I'm beyond encouraged..

[ScoutRefugee]

This ^^^^^ Geeze, I thought we were all going to give this team a little time to learn?

OMG, You are joking, right?

Here: http://kenpom.com/

I want 500 words on my desk by Monday on the history of defense under Fran McCaffery at Iowa. With footnotes.

My problem isn't the over all stats. My problem is the 2nd half collapses and the lack of defensive intensity late in close games. I'm not a big believer in adjusted defensive efficiency stats when I personally witness the defensive collapses in close games.

 

[ScoutRefugee]

SSG T mentioned Kenpom, and you said, "Kenpom?" After reading your concerns about McCaffery coaching defense I was prompted to actually believe you have never heard of Kenpom. Sorry. (Joke coming) If you walked in front of traffic I would think you never saw a traffic light.

The post I responded to did not mention Kenpom. I was clarifying.

 

[SSG T]

So you don't foresee any issues with the defense being played in the paint?

I've said many times the Hawks would miss Woody's defense more than most would want to admit.

And anyone who didn't see defensive struggles coming doesn't know basketball. Throw a bunch of guys not used to playing together onto the defensive end and this is what you get.

Defense isn't always about intensity or desire or playing hard. It's about communicating and understanding the switches and rotations and helping. On the ball defense is a completely different world than team defense. Even man to man isn't just about five individuals guarding five other individuals. It takes time to learn the things that make a good team defense.

 

[ScoutRefugee]

So you don't foresee any issues with the defense being played in the paint?

Yes but we have options at the 4 and 5 position. What I saw tonight was poor help defense by our younger bigs. That's something that can be adressed fairly easily. It was how badly we were beaten off the dribble on the perimeter that gave me cause for concern. That can improve too but it will take longer.

 

[SDHawkDoc]

Defense was bad, not that unexpected. Help was almost non existent. Guys blowing to the basket with ease. Defensive effort not there.
Nice offensive output from Cook. Would have been even better if he could have made free throws.
They have talent. A lot if improvement to be made if they're going to sneak into the NCAA.
On a side note, very disappointed in the turnout. Place was half empty.

 

[hawk-i bob]

Iowa didn't lose this game tonite with a 2nd half collapse...it lost it with very poor defense the entire game. I wish we had played good defense in the first half...which would have showed promise & something to build off of.

and shooting 6 of16 at the line...(Cook 5 of 12 Wagner 1 of 4) didn't help.
as well as 17 turnovers...

 

[RocknRollface]

I think it's telling when Fran was subbing out our 2nd best scorer for defensive possessions when he only had 1 foul late in the game.

Cook seems like a hard working kid. Hopefully, he gets better.

Yeah, I really like Cook. Hes the most offensively talented front court freshman Ive ever seen at Iowa, but his D is so bad it almost cancels his offense out.

When Iowa went zone he wasn't even in the middle, Wagner was.

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

JB should develop into a solid PG.

no....too slow.

 

[RocknRollface]

Yes but we have options at the 4 and 5 position. What I saw tonight was poor help defense by our younger bigs. That's something that can be adressed fairly easily. It was how badly we were beaten off the dribble on the perimeter that gave me cause for concern. That can improve too but it will take longer.

In addition to those defensive deficiencies we also played awful post defense.

Defense is never something that can be addressed easily. You can address effort. Rotations is probably on the easier side of things to teach but if you haven't grown up with an understanding of how defense works it all takes a while.

 

[ScoutRefugee]

Yeah, I really like Cook. Hes the most offensively talented front court freshman Ive ever seen at Iowa, but his D is so bad it almost cancels his offense out.

When Iowa went zone he wasn't even in the middle, Wagner was.

Cook was making a lot of help defense mistakes. As was Pemsl. The downside to that would be that our guards were getting beat so bad off the driblle, if they would have been in position, they would have been in foul trouble. I'd have much rather watched SH miss half of their FTs than see them getting layup after layup, however.

 

[ScoutRefugee]

In addition to those defensive deficiencies we also played awful post defense.

