Just look at the numbers. As many failures as successful wrestlers. Just a numbers game.

YEP!

We beat them with less then 1/10 the fire power in recruiting #s!!! KemDawg, and LEE I believe were our only 2 top 10. They had 17!!!! Why do people not understand this!?!?!?

WHAT is so hard. IF we had SEVENTEEN Kems& Lee's We would be not only beating them like a red headed step child, but it would never even be close!!!


YES!!!!

YES!!!!

If you want to give the great kale credit for something? I will gladly say he managed to skate the rules, play in the gray area, buy who he needed, laugh at 9.9 etc..... He did all this. He made an un-level playing field that continues to this day.

STOP with the other nonsense for the love of GOD!!!!! "ewww crail is just soOOOO wonderful!!!" Just look at how he develops ALL these #1 ranked kids!!!!" WOW!!!!

Just at 125 alone, he has brought in I believe EIGHT TOP 10 kids in the last 7 years! JACK SH*T to show for it!!!!

WHAT happened!?!?!? Most have even left F*** land. One left and became a 2X national champion!

TWO top 10 guys at 197 and Heavy brought in. Go right ahead and show me just ONE team in history that EVER had this????? You can't, you know why??? Because it never happened, and you want to know why? $$$$$, two of the hardest weights to fill. Getting just 1 top guy is hard enough.

You're a parody account at this point.

 

[mcpat]

PSU’s abundance of top 10 P4P recruits gives them better odds of some developing into D1 studs. How many top 10 P4P guys go to PSU and don’t develop into D1 studs?

Quite a few if PSU had 17 of them on the 2021 squad alone, as alleged by Ironbird.

 

[Random4598375]

Is your whole state filled with clowns, or is it just you wanna be pussy cat bandwagon jerks?

Did you ever see the movie MONEY BALL? It is about how this man developed a system if you will of evaluating talent. He made a program on how you win baseball games. It was/is revolutionary. By doing this, The A's Baseball team with a small % of say the Yankees payroll, could compete!!!

Your great Crailure did NOTHING like this. What they did was exactly what I said they did. He was brought in by some wealthy smuck in my opinion. Landing in a place where they knew they would look the other way. It worked you numb nuts!!!

"they do their job better" Do not be such a horse ass all your life!!! It is very well known that it was the money and is the money! Then to make yourself look even dumber, you bring up the club!?!?!? REALLY??? I mean how do you think they brought in Dake, Snyder, Gilman!?!?!?

YEA it was $$$$$$ TOO! Funny though how they have to bring in all these guys when the great PHRAILURE is "developing all this talent"

Just go back to what I had wrote, READ it, and if you want to take over for the other dork? Go right ahead and answer my questions. Then get back to me once we have all those numbers. Once again, lets see who is right by using MATH and FACTS!!!!

I see neither math nor facts in that entire post. LOL.