Is Cal really a good coach?

[OnceAhawk]

Keep in mind that with just 1:40 to go in the game, Wisconsin and Kentucky were tied at 60.

However, there was some interesting coaching going on that might have cost KY the game.

Consider:

1) It was revealed in the pregame that over the previous week Kentucky did not spend one minute looking at film of Wisconsin. Cal wanted to focus on themselves.

Who does that?

2) When the Wisconsin big would set a screen (and sometimes it was the WI guard who would set the screen on the KY big), Kentucky would often times switch, leaving the Kentucky guard [Tyler Ulis (5'9") or Devin Booker (6'6"), for example ] on 7'1" Frank Kaminsky. Why wasn't an adjustment made here?

Examples where KY got burned:

* In the 2nd half, right away, off the switch, Frank abused Booker for an easy lay up.

* at the 17 min mark, Gasser screened off the KY big who was guarding Frank, leaving Booker on Frank; Frank again abused Booker with a driving layup, where he got fouled, made the basket and FT

That's FIVE POINTS right there.

3) Wisconsin does a lot of shot fakes and Kentucky fell for many of them, which led to Wisconsin points. If Kentucky had watched some Wisconsin film, perhaps they would have known this.

Couple examples where KY got burned by the shot fake:

* In 1st half, Gasser did a pump fake, the KY guy went right on by, and Gasser nailed the 3 pointer
* At 10:34 mark of 2nd half, Jackson did a pump fake, got Ulis to bite, and Ulis fouled him, giving Jackson 2 FTs

Thats another FIVE POINTS right there.

4) The game was tied at half at 36. The Harrison twins had 18 of Kentucky's 36 first half points; Cal started the second half, nevertheless, with backups: Ulis and Booker. The Harrison twins started the 2nd half on the bench. Coincidence or not, at the 14:41 mark, WI was up 52-44. Why were your 2 starters and 50% of your 1st half offense on the bench?

5) Kentucky rallied, went on a 16-4 run and had the lead 60-56, and the ball, at the 4:50 mark, mostly because they were driving to the basket and were getting the ball inside; KY was not settling for jumpers. Kentucky, however, tried to milk some of the clock. During this possession, when up 60-56, KY threw up a crazy air ball, resulting in a shot clock violation. It appeared too soon to be milking the clock.

Thoughts?

In his defense, Cal was named 2015 AP Coach of the year. He, along w/ Bo Ryan, is up for the Hall of Fame.

However, when you consider the above, did he cost Kentucky a national championship? Does a good coach do so many stupid things?







This post was edited on 4/5 8:21 AM by OnceAhawk

 

[mikegsvu]

As Cal said on numerous occasions this year, regardless of how talented they are, they're still mostly 18-19 years old. You can coach and teach all you want, but sometimes they fall prey to instinct.

Now having said that, Duke starts three freshmen, so is Coach K the better teacher?
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[iahawkeyes17]

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:
Keep in mind that with just 1:40 to go in the game, Wisconsin and Kentucky were tied at 60.

However, there was some interesting coaching going on that might have cost KY the game.

Consider:

1) It was revealed in the pregame that over the previous week Kentucky did not spend one minute looking at film of Wisconsin. Cal wanted to focus on themselves.

Who does that?

2) When the Wisconsin big would set a screen (and sometimes it was the WI guard who would set the screen on the KY big), Kentucky would often times switch, leaving the Kentucky guard [Tyler Ulis (5'9") or Devin Booker (6'6"), for example ] on 7'1" Frank Kaminsky. Why wasn't an adjustment made here?

Examples where KY got burned:

* In the 2nd half, right away, off the switch, Frank abused Booker for an easy lay up.

* at the 17 min mark, Gasser screened off the KY big who was guarding Frank, leaving Booker on Frank; Frank again abused Booker with a driving layup, where he got fouled, made the basket and FT

That's FIVE POINTS right there.

3) Wisconsin does a lot of shot fakes and Kentucky fell for many of them, which led to Wisconsin points. If Kentucky had watched some Wisconsin film, perhaps they would have known this.

Couple examples where KY got burned by the shot fake:

* In 1st half, Gasser did a pump fake, the KY guy went right on by, and Gasser nailed the 3 pointer
* At 10:34 mark of 2nd half, Jackson did a pump fake, got Ulis to bite, and Ulis fouled him, giving Jackson 2 FTs

Thats another FIVE POINTS right there.

