Jason Whitlock Nails It!

[MemorialRedWarrior]

I have to throw the flag.

A lot of influential white dudes have been killed by other white dudes too.

Yes, but white America was never at the behest of black America. They killed one of their very own, simply due to disagreeing with each other. At least that is the narrative.
Killing one of your very own, especially one with the influence of Malcolm X, is a sign of barbarism. To me it is a very clear and real example of how black communities are for some reason handicapped to becoming truly cohesive.

 

[22*43*51]

Yes, but white America was never at the behest of black America. They killed one of their very own, simply due to disagreeing with each other. At least that is the narrative.
Killing one of your very own, especially one with the influence of Malcolm X, is a sign of barbarism. To me it is a very clear and real example of how black communities are for some reason handicapped to becoming truly cohesive.

I'm just saying that there are a lot of examples that can be made and cited.

That one is not the strongest.

 

[aflachawk]

That's an excellent article.

The one flaw is attaching the conservative/liberal label to various people or groups. By resorting to generic labels he commits the same "crime" that others do when they use a word like ******. People see the label and tune out what he says. It does not add to the point he is making and leads the very people he is trying to influence to discount his opinion.

Excellent point. Labels and names we call each other shut down discourse. The sad thing Tomb is that's exactly what many are aiming to do

 

[MemorialRedWarrior]

I'm just saying that there are a lot of examples that can be made and cited.

That one is not the strongest.

Fair enough. The real tragedy in all of this, was that young man that was lured and killed. This would be a great time for Obama to make a statement. Imagine how powerful him coming out and speaking against this, and addressing the violence problems within the black community would be.
Why as the first black President in America, would he not do this? This is the time to send a message to everyone. Is his chosen party holding him back from doing this? What is it that keeps Obama from making a very real and effective move to help end these types of situations?
The author of the article couldn't have been more correct in everything he said in my opinion. Obama is the ultimate example of that.

 

[MemorialRedWarrior]

Excellent point. Labels and names we call each other shut down discourse. The sad thing Tomb is that's exactly what many are aiming to do

How then would he go about the article without mentioning those things? How does he have a truthful discussion without adding in those words?

 

[wyohawk]

You know what is funny is that the death of Malcolm X was a premonition of what was to come.

Who is mostly in control of those areas? Republicans or Democrats? What about 69% of black youth being without their fathers? What about the self promotion of gangster pride, shooting, degrading women, and focusing ONLY on money in their chosen preference music, that is guess what? Promoted, created, and sold by them. Are you also going to claim that 'white governance' is automatically white oppression? The getting paid as well as their counterparts is BS, by the way. Companies can lose lots more money by making practice of that. I've also seen very legit firings, suddenly turned into racial bigotry on multiple occasions. What about Baltimore? New Orleans? Detroit? Memphis? All cities ran by black governance. What do you have to say about that?

So you are in fact one of these white people that claim that black people are still slaves? Ask Barack Obama what he thinks of that. Colin Powell, 70% of the NFL, my black general manager, etc, etc.

Again, you dodged my question. What is your experience with the black community.

My personal experience is irrelevant here. But, for the record, I am white and live in a diverse, historically working-class neighborhood near downtown Durham, NC; a city which, through progressive and often minority-led leadership, has come a long way towards equal rights and decreased violence in the last decade.

But, back to the point at hand, I feel as if you examined the root causes of all of the "symptoms" that black communities are responsible for their own problems, you'll find a different story. Why do you think many children are without fathers (hint: massive racially disproportionate incarceration)? Why do you think gangster culture is rampant (hint: a record of law and policing not being on the side of residents)? Why do you think "self-promotion" in the form of music is so successful (hint: it resonates within the culture and is often seen as one of the only "honest" enterprises to better one's position)? It's easy to think having black people in positions of power would be helpful, and it probably is to an extent. But how is having a black mayor going to affect a school board intent on promoting de facto segregation via districts, a state-mandated court system that convicts or acquits based upon the level of legal counsel its defendants can afford, or an often "capitalism-based" planning system that places a high proportion of unsavory (or toxic) developmental "necessities" in low-income neighborhoods while simultaneously ignoring proximity to fresh food or affordable, responsive health care.

It's funny you bring up President Obama- his experience in black communities far surpasses mine and he has lots of important ideas about this that you should listen to.

