Brian Hoyer has an NFL arm, Rudock does not. All you have to do is watch a college QB play to determine if they have NFL potential or not. College stats aren't completely meaningless when evaluating for the NFL, but they are close. So many other factors can impact a QB's stats that are out if his control.
Jake Rudock is kind of a stud.
- Thread starter UncleChesterton
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Brian Hoyer has an NFL arm, Rudock does not. All you have to do is watch a college QB play to determine if they have NFL potential or not. College stats aren't completely meaningless when evaluating for the NFL, but they are close. So many other factors can impact a QB's stats that are out if his control.
Give it up pocha, there is no arguing with these people. Someone actually compared stats with Tom Brady and thought that meant something. I can't think of any physical attribute that Jake is elite at, and if that's the case you better be deadly accurate, which JR is not. IMO the most frustrating part of watching JR was that he rarely hit a receiver in stride to let them do anything after the catch. He obviously had a weak arm and a terribly long release but there is no fixing that. What a terrible thread, F*** me for even posting in it.
Lol, I know. Shame on me for even getting involved. Some people will never change their minds no matter how much evidence is stacked up against them. I was baited by the OP and the 2nd poster, I just couldn't keep myself from taking the hook. I mean, you can't really argue that Rudock is better than CJ at anything in the college game, but better NFL potential? That's an argument I never thought I'd hear from even the biggest Rudock supporters. It was too much for me to withstand.
Why the obsession over Jake?...he's having a great season with better OLine pass protection, and likely a better QB coach in Harbaugh. Jake will have to prove his worth over the next two weeks...Harbaugh says he looks like an NFL QB...maybe just coach speak, but it's good enough for me. CJ is special...Jake is improving.
After his 3 INT performance vs Utah, I was pissed we didn't just go with Shane, and let him throw INTs if it was to be a heart breaking season.
That was then.
The kid has grown in his time with Harbaugh. If Smith and Johnson could stay healthy, we would really be kicking on offense. Both of our 5 star RBs appear to be busts. So we don't have anyone really to roll with currently. Jake Butt would be 1st round talent, at TE, if he gets better at blocking. Like the entire O line, Michigan hasn't known how to block, but are actually learning this year. Many bad habits to overcome.
But as far as the topic
Jake went from 3 INTs in his first game, after practicing a month, to very rarely throwing one, and looking stout 9 games into the season. For a rental year, I am pretty damn happy all things considered. People give Ferentz a lot of crap, yet when push comes to shove, he helped Michigan out so that one of his players could get another year in. Class move.
Only thing I'll say is iowa's current running game would not be as good with rudock at QB. We talked about this a lot last year but evidently most still don't understand how a defense feels threats or doesn't.
I agree with you that I do not think Jake has NFL potential because of his arm strength. However, I don't understand the obsessed hatred many seem to have for him. He's been a good college football QB for the past 3 years.
I don't think there's any doubt that CJ is the better QB, but excuse me if I don't hate Rudock so much that I will completely dismiss the production he has had in college.
This thread has been pretty typical in terms of those who seem to like Jake and those who hate him.
Supporters: Rudock is actually a pretty good QB, but CJ is better.
Haters: No! Rudock sucks!
Supporters: Not according to objective stats (list of objective stats).
Haters: Those mean nothing, he has a weak arm and is a terrible leader.
Of course there's no way for any of us to measure his leadership, but his old teammates seem to like him, as do his new teammates.
I am about as big of a supporter of Rudock there is, and here are my bold claims:
- Rudock is a pretty good college QB
- CJ Beathard is clearly a better QB
- Rudock will likely not make an NFL roster, but crazier things have happened
- Rudock has below average arm strength
Now tell me, which one of those claims is unreasonable? The "haters" claim Rudock is a terrible QB (despite his on-field production), they say he is a quitter (for leaving a program that essentially said they don't need him and a fan base that apparently hated him), is a poor leader, could never make a big play or comeback, has absolutely no chance in the NFL, and the biggest kicker of them all is that many seem to still hate Kirk and want him fired for even starting Rudock last year, even though Kirk has produced a team that is currently 10-0 and ranked 5th in the country.
I would love to hear how my bold claims are more extreme than the views expressed by the fans that hate Rudock.
Pat Narduzzi, defensive guru, said that CJB makes defenses play honest because he can do damage anywhere on the field.
CJ has had a positive effect on the running game, no doubt; however, I don't think this is a profound effect outside of his ability to rush for positive yards himself. This year we have been effective at running the ball even against 8 or 9 man fronts. This has been exemplified by Canzeri salting the game away against Illinois when they knew we were going to run it, and how Daniels helped win the game against Minnesota when they also knew we were going to run.
Yes, having a strong-armed QB helps loosen up defenses, but we've been much better than last year running the ball against defensive packages designed specifically to stop the run. I don't think that is really debatable, and that lands outside the scope of comparing Rudock to CJ.