4) The game was tied at half at 36. The Harrison twins had 18 of Kentucky's 36 first half points; Cal started the second half, nevertheless, with backups: Ulis and Booker. The Harrison twins started the 2nd half on the bench. Coincidence or not, at the 14:41 mark, WI was up 52-44. Why were your 2 starters and 50% of your 1st half offense on the bench?

5) Kentucky rallied, went on a 16-4 run and had the lead 60-56, and the ball, at the 4:50 mark, mostly because they were driving to the basket and were getting the ball inside; KY was not settling for jumpers. Kentucky, however, tried to milk some of the clock. During this possession, when up 60-56, KY threw up a crazy air ball, resulting in a shot clock violation. It appeared too soon to be milking the clock.

Thoughts?

In his defense, Cal was named 2015 AP Coach of the year. He, along w/ Bo Ryan, is up for the Hall of Fame.

However, when you consider the above, did he cost Kentucky a national championship? Does a good coach do so many stupid things?







This post was edited on 4/5 8:21 AM by OnceAhawk

One thing I couldn't believe he was doing and Reggie Miller brought it up in post game was the 4 low play. In last 4 min multiple times they ran this set under 15 in shot clock put 4 guys on baseline and let Harrison go to work. I know at least 2x it failed. Get the ball to Towns and let him do his thing. He's your best players and Wisc was rarely double teaming him. Bo on the other hand in last possession under a min made sure Frank got the ball and he got to the ft line.

 

[hooper56]

Some really good points being made here. I get the sense that all year long, Cal didn't really have to coach since his talent was so superior. Once Kentucky is playing some really good competition we have seen how they struggle. Against Notre Dame they looked like they had no idea how to handle a pick and roll. Against Wisconsin it appeared they had never seen a shot fake before. That's poor coaching, plain and simple. Those kids don't listen to Cal.

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by iahawkeyes17:

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:
Keep in mind that with just 1:40 to go in the game, Wisconsin and Kentucky were tied at 60.

However, there was some interesting coaching going on that might have cost KY the game.

Consider:

1) It was revealed in the pregame that over the previous week Kentucky did not spend one minute looking at film of Wisconsin. Cal wanted to focus on themselves.

Who does that?

2) When the Wisconsin big would set a screen (and sometimes it was the WI guard who would set the screen on the KY big), Kentucky would often times switch, leaving the Kentucky guard [Tyler Ulis (5'9") or Devin Booker (6'6"), for example ] on 7'1" Frank Kaminsky. Why wasn't an adjustment made here?

Examples where KY got burned:

* In the 2nd half, right away, off the switch, Frank abused Booker for an easy lay up.

* at the 17 min mark, Gasser screened off the KY big who was guarding Frank, leaving Booker on Frank; Frank again abused Booker with a driving layup, where he got fouled, made the basket and FT

That's FIVE POINTS right there.

3) Wisconsin does a lot of shot fakes and Kentucky fell for many of them, which led to Wisconsin points. If Kentucky had watched some Wisconsin film, perhaps they would have known this.

Couple examples where KY got burned by the shot fake:

* In 1st half, Gasser did a pump fake, the KY guy went right on by, and Gasser nailed the 3 pointer
* At 10:34 mark of 2nd half, Jackson did a pump fake, got Ulis to bite, and Ulis fouled him, giving Jackson 2 FTs

Thats another FIVE POINTS right there.

4) The game was tied at half at 36. The Harrison twins had 18 of Kentucky's 36 first half points; Cal started the second half, nevertheless, with backups: Ulis and Booker. The Harrison twins started the 2nd half on the bench. Coincidence or not, at the 14:41 mark, WI was up 52-44. Why were your 2 starters and 50% of your 1st half offense on the bench?

5) Kentucky rallied, went on a 16-4 run and had the lead 60-56, and the ball, at the 4:50 mark, mostly because they were driving to the basket and were getting the ball inside; KY was not settling for jumpers. Kentucky, however, tried to milk some of the clock. During this possession, when up 60-56, KY threw up a crazy air ball, resulting in a shot clock violation. It appeared too soon to be milking the clock.

Thoughts?

In his defense, Cal was named 2015 AP Coach of the year. He, along w/ Bo Ryan, is up for the Hall of Fame.

However, when you consider the above, did he cost Kentucky a national championship? Does a good coach do so many stupid things?







