What Fry did was amazing, no argument.
Fry's last team went 3-8 and the talent level was pretty low. KF had a rebuild on his hands, no where near what Fry had to deal with, but to pretend that KF was handed a winning hand is disingenuous.
Hopefully this is Kirks last year
- Thread starter Roncuba55
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Fry's last team went 3-8 and the talent level was pretty low. KF had a rebuild on his hands, no where near what Fry had to deal with, but to pretend that KF was handed a winning hand is disingenuous.
Why won't a coach with decades of experience recruit excellent offensive players?
What logic can you apply?
Anyone who thinks winning is easy, period, has no credibility. Every schedule is hard
Disagree. KF's "rebuild" after a few down seasons was nothing compared to HF changing a culture after 17 straight losing seasons.
Nonsense. Fry gave Iowa notoriety and exposure. His Image and personality were associated with Iowa put the program on the map.
Fry's dynamic flair and personality was reflected in his recruiting and coaching, the opposite of Ferentz's lethargic, boring old maid style.
I think both can be true. Hayden had done a magnificent job of keeping the engine running for nearly two decades, but he certainly had lost a bit of "oomph" on his fastball by the time he called it a career. I'm not sure how long he knew before his diagnosis was made public, but cancer had certainly sapped him of a fair bit of his energy.
KF likely won't be on the sidelines for very much longer, but assuming it's Beth that names his successor, she'd be wise to pick someone outside his coaching "tree".
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No disrespect to our HOF coach Hayden Fry but fans sure do forget some of his bad years and poor offenses. Let's take the years 1992, 1993 and 1994 when in the middle of his coaching career at Iowa we had 3 non-winning seasons in a row and we were 16-18-1 over that period. In 1993 we were 6-6 and had no wins against a team with a winning record. We beat a 4-6-1 Tulsa by 1 point, and a 3-8 ISU by 3 points and a 2-9 Northwestern by 4 points.
The 1993 offense seemed good against poor teams but when we played a decent team the offense could not do anything. In our 6 losses that year we never scored more than 10 points in any one of those games and scored a total of 33 points or 5.5 points per game in our six losses. Three times we scored 3 points or less. Great offense by Hayden.
Maybe Hayden should have had a decent defense in 1994 when he was 5-5-1 and in the 5 losses the other team averaged 40.8 points per game. We did score 37 points on a 0-10-1 ISU, and 49 on a 3-7-1 Northwestern and 49 on a 3-8 Minnesota. Every loss was by 14+ points except 6-5 Indiana who we lost by 7 at home.
Let's also review 1989 when we were 5-6. Here are the points we scored in our 6 losses. 6,14,12,7,0,7 so we averaged 7.7 points per game in our 6 losses.
Kirk has a 71% winning percentage in the last 5 years with 3 10 win seasons. Winning at Iowa is not easy as Hayden's record indicates and his offenses were fun to watch against poor teams but in both 1989 and 1993 he had 4 games each year where they did not score more than 7 points. That is 35% of our games in those two years we did not score more than 7 points.
The 1993 offense seemed good against poor teams but when we played a decent team the offense could not do anything. In our 6 losses that year we never scored more than 10 points in any one of those games and scored a total of 33 points or 5.5 points per game in our six losses. Three times we scored 3 points or less. Great offense by Hayden.
Maybe Hayden should have had a decent defense in 1994 when he was 5-5-1 and in the 5 losses the other team averaged 40.8 points per game. We did score 37 points on a 0-10-1 ISU, and 49 on a 3-7-1 Northwestern and 49 on a 3-8 Minnesota. Every loss was by 14+ points except 6-5 Indiana who we lost by 7 at home.
Let's also review 1989 when we were 5-6. Here are the points we scored in our 6 losses. 6,14,12,7,0,7 so we averaged 7.7 points per game in our 6 losses.
Kirk has a 71% winning percentage in the last 5 years with 3 10 win seasons. Winning at Iowa is not easy as Hayden's record indicates and his offenses were fun to watch against poor teams but in both 1989 and 1993 he had 4 games each year where they did not score more than 7 points. That is 35% of our games in those two years we did not score more than 7 points.