Defense is never something that can be addressed easily. You can address effort. Rotations is probably on the easier side of things to teach but if you haven't grown up with an understanding of how defense works it all takes a while.

When a guy doesn't understand his defensive responsibilities in the post, when it comes to helping, it's something that can be addressed in the film room and fairly easily corrected. Help defense in the post is usually a matter of a step here or there. The hedging at the 3 pt line not withstanding. It takes some discipline and repetition but it's not rocket science.
I'm on the other side of what you believe to be difficult to address. Effort and intensity is the hardest thing to address in my opinion. A lot of AAU and high school coaches don't put the same emphasis on those things that they used to. I see it a lot, unfortunately.

 

[mazda1]

The post defense wasn't a thing of beauty, but people were going around Jok at will. If someone jumped out on the driver there was absolutely no help defense.

I'm equally concerned about 2 total rebounds from Cook and the fact Jok led the team in that category. The huge points in the paint advantage was due to in part to our failure to rebound their misses.

I thought we saw decent hustle in the first half and that at the half the Hall were reminded we couldn't stop the dribble drive. We have young kids on the court that don't know how to play team defense at this level.

As I posted before the game until we hold teams with a pulse to under 80 regularly don't expect many W's.

 

[PhantomFlyer]

5 is just a lable.

Im just talking about someone who can play effective post defense and hopefully some help D. That can be any shape or size.

Cook looks lost unnatural and disinterested on D. There was atleast 1 time where he just moved out of the way of a guy driving right at him.

I agree the perimiter D is bad too but all of Iowas length did nothing. The only guy effecting shots is Bear because he has the instincts and desire for it.

True, but competent guard play would make the interior D look better. It's like DB's. You can make bad DB's look decent if you have a good or great D line. You can also make good DB's look bad if your D line sucks. The same is true with perimeter and inside D.

Cook is a FR so it's little wonder he looks a little lost when the guards are playing ole defense. Even the announcers were putting the blame on the guards for letting the offense players get into the lane too easily on the drives. We saw the same thing a couple times when a SH player dribbled the entire length of the floor and nobody stopped the ball handler. That isn't the bigs fault, that is the perimeter defenders. You could have Patrick Ewing playing inside and it's going to be tough to stop teams from scoring if the guards are so incompetent at keeping opposing guards from driving to the rim.

I agree the interior defense was horrible but the strength of the defense must start at the perimeter, just like the strength in football must start with your line play.

Let's face it, defense has never been a strong suit of Fran's teams. He just doesn't emphasize it like Wis (Ryan) or MSU (Izzo). Maybe they should spend less time in practice on fast breaks and more time working on halfcourt defense.

The good news is Iowa's half court offense looked better than I've seen in some time. Our guards seem to do more passing and less dribbling around without purpose, and we finally have a big man or two who can play with their back to the basket.

 

[PhantomFlyer]

Not unusual for a high school 4 star to struggle on defensive effort...it is a learning process. I do know that Fran had told Cook he needed to stay out of foul trouble...I don't think he meant for him to back away. But this is why you play tough teams early...they are not going to learn beating the crap out of the Savannah States...

I know its not popular ... Seton Hall was the more experienced team. I was encouraged we played them to the final score...especially considering how many uncontested baskets they got. Listening to Fran after the game he seemed to be more upset with how we ran the offense coming out to start the 2nd half. I have a feeling he knows the defense will come around...hopefully soon. .

Virginia in a week...

I was more upset with how Iowa took care of the basketball the final 10 minutes. I think Bohannon had 2 straight TO's and then Cook had one. I think each one led to an easy SH bucket. Very sloppy stretch and that's when SH gained control of the game.

The defense is terrible right now but this isn't surprising given all the young players. It should get better as the season rolls along. The offense was encouraging though. Our guards moved the ball, they just didn't dribble around the perimeter. Pretty good passing and spacing. Cook is a stud, Jok is a stud. Cook might be the best big man to wear an Iowa uniform since the George Raveling days. I know he's only a FR but he's the first Fran player I've seen where I thought, "This kid is playing in the NBA".