 

[aflachawk]

How then would he go about the article without mentioning those things? How does he have a truthful discussion without adding in those words?

Do you honestly think it's not possible to write about the positions or attitudes of various groups without political labels?

 

[MemorialRedWarrior]

Do you honestly think it's not possible to write about the positions or attitudes of various groups without political labels?

Of course it is possible. Is purposely leaving out important and corroborative details a good strategy to relaying ones point? I understand your point that by using certain words you automatically dissuade a certain audience. I can only ask that in this case, is he wrong? If he is, then the article is partially corrupted. If he is correct, then why hold back? It is his fault that the audience, guided by their biased opinions, may ignore what he says?

 

[HawktimusPrime]

My personal experience is irrelevant here. But, for the record, I am white and live in a diverse, historically working-class neighborhood near downtown Durham, NC; a city which, through progressive and often minority-led leadership, has come a long way towards equal rights and decreased violence in the last decade.

But, back to the point at hand, I feel as if you examined the root causes of all of the "symptoms" that black communities are responsible for their own problems, you'll find a different story. Why do you think many children are without fathers (hint: massive racially disproportionate incarceration)? Why do you think gangster culture is rampant (hint: a record of law and policing not being on the side of residents)? Why do you think "self-promotion" in the form of music is so successful (hint: it resonates within the culture and is often seen as one of the only "honest" enterprises to better one's position)? It's easy to think having black people in positions of power would be helpful, and it probably is to an extent. But how is having a black mayor going to affect a school board intent on promoting de facto segregation via districts, a state-mandated court system that convicts or acquits based upon the level of legal counsel its defendants can afford, or an often "capitalism-based" planning system that places a high proportion of unsavory (or toxic) developmental "necessities" in low-income neighborhoods while simultaneously ignoring proximity to fresh food or affordable, responsive health care.

It's funny you bring up President Obama- his experience in black communities far surpasses mine and he has lots of important ideas about this that you should listen to.

What I underlined, You lost me right there. You're using BS public narrative to make excuses. Stop selling drugs, killing other black people, and finding ways to get put in jail. You also make a big assumption that the entire 69% of all missing fathers is because they are in jail.

Basically what you're saying is that black communities are helpless and naive children who can't help but be led into these lives. You're making excuses for him. Obama has ideas on this? What are they then? Because he sure as hell isn't practicing any of these ideas. Maybe you need to quit relying on 'ideas, and start having he balls to take in the harsh truth.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that the gangster culture is easily one of the major talking problems, and it's not because white people are encouraging them to act like that. If they are unable to realize the futility of that culture, which they do realize by the way, then that is like calling them dumb children. They know, they just don't care. It's not hard to understand that living that lifestyle is less safe and sane than living a lifestyle that doesn't involve such violence.

What else does america need to do for them? More welfare? More free phones? More free housing? When does it ever fall on the shoulders of black american to handle their own problems? You're saying that they are incapable of doing it? You're saying that without white help, they will never achieve that? Are you saying that it takes a white community to fix a black community? This isn't the 1960's anymore dude.

Why do you see them as such victims? Why do you blame one guy shooting another black guy on white people?

 

[MemorialRedWarrior]

My personal experience is irrelevant here. But, for the record, I am white and live in a diverse, historically working-class neighborhood near downtown Durham, NC; a city which, through progressive and often minority-led leadership, has come a long way towards equal rights and decreased violence in the last decade.

But, back to the point at hand, I feel as if you examined the root causes of all of the "symptoms" that black communities are responsible for their own problems, you'll find a different story. Why do you think many children are without fathers (hint: massive racially disproportionate incarceration)? Why do you think gangster culture is rampant (hint: a record of law and policing not being on the side of residents)? Why do you think "self-promotion" in the form of music is so successful (hint: it resonates within the culture and is often seen as one of the only "honest" enterprises to better one's position)? It's easy to think having black people in positions of power would be helpful, and it probably is to an extent. But how is having a black mayor going to affect a school board intent on promoting de facto segregation via districts, a state-mandated court system that convicts or acquits based upon the level of legal counsel its defendants can afford, or an often "capitalism-based" planning system that places a high proportion of unsavory (or toxic) developmental "necessities" in low-income neighborhoods while simultaneously ignoring proximity to fresh food or affordable, responsive health care.

