And my reply is that you contradict your statement with the sentence you posted and I have now referenced directly to you twice. You cannot speak out of both sides of your mouth on the issue and then conveniently claim to be correct.
KU vs Clones
- Thread starter QChawks
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And my reply is that you contradict your statement with the sentence you posted and I have now referenced directly to you twice. You cannot speak out of both sides of your mouth on the issue and then conveniently claim to be correct.
No, it was a statement. Made by you. Someone claiming to be so superior in the art of communicating should be able to recognize that.
The argument about who is or isn't a "basketball" school or a "football" school is a frivolous one. Generally speaking, this is a claim made by fan bases who have traditionally sported very poor teams in one sport or the other. It's a way of compensating or taking the sting off of traditionally sucking in for example football at Indiana or basketball at Nebraska. In short, it's a loser's mentality.
Although I will be unintentionally lending credence to the heart of this debate by this last comment, Iowa State probably can't be considered a traditional "basketball" school (like say an Indiana or a Kansas or a Duke) because they have no tradition or history of ever being a national powerhouse. Good? Sure. On the cusp or flirting with potential greatness over the last few years? Perhaps. But no Final Fours, one Elite 8 appearance, and a handful of Sweet 16 appearances in 50 years of basketball doesn't translate into being a blue blood in basketball.
Although I will be unintentionally lending credence to the heart of this debate by this last comment, Iowa State probably can't be considered a traditional "basketball" school (like say an Indiana or a Kansas or a Duke) because they have no tradition or history of ever being a national powerhouse. Good? Sure. On the cusp or flirting with potential greatness over the last few years? Perhaps. But no Final Fours, one Elite 8 appearance, and a handful of Sweet 16 appearances in 50 years of basketball doesn't translate into being a blue blood in basketball.
Spin it any which way you care to now, clonewithagroan... it will not change. You made a fully opinionated statement as if it were fact.
Where were you in early October to chastise the isu fans pointing to isu's lofty status as an anticipated final four team? Did we miss your now sudden onset wisdom that you want others to believe you apply uniformly?
You and LC (and a few of the others) should really be in the 'spin' business. The demand is great right now (high political season) and your talking in circles would be great entertainment for others than just the few here on HR.
To be accurate, isu has a final four to its credit.... somewhere back in the 40's perhaps when the tourney was a much smaller event.
Yep, it is spin because I would know where someone is seeded and should be rated. You got me.
Hence why I said in the last 50 years. Does anyone care about Minnesota's greatness in football during the Depression/World War II era?
Some of you haters must lead a miserable life all you think of is the negative. You sure seem to get a lot of mileage out of that UAB loss last year. ISU shouldn't have lost however their coach had understudied with (either Roy Williams or Larry Brown I forget which and isn't worth looking it up again) for 15 years so I imagine he gave the UAB former Kansas player some tips. I personally did not see the game but I don't waste time on seeking out Iowa's embarrassing losses to teams they should not lose to. So petty and childlike.
And to answer the question if the win over Iowa was included in Iowa's 21 wins over ranked teams in the last 3 years (actually isn't only the last 2 years plus this season to date). No it is not because Iowa was not ranked when they lost to Iowa State in December. Iowa State has 21 wins and 8 losses during that time. If you are interested in trying to disprove it you can go to the ESPN.com basketball schedule for ISU and do the math for your self. It takes just a tad more research as the games that are played in the NCAA tournament list the opponents by their seed so I had to go back to the AP Top 25 rankings for the ranking to get proof the teams ISU beat in the NCAA tournament were ranked when they played them. They were 9-3 over ranked teams in the 2013-2014 season, 9-4 in 2014-2015 season and 3-1 thus far this season with a lot more ranked opponents in the last half of the conference season where they will face at least 6 more ranked teams before the conference tournament even begins..
Iowa has done well thus far this year against ranked teams going 5-2 but they were 5-12 against ranked teams the two years previous giving them a combined record in that time frame at 10-14. I don't know who your are trying to convince that Iowa is better than ISU in men's basketball in the Fran era. I wouldn't be posting these comparisons if you would be real and give as much credit to the ISU men's as Iowa should have if Iowa held a 5-1 record over ISU since Fran came. It really isn't difficult to give credit where credit is due instead of trying to make your opponent out as inferior when in fact you haven't had success with them. Might try playing nice you might like it and that doesn't just apply to 5Fan5.
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You are again equating basketball success to being a basketball school. That is not the case. The point about Florida is valid because they have success and are not a basketball school. Just like Duke is having success in Football and they are not a football school.
This is hilarious coming from a Clown. Go to CyFan. There are still a ton of Clone fans who still cannot admit that Iowa is even good this year. Weak schedule....Big Ten sucks....Lucky....blah, blah blah. At least the majority of Iowa fans are willing to give some props to the success that ISU has enjoyed the past few years. We just don't believe they have have been nearly as good as they think they are, and the NCAA results bear that out.
good call yippee, ISU is the only team to ever have an early exit in March.