 

[CAhawki]

no....too slow.

He'll be fine.

 

[vgshwk]

Charlie Moore scored 38 points the other night for Cal

How many dollars per minute is that?

 

[yiana]

Switch every ball screen. At least in crunch time. Our pg has a 6'11" wingspan, Peter is 6'6" and strong, Baer played center in high school, Cook and Uhl/Wagner move their feet well for big dudes. Thst stupid hedge opens up passing lanes.

 

[the24fan]

I didn't come away too mad either. Seton Hall appeared on first viewing to be a sure bet to make the big dance.

Cook showed us all what we've been waiting for and damn was it awesome. He's still a sieve defensively, but enough hard work can fix that up.

PG play was inconsistent. I thought there were stretches where both showed positives. It's frustrating because they followed up good sequences with shockingly bad play.

Too many easy buckets from penetration. Didn't think any of the guards defended well. Only players I semi trust on defense are Baer, Wagner, and Uhl.

Most of the lineups were fine. I didn't like the stretch with Bohannon, Ellingson, and Jok together in the first half. It was asking too much of Jordan to create. I also think the lack of defense from this group gave Seton Hall some confidence early.

Good news is it's one game and there's plenty of time to improve.

This is pretty much how I saw this too...showed our youth at times but the potential is definitely there. Would have like to see AWagner do a little more offensively but that will come eventually I hope.
As others stated we need to shore up that interior defense. My goodness it seemed Carrington had 20 layups last night!That has to improve for us to have any chance to be successful this year. Otherwise I really like the athleticism of this squad. Been a long time since I saw an Iowa player use a spin move in the lane and dunk with the left hand. That was impressive.

 

[And1Hawk]

What would also really help is if our fans would show up to bring energy and enthusiasm to a young team learning and trying. It's amazing that we have a really good non-con opponent and the place is half empty if not more. Those of us that were there did our best.

If you are criticizing and not attending well what does that say about your merit as a fan.

 

[DavenportHawk8]

This was their first game vs a team with a pulse. I thought they handled it very well. I realize there are TONS of things to improve and I am sure Fran & Co will go to work today.

Defensively both our man to man and zone were awful. That will come with time and once the team buys into the system. There was zero "help side" defense outside of Baer. Everyone else let the guy go right to the basket. Need to help more and on zone need to not allow the ball in the middle. Defense is going to be worked on and there will be an improvement.

Offensively I thought they looked okay. I mean we had two players who were dominating in Cook & Jok. Now that being said, Fran needs to find someone else to step up. Seton Hall started to double Cook and basically man handle Jok down the stretch. Who is going to be that 3rd guy to help out?? I think you saw when Iowa needs a basket, they will go to those 2 first, but Seton Hall collapsed on both of them and Jok and Cook had to force some shots down the stretch. Need a 3rd guy to come out and score.

Overall it was game one. I looked back to IA vs Marquette last year and this game reminded me of that. (Marquette young squad vs a Veteran squad at home). I thought Iowa handled themselves. A couple of bad turnovers, but hey the didnt' get housed in their own arena. They played hard and the mistakes will be able to be fixed. This is going to be a fun/frustrating team to watch!

 

[DavenportHawk8]

What would also really help is if our fans would show up to bring energy and enthusiasm to a young team learning and trying. It's amazing that we have a really good non-con opponent and the place is half empty if not more. Those of us that were there did our best.

If you are criticizing and not attending well what does that say about your merit as a fan.

Just saying doesn't help when the State Football Finals are on and you have a family member playing in the game. I realize that was only 2 towns, but a 8pm tip during the week is going to be tough to sell out. U of Iowa needs to offer 5-10 dollar tickets if they want the place to sell out during the week and a late start.

 

[24 so far]

Cook was making a lot of help defense mistakes. As was Pemsl. The downside to that would be that our guards were getting beat so bad off the driblle, if they would have been in position, they would have been in foul trouble. I'd have much rather watched SH miss half of their FTs than see them getting layup after layup, however.