This post was edited on 4/5 8:21 AM by OnceAhawk

One thing I couldn't believe he was doing and Reggie Miller brought it up in post game was the 4 low play. In last 4 min multiple times they ran this set under 15 in shot clock put 4 guys on baseline and let Harrison go to work. I know at least 2x it failed. Get the ball to Towns and let him do his thing. He's your best players and Wisc was rarely double teaming him. Bo on the other hand in last possession under a min made sure Frank got the ball and he got to the ft line.

good point

KY had so many chances to pull this game out but....

 

[DanL53]

Did anyone mention the switching they were doing on picks? I know that Wisconsin had a field day with the mismatches all game long.

But, good. So far Calipari's Early Childhood Development and Semi-Pro Basketball System hasn't taken over college basketball completely.

I'm hopeful some of the talent standing in line for a Kentucky spot might realize they are better off playing where they get a little coaching.

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by DanL53:

Did anyone mention the switching they were doing on picks? I know that Wisconsin had a field day with the mismatches all game long.

But, good. So far Calipari's Early Childhood Development and Semi-Pro Basketball System hasn't taken over college basketball completely.

I'm hopeful some of the talent standing in line for a Kentucky spot might realize they are better off playing where they get a little coaching.

did you read the orig post? c'mon, Dan! lol

 

[DanL53]

Re: Is Cal really a good Easter Bunny?

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:

Originally posted by DanL53:

Did anyone mention the switching they were doing on picks? I know that Wisconsin had a field day with the mismatches all game long.

But, good. So far Calipari's Early Childhood Development and Semi-Pro Basketball System hasn't taken over college basketball completely.

I'm hopeful some of the talent standing in line for a Kentucky spot might realize they are better off playing where they get a little coaching.

did you read the orig post? c'mon, Dan! lol




Oh, yeah. There's the switching thing.

PS: I was going to make a joke and post a funny picture but I found this:

Happy Easter everyone!

This post was edited on 4/5 9:51 AM by DanL53

 

[OnceAhawk]

15h15 hours ago

McDonald's All-Americans on roster: Kentucky (9) vs. Wisconsin (0)

 

[longliveCS40]

Re: Is Cal really a good Easter Bunny?

OP's point #1 is all you need to form the opinion that Calipari is not a good coach.

A big part of "coaching" is the pre game scouting of your opponent and gameplanning to exploit their weaknesses.

He's a recruiter, not a coach.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[edbok]

Originally posted by DanL53:


I'm hopeful some of the talent standing in line for a Kentucky spot might realize they are better off playing where they get a little coaching.

I doubt it. The most elite players probably care more about exposure than whatever coaching they are going to get in their one or two years of college. Calipari can pretty much guarantee a player national exposure if the player is good enough to get significant minutes on his roster.

 

[LuteHawk]

Cal can recruit talented players who like the big
stage that Kentucky provides.

However, with superior talent, it becomes more
difficult to coach them. These players have big
egos and know they will be "one and done".

Derek Rose played for Coach Cal at Memphis,
and Rose is a midget intellectually. He listens
to his handlers and never is able to express
himself in a conversation.

 

[Scott559]

Originally posted by DanL53:

I'm hopeful some of the talent standing in line for a Kentucky spot might realize they are better off playing where they get a little coaching.

Kids will always line up Kentucky, Cal is the perfect used car salesman, They get exposure, Attention and who knows what other perks that come with attending UK off the court.

 

[TopHawkeye]

I noted in another thread that there were at least two obvious times in the second half (which suggests there were plenty more at other times) where UK's players flat out ignored Calipari's instructions from the side line. One time down he motioned for the players to clear out and run an iso for Harrison who had the ball. The players ignored it and continued to run basic motion with one of the bigs coming out to screen for Harrison at the top of the key and Cal was visibly frustrated. The very next possession he was trying to call a set play from the sideline and again the players appeared to completely ignore it and Cal was raising his arms in frustration and turned away. Now part of that could have just been kids too focused on the heat of the moment for their coach's words to register, but it causes you to wonder whether the players are just used to "playing ball" without much in the way of coaching.

This post was edited on 4/5 2:14 PM by TopHawkeye

 

[EZ2BJZ]

Yes, Coach K is the better teacher. No question about it.

 

[pmknicks]

Isn't recruiting part of coaching? If so he has to be considered a good coach as he is arguably the best recruiter there is. He might be using tactics that are not quite kosher, although we don't know that for certain most would believe he is not above board. But he's certainly not the only coach who using qurstionable tactics on the recruiting trail.

How many threads on the Iowa board bemoan our coaches, football and basketball, recruiting ability?