Who cares about final four hype or not. It's not like ISU still can't make the final four. Hell about 20 teams can this year.
Iowa has done well thus far this year against ranked teams going 5-2 but they were 5-12 against ranked teams the two years previous giving them a combined record in that time frame at 10-14. I don't know who your are trying to convince that Iowa is better than ISU in men's basketball in the Fran era. I wouldn't be posting these comparisons if you would be real and give as much credit to the ISU men's as Iowa should have if Iowa held a 5-1 record over ISU since Fran came. It really isn't difficult to give credit where credit is due instead of trying to make your opponent out as inferior when in fact you haven't had success with them. Might try playing nice you might like it and that doesn't just apply to 5Fan5.
I read these boards quite frequently and can not once recall an Iowa fan making the claim that Iowa has been better than Iowa State in basketball during the Fran era. What I think most Iowa fans would repudiate is that Iowa State became some sort of blue blood, national powerhouse basketball program under Hoiberg, as many Iowa State fans who come flocking to this board in droves under a thick cloak of delusion try to substantiate. Clearly, for whatever reason(s), they are seeking some sort of validation from Iowa fans that is still a mystery to me (I can not speak to you or your reasons for rendering input).
Since most Iowa fans openly admit that Steve Alford began the digging process that led to Todd Lickliter moving Iowa basketball into the cellar (and are merely excited about the direction Fran is taking the program), I see no reason for your long-winded diatribe beyond an apparent need to boost your self-esteem. Oh, and since you like to dwell in the realm of facts and statistics here are a few fun ones for you:
During Iowa State's brief flirtation with the prospect of becoming a Top 10 program under Hoiberg the following are true:
Fred Hoiberg won as many regular season conference titles in the Big XII as Todd Lickliter did in the B1G 10: Zero
Fred Hoiberg won 2 conference tournament championships in his tenure at Iowa State. The same number of B1G 10 tournament championships that Alford won while at Iowa.
Fred Hoiberg's deepest tournament run was the Sweet 16. A feat Dr. Tom Davis accomplished in his lame duck year.
Thanks for dropping by. Toodles!
I read these boards quite frequently and can not once recall an Iowa fan making the claim that Iowa has been better than Iowa State in basketball during the Fran era. What I think most Iowa fans would repudiate is that Iowa State became some sort of blue blood, national powerhouse basketball program under Hoiberg, as many Iowa State fans who come flocking to this board in droves under a thick cloak of delusion try to substantiate. Clearly, for whatever reason(s), they are seeking some sort of validation from Iowa fans that is still a mystery to me (I can not speak to you or your reasons for rendering input).
Since most Iowa fans openly admit that Steve Alford began the digging process that led to Todd Lickliter moving Iowa basketball into the cellar (and are merely excited about the direction Fran is taking the program), I see no reason for your long-winded diatribe beyond an apparent need to boost your self-esteem. Oh, and since you like to dwell in the realm of facts and statistics here are a few fun ones for you:
During Iowa State's brief flirtation with the prospect of becoming a Top 10 program under Hoiberg the following are true:
Fred Hoiberg won as many regular season conference titles in the Big XII as Todd Lickliter did in the B1G 10: Zero
Fred Hoiberg won 2 conference tournament championships in his tenure at Iowa State. The same number of B1G 10 tournament championships that Alford won while at Iowa.
Fred Hoiberg's deepest tournament run was the Sweet 16. A feat Dr. Tom Davis accomplished in his lame duck year.
Thanks for dropping by. Toodles!
Fred Hoiberg won 2 conference tournament championships in his tenure at Iowa State. The same number of B1G 10 tournament championships that Alford won while at Iowa
^ ^ You failed to mention that Alford won his two Big 10 tournaments in 8 years, not 5.
And about ISU's deepest tournament run was the Sweet 16. We'll never know what might have been but Niang broke his foot in the opening round game but they won that game as well as the game against North Carolina in the next game which probably even surprised a lot of Cyclone fans. They then lost in the Sweet 16 to Connecticut who went on to be the 2014 champions. I forget how many NCAA games did Iowa win that yea as I couldn't find that information anywhere?
The same thing happened in 2012 they beat the 2011 NCAA champion Connecticut team in the opening round. No player was injured so no excuse but that put them up against the eventual champion Kentucky Wild Cats in the second game which they lost. No shame in that.
I don't think any ISU fans would try to claim the Cyclones are blue bloods if they do they are as misguided as many Hawkeye fans who do nothing but ridicule anything Cyclone. Apparently you haven't read many threads here.
I think you would save your self a lot of frustration if you went some place besides a Hawkeye message board seeking validation for the Cyclones. I was poking fun with those stats. Relax.
When was Iowa's last sweet 16? Had to be over 20 years ago since you went 15 without even winning a game.
One sweet sixteen in 17 years, we're totes a basketball school using Clone fan logic!