I was a bit surprised there wasn't more effort in altering or barely attempting to block shots in the paint. I thought with all of our supposed depth, we'd have plenty of guys able to take on some potential fouls and not alter the game that much.

We had a poor stretch with turnovers and easy baskets late that made the difference ultimately. We figured we'd be poor defensively and poor rebounding and that will likely be the case all year long. I don't know how many free throws Seton Hall missed, but Iowa missed 13 and lost by 8.

Seton Hall shot 66% in the 2nd half, you'll lose a lot of games if that continues. The good news is that this game was close for the majority of it. Expectations for me are low, so this season should be more "fun" than the last couple of years.

 

[33hawkfan]

I like the young talent. I am not convinced this staff will ever get a team to consistently play good and fundamentally sound defense.

I mean we've finished in the top 35 in D in three of the last four years, what constitutes good and fundamentally sound defense, top 10?

 

[Rifler]

I saw a lot that I liked last night, and a few things that I didn't,.... Down the road I think this team has some serious potential if they can get their defense figured out, as Big 10 is going to be tough. Also suspect that we will look back at this Seton Hall loss as having been a more valuable team lesson than a Seton Hall win would have been..... I'm encouraged.

 

[And1Hawk]

Just saying doesn't help when the State Football Finals are on and you have a family member playing in the game. I realize that was only 2 towns, but a 8pm tip during the week is going to be tough to sell out. U of Iowa needs to offer 5-10 dollar tickets if they want the place to sell out during the week and a late start.

The tip time is not great but I am tired of the excuses. It's a Thursday night meaning the next day is the end of the week. There's tons of Hawk fans within an hour of Carver. Everyone wants a great program but does not support the effort unless it's free.

 

[DavenportHawk8]

The tip time is not great but I am tired of the excuses. It's a Thursday night meaning the next day is the end of the week. There's tons of Hawk fans within an hour of Carver. Everyone wants a great program but does not support the effort unless it's free.

I understand where your coming from. I would of made the trip if my cousin hadn't been playing. The problem with the 8pm start time is a lot of people won't come. Its been that way for years. I remember the first year of the BTN and Iowa had a lot of 8:05 or 8:30 tip times and season ticket holders were upset. So I don't know what you can do to stop that.

I did go back and notice that the Seton Hall game was on Groupon (15 dollars for a ticket) as opposed to 25 or 27.

 

[CanadaHawk]

The morning after the SH game, I think there's a lot of dissatisfaction because despite SH being a tough team, it was a winnable game, but for mainly the freshmen defensive mistakes and turnovers. Their freshman Powell coming off the bench to score 26 had something to do with it as well. Step off the ledge of disappointment that we couldn't close and look at the box score. For those of you complaining about rebounding, realize that we actually beat SH by 8 on the boards: 46-38. Yeah, that's right.
http://sidearm.sites.s3.amazonaws.com/hawkeyesports.com/documents/2016/11/17/IOWA03.pdf
Turnovers: SH 12, Iowa 17
Steals: SH 10, Iowa 9
These aren't quite the disparity that it seemed.
Assists: Iowa 16, SH 11- Iowa actually made more plays for their teammates than SH!
FTs: Iowa 19/32 for 59.4%, SH 17/31 for 54.8%- Iowa actually was better from the line.
If you're criticizing Iowa for these things, imagine what SH fans are saying: their core has 2 more years of experience!
The defense was bad, but it will improve. This happens with young teams. The ride begins!

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

He'll be fine.

if you really think that then i question your definition of a solid PG. if being a huge liability his entire career on defense is solid then sure he may become solid one day.

 

[CAhawki]

if you really think that then i question your definition of a solid PG. if being a huge liability his entire career on defense is solid then sure he may become solid one day.

And what leads you to believe he'll be a liability his entire career? We are three games into his freshman year, tool bag. Pull you head out of you ass.

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

And what leads you to believe he'll be a liability his entire career? We are three games into his freshman year, tool bag. Pull you head out of you ass.

because is slow. you can't coach up slow. stick with the insults because that's all you have. Come back in 4 years and i will accept your apology and concession that i was correct.