Moreover, aside from Jake, the favorite whipping boy among Iowa fans was Mark Weisman. For fans that hated both, you surely aren't going to explain this year's improvements in the running game based solely on the fact that CJ replaced Jake, are you?
Scott Tolzein is the backup QB in Green Bay. Read his strengths and weaknesses in the link below and see if it is much different than Rudock's traits.
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/scott-tolzien?id=2495425
ANALYSIS
STRENGTHS
Takes care of the football. Checks down and throws the ball away. Displays the ability to move to his second and third options. Accurate in the short passing game. Gets rid of the ball on time on three-step drops. Flashes the ability to climb the pocket. Outstanding intangibles and leadership skills.
WEAKNESSES
Below average size measureables. Lacks the arm strength to drive the ball downfield into tight spots. Deep-ball accuracy is below average. Has a hitch in his delivery at times on intermediate-to-deep pass attempts. Doesn't possess the athleticism to consistently avoid rushers or pick up yards with his feet.
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/scott-tolzien?id=2495425
ANALYSIS
STRENGTHS
Takes care of the football. Checks down and throws the ball away. Displays the ability to move to his second and third options. Accurate in the short passing game. Gets rid of the ball on time on three-step drops. Flashes the ability to climb the pocket. Outstanding intangibles and leadership skills.
WEAKNESSES
Below average size measureables. Lacks the arm strength to drive the ball downfield into tight spots. Deep-ball accuracy is below average. Has a hitch in his delivery at times on intermediate-to-deep pass attempts. Doesn't possess the athleticism to consistently avoid rushers or pick up yards with his feet.
what's not to like? he's slow and has a weak arm. has a tendency to make awkward plays that uncoordinated people make. that right there is a recipe for a nice long NFL career, right?
It doesn't have to be he was a star or a dud.
I found Jake to be an OK game manager without significantly distinguishing physical skills.
My main beef has always been with Ferentz sticking with a guy to a fault. It's obvious now that CJ should have gotten more time on the field last year.
As for the NFL, stranger things have happened. Perfect example of the generic wisky QBs that they've had (outside of Russell Wilson's one year) that Tolzien hangs around as a backup. Jake fits that mold.
I found Jake to be an OK game manager without significantly distinguishing physical skills.
My main beef has always been with Ferentz sticking with a guy to a fault. It's obvious now that CJ should have gotten more time on the field last year.
As for the NFL, stranger things have happened. Perfect example of the generic wisky QBs that they've had (outside of Russell Wilson's one year) that Tolzien hangs around as a backup. Jake fits that mold.
He didn't play badly today . . . 19/32 for 263 yards and a TD. He was let down by the complete absence of a running game, which allowed OSU to tee off on him and finally knock him out.
Can you think of any reasons why the OSU defense sold out against your run game?
Maybe, just maaaaybe, they did not respect your QB to beat them.
Shocking defensive game plan considering our program saw such monster programs such as Ball State and a 2-10 ISU squad effectively employ this game plan and completely shut down our offense last year.
what's not to like? he's slow and has a weak arm. has a tendency to make awkward plays that uncoordinated people make. that right there is a recipe for a nice long NFL career, right?
I'm sorry, but at the end of the day, Jake quit. He didn't mind CJ sitting the bench behind him, but when faced with doing the same (and who knows, if CJ gets hurt he is right back to being the starter) he QUIT on his team -- and then goes to a hated rival. That's not what a Hawkeye at heart does.
In my book, I've never heard of the guy -- Jake who?
Only saw Jake in 1st half of Michigan-OSU game. Jake was improved vs what he did at Iowa..more willing to tuck and run, more willing to hang in pocket and make a pass to the chains instead of dumping off short and punting. My problem with Rudock at Iowa was he rarely made big plays---i.e. he was not a playmaker...Beathard has definitely made a lot more plays that make you say wow.
It truly was win-win for Michigan and Iowa. Jake wasn't going to like sitting on bench and would have been distraction. Beathard is clearly better fit for Iowa and more upside and has another year.
I don't think Iowa's poor showing last year was Rudock. We didn't play much defense last year and our run game was too much of our fullback RB Weismann.
They didn't sell out against the run. Michigan's running game is just not very good. Our leading rusher (De'Veon Smith) has about 600 yards on the season. We've basically had no conventional run game all season, and have relied on end-arounds and various gadget plays to manufacture ground yardage.
Jake had a huge November. He passed for over 1,200 yards in those four games. If he had not stepped up his game in that final month we'd be probably 6-6. (In the first two months of the season, we relied on defense and special teams to carry us, but our defensive line was hit hard by injuries and was much less effective in the final games.) He was basically a game manager over the first two months but in the last four games he made a lot of plays, hitting receivers in tight windows.
Not sure why you're bashing the guy - he represented your school for four years, has never said anything bad about Iowa since he's come here, and it seems like his transfer was a win-win for all involved.
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I prefer that Iowa be stacked at every position, or at least the key positions, like the blue bloods. But you keep building that stairway to heaven with your altruistic thoughts.