As mentioned above how tough is it too coach the numerous huge egos on that team? Especially at the very end of their short lived Kentucky career.

He has been ultra successful every place he has been. Not sure how anyone could substantiate that he is not a good coach.

 

[TopHawkeye]

Originally posted by pmknicks:
Isn't recruiting part of coaching? If so he has to be considered a good coach as he is arguably the best recruiter there is. He might be using tactics that are not quite kosher, although we don't know that for certain most would believe he is not above board. But he's certainly not the only coach who using qurstionable tactics on the recruiting trail.

How many threads on the Iowa board bemoan our coaches, football and basketball, recruiting ability?

As mentioned above how tough is it too coach the numerous huge egos on that team? Especially at the very end of their short lived Kentucky career.

He has been ultra successful every place he has been. Not sure how anyone could substantiate that he is not a good coach.

Coach can be used in a broader and a narrower sense. In the broader sense, sure, Cal has been successful in winning basketball games so yes he's been a great coach. In the narrower sense, in terms of teaching the game, developing players, developing gameplans, making adjustments, etc., I think the verdict is still out.

 

[longliveCS40]

Think about what a Boo Ryan or Shaka Smart or even a Fran McCaffrey would do with that talent and then tell me he's a good coach.

He's pathetic. To not win a title with that team is on him.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[Cerro Gordo Hawk]

Yes, he is.

 

[rillo 62]

Originally posted by longliveCS40:
Think about what a Boo Ryan or Shaka Smart or even a Fran McCaffrey would do with that talent and then tell me he's a good coach.

He's pathetic. To not win a title with that team is on him.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

LMAO He was 38-1

 

[pmknicks]

Well longlivecs40, Bo, Fran nor Shaka have been able to recruit that type of talent, does that make them a bad coach since they are limited in the recruiting portion of coaching? Shaka may get to near that level at his new gig. So jury is out on that one.

And remember, all that talent is prett young, given that core for 3 years and he might win titles but we will never know. The fab five had two full years together and did not win a title.

 

[longliveCS40]

I consider Tom Davis a much better coach than George Raveling. That pretty much sums up how I compare other coaches to Calipari.

Recruiting well doesn't make you a good coach. It makes you a good recruiter.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by longliveCS40:
I consider Tom Davis a much better coach than George Raveling. That pretty much sums up how I compare other coaches to Calipari.

Recruiting well doesn't make you a good coach. It makes you a good recruiter.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

good point.

A good coach would maximize the talent and prepare the team. Davis did that in 1987.

Did Cal maximize the talent he had this year? I think the answer is no, based on being the overwhelming favorite to win the national championship.

Did he prepare his team vs Wisconsin? Re-read my orig post, point #1, and I think the answer is clearly no. And that is terrible coaching and is on him.

 

[Titanhawk2]

Originally posted by mikegsvu:
As Cal said on numerous occasions this year, regardless of how talented they are, they're still mostly 18-19 years old. You can coach and teach all you want, but sometimes they fall prey to instinct.

Now having said that, Duke starts three freshmen, so is Coach K the better teacher?

Posted from Rivals Mobile

They were an immensely talented team of individuals, actually probably the equivalent of two "normal" college teams, probably most talented team ever. Excepting the one guy who is a senior that can't keep playing, what's the probability this team would be in the exact same position this time next year and the year after? They arguably would then be the greatest college team ever.

 

[swagsurfer02]

Yes. His players just failed to execute..


Amirite!
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[DesMoinesHawki]

I don't respect Cali or the fact that Kentucky has simply become a farm club for the NBA... But I do think he is a good coach. He starts with a new roster of "kids" in each year and he gets hem to play together.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[GenericHawk]

Culver's All-Americans > McDonald's All-Americans.

 

[BlueHawk23]

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:

Originally posted by longliveCS40:
I consider Tom Davis a much better coach than George Raveling. That pretty much sums up how I compare other coaches to Calipari.

Recruiting well doesn't make you a good coach. It makes you a good recruiter.

Posted from Rivals Mobile

good point.

A good coach would maximize the talent and prepare the team. Davis did that in 1987.

Did Cal maximize the talent he had this year? I think the answer is no, based on being the overwhelming favorite to win the national championship.

Did he prepare his team vs Wisconsin? Re-read my orig post, point #1, and I think the answer is clearly no. And that is terrible coaching and is on him.

i read your original post and laughed at point 1 as it is inaccurate.

