Lugo & Jayden out of WTT?
- Thread starter rider57
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But seriously, when is this stand alone getting built? I give a fair amount and they send no one? Kind of irritating to me.
DeSanto has proven he can beat the best at the weight the first time they wrestle. Not once they feel him and figure him out. If he makes it to the finals and wrestles someone for the first time, I like his odds.
Ferrari wrestled all of his opponents that way from the quarters on. There’s a difference between the final score and what goes on during a wrestling match. Their match was a 3-2 score but completely controlled by Ferrari. Plenty of upside in year 5 of the program? I won’t say it’s impossible to make a big jump in your fifth year, but it’s not likely.
Your point with both wrestlers is valid. My point with Warner is not with how much growth he can have within the program, but rather how much growth he can have physically and mentally if last seasons results flipped the proverbial switch in his mind. I am not a Hawk insider, but I have known a few people within the program the last several years and based off of their opinions Warner was not a hard worker. He put little to no time on improving himself physically. According them them he was also not mental warrior (to me this is harder to fix or improve, but you definitely don't improve it if you don't spend time working on it). It is my opinion that if Warner poured time into improving these deficiencies he definitely could make the leap necessary to turn a 2-3 "controlled loss" into a victory. So I remain in the camp that says it is possible for Warner to be considered in that list of 7 that was given above. He was not getting dominated by anyone like Cass did by Parris.
I think we both probably agree on DeSanto, although I probably hold out a little more hope in him being able to win those matches again.
My belief is that college wrestling should be about college wrestling. Let the kids focus off one thing at at time. They can compete in freestyle when they are finished with their college careers, so I agree that the NCAA tourney is more important to Tom Brands and staff and the kids on the team AT THIS TIME. Also, I am guessing that Tom is encouraged to perform well as a college team and his WTT performance is not mentioned in his contract anywhere.
Also, lets face it- who does the HWC have on its roster that has a legit chance at making a world team this year or in the next 5? I can only think of one. Let them wrestle folk style and enjoy it and excel at it. There will be 15,000 crazy, screaming, wild fans at Carver this year rooting for the Hawks (If the administration doesn't go all Covid fear crazy). A good product needs to be put out there. They (the 15,000 fans) won't be at the WTTs.
I see your point. I would tell you two had a shot to make the team. Lee (who is injured so I guess maybe we don't include him) and Jayden. Is Jayden likely to make the team? No, but did he have a shot? He sure does.
The problem with a lot of this is that the top notch blue chippers have goals that go above college. They want to see an active, successful freestyle club. We’ll have to wait and see how the success of NLWC, and almost complete nonexistence of the HWC, impacts the next couple years of recruits, but you can guarantee that the top tier recruits are watching what the RTC/clubs are doing very closely.
Now, I have to imagine that the coaches see this as a short term problem. Spencer could very well win a world title next year. Then I think you have some of the young guys that could make the Junior team (Ayala, Henson). I think Eierman will be competitive on the Senior Circuit for a while. The narrative could shift completely after next freestyle season, however that is very contingent on Spencer’s health.
All very valid points, I do think the Hawkeye coaching staff is using your bottom paragraph as their selling point. They are probably also adding in DeSanto being a threat at 61, Lugo with Jayden, Bull & Kem, Warner, and Cass. They have Assad and the young guys you already mentioned coming as well. That is also what the Hawkeye faithful are banking on. But it's a bad look IMO to not be at any of the senior circuit events, meanwhile NLWC is sending multiple people to the Olympics including an ex-Hawk.
Love Eirman calling Pat Mineo out on the twitter
That's a recent history bad take. Elite recruits want to know that they'll get to compete in FS while they're still competing collegiately. No Hawks at the WTT is not a good look, but also entirely explainable. Like Jaydin said, there are 2 guys on the U23 team. But don't think for a second that Spencer not competing in any FS tournaments since he's arrived is not a negative recruiting pitch that isn't being used against Iowa.
Just for facts sake, Spencer won Senior Nationals. But I believe that is the only 1 he entered.
I’ll bet $100 to WFL that Cass beats Parris at least once this season.
If there is $ exchanging hands, I would prefer it to go in my pocket. If you want to make a personal bet, I would be glad to take that bet and glad to lose it.
I like our guy! I believe BIG Cass made a jump physically and I’m looking forward to him making you eat your words.
I’m not so sure. Spencer has had nagging health issues most of his career at Iowa. And most everyone knows that. I think the idea of Spencer negatively influencing potential Iowa recruits for any reason is off. As is the current focus on WTT and the comparison to upcoming college season.
Get a life, looser. Lol j/k
You're also failing to think about the fact that Spencer has barely been healthy throughout his time here, and the one time he was completely (minus an acl) healthy he entered and won senior nationals.
That screams to me that if he had been healthy he would have been wrestling in much more freestyle tournaments.
Also, our coaches have always put the wrestlers and their best individual interests above the team.
If it was in our guy's best interest to wrestle at WTT's, you can bet that they would be there.
