How does ISU totally kill Iowa in recruiting

[Pepperman]

ISU gets criticized for this, but they don't focus on kids from the state of Iowa.

I think if anything, people understand that and support it?

Also not sure why Fran refuses to go hard after transfers. Weiler Babb, Shayok, Jacobson, Talley are all transfers. Have another one sitting out this year. You don’t need 13 guys playing. There is room on a roster for guys to transfer and sit out.

This is a huge point. Hell, the Hawkeye coach banked a scholarship (or did he give it to his son?) in a year where it was OBVIOUS we needed better guards.

They take a pass on 6'6 to 6'10 skinny white guys

Not only does Fran seem to love these guys - he urges them to play uptempo basketball!

 

[IamHawkeye]

The more you post the more it seems that Fran just can't coach. He clearly has plenty of talent amirite?

So what happened to Fran.? He clearly could coach and recruit when he was at other schools.(and beat OSU in the NCAAs) And don't say it's because they were mid-majors, There are myriad mid major coaches who continue success going to "higher up."

 

[Fsanford]

From 2016-2019 recruiting classes: Iowa has pulled in the #43, #64, #74, and #111 ranked recruits according to Rivals. ISU has pulled in #24, #33, #85, #116, #131 (Jakolby Long who's gone), and #143. Looking at this, I wouldn't say they are "killing" us in recruiting. The main difference between these two programs, is ISU "kills" it with transfers. Which I guess, you could say is recruiting, in a way. Without Talley, Babb, Jacobsen, and Shayok, ISU wouldn't be near where it is right now. Iowa needs to find a way to get some impact transfers. ISU had some things fall there way with these transfers, as Babb recruited his brother and Jacobsen wanted to come home, but Frans' inability to adapt to the college transfer game has really hurt him in his time here.

Valid, he has a very good guard that transferred from Colorado State, Wiggington will go pro this year, but he already has a guy who averaged 16 points a game at CSU waiting in the wings. As someone pointed out ealier, this is like bagging a 5 start recruit because of his experience. You remove the learning curve of college ball, and you get guys who are used to hostile environments.

Also I think college is about how many top 50 guys you get. I mean the 3 you talk about in the rankings above started from day 1, started and are extremely high end and productive. That is the difference

 

[billshawks]

ISU has an offer to an 8th grader in Ames.

He is in 9th now but point taken. Iowa offered one of their best guards ever in 8th grade. He was either from Fort dodge or Mason City. Can’t remeber

Horner from Mason City

 

[billshawks]

From 2016-2019 recruiting classes: Iowa has pulled in the #43, #64, #74, and #111 ranked recruits according to Rivals. ISU has pulled in #24, #33, #85, #116, #131 (Jakolby Long who's gone), and #143. Looking at this, I wouldn't say they are "killing" us in recruiting. The main difference between these two programs, is ISU "kills" it with transfers. Which I guess, you could say is recruiting, in a way. Without Talley, Babb, Jacobsen, and Shayok, ISU wouldn't be near where it is right now. Iowa needs to find a way to get some impact transfers. ISU had some things fall there way with these transfers, as Babb recruited his brother and Jacobsen wanted to come home, but Frans' inability to adapt to the college transfer game has really hurt him in his time here.

Valid, he has a very good guard that transferred from Colorado State, Wiggington will go pro this year, but he already has a guy who averaged 16 points a game at CSU waiting in the wings. As someone pointed out ealier, this is like bagging a 5 start recruit because of his experience. You remove the learning curve of college ball, and you get guys who are used to hostile environments.

Also I think college is about how many top 50 guys you get. I mean the 3 you talk about in the rankings above started from day 1, started and are extremely high end and productive. That is the difference

Iowa State kills it in coaching as well. Chalk it up....Fran blows.

 

[Kurt Warner]

Iowa State kills it in coaching as well. Chalk it up....Fran blows.

I like fran but it's becoming obvious that he isn't going to move this program any higher

 

[herkhatescy]

There has to be a dirty booster or two...why else would anybody want to go to a ****hole city in Iowa.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

Valid, he has a very good guard that transferred from Colorado State, Wiggington will go pro this year, but he already has a guy who averaged 16 points a game at CSU waiting in the wings. As someone pointed out ealier, this is like bagging a 5 start recruit because of his experience. You remove the learning curve of college ball, and you get guys who are used to hostile environments.