I'm tired of yearly excellent defense argument
Why won't he recruit high profile offense players?
Because he's lazy. It's intense and hotly contested.
There is no way around this. No way to argue against it. Concentrate on OL/OL, TEs and defense players.
Skilled QB, WR and RB require intensive recruiting resources. Years of dedicated resources to land the top flight althletes. Why do it when your tenured at sleepy Iowa City with a silver spoon until retirement.
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And that strong winning percentage isn't going to hold up much longer, now that the B1G has done away with divisions. Iowa got lucky as the only "elite" opponent they face is Ohio State, but 2025 will probably be a much tougher nut to crack as they're going to probably face two (if not three) of Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, USC, and Oregon. In other words... unless something changes (either KF's philosophy, or the coaching staff altogether), Iowa could be staring down a losing season next year.
Haden did not leave a borderline perennial top 25 team that is just BS. The facts are in his last 10 years he had 4 top 25 teams. He also had 2 losing seasons in 1989 and 1992 as well as two seasons where he had a 6-6 and 5-5-1. In 1997 he was 7-5 with the 61st most difficult schedule the, last time Kirk had a schedule this week was 2014, then Hayden was 3-8 in 1998 before he left.
College football is not about Xs and Os but Jimmys and Joes. All three Florida schools have won national championships since 2001. Florida and Georgia combine to have over 100 4 and 5 star recruits most years.
Dennis Erickson won NC at Miami and did little at OSU and ASU. Spurrier wins a NC at Florida and his record in the same SEC division at South Carolina is completely different.
If you actually read my post I had that covered. "no where near what Fry had to deal with"
I don't disagree with any of that.
Just stating KF had a rebuild on his hands. The talent level was pretty low Fry's last year due to a couple bad recruiting years. No where near what Fry had to do....
There is truth to that, but Michigan won a natty last year with recruiting classes that are certainly a notch below Ohio State and Alabama, both of whom they defeated en route to said title. They don't recruit poorly, but their classes are usually around 10-12, whereas nearly all of the other recent champions have had at multiple top five classes.
I believe last year's Michigan team set a record for most draft picks on a roster
I think he tries to recruit better offensive players but the actual games show Kirk won’t let them “do their thing”. Too conservative and a philosophy that says “get ahead by 6-8 points and let the defense win it”.
Other schools just show Iowa game tape and ask the player “do you think this style of play will get you to the nfl?” Or “is this the style you dream of playing?”
Recruiting QB WR against Iowa is easy, just show them game footage.
Nick Saban use to be a “let defense win it guy”. But he evolved and I think he is quoted as saying “sometimes you need to score 35 points no matter how good your defense is”.
Kirk is a dinosaur, he isn’t changing and he rarely if ever going to beat a truly good team going forward.
I would even perhaps be good with Conservative/Dinosaur Kirk, if he didn't consistently make basic clock management & end of game TO blunders. It's actually embarrassing for a guy that is as respected & renowned as Kirk is.
The TO he took at 1:25 in the 2nd quarter was an example (got away with it, due to missed FG). The decision to take a penalty at the end of our last possession, rather than using a TO, was borderline criminal. There's just been ample evidence over the years that he doesn't have a feel for clock management/end up game situations. Generally, I must admit, he's gotten away with it...but it's painful. It quite possibly cost us the game Saturday.
The TO he took at 1:25 in the 2nd quarter was an example (got away with it, due to missed FG). The decision to take a penalty at the end of our last possession, rather than using a TO, was borderline criminal. There's just been ample evidence over the years that he doesn't have a feel for clock management/end up game situations. Generally, I must admit, he's gotten away with it...but it's painful. It quite possibly cost us the game Saturday.
Like in November of 2022, night game, when Nebraska won 24-17???? Snake pit for whom that night?
Who had the best scoring defense in college football last year? Michigan how did the Alabama and Washington offenses that averaged 34+ points do against that defense. 20 and 13 points.
Iowa ain’t no Michigan and that defense was once a generation.
If that is the Iowa formula…ROFLMAO.
Iowa’s defense wasn’t close to that good with the added bonus of pairing it with an offense that scored zero points against ranked opponents.
See here's the thing..... Michigan also put points on the board while having a good defense.