If you don't believe that, then frankly you aren't worth arguing with.
If it was in our guy's best interest to wrestle at WTT's, you can bet that they would be there.
If you don't believe that, then frankly you aren't worth arguing with.
No, but I can see your point. Anyway I really love this thread and cannot wait till the cage is opened this season.
I also will be watching the WTT trials this weekend.
Ouch.
You're right. But don't think for a second that that isn't being used against Iowa. That TnT overtrain the guys.
You're not listening. It's not me. I'm sure TnT will always do what's best for the athletes. and 2 summers ago when they focused on folk more? Hey, it was smart.
I'm simply stating the truth. The optics don't look good. The HWC doesn't look good right now. And yeah, I've heard from multiple persons who's opinion we should care about. I'm sure that its a case-by-case basis, but the adage that Iowa won't let guys compete until after they graduate is a tool that has been used against us in the past, and with our lack of guys at the WTT, it's being wielded again. (and I don't mean by Pat Mineo)
I just hope that TnT are being more proactive than they have been in the past and communicating with recruits, hey, that isn't real, here's what's really going on.
I love to see Iowa win, as long it isn't against MU. I see 125, 141, 165 (though NCCA track record suggests otherwise), 174 as potential finalists or champs. Not sure Warner makes the jump, although he did look different at the Iowa team camp this summer. Cass definitely looked a lot more svelte, for lack of a better term. I really hope he can do it, but HWT seems to have the biggest separation from the top 2 to everyone else.
i am sure that our guys would take a bullet for tnt and same for tnt and their guys, i don't think carol is out for anyone but hisself. i hope recruits are smart enough to understand this.
Big Ten tournament isn’t until March. Seems like plenty of time.
But, he actually IS an NCAA Champion. I am pretty sure it was Iowa and NOT PSU that won the NCAA Team Title last season. Is that not correct?
The best kids definitely have dreams going beyond college. That being said, having them focus on college first and then freestyle afterwards is a very good option. The problem that Iowa is having is they do not have as much post college success at the PSU guys are now having.
If HWC was tearing things up, then the Iowa way would be the preferred way. So are they not tearing it up because they are not going to tournaments or do they not have the personnel to win at the next level? I am sure it is being used a negative pitch against Iowa, but Iowa could also use it as a positive pitch - if they can start having success at the world level.
Cornell could sell almost anything to a kid recently with Dale and Yanni. Having the personnel to pull off wins on the big world stage wins is what makes your sale pitch effective. Other than Lee, the HWC has not had much to crow about (Gilman a few years back was a great success story for the Hawks as was Ramos and Dan Dennis) If they have more of those then the Iowa way of concentrate on folk style in college and freestyle afterwards will be a great sales pitch.
He did win the US Open, so one could argue that he is actually succeeding at his goal.
Not even remotely. It's kind of like saying I came to Hollywood to win an Academy Award, not get laid by beautiful star struck women. If you get nominated, but fall just short, you sure as hell are NOT failing if that type of getting laid is a by-product!!!
Dale. I love it.
Also. You're not going to get the elite recruits that way. Kyle Snyder killed that for everyone. While I believe it will be a while before a recruit can command a Snyder-like FS schedule during the season - you best believe that elite recruits want to be on FS World Teams. And if you don't get on that train, don't go looking for the elite recruits.
Look at Missouri, it's no surprise that their recent love-affair with FS has led to getting some recruits they normally wouldn't have had a chance at. It's fine if you want to be a Folk-for-Four and then FS college team. But you won't be getting the blue chippers. Obviously, this next quad is huge for the HWC. You'll be graduating an entire title team, all of whom have or want to have FS accolades.
This is NOT true. Yes, it will be harder to get access to all the blue chippers, but there are PLENTY that will happily go to Iowa without a fully focused Freestyle plan. In fact, there will ALWAYS be blue chippers that are NOT fans of the International Styles.
With that said, there will be Albatrosses like Snyder and Steveson who you won't get without a full plan for International, but I don't believe Iowa wouldn't address that with the right recruits. Lee was absolutely recruited with the mindset to wrestle Freestyle, but injuries got in the way.
Iowa isn't going to sacrifice its NCAA success for the HWC, but they will use the HWC to supplement their NCAA success when the situation demands it!
Well it turns out Gable S will be wrestling for the gophers this season, crazy how HWT is highlight class these days and I love it!
Sorry man. This is just no longer true. If you're talking blue chippers, you're talking guys who compete and are winning Cadet Trials and then winning world medals. They all talk about winning world medals. When you say "PLENTY" - that's false. Take a look at the top 20 of the recruiting classes for the next few years. It's all a bunch of guys with FS credentials.
And lets be damn honest. We are not going to win titles without getting those guys. We're competing with PSU for titles, right? Because their absolute biggest sell is the NLWC. And if we don't have that, we will fall behind. Much in the same way TnT figured out they couldn't just recruit guys who would handle the room/workload well, you're falling behind if your RTC (and consequently, wrestling FS) isn't a BIG part of your recruiting pitch.