Also I think college is about how many top 50 guys you get. I mean the 3 you talk about in the rankings above started from day 1, started and are extremely high end and productive. That is the difference

4* players that started from day 1 for Iowa
Cook #38 by ESPN
4* WIeskamp #42 by Rivals top 100 by ESPN
4* Garza top 100 by ESPN 4* just outside their top 100
4* Jordan by ESPN outside their top 100
4* Moss by ESPN outside their top 100
NOT starting 4* Connor top 100 by ESPN 4* outside Rival top 100
yet to step foot on campus
4* Patrick #50 by ESPN and top 100 by Rivals
that will make 7 4* recruits that will be on scholarship for the 2019-20 season
if Cook stays for his SR year.

Pat is getting Baer's scholarship

yes Fran and his staff have picked up the pace in recruiting but none of these are/were 5* 1 n Done players let alone a multi year 5*.

 

[Ycusi]

JFC

 

[Hayes_30]

4* players that started from day 1 for Iowa
Cook #38 by ESPN
4* WIeskamp #42 by Rivals top 100 by ESPN
4* Garza top 100 by ESPN 4* just outside their top 100
4* Jordan by ESPN outside their top 100
4* Moss by ESPN outside their top 100
NOT starting 4* Connor top 100 by ESPN 4* outside Rival top 100
yet to step foot on campus
4* Patrick #50 by ESPN and top 100 by Rivals
that will make 7 4* recruits that will be on scholarship for the 2019-20 season
if Cook stays for his SR year.

Pat is getting Baer's scholarship

yes Fran and his staff have picked up the pace in recruiting but none of these are/were 5* 1 n Done players let alone a multi year 5*.

What were these guys ranked by 247? ESPN recruiting service is trash.

 

[Pepperman]

What were these guys ranked by 247? ESPN recruiting service is trash.

Can we also get their 40 yard dash times please, Kilroy?

 

[twindman]

As to Wiescamp starting at ISU - I think his numbers would be MUCH better with the ISU other 4 starters. It would open up driving lanes - he would also get kick outs from a driving pg.

 

[WhiteSoxClone]

Honestly how do you expect to recruit when recruits show up and it’s a morgue.

There is way too much aisle space at the courtside level in Carver Hawkeye. Its been a few years since I've been in that arena, so I don't recall if all of the aisles go all the way to the floor, or just some. Either way, they don't need so many aisles going down to the floor level. It looks like crap on TV and kills the atmosphere when there is a big wide aisle between every five or six fans on the sides of the court. Half of those aisles should only go down partially and should stop as the rows get narrower, well up from the floor level that can be seen on TV. I don't know why the athletic department hasn't done this.

 

[cg8284]

What were these guys ranked by 247? ESPN recruiting service is trash.

Cook #72
Wieskamp #60
Garza #119
Bohanon #312
Moss #287
Connor #152
Patrick #69

Others:
Kreiner #317
Pemsl #230

Carton #25
Foster #26

I think you can see how important those last two are.

 

[Hayes_30]

Can we also get their 40 yard dash times please, Kilroy?

Not sure about 40s but 247 rankings differ from ESPN a bit.
Cook 4* #71 ranked Player in the Class
Wieskamp 4* #60 ranked Player in the Class
Garza 4* #118 ranked Player in the Class
J-Bo 3* #312 ranked Player in the Class
Moss 3* #248 ranked Player in the Class
Connor 3* #152 ranked Player in the Class
Pat 4* #69 ranked Player in the Class

All in all Iowa's Roster is not bad but not as good as you indicated

 

[K OKeefe]

Cook, Moss, and Wieskamp all had ISU offers

Garza did not, but he was a consensus 4* that fits our style.

McCaffery is obviously tough to judge but he was also a 4* player.

So basically we are talking about Bohannon, Kriener, and Baer in terms of whether or not iowa should have recruited. one of which is a starter and is the weak link right now. Kriener had better offers than Jacobson out of high school.

I do not know nor am I accusing you of proclaiming the "weak link" in the starting line up of being one of the best point guards in the conference. However, I remember many proclaiming the "weak link" as better than former ISU point guard Monte Morris. Of course, the people that wrotea this always pointed to his freshman and sophomore stats as their proof. How many ever expect the "weak link" to ever suit up and contribute in the League? The "weak link" is the same player this year as he was the prior two years. He lack the quickness to guard his position, to get north and south off of the dribble, and the ability to get his own shot. Sometimes stats do not tell the entire "tale of the tape."

 

[IowaPride95]

Give me more details of how iowa state is killing us in recruiting.

If the difference is not in recruiting, then it must be in coaching

UNI thought he was coming there until late.

I’m not saying ISU hasn’t recruited better. They have. But iowa has not recruited poorly and ISU is not “absolutely killing” iowa.

LOL @ UNI for believing that. AJ Green sure could have use that help.