 

[pmknicks]

Wasn't one of the reasons Dr Tom got fired was because of poor recruiting? Recruiting is one part of coaching, just like X and O and skill development. They all go hand in hand. Only the top 1% do all facets well. Like him or not Calipari has won nearly 78% of his games at the college level with a couple stops at non blue bloods. The guy is among the best at his profession.

 

[squibs]

He is a really, really good coach. So is Krzyzewski. So is Bo Ryan. So is Izzo. The fact that he can recruit like hell (as can Coach K and Izzo) does not diminish his coaching skills. It adds to them. He made a great team out of a group of all-stars (38-1 is terrific with any players).

He has the highest NCAA tournament winning % of any active coach...against the best, he has been the best. He has nine 30-win seasons...21 seasons with 20 or more wins. Can he coach? Are you kidding?

 

[longliveCS40]

Originally posted by BlueHawk23:

Originally posted by OnceAhawk:

Originally posted by longliveCS40:
I consider Tom Davis a much better coach than George Raveling. That pretty much sums up how I compare other coaches to Calipari.

Recruiting well doesn't make you a good coach. It makes you a good recruiter.

Posted from Rivals Mobile

good point.

A good coach would maximize the talent and prepare the team. Davis did that in 1987.

Did Cal maximize the talent he had this year? I think the answer is no, based on being the overwhelming favorite to win the national championship.

Did he prepare his team vs Wisconsin? Re-read my orig post, point #1, and I think the answer is clearly no. And that is terrible coaching and is on him.

i read your original post and laughed at point 1 as it is inaccurate.

Tell this to the announcers of the game. I tend to think they know more than you as they said Calipari told them that himself.

 

[OnceAhawk]

Originally posted by squibs:
He is a really, really good coach. So is Krzyzewski. So is Bo Ryan. So is Izzo. The fact that he can recruit like hell (as can Coach K and Izzo) does not diminish his coaching skills. It adds to them. He made a great team out of a group of all-stars (38-1 is terrific with any players).

He has the highest NCAA tournament winning % of any active coach...against the best, he has been the best. He has nine 30-win seasons...21 seasons with 20 or more wins. Can he coach? Are you kidding?

Did Cal's team look prepared vs WI? Perhaps it was the lack of film sessions.

Do WI and Duke look prepared tonight? Perhaps it was the film sessions.

 

[pmknicks]

I'm not sure I would believe everything Calipari says. Remember he also claimed he had no knowledge of recruiting violations at both UMASS and Memphis.

 

[rillo 62]

Originally posted by pmknicks:
I'm not sure I would believe everything Calipari says. Remember he also claimed he had no knowledge of recruiting violations at both UMASS and Memphis.

What recruiting violations?

 

[J_Heater]

38-1 but you lose that last one and suddenly you can't coach.

Par for the course on Iowa Rivals. Where real coaches go to prove they know nothing. .

 

[bizkitsngravy]

Cal is a gr8 recruiter snake oil salesman. you name it but not a great coach, Williams Coach k Shaka Smart Ryan Izzo Few would have won a national champion with KY's Talent this year and not even close. It is utter BS that he won AP coach of the year and now the NCAA hall of fame is tarnished and sullied by his inclusion in it (PUKE).

 

[Guidotheguide]

Reminds me of when the Yankees had some great teams back in the 50's and early 60's. My dad would say "hell i could manage that team, just throw the bats and balls out there and say play."

 

[IronFist1776]

Originally posted by squibs:
He is a really, really good coach. So is Krzyzewski. So is Bo Ryan. So is Izzo. The fact that he can recruit like hell (as can Coach K and Izzo) does not diminish his coaching skills. It adds to them. He made a great team out of a group of all-stars (38-1 is terrific with any players).

He has the highest NCAA tournament winning % of any active coach...against the best, he has been the best. He has nine 30-win seasons...21 seasons with 20 or more wins. Can he coach? Are you kidding?

I think its better to say that he's an average coach w/ way above average talent. As the OP pointed out, he made numerous blunders just in that one game. As far as the 38-0 up until the loss, so what? If this hadn't been the worst shape the SEC has ever been in, then that argument might mean something but as sorry as the SEC was this year, I think there were several teams that could have achieved the same thing. Even Florida sucked and they've had the most consistent program since the early to mid '90's. Arkansas was ranked but IMO it was due more to the weakness of the SEC than because Arkansas really showed something. Also, the early OOC wins look good but since they're so early, it's easy to make too much of them. All of that stuff adds up to Kentucky not being as good as they and most people thought they were.