It's funny you bring up President Obama- his experience in black communities far surpasses mine and he has lots of important ideas about this that you should listen to.

Interesting points, how though does this relate to white Americans? I am confused by the way as to whether you are blaming white americans for this. If I am wrong then correct me.
What would you like to see more of? What would you like to see less of? What steps do you think need to be taken to start in correcting the criteria you have written about here?

 

[wyohawk]

What I underlined, You lost me right there. You're using BS public narrative to make excuses. Stop selling drugs, killing other black people, and finding ways to get put in jail. You also make a big assumption that the entire 69% of all missing fathers is because they are in jail.

Basically what you're saying is that black communities are helpless and naive children who can't help but be led into these lives. You're making excuses for him. Obama has ideas on this? What are they then? Because he sure as hell isn't practicing any of these ideas. Maybe you need to quit relying on 'ideas, and start having he balls to take in the harsh truth.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that the gangster culture is easily one of the major talking problems, and it's not because white people are encouraging them to act like that. If they are unable to realize the futility of that culture, which they do realize by the way, then that is like calling them dumb children. They know, they just don't care. It's not hard to understand that living that lifestyle is less safe and sane than living a lifestyle that doesn't involve such violence.

What else does america need to do for them? More welfare? More free phones? More free housing? When does it ever fall on the shoulders of black american to handle their own problems? You're saying that they are incapable of doing it? You're saying that without white help, they will never achieve that? Are you saying that it takes a white community to fix a black community? This isn't the 1960's anymore dude.

Why do you see them as such victims? Why do you blame one guy shooting another black guy on white people?

Yikes.
I didn't realize how easy it all was and how you obviously have it all under control.
I hope for your sake you never have to talk with a black person about this. If you live in Iowa, you're probably safe I suppose.

 

[HawktimusPrime]

Yikes.
I didn't realize how easy it all was and how you obviously have it all under control.
I hope for your sake you never have to talk with a black person about this. If you live in Iowa, you're probably safe I suppose.

Yeah, I've lived in St Louis, Newport News area Va, and Oakland CA. I'll be fine. I have spoken about this with many black people and they agree with me. What you are missing out on is that YOU are the one being racist here.

 

[wyohawk]

Interesting points, how though does this relate to white Americans? I am confused by the way as to whether you are blaming white americans for this. If I am wrong then correct me.
What would you like to see more of? What would you like to see less of? What steps do you think need to be taken to start in correcting the criteria you have written about here?

In my mind, the only blame to be placed on the majority (up until recently white Americans) is ignorance and continually trying to put cost-effective "band-aids" on issues without delving deeper into root causes. We live in a capitalist society that has been very profitable to many Americans, but has been traditionally skewed towards the concerns of those with capital (both economically and politically), which in our case has been white people since about 1776.

I obviously don't have answers or solutions to these questions but the key is to at least consider them, acknowledge that differences exist in opportunity and access to upward mobility, and find ways to further integrate and empower, rather than resorting to lazy generalizations, victim-blaming, and borderline anthropological racism.

 

[wyohawk]

Yeah, I've lived in St Louis, Newport News area Va, and Oakland CA. I'll be fine. I have spoken about this with many black people and they agree with me. What you are missing out on is that YOU are the one being racist here.

That was a quick, hostile response and I do take a step back and apologize.

I think the difference between our perspectives is that you see each person's life decisions as choices to be made in a vacuum, whereas I see them as the product of their environment. I don't blame white people for when a black person shoots another black person, but I do blame the system in which it occurs, which, by and large, is a result of a long ruling history of white male capitalists.

 

[HawktimusPrime]

That was a quick, hostile response and I do take a step back and apologize.

I think the difference between our perspectives is that you see each person's life decisions as choices to be made in a vacuum, whereas I see them as the product of their environment. I don't blame white people for when a black person shoots another black person, but I do blame the system in which it occurs, which, by and large, is a result of a long ruling history of white male capitalists.

Passive aggressiveness often breeds hostility. Choices come from both the vacuum and the environment. That system you speak of works against everyone along with the black communities. If you see higher percentages of something, in a certain area though, then you have to conclude that there is a problem besides just the system.

Blaming Capitalism? In the era of the black billionaire and millionaires? I'd have to think that many of those people wouldn't like that accusation.