Iowa has not so much recruited poorly as the pieces they have recruited just do not seem to fit together and the way Fran tries to utilize them seems odd at times. Last year, when almost every program in the nation was trending towards small ball, Fran rolled out three centers in Nunge, Cook and Garza as his most heavily used lineup. He just seems to be trying to do things different than most.

And Iowa has recruited not much differently rankings wise than ISU at the prep ranks, the difference is in the taking of the transfers. Iowa State has had prep players like Morris, Thomas, Niang, Mitrou-Long, Wigginton, THT, etc be the heart of their team and then supplemented with Shayok, Jacobson, Lucious, Babb, Babb, Allen, White, Clyburn, Burton, McKay, etc from the transfer pool. Currently, Niang, Burton, Nader and Morris are in the NBA and Mitrou-Long has a two way contract. Iowa has not had much for NBA level talent under Fran during this same time period and the only transfer he took in Uthoff was one of the best players he has had but he seems to refuse to go back to that route.

If Fran is going to elevate Iowa's program to ISU's recent level, he is either going to have to vastly out-recruit ISU at the prep ranks to make up for not using high level transfers OR he is going to start having to take high level transfers in addition to the preps he brings in. If he continues to just sign kids rated between 100-250, he will not have success long term.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

Iowa got one decent player out of the 2013-2015 classes. Iowa State was way better. I am not arguing that timeframe.

 

[Iowan525]

Regarding the transfer market...everyone is ignoring the elephant in the room. How do you attract high level transfers with 1or 2 years left to play to Iowa City? Those high level transfers dont want to play in a dead atmosphere for a team who historically does not make the NCAA tournament.

 

[Lone Clone]

Regarding the transfer market...everyone is ignoring the elephant in the room. How do you attract high level transfers with 1or 2 years left to play to Iowa City? Those high level transfers dont want to play in a dead atmosphere for a team who historically does not make the NCAA tournament.

That's a good point, but I think a really important factor is that Fred took a chance and was 'way out front nationally in going after transfers. And he took a lot of shit for it, too -- especially on this board. "Transfer U" is a term of derision to some, but if you're looking for a place to go, it's just the opposite.

 

[Hayes_30]

Cook, Moss, and Wieskamp all had ISU offers

Garza did not, but he was a consensus 4* that fits our style.

McCaffery is obviously tough to judge but he was also a 4* player.

So basically we are talking about Bohannon, Kriener, and Baer in terms of whether or not iowa should have recruited. one of which is a starter and is the weak link right now. Kriener had better offers than Jacobson out of high school.

Moss absolutely did not have an offer from Iowa State. Cook did, and the only offers Wieskamp had were from In State Schools. Plus I feel like the reason Joe had the offer from ISU just was to save face because he was from Iowa. ISU had Talen Horton-Tucker, Zion Griffin "got both", Timmy Allen, Torrence Watson, and Rodgerick Brown all higher on their board than Joe was

 

[L. Wade Childress]

Moss absolutely did not have an offer from Iowa State. Cook did, and the only offers Wieskamp had were from In State Schools. Plus I feel like the reason Joe had the offer from ISU just was to save face because he was from Iowa. ISU had Talen Horton-Tucker, Zion Griffin "got both", Timmy Allen, Torrence Watson, and Rodgerick Brown all higher on their board than Joe was

LOL they offered Joe as a freshman, before Iowa

 

[Cydkar]

Moss absolutely did not have an offer from Iowa State. Cook did, and the only offers Wieskamp had were from In State Schools. Plus I feel like the reason Joe had the offer from ISU just was to save face because he was from Iowa. ISU had Talen Horton-Tucker, Zion Griffin "got both", Timmy Allen, Torrence Watson, and Rodgerick Brown all higher on their board than Joe was

Moss absolutely DID have an offer from ISU.

 

[Hayes_30]

Moss absolutely DID have an offer from ISU.

https://247sports.com/college/iowa-state/Season/2015-Basketball/Offers/

https://247sports.com/player/isaiah-moss-25818

 

[IowaPride95]

Moss absolutely did not have an offer from Iowa State.

https://www.suntimeshighschoolsports.com/2014/11/02/simeons-isaiah-moss-commits-to-iowa/

 

[Hayes_30]

https://www.suntimeshighschoolsports.com/2014/11/02/simeons-isaiah-moss-commits-to-iowa/

See above post

 

[Cydkar]

See above post

I know for a fact that he did.

 

[Walleye70]

Their students go to games

 

[Frank Cannon]

-------ISU gets criticized for this, but they don't focus on kids from the state of Iowa.