You're probably correct. If think the next 2 seasons are going to be a really rude awakening for the fans when it will be a much rougher schedule and a lot of new faces on both sides of the ball.
The 5th most efficient offense in the country.
Where does the money come from for that massive buyout? They will need that money if the NCAA allows the universities to pay players a salary.
It was one down season. They were 9-3 and finished ranked 18th in 96. In 97 they were ranked almost all year including being #12 going into week 9 but finished 7-4 playing a tough schedule that included back to back road games at #7 Ohio State and at #5 Michigan (eventual national champion) and then lost the bowl game so 7-5. They were only really bad in '98
Totally agree it was nothing compared to what HF inherited
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Its the same Kirk Ferentz over rated team with a shitty offense. I will celebrate when he is gone. Hopefully he will follow his son Brian very soon.
This is so very true. Actually, Bob Commings left more talented young players for Hayden than Kirk found after Hayden retired. The 1981 team that went to the Rose Bowl was filled with prominent players Commings recruited.
Kirk was informed by Beth following the Minnesota game that Boy Wonder would not be retained. Regardless of the timing and the new face, we’re still seeing Kirk’s fingerprints around the neck of this offense - namely in the form of choosing to play a grossly incompetent QB.
I wanted him gone in 2009 when he played for OT in Columbus like a coward. That was the ultimate dagger for me. There's no coming back from that unless he miraculously wins a national title.
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Are you questioning when Kirk Ferentz knew he would need to hire a new OC? That date was 10/30/23:
Brian Ferentz will be out as Iowa's offensive coordinator at end of the season, interim AD says
Iowa interim athletic director Beth Goetz has announced Brian Ferentz will be out as Iowa’s offensive coordinator at the end of the season.
apnews.com
With respect to Cade being the starting QB, check the box scores for the first two games of the 2024 season.
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Thanks for posting. I've tried (unsuccessfully ) for years to get some perspective out there, but most here simply won't take the FACTS into play when they get all nostalgic about old Hayden. The fact is he beat up really bad teams, (and we played a bunch of them back then) and had a ton of trouble doing much offensively against really good teams. People talk about all the exotics and they rarely worked against solid teams, but they looked great against the piss poor ISU, NW, and Wisc teams we played in the 80's and early 90's. Of course thats kept the old memory bank all giddy about how we used to run it up on those crap teams.
I see a lot of people on here acting like they know how much direct influence Kirk exerts over the offense. The only thing I'm relatively sure is that he decides which QB plays. Beyond that I, and I have to assume everyone else, has no idea where the line is drawn between Kirk/Lester.
True. All was not roses with Hayden, but the element of excitement and possibility was always within reach.
Let's face it, you, the defense coordinators and the TV announcers know what play is coming on 3rd and 3. Aren't Iowa fans sick of the play clock running down to 1 second? How long has it been since Iowa has run a counter-play?
p.s. maybe they have. If so, chalk this up to facetiousness.
Conservative plays are nostalgic and nice when they work but this is 2024 and high-powered modern athletes want dynamic, wide open exciting down-field offenses. Otherwise, you get lower-tiered offensive recruits, which is reflected in Iowa's terrible offensive performance.
McNamara is a quality QB with a history of success. He has been incorporated into a program that has put no priority on recruiting equivalent talent WRs for decades. It is almost bizarre how a coach with Ferentz's experience can be so negligent and the Iowa program can be so complacent to not be demanding.
Coaching never substitutes for recruiting.
I wonder how the ISU game would have turned out if Kirk had a two-game suspension?
The problem Saturday was NOT our receivers. We had open receivers that were either poorly thrown to or not seen when open.
Cade was bad second half. Just bad. The coaching was bad. The conservative game mgmt bad. Clock mgmt bad. RBs and receivers were not part of why we lost.
The problem was having 1st and goal from the 1 in your home stadium and not pounding the ball straight ahead 3 times in a row.
END.
And yet he waited until February to hire Lester. More gross incompetence.
Three years of Petras, a year of Bacon and now this, wins or not, it has been grueling to watch week in and week out. Especially considering every other game I watch has a QB/offense that I would take in a heartbeat.