 

[CAhawki]

because is slow. you can't coach up slow. stick with the insults because that's all you have. Come back in 4 years and i will accept your apology and concession that i was correct.

GTFO...with that. You are the one that wants to write off a player in the third game. Enough with that sort of jackassery.

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

GTFO...with that. You are the one that wants to write off a player in the third game. Enough with that sort of jackassery.

seton hall's freshman guard dropped 26 on JOBO. why do you think that was?

 

[CAhawki]

seton hall's freshman guard dropped 26 on JOBO. why do you think that was?

Defense was weak on all fronts. You can't bail on a freshman and 1 poor performance.

 

[AZmess]

Switch every ball screen. At least in crunch time. Our pg has a 6'11" wingspan, Peter is 6'6" and strong, Baer played center in high school, Cook and Uhl/Wagner move their feet well for big dudes. Thst stupid hedge opens up passing lanes.

Just to clarify, you want to switch all ball screens, correct?

 

[jaffarosenfels]

because is slow. you can't coach up slow. stick with the insults because that's all you have. Come back in 4 years and i will accept your apology and concession that i was correct.

He is slow and you are a tool bag. Both just telling it like it is.

 

[sober_teacher]

I understand where your coming from. I would of made the trip if my cousin hadn't been playing. The problem with the 8pm start time is a lot of people won't come. Its been that way for years. I remember the first year of the BTN and Iowa had a lot of 8:05 or 8:30 tip times and season ticket holders were upset. So I don't know what you can do to stop that.

I did go back and notice that the Seton Hall game was on Groupon (15 dollars for a ticket) as opposed to 25 or 27.

I would have gone if it were a 6 pm game. Trouble is i live in Des Moines. 8 pm game means at best I'm home around midnight then I have to go to bed and get up early for work. That's the issue for anyone in central/western Iowa.

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

can McCaffery pick up a JUCO PG at mid-season? would be a great addition to this team.

 

[unIowa]

Monte Morris is going to have an absolute field day. Drive and kick for wide open threes to Thomas and Long all night. Frans inability to recruit a PG is going to hurt all year long.

Or if we are going to have a 6'6" PG with an ever greater wingspan then maybe post them up from time to time to take advantage of the size/reach delta.

 

[unIowa]

I've said many times the Hawks would miss Woody's defense more than most would want to admit.

And anyone who didn't see defensive struggles coming doesn't know basketball. Throw a bunch of guys not used to playing together onto the defensive end and this is what you get.

Defense isn't always about intensity or desire or playing hard. It's about communicating and understanding the switches and rotations and helping. On the ball defense is a completely different world than team defense. Even man to man isn't just about five individuals guarding five other individuals. It takes time to learn the things that make a good team defense.

Woody would have been worth probably 10-15 points on the defensive end alone last night.

 

[SSG T]

The tip time is not great but I am tired of the excuses. It's a Thursday night meaning the next day is the end of the week. There's tons of Hawk fans within an hour of Carver. Everyone wants a great program but does not support the effort unless it's free.

I go to as many games as possible. However, I live 2 hours from CHA and have 2 kids that play sports in HS, a daughter that has dance team at 6 in the morning at her school 20 miles away (her brother rides with her, they leave at 530 in the morning every day) and I leave for work at 6 in the morning. 6 pm weekday games are hard, 8 pm tips are nearly impossible. A game that ends at 10, I'm pulling out of the lot at 1020, hitting the interstate at 1030 and getting home at 1230. That's best case and that doesn't work.

A Friday I might be able to do, except my kids both play ball that night. I love the Hawks, but I love my kids more, and I've missed more of their stuff than I wish I had doing Army things. They come first.

And honestly, the only people I'll ever complain about going to games is students. I wish they'd do more to attract them, including free or extremely cheap tickets, but as it is, the student turn out is disappointing as they have the fewest reasons for not being there.

So I'm turning on the TV as much as possible and pacing in the living room watching the big screen.