Been saying this for TWO decades!!!!

 

[IllQChawk]

Regarding the transfer market...everyone is ignoring the elephant in the room. How do you attract high level transfers with 1or 2 years left to play to Iowa City? Those high level transfers dont want to play in a dead atmosphere for a team who historically does not make the NCAA tournament.

Did you not notice the crowd in attendance on Friday night. If truth be told, I believe there's a fan base that's yearning to back a successful program and every time that Iowa shows a heartbeat they turn up dead on arrival.
It's time for a change, Gary Dolphin was right!

 

[And1Hawk]

Did you not notice the crowd in attendance on Friday night. If truth be told, I believe there's a fan base that's yearning to back a successful program and every time that Iowa shows a heartbeat they turn up dead on arrival.
It's time for a change, Gary Dolphin was right!

Agree the fans are just waiting it out. Any signs of life and a good opponent and we show up only to get our hearts stomped. Friday’s game was an incredible opportunity lost. A decent Wisconsin team but not awesome. We’ve seen them have much, much better teams than what they rolled out. Up 8 in the second half and then nothing. It was a worse loss in some respects than an MSU road drubbing. You kind of knew that was a strong possibility.

I have said this multiple times. We must either radically gut Carver to remake it into a basketball venue first venue or build a new one. That’s the only way to turn around b-ball fortunes truly and get some mojo going. This is the time to do it with the extra B1G TV money as a down payment that won’t last forever. Besides coaching the other major thing wrong is our arena on so many levels.

 

[walleye hunter16]

Wieskamp would be the 8th man for ISU THIS year at best. He will be a heckuva player in years to come but would have a hard time getting significant minutes in Ames this year.

Yep, clearly the typical delusional ISU fan.

 

[IowaPride95]

See above post

Which was incorrect. Just because some database did not reflect it does not mean it did not happen. The article I linked is correct.

 

[Frank Cannon]

-----But we have been way better in football, wrestling, and baseball if you want to keep changing the subject.

Football?

 

[Iowan525]

Yep, clearly the typical delusional ISU fan.

Weiskamp is a 2/3 guard and there is no chance he would earn minutes over Wigginton, Shayok, or Horton-Tucker. 0% chance. If you think that makes me delusional I dont know what to tell you. It isn't even a conversation.

 

[CyberJJ]

Clonefan, but I wanted Cook, Moss and Weiskamp. If I could pick only one of those today it would be Weiskamp. The kid is a player and already at a high level at this tender age. Someone suggested trading him for Lard which is an apples and oranges discussion. Moss showed the ability to create his own shot and dribble penetrate. He shows flashes of that at times but also disappears for extended lengths, but coming out of high school I thought he fit the ISU system. Cook has great strengths and some glaring weaknesses (eg little threat to shoot and hit beyond bunnies and dunks) but has developed as a free throw shooter. Coming out of high school, he was one I really wanted at ISU as well.

 

[CyberJJ]

4* players that started from day 1 for Iowa
Cook #38 by ESPN
4* WIeskamp #42 by Rivals top 100 by ESPN
4* Garza top 100 by ESPN 4* just outside their top 100
4* Jordan by ESPN outside their top 100
4* Moss by ESPN outside their top 100
NOT starting 4* Connor top 100 by ESPN 4* outside Rival top 100
yet to step foot on campus
4* Patrick #50 by ESPN and top 100 by Rivals
that will make 7 4* recruits that will be on scholarship for the 2019-20 season
if Cook stays for his SR year.

Pat is getting Baer's scholarship

yes Fran and his staff have picked up the pace in recruiting but none of these are/were 5* 1 n Done players let alone a multi year 5*.

Kilroy?

 

[ClarindaA's]

Yeah, I'm not so sure of that.
By the time ism and smith are 4th year guys, I expect them to be just as good.....

No

 

[ClarindaA's]

Kilroy?

Yes it is

 

[Fsanford]

Weiskamp is a 2/3 guard and there is no chance he would earn minutes over Wigginton, Shayok, or Horton-Tucker. 0% chance. If you think that makes me delusional I dont know what to tell you. It isn't even a conversation.

Tucker, Wiggington, Jacobson, Babb, Shayok and Wieskamp are the primary 6 I would run out there. ISU has mad a living in recent years, with several guys who all can handle the ball.


ISU is 30th in Scoring defense
They rank 35th in Rebound Margin
ISU is 208th in 3 pt fg %.

Wieskamp is currently at 41.5% from three,
Coming out of high school he shot 48% from 3. He has Matt Thomas shooting skills.

Given you are putting 8th on the depth charge, how would you address the biggest need for ISU?